When are taxes high enough???

[EdwardBaiamonte]

to live??? So then why be so afraid to say exactly how you would accomplish this?????????

Taxes will be high enough when I have every penny of yours...

And there you have it - the quintessential liberal truth.

yes indeed, there is no other logical end to liberalism. It is 100% about violence, as always.

 

[bripat9643]

when the private sector mans up and pays employees a wage that a family can live on....if that were to happen, there would be no need for social programs and they could be cut.....along with our taxes...then all we would have to do is address our bloated military, along with redundant Government offices, like Homeland Security for instance. We already have the NATIONAL SECURITY ADMINISTRATION(NSA), the CIA, and the FBI.

Yeah. That hostess at Denny's deserves a good 20-25$ an hour.

If she has a family to raise? you're damned right she does. Hire High School kids to work the tables...Hostess is a full time job and only one needed o'er shift.

In other words, "to each according to his need."

And you also believe the rich should "pay their fair share." Right?

 

[bripat9643]

Nice talking point shooter. Not true at all....but nice talking point. who decides what you claim? The market? who controls the market? Oh.... that's right....those who have been making a killing while destroying the wage scale in America. Yeah....they're not going to lie, are they?

No one "controls" the market. The definition of "market" is a place where VOLUNTARY exchanges of goods and services occur. "Control" is the opposite of voluntary.

 

[bripat9643]

Got it. A woman with a child deserves more than one without a child. Excellent point.

exactly, if a woman has 10 kids and needs drug treatment the customers should pay for the choices she made!! It makes perfect sense!!!

I'll bet he pays the guy who mows his lawn $500/month because he's an alcoholic who has to pay $1000/month for car insurance.

 

[bripat9643]

Employees that are worth that level of pay already have that level of pay.

Nice talking point shooter. Not true at all.

How so?

who decides what you claim?

Your wage, like everyone else's, is decided by you and your employer.
You believe you are worth $X, he is willing to pay $Y for the work he has for you. If the numbers match up, you have a job; if not, you do not.
The work he has for you may not be worth 'enough for a family to live on', and so, if you take that job, you choose to make less than that amount.

The bottom line is that the consumers determine how much you make. If their choices in the market require employers to pay a certain wage to obtain services of the kind you provide, then that is what your services are worth. If consumers make other choices that reduce the demand for your services, then you will earn less.

It's as simple as that. If your wages aren't to your liking, You can blame your neighbors. They determined your wages.

 

[Wiseacre]

Nice talking point shooter. Not true at all.

How so?

who decides what you claim?

Your wage, like everyone else's, is decided by you and your employer.
You believe you are worth $X, he is willing to pay $Y for the work he has for you. If the numbers match up, you have a job; if not, you do not.
The work he has for you may not be worth 'enough for a family to live on', and so, if you take that job, you choose to make less than that amount.

The bottom line is that the consumers determine how much you make. If their choices in the market require employers to pay a certain wage to obtain services of the kind you provide, then that is what your services are worth. If consumers make other choices that reduce the demand for your services, then you will earn less.

It's as simple as that. If your wages aren't to your liking, You can blame your neighbors. They determined your wages.

Actually, the first person to blame is the person in the mirror. If you don't have more market value it's your own fault to some degree.

I do wish the left would divest themselves of the notion that employees should be paid what they need rather than what they're worth. It's totally unrealistic.

 

[Steelplate]

so what you are saying is that if everyone just "applied" themselves....there are enough good paying jobs here in the country to support the 300 million people(give or take) that are of working age?

love to see you back that up.

 

[Moonglow]

I would guess that taxes equate to political power over others so the link below seems to be spot on.

Addiction Taxes « The Liberty Bullhorn

Class envy leads to class warfare... you decide!

for a liberal taxes are never high enough!! They always need new taxes to buy new votes with promises of new welfare programs.
Liberalism should be made illegal as the Constitution intended.


"When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic."
-Benjamin Franklin

Evidently you have no sense when it comes to painting people with a broad brush.I lived in Arkansas, in Benton county they raise property taxes 5 fold in 15 years.($200.00to $1000.00)
Local taxes were high also. (10%)So I bought 43 acres in SW Missiuri and paid less for land 1/5th of current land prices in Arkansas.
I put a doublewide on the land(I am twice the trailer trash of poor people), It is about 2100 square feet.
Taxes on the land with house is $365.00 per year, local taxes are 6%.Local businesses are cheaper in price than big cities.
I love it here. I am a liberal.

 

[Moonglow]

so what you are saying is that if everyone just "applied" themselves....there are enough good paying jobs here in the country to support the 300 million people(give or take) that are of working age?

love to see you back that up.

There are, but getting the unemployed to those jobs in different parts of the nation that are doing well is the bottleneck in the process.

 

[Moonglow]

How so?


Your wage, like everyone else's, is decided by you and your employer.
You believe you are worth $X, he is willing to pay $Y for the work he has for you. If the numbers match up, you have a job; if not, you do not.
The work he has for you may not be worth 'enough for a family to live on', and so, if you take that job, you choose to make less than that amount.

The bottom line is that the consumers determine how much you make. If their choices in the market require employers to pay a certain wage to obtain services of the kind you provide, then that is what your services are worth. If consumers make other choices that reduce the demand for your services, then you will earn less.
If your wages aren't to your liking, You can blame your neighbors.

Actually, the first person to blame is the person in the mirror. If you don't have more market value it's your own fault to some degree.They determined your wages.

I do wish the left would divest themselves of the notion that employees should be paid what they need rather than what they're worth. It's totally unrealistic.

I am self employed, I do construction. The recessions caused us to lower prices up to 40%.
We still work but for less and we travel farther. Now tell me how this liberal, leftist, needs to evaluate my situation to do better when I have many skills .
It's as simple as that. If your wages aren't to your liking, You can blame your neighbors.
I did the same thing under Reagan and Bush sr(Black monday) then we lost 50% of current earnings to work.

 

[Immanuel]

a conservative lacks the IQ to understand that they are LYING to them.

btw...to the other responder, I do much better than that.

what you two are saying is that the private sector is paying as much as it can? I call bullshit. The private sector is paying as little as possible....because they can. They've destroyed private sector labor unions, lobbied and got their slave labor countries to drive wages down further and forget about benefits....fuck. and you fuckers still hold their dicks for them while they take a piss.

You want to know why the economy sucks? because o ly 10-15% of the country has any disposable income. fucking idiots, the lot of ya.

I'll make you a deal...the day one income for...say... a janitor is enough to raise a family on(in a minimalist, frugal way), and two of those incomes allow a family to thrive? I'll immediately switch parties and join your ranks screaming for smaller government and the abolition of welfare.

until then...fuck off.

Do you honestly believe that an employer should interview a perspective employee then decide to hire him or her and then ask the new employee, "What do you expect us to pay?" and then after the answer add, "Great you want, $100/hr, well we will pay you that and add $25/hour too... dishwashing is hard work."

What the hell kind of logic is that?

Of course, an employer is going to hire the best qualified employee that fits into their budget. Good lord, is that really that hard to understand?

Immie

 

[Steelplate]

a conservative lacks the IQ to understand that they are LYING to them.

btw...to the other responder, I do much better than that.

what you two are saying is that the private sector is paying as much as it can? I call bullshit. The private sector is paying as little as possible....because they can. They've destroyed private sector labor unions, lobbied and got their slave labor countries to drive wages down further and forget about benefits....fuck. and you fuckers still hold their dicks for them while they take a piss.

You want to know why the economy sucks? because o ly 10-15% of the country has any disposable income. fucking idiots, the lot of ya.

I'll make you a deal...the day one income for...say... a janitor is enough to raise a family on(in a minimalist, frugal way), and two of those incomes allow a family to thrive? I'll immediately switch parties and join your ranks screaming for smaller government and the abolition of welfare.

until then...fuck off.

Do you honestly believe that an employer should interview a perspective employee then decide to hire him or her and then ask the new employee, "What do you expect us to pay?" and then after the answer add, "Great you want, $100/hr, well we will pay you that and add $25/hour too... dishwashing is hard work."

What the hell kind of logic is that?

Of course, an employer is going to hire the best qualified employee that fits into their budget. Good lord, is that really that hard to understand?

Immie

where in the FUCK did I day that? Project much?

 

[Moonglow]

a conservative lacks the IQ to understand that they are LYING to them.

btw...to the other responder, I do much better than that.

what you two are saying is that the private sector is paying as much as it can? I call bullshit. The private sector is paying as little as possible....because they can. They've destroyed private sector labor unions, lobbied and got their slave labor countries to drive wages down further and forget about benefits....fuck. and you fuckers still hold their dicks for them while they take a piss.

You want to know why the economy sucks? because o ly 10-15% of the country has any disposable income. fucking idiots, the lot of ya.

I'll make you a deal...the day one income for...say... a janitor is enough to raise a family on(in a minimalist, frugal way), and two of those incomes allow a family to thrive? I'll immediately switch parties and join your ranks screaming for smaller government and the abolition of welfare.

until then...fuck off.

Do you honestly believe that an employer should interview a perspective employee then decide to hire him or her and then ask the new employee, "What do you expect us to pay?" and then after the answer add, "Great you want, $100/hr, well we will pay you that and add $25/hour too... dishwashing is hard work."

What the hell kind of logic is that?

Of course, an employer is going to hire the best qualified employee that fits into their budget. Good lord, is that really that hard to understand?

Immie

where in the FUCK did I day that? Project much?

excessively

 

[Immanuel]

a conservative lacks the IQ to understand that they are LYING to them.

btw...to the other responder, I do much better than that.

what you two are saying is that the private sector is paying as much as it can? I call bullshit. The private sector is paying as little as possible....because they can. They've destroyed private sector labor unions, lobbied and got their slave labor countries to drive wages down further and forget about benefits....fuck. and you fuckers still hold their dicks for them while they take a piss.

You want to know why the economy sucks? because o ly 10-15% of the country has any disposable income. fucking idiots, the lot of ya.

I'll make you a deal...the day one income for...say... a janitor is enough to raise a family on(in a minimalist, frugal way), and two of those incomes allow a family to thrive? I'll immediately switch parties and join your ranks screaming for smaller government and the abolition of welfare.

until then...fuck off.

Do you honestly believe that an employer should interview a perspective employee then decide to hire him or her and then ask the new employee, "What do you expect us to pay?" and then after the answer add, "Great you want, $100/hr, well we will pay you that and add $25/hour too... dishwashing is hard work."

What the hell kind of logic is that?

Of course, an employer is going to hire the best qualified employee that fits into their budget. Good lord, is that really that hard to understand?

Immie

where in the FUCK did I day that? Project much?

You drinking?

That is exactly what you said. You expect the employer to happily pay more than the market will bear. You day[sic] that you want the employer to pay more. More than what? What the hell are they supposed to pay?

"As little as possible" means they are paying what the market will bear. You day[sic] they should voluntarily pay more than that. Why? When you buy a car, do you negotiate the price and then when the seller settles with you, tell him you will add 25% because the car you just bought is a "real steal".

Immie

 

[Wry Catcher]

I would guess that taxes equate to political power over others so the link below seems to be spot on.

Addiction Taxes « The Liberty Bullhorn

Class envy leads to class warfare... you decide!

I suggest you purchase a copy of SimCity. Doing so may aid you in posting new threads; threads which have less resemblance to a Chatty Kathy Parrot.

 

[Immanuel]

Then again, Steelplate, maybe you should define "as little as possible". When you do, maybe real life will start to make sense to you, because there really is no other definition in this context.

If you as the perspective employee are not willing to take what the employer is offering, you have a very clear choice. Refuse the job and keep looking or accept the job and do the best you can until you can find a better position.

Immie

 

[there4eyeM]

Taxes will be high enough when everyone pays her/his fair share according to the benefit derived.

Sales taxes are already automatically too high for lower incomes.

Progressive taxes must be simple and fair.

People must realize and acknowledge the benefit received.

Again:

"Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration."
Abraham Lincoln
Was he a commie?

 

[there4eyeM]

"If you as the perspective (sic) employee are not willing to take what the employer is offering, you have a very clear choice. Refuse the job and keep looking or accept the job and do the best you can until you can find a better position."

Good to see that God is among us.

Existential choice may be clear. 'Real life' choices often are not. A soldier given an unconstitutional order has the obligation to refuse. He has a choice, but the context rather limits exercise.
A W. Va. resident may feel mine work is not for him or that the pay is not correct, but his options are extremely limited and perhaps non-existent in any meaningful, compassionate way.

It isn't easy being human.

 

[Pho_King]

Do people make bad choices? sure they do....but I'm not willing to destroy the economy because I'm pissed off at other people's poor choices, are you?

It is precisely because we have stopped holding people accountable for their choices that we are now in the position of being held hostage by LOSERS.

We stopped letting high school dropouts fail, and we stopped letting banks that overleverage and take astronomical risks fail.

Christ, there are people who want to stop letting kids keep score on the sports field or receive an F in class.

This is bullshit.

The economy is wrecked because we have strayed far from our roots, and we have grown a MASSIVE class of government dependents at BOTH ends of the socioeconomic scale.

Time to wean all of them off the government tit. You drop out of high school, we let you sink. You fuck up your bank, you sink out of sight. Period.

You're wrong. There used to be good paying jobs to accommodate the "losers"....which, btw are also your fellow citizens. My Dad had an 8th grade education and did well for us as an overhead crane operator....guess what? his company TRAINED him to do the job.

I want people off the government tit too. you want them to starve...I want them to live...huge fucking difference.

Nobody wants anybody to starve. Normal people want for people to do what is necessary to take care of themselves. You want society to do that for them. Neither philosophy starves the individual of nutrition. But your philosophy starves the individual of dignity.

 

[Pho_King]

many people don't have a choice...they take what they can get. Fuck it....I guess that's the way you want the game to be played....so, when someone tells me that there are no good paying jobs available....I'll tell them not to work...collect welfare....it pays better.

You want a solution to high taxes....I gave you one. to have our private sector man the fuck up...you don't like the idea of "job creators" having a sense of decency, responsibility to their employees, and a sense of patriotism to their communities and their countries? Well...then I guess it's government's job to take it into their own hands. You can't have it both ways....crappy fucking wages and government butting out...

Most of those people that, as you say, don't have a choice, made plenty of choices that landed themselves in such a lpredicament.

so fuck 'em....right? Let them starve. You dumbass.... it's because of people like you that we are in the predicament we're in. It's real....REAL simple. The more money one makes, the more their buying power is...The more they can buy...the better off our economy is. Stop acting like the workforce is an afterthought.

You know, there was a time when menial labor was paid pretty well, and our country thrived instead of slowly swirling down the toilet. Not to the point you mentioned(20-25/hr)....that was over the top so I went the same direction....but when I was a kid, I remember my Dad talking about employees at a Merck plant in our area where people got $20 an hour to push a broom, and that was back in the 70's.

Let's move on to Government.....Why can't we pay our debts? Oh....we sure do spend too much, but the insolvency problem has gotten much, much worse because of too many people not making enough to collect revenues that will cover it. If some family has two parents working at a minimum wage job, that's right around $30k/year...or one job at $15/hr. With the cost of living the way it is? fuck....they're barely surviving....probably collecting food stamps to make ends meet.

Do people make bad choices? sure they do....but I'm not willing to destroy the economy because I'm pissed off at other people's poor choices, are you?

The Median family income in this country is around what? 50k? When you consider the cost of living, even that isn't living high on the hog....definitely doable, but not thriving by any means.

Christ you are a whiny little pussy. YOU and other parasitic losers like you are the problem. You have no belief in people. You see the world as broken into two classes, the victims and the victimizes. And your parasitic loser mentality is spreading through the population rapidly. It's not hard to make enough money to meet basic needs. You just can't be a total fuckup. But what you want is to coddle the fuckups. Make them comfortable in their fucked up lifestyle. Like the parent that never pushes his kid, just tells the little shit that he is a winner no matter what he does. And then the kid grows up. To be like you, thinking the world owes him a living because his emasculated father told him he was so special. Grow up you little pussy. The world you want is a Losers utopia, but guess what? It won't ever exist. You know why? Because this country is not run by the losers. It's run by people that got off their ass and did something for themselves, rather than waiting for someone to hand their success to them. Starvation occurs when one feels like such a victim that they can't plant a couple fuckin seeds in the ground for fear they might miss the government truck comin by with their food rations. Now fuck off and finish your Popsicle.