What the Left Isn't Telling You About US Healthcare

Cecilie1200

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Nov 15, 2008
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Okay, let's discuss health care in industrialized nations, shall we? Let's cut through some of the liberal smoke and mirrors and get down to brass tacks.

The left tells us in horrified tones that the United States spends far more on health care than any other country, whether measured as a percentage of gross domestic product (GDP) or by expenditure per capita. This is quite true. the United States now spends close to 16 percent of GDP on health care, nearly 6.1 percent more than the average for other industrialized countries.

What is not true is that health care spending is automatically bad. To a large degree, America spends money on health care because it is a wealthy nation and chooses to do so. Economists consider health care a “normal good,” meaning that spending is positively correlated with income. As incomes rise, people want more of that good. Because we are a wealthy nation, we can and do demand more health care.

The left also tells us that health insurance premiums are rising faster than wages are, and this is also true. What they forget to tell you is that government health care programs, particularly Medicare and Medicaid, are piling up enormous burdens of debt for future generations. Medicare’s unfunded liabilities now top $50 trillion. Unchecked, Medicaid spending will increase fourfold as a percentage of federal outlays over the next century. In other words, what we already have in the direction they want to go isn't doing any better in the "holding down costs" arena. None of this indicates that what's needed is a huge new bureaucracy . . . of ANY type.

The left loves to cite a 2000 World Health Organization study that ranks the U.S. health care system 37th in the world, “slightly better than Slovenia.” What they don't bother to tell you (and often don't know themselves) is that this study bases its conclusions on such highly subjective measures as “fairness” and criteria that are not strictly related to a country’s health care system, such as “tobacco control.” For example, the WHO report penalizes the United States for not having a sufficiently progressive tax system, not providing all citizens with health insurance, and having a general paucity of social welfare programs. Indeed, much of the poor performance of the United States is due to its ranking of 54th in the category of fairness. The United States is actually penalized for adopting Health Savings Accounts and because, according to the WHO, patients pay too much out of pocket. Such judgments clearly reflect a particular political point of view, rather than a neutral measure of health care quality. They also neglect to mention that the WHO report ranks the United States number one in the world in responsiveness to patients’ needs in choice of provider, dignity, autonomy, timely care, and confidentiality. Whoops!

The left likes to point out how much higher other countries' life expectancy and infant mortality rates are compared to ours. What they don't tell you is that life expectancies are affected by exogenous factors such as violent crime, poverty, obesity, tobacco and drug use, and other issues unrelated to health care. In fact, a study by Robert Ohsfeldt and John Schneider for the American Enterprise Institute found that those exogenous factors are so distorting that if you correct for homicides and accidents, the United States rises to the top of the list for life expectancy.

Likewise, infant mortality is highly problematic. In the United States, very low birth-weight infants have a much greater chance of being brought to term with the latest medical technologies. Some of those low birthweight babies die soon after birth, which boosts our infant mortality rate, but in many other Western countries, those high-risk, low birth-weight infants are not included when infant mortality is calculated. In addition, many countries use abortion to eliminate problem pregnancies. For example, Michael Moore cites low infant mortality rates in Cuba, yet that country has one of the world’s highest abortion rates, meaning that many babies with health problems that could lead to early deaths are never brought to term.

When you compare the outcomes for specific diseases, the United States clearly outperforms the rest of the world. Whether the disease is cancer, pneumonia, heart disease, or AIDS, the chances of a patient surviving are far higher in the United States than in other countries. Notably, when former Italian prime minister Silvio Berlusconi needed heart surgery last year, he didn’t go to a French, Canadian, Cuban, or even Italian hospital—he went to the Cleveland Clinic in Ohio. Likewise, Canadian MP Belinda Stronach had surgery for her breast cancer at a California hospital.

The United States drives much of the innovation and research on health care worldwide. Eighteen of the last 25 winners of the Nobel Prize in Medicine are either U.S. citizens or individuals working here. U.S. companies have developed half of all new major medicines introduced worldwide over the past 20 years. In fact, Americans played a key role in 80 percent of the most important medical advances of the past 30 years. Advanced medical technology is far more available in the United States than in nearly any other country.

The same is true for prescription drugs. For example, 44 percent of Americans who could benefit from statins, lipid-lowering medication that reduces cholesterol and protects against heart disease, take the drug. That number seems low until compared with the 26 percent of Germans, 23 percent of Britons, and 17 percent of Italians who could both benefit from the drug and receive it. Similarly, 60 percent of Americans taking anti-psychotic medication for the treatment of schizophrenia or other mental illnesses are taking the most recent generation of drugs, which have fewer side effects. But just 20 percent of Spanish patients and 10 percent of Germans receive the most recent drugs.

(Thanks to the Cato Institute for this info.)
 
47 million people in America don't have health insurance.

60% of all bankruptcies are caused by medical bills.

The U.S. is the ONLY industrialized country that doesn't have a single payer healthcare system. Every Western democracy has a single payer system, and they pay HALF per person what we pay for healthcare.

In America the rich get great healthcare, the poor get none until they are at death's door.

What a fucked up society we have!
 
The brain dead left is already telling those things, ad nauseum, dickweed.

I think Chris has a macro that automatically posts the same old canards in every new thread about healthcare, in an attempt to kill them before anyone has a chance to have any sort of free, open, thoughtful discussion of the topic.
 
Chris is a room temperature IQ fucking nitwit, who only knows canards, slogans and worn out false dichotomy questions that beg the answers he wants.

He wouldn't know an analytical thought if it fell on him.

It's true. If an original thought ever entered his coconut, it would probably implode.

But back to the topic of the truth about US healthcare. None of this is to say that the US system is perfect, because it isn't. It's just to point out that what's wrong with our system isn't what the left tells us it is, and the solution DEFINITELY isn't what they tell us.
 
When faced with inconvienent truths, the right wing does two things...

Hurls insults.

Or changes the subject.

Your insults don't change the fact that our system sucks.

It punishes the sick and the poor.
 
When faced with inconvienent truths, the right wing does two things...

Hurls insults.

Or changes the subject.

Your insults don't change the fact that our system sucks.

It punishes the sick and the poor.

it rewards those that prepare and punishes those that do not. Some day it will punish you.
 
Perfection cannot be an option.

The problem with health care is that there's too much interference in the market, not too little.

Perfection is never an option as long as humans are involved. Still, there are lots of ways the US system could be improved. And you're correct. They all involve less government interference.
 
When faced with inconvienent truths, the right wing does two things...

Hurls insults.

Or changes the subject.

Your insults don't change the fact that our system sucks.

It punishes the sick and the poor.

it rewards those that prepare and punishes those that do not. Some day it will punish you.

It's already punishing him by treating him as the laughingstock that he is. It's just that he's too damned dumb to realize it.
 
When faced with inconvienent truths, the right wing does two things...

Hurls insults.

Or changes the subject.

Your insults don't change the fact that our system sucks.

It punishes the sick and the poor.
There you go again.

No substance.

Just lame-brained truisms and bromides.

Not worth any better reply than pointing out the obvious...That you're a meathead.
 
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Chris is a room temperature IQ fucking nitwit, who only knows canards, slogans and worn out false dichotomy questions that beg the answers he wants.

He wouldn't know an analytical thought if it fell on him.

It's true. If an original thought ever entered his coconut, it would probably implode.

But back to the topic of the truth about US healthcare. None of this is to say that the US system is perfect, because it isn't. It's just to point out that what's wrong with our system isn't what the left tells us it is, and the solution DEFINITELY isn't what they tell us.

No, you are ignoring what is wrong with the system.
 
Chris is a room temperature IQ fucking nitwit, who only knows canards, slogans and worn out false dichotomy questions that beg the answers he wants.

He wouldn't know an analytical thought if it fell on him.

It's true. If an original thought ever entered his coconut, it would probably implode.

But back to the topic of the truth about US healthcare. None of this is to say that the US system is perfect, because it isn't. It's just to point out that what's wrong with our system isn't what the left tells us it is, and the solution DEFINITELY isn't what they tell us.

No, you are ignoring what is wrong with the system.

No. you are ignoring that YOU are what's wrong with the country, you little parasite.
 
When faced with inconvienent truths, the right wing does two things...

Hurls insults.

Or changes the subject.

Your insults don't change the fact that our system sucks.

It punishes the sick and the poor.

No it doesn't.

Are there things wrong with it? Yes.

Room for improvement? Lots.

Should they be focusing on fixing and improving on what we already have? Yes.

Should the government be concocting a new jumbo-sized health care bureaucracy that will introduce gobs of red tape, that will cost way more money than what they're claiming, that will work less efficiently, that we can't afford, and that has much less to do with health care and much more to do with growing the government control over our lives even more? NO.
 
Are we still pushing the 47 million Americans thing here too?

Let us break down the infamous '47 million uninsured.' According to the Census Bureau, of that 47 million, 38 percent of them (18 million) have personal incomes of more than $50,000 a year. This means that they can afford coverage, and choose not to purchase it. Is it just to tax other working people to subsidize health coverage for these 18 million who could afford it for themselves but choose not to purchase it for themselves? Anybody with half a brain towards liberty would have to answer no to the above question.

Now that leaves us with 29 million uninsured left to explain.

Of that 29 million uninsured, the biggest chunk of them aren't even citizens. Yes, you guessed it, those pesky illegal immigrants that drive up the cost of everything. It seems that our uninsured problem is directly related to the lack of border security! Of course they wouldn't be able to be covered by private health insurers because they do not possess citizenship! Their number is about 12.6 million, or 27 percent of the original '47 million uninsured' number. This could be a higher percentage, because many prominent think tanks place the number of illegal immigrants as high as 20 million, instead of the 12 or 13 million figure. However, for the sake of argument, let us go with the most conservative figure.

Subtract the 12.6 number from the remaining 29 million uninsured number, and we come to the next stage of our breakdown, 16.4 million uninsured.

Of that remaining 16.4 million uninsured, 8 million are under the age of 18. If the parents of these young ones cannot afford to cover them either on their own family plans or independently, there are public insurance options already available for them but their parents have just not signed them up.

So that leaves us with 8.4 million uninsured, a figure less than 3 percent of the American population...

Debunking the 47 Million Myth - MyFoxmemphis Community Blog post


As for the banruptcy issue this is the study that most of this talk comes from..

Illness and medical bills caused half of the 1,458,000 personal bankruptcies in 2001, according to a study published by the journal Health Affairs.

The study estimates that medical bankruptcies affect about 2 million Americans annually -- counting debtors and their dependents, including about 700,000 children.



Read more: Medical Bills Leading Cause of Bankruptcy, Harvard Study Finds


This study reflect personal bankrupty and not ALL and is over 8 years old. Given the state of the economy now I would venture to say that the mortgage crisis might have something to say about those numbers as well as layoffs. I also have a simply suggestion for those who think this nation is such a terrible place, work within the framework of this nations form of Govt. to effect changes rather than outside it. or move to a nation that better suits your own ideals as to what your needs are.
 
When faced with inconvienent truths, the right wing does two things...

Hurls insults.

Or changes the subject.

Your insults don't change the fact that our system sucks.

It punishes the sick and the poor.

No it doesn't.

Are there things wrong with it? Yes.

Room for improvement? Lots.

Should they be focusing on fixing and improving on what we already have? Yes.

Should the government be concocting a new jumbo-sized health care bureaucracy that will introduce gobs of red tape, that will cost way more money than what they're claiming, that will work less efficiently, that we can't afford, and that has much less to do with health care and much more to do with growing the government control over our lives even more? NO.

Every other industrialized nation has a single payer healthcare and they pay HALF per person what we pay for healthcare. Why? Because the single payer system is more efficient.

The rest of the world knows this, and that is why they don't use a for profit system.
 
When faced with inconvienent truths, the right wing does two things...

Hurls insults.

Or changes the subject.

Your insults don't change the fact that our system sucks.

It punishes the sick and the poor.

No it doesn't.

Are there things wrong with it? Yes.

Room for improvement? Lots.

Should they be focusing on fixing and improving on what we already have? Yes.

Should the government be concocting a new jumbo-sized health care bureaucracy that will introduce gobs of red tape, that will cost way more money than what they're claiming, that will work less efficiently, that we can't afford, and that has much less to do with health care and much more to do with growing the government control over our lives even more? NO.

Every other industrialized nation has a single payer healthcare and they pay HALF per person what we pay for healthcare. Why? Because the single payer system is more efficient.

The rest of the world knows this, and that is why they don't use a for profit system.
except they don't. Holland and other European nations do not have single payer systems.
 
Okay, while we're on the subject of what the left doesn't tell people about US healthcare, let's discuss the REAL problems with our system that the left doesn't want you to know, because they aren't what the left would like them to be.

Rationing

Is there rationing in the US? Sure, especially in government programs like public hospitals that treat the poor, and Medicare and Medicaid.

Doctors estimate that as many as half of the 300,000 people on dialysis in the US might benefit from 6-day-a-week treatment; but Medicare only covers a maximum of 3 days a week.

Only about one in fifteen patients who could benefit from a device called HeartMate get it because Medicare won't pay for the full cost.

750,000 people suffer from sepsis each year, and 250,000 people die from it every year. Medicare balks at paying the cost ($6,800 a treatment) for Xigris, so doctors write fewer than 15,000 prescriptions for it a year.

Still, the Commonwealth Fund and Harvard School of Public Health tells us that only about 5% of Americans undergoing surgery have to wait more than four months. The figures for Australia, New Zealand, Canada, and Great Britain are 23%, 26%, 27%, and 36% respectively.

Inequality of Access

As we've all heard until our ears are ready to bleed, much of the US population does not have private health insurance and is not enrolled in public health programs. Studies show that the uninsured consume about 50% less health care than those with insurance, all other things being equal.

For decades, the European press has repeated the canard that poor people in the US get no care because they cannot afford it, and now the US press is echoing that. Not true. 95% of the elderly are enrolled in Medicare. Medicaid spends even more than Medicare does, even though it covers roughly the same number of people. The VA provides yet another safety net. And every state has a system of public hospitals and clinics for the indigent. Federal law requires emergency rooms to take all comers. State and federal laws both also require many hospitals to provide charity care, and offer matching funds for those institutions that provide a disproportionate share of care to Medicaid and the uninsured.

Low-income persons in the US without job-related health insurance spend only about fifty dollars per year more out of pocket than those with employer-provided health benefits. On average, they make 2.4 visits to doctors per year, compared to 3.4 for people with employer-provided insurance. When seriously ill, uninsured low- to moderate-income Americans receive about the same level of treatment with out of pocket costs about the same as those with employer-provided insurance.

But yeah, people with money have better health care than poor people. Being rich is always better than being poor, and that's as true in other countries as it is here.
 
No it doesn't.

Are there things wrong with it? Yes.

Room for improvement? Lots.

Should they be focusing on fixing and improving on what we already have? Yes.

Should the government be concocting a new jumbo-sized health care bureaucracy that will introduce gobs of red tape, that will cost way more money than what they're claiming, that will work less efficiently, that we can't afford, and that has much less to do with health care and much more to do with growing the government control over our lives even more? NO.

Every other industrialized nation has a single payer healthcare and they pay HALF per person what we pay for healthcare. Why? Because the single payer system is more efficient.

The rest of the world knows this, and that is why they don't use a for profit system.
except they don't. Holland and other European nations do not have single payer systems.

They have a government system that all can join. That is what I am talking about.

We should have a government system open to everyone with reasonable co-pays, and if others want to buy private insurance, they can.

I still think the French system is the best.

Their medical schools are free, they limit doctor liability, and doctor pay to a reasonable level. They also fund it, so there is no waiting.
 

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