what really matters?

[MrProlifer]

I don't really care too much for taxes, I am sure no one does, but tax isn't what makes me vote republican. It pains me to see people vote democrat just because they believe that person is going to bring them jobs. They don't see the pro-abortion-gay rights supporter they just voted into office. I'm a new daddy and how anyone could kill or beat a little baby is beyond me. I also would like to say I don't hate gay people just what they do. Lastly, how can a Christian be Democrat, when most of what they stand for is wrong?

 

[Avatar4321]

You dont understand. to these people those issues dont really matter. they are just "wedge" issues meant to divide us. I mean who cares if someone murders a defenseless child because they dont want to take responsibility for the night in the back seat with their boyfriend. its not our place to tell them to grow up and stop being selfish is it? But then again we live in america and have the freedom to speak our minds.

The fact is, these are teh most important issues. but people with guilty consciences dont want to deal with them.

 

[menewa]

We need to look at the deeper issue of why abortion is even practiced. If America had not lost it's tight communities, abortions would never be necessary. In the past, when one had a baby, they had an extended family and a close community with neighbors to help raise children. Modern America has barely any tight communities like this anymore. So, when someone gets pregnant today its all on them, and we've become a very selfish, materialistic society in the years since WWII. People don't have the extended family and the village type of community to help raise the babies anymore.
So, I would be completelty against abortion. I think it is disgusting and violent. But when a baby is raised in a home with no love or support, that child will manifest into something disgusting and violent.

 

[Shazbot]

It's called adoption.

-Douglas

 

[Gop guy]

Originally posted by Avatar4321
You dont understand. to these people those issues dont really matter. they are just "wedge" issues meant to divide us. I mean who cares if someone murders a defenseless child because they dont want to take responsibility for the night in the back seat with their boyfriend. its not our place to tell them to grow up and stop being selfish is it? But then again we live in america and have the freedom to speak our minds.

The fact is, these are teh most important issues. but people with guilty consciences dont want to deal with them.

It may not be very important to you Avatar.

However I believe that these people, and all who support them have blood on their hands.

They are murderers and their supporters accomplaces

 

[Modu$OperanDi]

Originally posted by menewa
If America had not lost it's tight communities, abortions would never be necessary. ... Modern America has barely any tight communities like this anymore. So, when someone gets pregnant today its all on them, ... So, I would be completelty against abortion. I think it is disgusting and violent. But when a baby is raised in a home with no love or support, that child will manifest into something disgusting and violent.

Give me a break. America will never ever be a number of 'tight communities', I would dispute if it ever was. It is clear you are not focusing on the entirety of America, i.e. poverty, and areas which will always manifest violence. Abortions will always be necessary, I like how you completely ignore disgusting circumstances such as a woman being raped by her own brother, peachy situations such as that deserve the option to abort. I think ou need to listen to 'Brenda's Got a Baby'.
I support abortion, if you don't, I can only say I think you are focusing on the wrong thing. It is a hot issue and always will be, but fact is, things are going to get far more fucked up in the next century to gripe about a woman's right to choose.

 

[dmp]

Originally posted by Modu$OperanDi
Give me a break. America will never ever be a number of 'tight communities', I would dispute if it ever was. It is clear you are not focusing on the entirety of America, i.e. poverty, and areas which will always manifest violence. Abortions will always be necessary, I like how you completely ignore disgusting circumstances such as a woman being raped by her own brother, peachy situations such as that deserve the option to abort. I think ou need to listen to 'Brenda's Got a Baby'.
I support abortion, if you don't, I can only say I think you are focusing on the wrong thing. It is a hot issue and always will be, but fact is, things are going to get far more fucked up in the next century to gripe about a woman's right to choose.

I'm thinking Lacey Peterson's parents should go to jail/be executed because of her killing. It's Good to punish vicitims.



Even babies born of incest or rape are still 'people'.

 

[Modu$OperanDi]

A single woman who cannot afford a child victimizes herself by having one.

 

[brneyedgrl80]

Originally posted by MrProlifer
I don't really care too much for taxes, I am sure no one does, but tax isn't what makes me vote republican. It pains me to see people vote democrat just because they believe that person is going to bring them jobs. They don't see the pro-abortion-gay rights supporter they just voted into office. I'm a new daddy and how anyone could kill or beat a little baby is beyond me. I also would like to say I don't hate gay people just what they do. Lastly, how can a Christian be Democrat, when most of what they stand for is wrong?

Actually, that's some of the reasons I do vote Democrat. I don't really care about the tax issues.

As for what's wrong or right, it all depends what side politically and religiously you stand.

 

[HGROKIT]

Originally posted by Modu$OperanDi
A single woman who cannot afford a child victimizes herself by having one.

Did you read what you posted and realize how dumb that comment it?

She vitimizes herself by having sex. The child does not victimize her!

She can always give the child up for adoption.

Bottom damn line though is that if she hadn't let her boyfriend or whomever take an un-protected poke at her, she wouldn't be pregnant. She should bear the kid and deal with it.

 

[Shazbot]

I support giving women the choice to abort only in situations of rape (albeit in the VERY early stages of the pregnancy). However, whenever the woman becomes pregnant by voluntarily having sex, it becomes her problem. If she can't support the child, she can give it up for adoption. If she can support the child, it is her responsibility to raise him/her. To freely have sex and then simply abort if and when a baby happens to come along is and always will be no less than murder.

-Douglas

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Originally posted by menewa
We need to look at the deeper issue of why abortion is even practiced. If America had not lost it's tight communities, abortions would never be necessary. In the past, when one had a baby, they had an extended family and a close community with neighbors to help raise children. Modern America has barely any tight communities like this anymore. So, when someone gets pregnant today its all on them, and we've become a very selfish, materialistic society in the years since WWII. People don't have the extended family and the village type of community to help raise the babies anymore.
So, I would be completelty against abortion. I think it is disgusting and violent. But when a baby is raised in a home with no love or support, that child will manifest into something disgusting and violent.

Tight family connections are mocked and maligned by the left, considered something only hillbillies in "fly-over" country practice. Check yourself, before you wreck yourself.

It doesn't take a village, it takes a family. Remember how the left maligned families values in the '92 election i.e."Hate is not a family value"?. Your own house is in shambles.

 

[dmp]

Originally posted by rtwngAvngr
Tight family connections are mocked and maligned by the left, considered something only hillbillies in "fly-over" country practice. Check yourself, before you wreck yourself.

It doesn't take a village, it takes a family. Remember how the left maligned families values in the '92 election i.e."Hate is not a family value"?. Your own house is in shambles.

Hate sure as hell IS a family value - and SHOULD be taught.

Hate those things which are evil. Do not allow for evil simply because it's prefaced by "It's my opinion"...

 

[MrProlifer]

I don't care if she was raped or not, if God doesn't want that baby here he'll kill it in the womb himself not some doctor. Besides the baby did nothing wrong punish the person who raped you not the innocent baby, because then there would be two victims, the woman and the child

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by Gop guy
It may not be very important to you Avatar.

However I believe that these people, and all who support them have blood on their hands.

They are murderers and their supporters accomplaces

Um you did read the end of my post and detect the sarcasm didnt you?

 

[acludem]

I believe it is immoral for a government to make medical and moral decisions for individuals. The Republican party would have the federal government make ALL moral and medical decisions for people. I am morally opposed to abortion, but is neither my right nor my place to make that deep moral decision for someone else. I do have a problem with the idea that life begins at conception - if this is true than every woman who's ever had sex and more than one period is a serial killer. Only a microscopic percentage of fertilized eggs ever survive pregnancy. Most don't even survive the first few hours. This is a biological fact. As for the gay rights issue, this is another example of the religious right seeking to use the power of the federal government to force their personal moral codes on the rest of us.

I vote Democratic because I believe in freedom. The religious right wing, which controls the Republican party, opposes individual liberty and freedom.

acludem

 

[menewa]

Originally posted by rtwngAvngr
Tight family connections are mocked and maligned by the left, considered something only hillbillies in "fly-over" country practice. Check yourself, before you wreck yourself.

It doesn't take a village, it takes a family. Remember how the left maligned families values in the '92 election i.e."Hate is not a family value"?. Your own house is in shambles.

How can you say that anyone who has progressive beliefs is against a tight community and a close family?

 

[acludem]

The right paints itself as "pro-family" yet they seek to tear children from the only homes they've known because a parent is gay. The right is only "pro-families who subscribe to our personal religious and moral beliefs". As far as the right is concerned, the rest of us aren't "families"

acludem

 

[Avatar4321]

Only a totally heartless person could call the slaughter of a child a "medical procedure". What a sad world we live in.

If you want to support infanticide. fine. But dont think we are going to shut up because you have justified your conscience on this issue away. Why is it those who pretend to advocate on behalf of compassion for the innocent have no pretense in killing the most innocent without a thought? And why are those who have compassion on the innocent treated as though they have committed the most grevious sin to man to suggest that a man and woman take responsibility for their actions and raise the child they obviously thought they were mature enough to make?

And why is it when people make poor choices and dont want to face the consequences they try to ignore responsibility by saying they have a right to choose whether they face the consequences or not. BS. You made the choice. you have to face the consequences and i can promise you in the long run having an abortion will have been the worse consequence then taking responsibility for yourself.

 

[Shazbot]

Originally posted by acludem
I believe it is immoral for a government to make medical and moral decisions for individuals. The Republican party would have the federal government make ALL moral and medical decisions for people. I am morally opposed to abortion, but is neither my right nor my place to make that deep moral decision for someone else. I do have a problem with the idea that life begins at conception - if this is true than every woman who's ever had sex and more than one period is a serial killer. Only a microscopic percentage of fertilized eggs ever survive pregnancy. Most don't even survive the first few hours. This is a biological fact. As for the gay rights issue, this is another example of the religious right seeking to use the power of the federal government to force their personal moral codes on the rest of us.

I vote Democratic because I believe in freedom. The religious right wing, which controls the Republican party, opposes individual liberty and freedom.

Then you need to ask yourself, "What are morals and moral decisions?" You need to realize that the whole idea of government and a set of laws exists to keep people within those moral boundaries. And in case you haven't noticed, all our laws as well as the constitution are based on those very morals.

You see, there will always be people of different "morals" in any society. If it suddenly became legal to steal cars in the United States, can you imagine how many cars would be stolen? And yet, I, for one, would not steal anything. Why? Because that is my own moral choice. Fortunately, my own "moral decision" coincides with the that of the government. Go ahead, put the moral issues in the hands of the "people" and see what happens.

We might as well make drug use legal. I mean, technically, not every drug addict out there commits crime. But then again, what is crime, but a violation of moral standards. Maybe my next-door neighbor really doesn't respect the law (or moral) of no indecent public exposure. I mean, he's not hurting anyone by walking the streets nude, is he? So why should it be a crime?

What we find here is not a question about the rights of women to have abortions. We find a question about whether or not we can bend or change the ground rules to our own convenience. Those who try to justify abortion rights, are trying to justify a change in the definition of the word "murder." I mean, all my moral values are, in fact, based upon my own religious convictions. But then, I guess people of a different moral standard suddenly have a free ticket to do what they want because they don't believe in my morals? I don't think so.

Here I can allude back to the post I made in the thread about God and the Pledge of Allegiance. Basically, this is a country of religious freedom - you can believe or disbelieve all you want. However, it is a nation created in piety to God, and the government was created with the allowance for those who don't believe. Notice the word allowance. What I mean here is that although the nation affords religious freedom, it was never meant to be an atheist nation that respects religion. Quite the opposite. So you want to live in the United States of America, but you don't believe in God? That's perfectly fine - just don't break the pious morals upon which the nation was formed.

The fact of the matter is that the conservatives do not wish to control the lives of anyone through its moral system. The conservatives wish to conserve (hence the name) that which is tried and true throughout the years, so as to promote peace and safety. The moment you start changing the rules and the moral standard, you never know where you will end up.

-Douglas