What's wrong with for profit healthcare

[Bern80]

So when you turn 65, you are going to refuse to take any money from Medicare?

I'm not even close to 65 for one thing. I am however planning for my financial future and one can only hope in doing so that I will be able to find a better alternative.

 

[Bern80]

Has our for profit system developed a cure for cancer yet?

has non-profit?

 

[Bern80]

Because a the government is answerable to the people. The doctors, the lawyers, the insurance companies, the hospitals, and Big Pharma are only answerable to their shareholders.

How well is government answering to you right now?

 

[Bern80]

But it is the goal of all healthcare, is it not?

No preventative for cancer. Do you know why? Because there is no money in it. All the money is in treating cancer after people get it.

No it isn't. there purpose is to treat the ill.

It is the purpose of scientists in labratories to find cures for diseases.

 

[Bern80]

So the moral to this whole saga is ... stay where you are, suck it up, and pray for the best. I guess. But it is still

NO it isn't. The moral is don't throw the baby out with the bath water. As I alluded to before there isn't any reason to think of this in terms of extremes. It doesn't have to be one or the other. Indeed we already have private and government funded health care.

We are only trying to solve one problem here. And that is the affordablilty of our healthcare. The quality of actual care and the responsiveness of our healthcare system is one of the best in the world.

it is ridiculous to look at one variable like cost and conclude that somehow our healthcare system is broken, must be scrapped and the best solution is that government pay for it.

You say you're 60+ years old which means you've been around long enugh to see what a wonderful job government does at administering programs. That alone should give every single American pause in such a venture.

 

[Chris]

NO it isn't. The moral is don't throw the baby out with the bath water. As I alluded to before there isn't any reason to think of this in terms of extremes. It doesn't have to be one or the other. Indeed we already have private and government funded health care.

We are only trying to solve one problem here. And that is the affordablilty of our healthcare. The quality of actual care and the responsiveness of our healthcare system is one of the best in the world.

it is ridiculous to look at one variable like cost and conclude that somehow our healthcare system is broken, must be scrapped and the best solution is that government pay for it.

You say you're 60+ years old which means you've been around long enugh to see what a wonderful job government does at administering programs. That alone should give every single American pause in such a venture.

We are paying 15% of our GDP for healthcare, and that number is going to go up.

If you don't think our system is broken, you are clueless.

 

[Chris]

No it isn't. there purpose is to treat the ill.

It is the purpose of scientists in labratories to find cures for diseases.

Shouldn't the purpose of a healthcare system be to prevent disease rather than making money off of sick people?

 

[jreeves]

We are paying 15% of our GDP for healthcare, and that number is going to go up.

If you don't think our system is broken, you are clueless.

As has been proven it's not a problem that is isolated in the US....

 

[Chris]

has non-profit?

As a matter of fact they have.

 

[Bern80]

We are paying 15% of our GDP for healthcare, and that number is going to go up.

If you don't think our system is broken, you are clueless.

Oh, so I am assuming if you had cancer you would choose to be treated in another country because their resources and their quality of physicians is far superior to ours, correct?

Again one out of whack variable in a system does not make for a broken system.

 

[Bern80]

Shouldn't the purpose of a healthcare system be to prevent disease rather than making money off of sick people?

Why do they not deserve to make money? There is far more to a healthcare system then treating disease. There are literally thousands of medical specialities out there, are you suggesting all of that should be forgone for disease prevention?

 

[Bern80]

As a matter of fact they have.

Feel free to link

 

[jreeves]

Shouldn't the purpose of a healthcare system be to prevent disease rather than making money off of sick people?

Here's American medicine preventing disease rather than treating sick people...



At the AIDS Vaccine 2007 Conference today, Etubics Corporation reported on a novel adenovirus vector vaccine that can boost the HIV/AIDS virus immune response and deliver vaccination against a second disease at the same time.

For the first time ever, Etubics has demonstrated that animals can be immunized against the HIV virus using Etubics HIV-1, E2b-gag vaccine, then at a later date their immunity can be boosted by a second immunization with the same vaccine. This second immunity boost has been unable to be produced prior to this study. Furthermore, the E2b-gag vaccine was found to stimulate the most important early warning system which is composed of dendritic cells (DC), CD8+ and CD4+ T-cells. Stimulation of the DC's also stimulates natural killer T-cells that are part of the innate immune response. Together, these immune cells and possibly HIV antibodies are needed to protect against the HIV/AIDS virus infection.

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Feeding the world with biotech crops. "We are excited to have discovered these findings during our animal trials. The HIV vaccine development industry has been in search of a product that can be used over and over to boost the immune response following an initial vaccination and we believe that we have found such a product," stated Dr. Frank Jones, founder, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of Etubics and leader of the scientific efforts. "We are encouraged enough that we have initiated non-human primate trials which, if successful, will move us one step closer to the clinics."

"This avant-garde E2b vector vaccine technology needs to find its way into the armamentarium of healthcare workers attempting to treat patients with HIV/AIDS but also in other areas such as influenza, including bird flu, herpes simplex virus, and the treatment of a variety of cancer patients," said Dr. Andrea Amalfitano, professor at Michigan State University and Chairman of Etubics Scientific Board as well as a patent holder and creator of Etubics technology. "Presently, I am working with Etubics to start a Phase I/II cancer trial with our E2b based cancer vaccines. I also look forward to testing the HIV E2b-gag vaccine in humans within a few years, if initial trials on primates go as expected."

Etubics Reports Breakthrough Next Generation HIV Vaccine at AIDS Conference | Business Wire | Find Articles at BNET

 

[Chris]

Oh, so I am assuming if you had cancer you would choose to be treated in another country because their resources and their quality of physicians is far superior to ours, correct?

Again one out of whack variable in a system does not make for a broken system.

No, I'm saying we could prevent cancer right now, but there is no money in it, so it doesn't happen.

Malaria is another good example. Two million children die of malaria each year.

Two million children.....think about that.

Malaria is a very preventable disease. Why is nothing being done by the healthcare companies?

There's no money in it.

So who do you think is now preventing malaria. The non-profits. Why? Because their purpose is to heal, not to make money.

 

[dilloduck]

No, I'm saying we could prevent cancer right now, but there is no money in it, so it doesn't happen.

Malaria is another good example. 2 million children die of malaria each year.

2 million children.....think about that.

Malaria is a very preventable disease. Why is nothing being done by the healthcare companies? There's no money in it.

So who do you think is now preventing malaria. The non-profits. Why? Because their purpose is to heal, not to make money.

I'll bite. What's this cancer preventing treatment that we aren't using ?

 

[Bern80]

No, I'm saying we could prevent cancer right now, but there is no money in it, so it doesn't happen.

Malaria is another good example. 2 million children die of malaria each year.

2 million children.....think about that.

Malaria is a very preventable disease. Why is nothing being done by the healthcare companies? There's no money in it.

So who do you think is now preventing malaria. The non-profits. Why? Because their purpose is to heal, not to make money.

and again there is so much more to medicine than cancer. You're still not gettin the big picture.

How do you know no for profit company is working on malaria? Did ya check them all. I imagine you don't have shit to back any of this up do you?

 

[jreeves]

I'll bite. What's this cancer preventing treatment that we aren't using ?

see post #73 an American company developing a cancer vaccination....

 

[Chris]

and again there is so much more to medicine than cancer. You're still not gettin the big picture.

How do you know no for profit company is working on malaria? Did ya check them all. I imagine you don't have shit to back any of this up do you?

Do you read the newspaper at all?

Millions of children were dying of malaria, and no one was doing anything about it, even though it would cost very little to prevent.....probably a miniscule percentage of our bloated defense budget.

So do you know who stepped into the breach? Bill Gates.

His nonprofit has taken up the cause of malaria because no one else was willing to spend the money to save two million children. But hey, those bombs we're dropping in the Middle East cost a lot of money, right?

 

[CA95380]

.....
You say you're 60+ years old which means you've been around long enugh to see what a wonderful job government does at administering programs. That alone should give every single American pause in such a venture.

Oh yeah! I been there and have seen it - but to be totally honest the past couple of years have been the worst. Of coarse ... declining health makes you see more than when you are young, and completely healthy, too.

 

[Prefx]

Oh, so I am assuming if you had cancer you would choose to be treated in another country because their resources and their quality of physicians is far superior to ours, correct?

Again one out of whack variable in a system does not make for a broken system.

I had a friend (acquaintance would probably be a better term) who came to America from France with cancer. What cost her thousands of dollars here came up as 10 or 20 euros in France. She said the care in both countries was about the same. By the time she arrived in the United States most of the problems had ceased ('course - you don't travel that sick). Hilariously, the bill here was more expensive for check-ups than the actual procedure there. In France, where they use a two-pronged system, the sicker you are, the less you pay. There is consecutively better rates of survival, as seen through infancy and maternal studies. Why? Because most people don't want to be sick, so the free rider "problem" is non-existent. Those who do disregard health concerns already act without thinking. There's also the fickle relationship between not caring for one's health while still caring for finances. Greater harm (and expenses) come from people worrying about their bank account.

Methinks with those startling conclusions I would go to a different country. Your assumption about the "finest medical technology" doesn't persuade me otherwise. If I was from an undeveloped country, and I couldn't afford to frequent a developed one, I would go to Cuba - not India, China, South Africa, Egypt, Chile, Lebanon, or Costa Rica.