Which Holocausts Get Taught?

[theDoctorisIn]

This thread is on genocide and mass murder right? Reporting of it and teaching it?

post number 6



That would be your post.

Indeed. Notice the lack of words like "huge numbers" and such. Notice the use of words like "honesty".

All I am saying is we should give our children more credit than we do now, and teach them truthfully - both the good and the bad things that we as a country have done, and the good and bad that every country has done.

But I guess you were just itching for a partisan fight, and read into it what you wanted to see.

No you got caught and are now trying to back pedal. Good luck on that.

Nevermind. This is very much not worth my time.

Go find someone else to attack mindlessly, I'm going to talk to adults.

 

[Dr Grump]

They should teach what the Soviet union was, so many people today have a hardon for communism, they should study its finest example.

Starting with the purge pogroms against the Mensheviks, after the Reds won.

Then we could move on to how political dissidents and other "undesirables" were conscripted into the Red Army, to be trotted out in front of the Germans armed with little more than broom handles, as a means to run them out of ammo in places like Stalingrad, Moscow and Kursk.

Moving right along, we could then teach about how nearly no German prisoners ever captured by the Reds made it out of captivity alive. The slave labor gulags, purges of the Ukrainians and the turning of their home into a modern industrial environmental wasteland would be a nice touch.

But then we'd run into that touchy subject of how much a disaster socialism is in practice....And we can't have any of that.

It wasn't socialism....it was totalitarianism.

 

[Dr Grump]

This thread is on genocide and mass murder right? Reporting of it and teaching it?

post number 6



That would be your post.

Indeed. Notice the lack of words like "huge numbers" and such. Notice the use of words like "honesty".

All I am saying is we should give our children more credit than we do now, and teach them truthfully - both the good and the bad things that we as a country have done, and the good and bad that every country has done.

But I guess you were just itching for a partisan fight, and read into it what you wanted to see.

No you got caught and are now trying to back pedal. Good luck on that.

You start an ignorance poll, and then post shit like this? Grow up, you got your arse handed to you on a plate.

That aside, how many Iraqi civilians were killed?

 

[Oddball]

They should teach what the Soviet union was, so many people today have a hardon for communism, they should study its finest example.

Starting with the purge pogroms against the Mensheviks, after the Reds won.

Then we could move on to how political dissidents and other "undesirables" were conscripted into the Red Army, to be trotted out in front of the Germans armed with little more than broom handles, as a means to run them out of ammo in places like Stalingrad, Moscow and Kursk.

Moving right along, we could then teach about how nearly no German prisoners ever captured by the Reds made it out of captivity alive. The slave labor gulags, purges of the Ukrainians and the turning of their home into a modern industrial environmental wasteland would be a nice touch.

But then we'd run into that touchy subject of how much a disaster socialism is in practice....And we can't have any of that.

It wasn't socialism....it was totalitarianism.

You don't get one without the other.

Try being an unwilling participant in socialist regimes and you'll find out how "voluntary" the are, in short order.

 

[Dr Grump]

You don't get one without the other.

Try being an unwilling participant in socialist regimes and you'll find out how "voluntary" the are, in short order.

I don't think there have ever been any true-blue socialist states. Many have tried, but never reached the mark....

 

[theDoctorisIn]

You don't get one without the other.

Try being an unwilling participant in socialist regimes and you'll find out how "voluntary" the are, in short order.

I don't think there have ever been any true-blue socialist states. Many have tried, but never reached the mark....

As a state, no. It's only ever worked on a small scale.

Dude, I think you're talking about Communism - which isn't the same.

 

[Dr Grump]

I'd argue there hasn't been a true-blue communist state either.....

 

[theDoctorisIn]

I'd argue there hasn't been a true-blue communist state either.....

Well, nothing is ever true-blue. We're not a true-blue Democratic Representation Republic either, but we're pretty close.

 

[midcan5]

I thought skinheads were mostly Holocaust deniers? Let's face it the term usually applies to the Nazi murder of the Jews, but yes, there are lots in history. How about the barbarians, or the Romans, or the Inquisition as starters. We need to study them all but it is doubtful modern man would like what he saw.

Check Waller's book out, he gives writings from several that will make you wonder why gawd doesn't give up the grand experiment.

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Becoming-Evil-Ordinary-Genocide-Killing/dp/0195189493/ref=pd_cp_b_2]Amazon.com: Becoming Evil: How Ordinary People Commit Genocide and Mass Killing (9780195189490): Books[/ame]


This talk sums it up nicely or is that...

Philip Zimbardo shows how people become monsters ... or heroes | Video on TED.com

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Evil-Modern-Thought-Alternative-Philosophy/dp/0691117926/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1261446118&sr=1-5]Amazon.com: Evil in Modern Thought: An Alternative History of Philosophy (9780691117928): Susan Neiman: Books[/ame]


"Is God willing to prevent evil but not able? Then he is impotent. Is he able but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Whence, then, evil." Epicurus

 

[Cecilie1200]

Most on the board seem to agree that teaching the "Holocaust" (TM) should be state-mandated. It's just history.

So how do the same people feel about the murder of 7 million Ukranians by the Soviets? Should that be taught?

Seven million died in the 'forgotten' holocaust - Eric Margolis

Amazon.com: The Harvest of Sorrow: Soviet Collectivization and the Terror-Famine (9780195051803): Robert Conquest: Books

Can't wait to hear the answers!

Sure. It's recent world history, and relevant to studies of US relations with the former Soviet Union. However, you should understand that the Nazi Holocaust is much more closely related to US history, and as such, will get more attention.

 

[Cecilie1200]

You don't get one without the other.

Try being an unwilling participant in socialist regimes and you'll find out how "voluntary" the are, in short order.

I don't think there have ever been any true-blue socialist states. Many have tried, but never reached the mark....

As a state, no. It's only ever worked on a small scale.

Dude, I think you're talking about Communism - which isn't the same.

The former Soviet Union wasn't Communist, however much they pretended to aspire to that. They were socialist, allegedly as a step in the process to becoming communist. It was even in their name - Union of Soviet SOCIALIST Republics.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Indeed. Notice the lack of words like "huge numbers" and such. Notice the use of words like "honesty".

All I am saying is we should give our children more credit than we do now, and teach them truthfully - both the good and the bad things that we as a country have done, and the good and bad that every country has done.

But I guess you were just itching for a partisan fight, and read into it what you wanted to see.

No you got caught and are now trying to back pedal. Good luck on that.

You start an ignorance poll, and then post shit like this? Grow up, you got your arse handed to you on a plate.

That aside, how many Iraqi civilians were killed?

Looks like I need to add YOUR name to the poll, this has to be one of the stupidest posts ever. You over the age of 10?

As for how many were killed ask the Iraqi Government they have the figures based on death certificates and reported deaths. BUT the question was not how many were killed but how many were killed by American TROOPS. And the answer to THAT question is few.

 

[garyd]

How many different civilizations and ethnic groups have been ceased to exist for one reason or the other in the 25 k years?

Not trying to make light of anything here but one should have a care about what one calls a genocide.

 

[Dr Grump]

How many different civilizations and ethnic groups have been ceased to exist for one reason or the other in the 25 k years?

Not trying to make light of anything here but one should have a care about what one calls a genocide.

You really are an island aren't you..

..why not go live on one...

...preferably with an active volcano...

 

[garyd]

You really are an idiot aren't you gump? As usual you totally miss the point.

 

[Godboy]

I thought skinheads were mostly Holocaust deniers? Let's face it the term usually applies to the Nazi murder of the Jews, but yes, there are lots in history. How about the barbarians, or the Romans, or the Inquisition as starters. We need to study them all but it is doubtful modern man would like what he saw.

Check Waller's book out, he gives writings from several that will make you wonder why gawd doesn't give up the grand experiment.

Amazon.com: Becoming Evil: How Ordinary People Commit Genocide and Mass Killing (9780195189490): Books


This talk sums it up nicely or is that...

Philip Zimbardo shows how people become monsters ... or heroes | Video on TED.com

Amazon.com: Evil in Modern Thought: An Alternative History of Philosophy (9780691117928): Susan Neiman: Books


"Is God willing to prevent evil but not able? Then he is impotent. Is he able but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Whence, then, evil." Epicurus

Theres only been one true holocaust, and it was against the jews during WW2. All other genocides are called genocides because they dont meet the criteria for the definition of a holocaust.

Holocaust: to consume by fire

The jews were burned in ovens, therefore its called a holocaust. Get it?

 

[Dr Grump]

You really are an idiot aren't you gump? As usual you totally miss the point.

actually I don't miss the point. You are just a self-centred arsehole....and you make that point in every post without even realising it - so, yes, a point is being missed - by you.....

 

[Nevadamedic]

Sure. But lets be honest about it, and teach the number of Iraqi civilians that were killed by American troops as well.

In fact, let's teach our kids honestly about everything.

The number of civilians doesn't even come close to the numbers massacared by Saddam's goons.

But if you want to play that way we can, lets talk about the numbers of innocent civilians who died during WW2, oh wait it was a Democratic President so I guess it doesn't count..........

You're the only one bringing partisan nonsense into this discussion. Of course we should teach how many civilians were killed during WWII.

No, a comment about how many civilian's who died in Iraq is a common Liberal talking point as they don't have really any good excust to attack the war in Iraq and they know it.

 

[Nevadamedic]

Most on the board seem to agree that teaching the "Holocaust" (TM) should be state-mandated. It's just history.

So how do the same people feel about the murder of 7 million Ukranians by the Soviets? Should that be taught?

Seven million died in the 'forgotten' holocaust - Eric Margolis

Amazon.com: The Harvest of Sorrow: Soviet Collectivization and the Terror-Famine (9780195051803): Robert Conquest: Books

Can't wait to hear the answers!

I agree, of course it should be taught. So should the Armenian genocide by the Turks, the genocide of the Hutus in Rwanda, and the near genocide of the American Indian.

And all the other mass murders, past, present and future.

Until the Liberals perverted American History into Social Studies the murder of American Indians was always taught in the American School system as was the American slave issue. Now only feel good crap is taught with one class on American History in High School.

According to Harry Reid, Republican's supported and continue to support slavery and oppose equal rights. LMFAO.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

Dont forget the 80 million Hindi by the muslims