I consider myself an independent. There are some right wing views that I agree with as well as some left wing views. But I really am curious,for example, If you voted for Trump, what would make you question or oppose some of the things he does? I'd ask the question about Hillary but obviously she didnt get elected. My point is, seems like so many people on both sides will go down with the sinking ship no matter what. Is this human nature? Brainwashing? People can't admit maybe they voted wrong? Anyways, so much anger and hate and maybe someone that can speak openly and honestly without getting biased and give me and maybe us some insight.
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What Would Change Your Mind/Views/Ideology??
- Thread starter debonora
- Start date
- May 17, 2013
- 67,493
- 32,631
- 2,290
I'd be willing to concede some points but only if the other side is willing to concede some points. But this has become a battle in the Trenches.
For instance border security and the Wall. I don't think the entire thing should be a wall. Only high traffic areas where cities are side by side is it really needed. In the vast expanses...........modern cameras and outposts would do the trick...............None of this will work without the manpower to do the job........On employers hiring illegals..........I'd like to see the E-Verify....and businesses punished if they hire illegals........
In agriculture.....I'd want to see efficiency in the DOL programs for farm workers...........Under this program the red tape has caused too many delays for farmers doing it legally........but some reports show about 2 million or more illegals simply working on farms outside the legal way..........This needs to end.
I'd also like to see more centers for temp holding of the illegals here with more judges...........
If they'd agree with that..........then the dreamers could get the path.........but only until the other side is guaranteed and the border is secure.
For instance border security and the Wall. I don't think the entire thing should be a wall. Only high traffic areas where cities are side by side is it really needed. In the vast expanses...........modern cameras and outposts would do the trick...............None of this will work without the manpower to do the job........On employers hiring illegals..........I'd like to see the E-Verify....and businesses punished if they hire illegals........
In agriculture.....I'd want to see efficiency in the DOL programs for farm workers...........Under this program the red tape has caused too many delays for farmers doing it legally........but some reports show about 2 million or more illegals simply working on farms outside the legal way..........This needs to end.
I'd also like to see more centers for temp holding of the illegals here with more judges...........
If they'd agree with that..........then the dreamers could get the path.........but only until the other side is guaranteed and the border is secure.
fncceo
Diamond Member
- Nov 29, 2016
- 42,701
- 35,298
- 3,615
People can't admit maybe they voted wrong?
Not agreeing with everything a candidate does is not the same as admitting you voted wrong. The performance of any elected politician has to be evaluated as a whole.
- Oct 12, 2009
- 58,613
- 10,629
- 2,030
A solid third party option.
It doesn't change my mind, views or ideology, just aligns it with a party.
It doesn't change my mind, views or ideology, just aligns it with a party.
2aguy
Diamond Member
- Jul 19, 2014
- 111,956
- 52,217
- 2,290
I consider myself an independent. There are some right wing views that I agree with as well as some left wing views. But I really am curious,for example, If you voted for Trump, what would make you question or oppose some of the things he does? I'd ask the question about Hillary but obviously she didnt get elected. My point is, seems like so many people on both sides will go down with the sinking ship no matter what. Is this human nature? Brainwashing? People can't admit maybe they voted wrong? Anyways, so much anger and hate and maybe someone that can speak openly and honestly without getting biased and give me and maybe us some insight.
Show me where the other side gets something right...
- Thread starter
- #6
[/QUOTE]
Show me where the other side gets something right...[/QUOTE]
The other side? As in the democratic party? I'm not quite understanding your question? You implying I LIKE Hilary? BTW in general,on both sides seems like I've never met someone who even sees faults in the person they voted for. Whether it is Hilary's emails or trumps consistent lying. Just seems like whoever the person voted for, can't see the forest through the trees if that makes sense.
Show me where the other side gets something right...[/QUOTE]
The other side? As in the democratic party? I'm not quite understanding your question? You implying I LIKE Hilary? BTW in general,on both sides seems like I've never met someone who even sees faults in the person they voted for. Whether it is Hilary's emails or trumps consistent lying. Just seems like whoever the person voted for, can't see the forest through the trees if that makes sense.
2aguy
Diamond Member
- Jul 19, 2014
- 111,956
- 52,217
- 2,290
Show me where the other side gets something right...
The other side? As in the democratic party? I'm not quite understanding your question? You implying I LIKE Hilary?[/QUOTE]
the left.
I consider myself an independent. There are some right wing views that I agree with as well as some left wing views. But I really am curious,for example, If you voted for Trump, what would make you question or oppose some of the things he does? I'd ask the question about Hillary but obviously she didnt get elected. My point is, seems like so many people on both sides will go down with the sinking ship no matter what. Is this human nature? Brainwashing? People can't admit maybe they voted wrong? Anyways, so much anger and hate and maybe someone that can speak openly and honestly without getting biased and give me and maybe us some insight.
Why do you care? Why are you trying to change people's minds? I bet you want to change everyone to think just like you right? You want us all to admit we voted wrong? Why not leave people's opinions alone and respect them as is?
- Dec 25, 2009
- 15,907
- 6,513
- 390
- Banned
- #9
My ideology is for honesty and ethics in government, the constitution, the rule of law and putting the interests of average Americans first while also protecting the rights of the individual. This is obviously opposite to the ideals of American liberals.
- Aug 4, 2009
- 281,015
- 140,247
- 2,300
I was a Republican...voted for Reagan and Bush twice
Believed in trickle down and the evils of welfare
What changed my mind was how hateful and callous Republicans became in the 1990s
It became obvious they were blatant sell outs to the wealthy and cared nothing about the people
Believed in trickle down and the evils of welfare
What changed my mind was how hateful and callous Republicans became in the 1990s
It became obvious they were blatant sell outs to the wealthy and cared nothing about the people
- May 17, 2013
- 67,493
- 32,631
- 2,290
The other side is a my way or the highway type of group. Leftist.........They don't budge and hardly ever negotiate............
If they were willing to negotiate to get a law passed that both could stomach without throwing our guts out in the process then deals could be made that wouldn't give everyone what they wanted but a compromise that would give points to both sides.
On issues like immigration they have made it clear they want open borders...........many have admitted it now and those always saying they don't are usually lying.
They can't be trusted.
If they were willing to negotiate to get a law passed that both could stomach without throwing our guts out in the process then deals could be made that wouldn't give everyone what they wanted but a compromise that would give points to both sides.
On issues like immigration they have made it clear they want open borders...........many have admitted it now and those always saying they don't are usually lying.
They can't be trusted.
MarathonMike
Diamond Member
So this is the question I am answering from your OP:
If you voted for Trump, what would make you question or oppose some of the things he does?
Just like every President I have ever voted for there are always decisions, actions, statements that I question. In Donald Trump's case I have never agreed with a 30 foot wall a thousand miles long. I have lived relatively close to the Mexican border for over 3 decades and based on everything I have heard and seen a massive wall would not be a good use of tax revenue. Beyond that, I could do without Trump's tendency to hit back at every attack. But I also recognize that it is in his DNA to hit back being a New Yorker. That is who he is and he is not pretending, so I accept it.
On tariffs and trade I would like to see very specific, limited goals for China, Mexico and EU and have the changes be phased in over a period of years. I view tariffs as an entitlement that other countries have become dependent upon, so if you go for too much too soon you risk full retaliation.
If you voted for Trump, what would make you question or oppose some of the things he does?
Just like every President I have ever voted for there are always decisions, actions, statements that I question. In Donald Trump's case I have never agreed with a 30 foot wall a thousand miles long. I have lived relatively close to the Mexican border for over 3 decades and based on everything I have heard and seen a massive wall would not be a good use of tax revenue. Beyond that, I could do without Trump's tendency to hit back at every attack. But I also recognize that it is in his DNA to hit back being a New Yorker. That is who he is and he is not pretending, so I accept it.
On tariffs and trade I would like to see very specific, limited goals for China, Mexico and EU and have the changes be phased in over a period of years. I view tariffs as an entitlement that other countries have become dependent upon, so if you go for too much too soon you risk full retaliation.
- Thread starter
- #14
The other side is a my way or the highway type of group. Leftist.........They don't budge and hardly ever negotiate............
If they were willing to negotiate to get a law passed that both could stomach without throwing our guts out in the process then deals could be made that wouldn't give everyone what they wanted but a compromise that would give points to both sides.
On issues like immigration they have made it clear they want open borders...........many have admitted it now and those always saying they don't are usually lying.
They can't be trusted.
So playing devils advocate, do you think any Republicans refuse to budge? It can't JUST BE leftist can it?
night_son
Diamond Member
I consider myself an independent. There are some right wing views that I agree with as well as some left wing views. But I really am curious,for example, If you voted for Trump, what would make you question or oppose some of the things he does? I'd ask the question about Hillary but obviously she didnt get elected. My point is, seems like so many people on both sides will go down with the sinking ship no matter what. Is this human nature? Brainwashing? People can't admit maybe they voted wrong? Anyways, so much anger and hate and maybe someone that can speak openly and honestly without getting biased and give me and maybe us some insight.
Personally, for me, patriotism is not conditional on who is serving in the majority party. I have served my country under five Presidents now--some of whom I've despised but always upheld my oath and respected the office. Patriotism, in two parts, is loyalty to our commander in chief, and secondly, unflinching loyalty to protect the Constitution and the people of our nation--a euphemism for family, community, unit, and all officers appointed over me. MSM scandals are engineered by both parties to legitimize divisive punditry and constantly plant in the public mind the idea that their party's political ship is sinking.
The choice for me is an easy one. After careful examination over the past decade of Leftist politics, historical cycles, ideologies, running platforms and their collective highly detrimental effect on all I hold sacred--including American traditional moral facts, freedoms and practices--siding with the Democrat party is opposite of reasonable, logical or ethical. At present, I do not believe there is a sizeable enough political tremor or manufactured MSM crisis that could shake my loyalty to party, unless we're talking military junta--in which case, so long as it was Right leaning and in prevention of socialist or communist revolution and enshrined the Constitution and the Declaration, I'd say sign me up.
- Thread starter
- #16
So this is the question I am answering from your OP:
If you voted for Trump, what would make you question or oppose some of the things he does?
Just like every President I have ever voted for there are always decisions, actions, statements that I question. In Donald Trump's case I have never agreed with a 30 foot wall a thousand miles long. I have lived relatively close to the Mexican border for over 3 decades and based on everything I have heard and seen a massive wall would not be a good use of tax revenue. Beyond that, I could do without Trump's tendency to hit back at every attack. But I also recognize that it is in his DNA to hit back being a New Yorker. That is who he is and he is not pretending, so I accept it.
On tariffs and trade I would like to see very specific, limited goals for China, Mexico and EU and have the changes be phased in over a period of years. I view tariffs as an entitlement that other countries have become dependent upon, so if you go for too much too soon you risk full retaliation.
Thanks for replying. Makes complete sense. I get that. So from what I'm understanding, it's not "everything trump does, says is perfect, but it's some bad,good"
- May 17, 2013
- 67,493
- 32,631
- 2,290
On securing the wall and border first ............I will not budge on that..........no deal will be made on it without that first.The other side is a my way or the highway type of group. Leftist.........They don't budge and hardly ever negotiate............
If they were willing to negotiate to get a law passed that both could stomach without throwing our guts out in the process then deals could be made that wouldn't give everyone what they wanted but a compromise that would give points to both sides.
On issues like immigration they have made it clear they want open borders...........many have admitted it now and those always saying they don't are usually lying.
They can't be trusted.
So playing devils advocate, do you think any Republicans refuse to budge? It can't JUST BE leftist can it?
Are their some .........my way or the highway.......yes........compromise is how it is supposed to work........but controlling our borders and OBEYING and ENFORCING the laws of the Republic are first.
We can't hand them their Dreamers on a silver platter without serious concessions...........Not gonna happen.
CrazedScotsman
VIP Member
- Jul 1, 2012
- 980
- 263
- 80
I didn't vote for Trump in 2016 but will be voting for Trump in 2020.
For me it all comes down to the Supreme Court Justices. Right now Trump is replacing Conservative with Conservative but RBG is close to retirement as is Breyer and to replace Liberal with Conservative is what I want to happen.
So, I will vote for Trump in 2020.
I really shutter to think what Hillary would have done getting to nominate Justices to the Supreme Court. Talk about destroying the Constitution with far left interpretations just freaks me out.
For me it all comes down to the Supreme Court Justices. Right now Trump is replacing Conservative with Conservative but RBG is close to retirement as is Breyer and to replace Liberal with Conservative is what I want to happen.
So, I will vote for Trump in 2020.
I really shutter to think what Hillary would have done getting to nominate Justices to the Supreme Court. Talk about destroying the Constitution with far left interpretations just freaks me out.
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