What Is Heaven or Paradise or the Afterlife?

[Sky Dancer]

Huggy speaks to the misuse of faith, not the use of it to make you happy.

 

[HUGGY]

Don't be so hard on yourself, I like you.

Why does anyone have to be deferring. I don't think I do. I'm really very happy with most of my life and the things I'm not thrilled about aren't really in my control. I believe in God and doing nice things for people and I don't think I'm missing out on anything. What am I being cheated out of?

We are all cheated by the miss use of what we have.

I'm starting to think you don't have much of an answer. My faith makes me happy, how am I missing out on anything because I have it?

If your indoctrination is thorough enough you personally might find my argument lacking.

Fortunately this is not a PM.

You are young..not a crime. You say you are open which is a good thing up to a rational point. You would not jump off of a building just because 100 million others would do so if thier religious elders told them to.

 

[Amanda]

We are all cheated by the miss use of what we have.

I'm starting to think you don't have much of an answer. My faith makes me happy, how am I missing out on anything because I have it?

If your indoctrination is thorough enough you personally might find my argument lacking.

Fortunately this is not a PM.

You are young..not a crime. You say you are open which is a good thing up to a rational point. You would not jump off of a building just because 100 million others would do so if thier religious elders told them to.

Personally, I'm finding your argument missing. You haven't addressed what I asked. I don't think I've been indoctrinated... I'm a pretty crappy Christian by a lot of peoples standards. I have a lot of my own ideas about how things work that I got from talking to people, reading books and self reflection.

I believe in the power of unconditional love. I think God is the essence of that love. I think the more we love without any expectation the closer we get to God. I wake up every morning smiling because God is the first thing I think of. When I go through my day I try to send positive energy into the world with everything I do, whether it's just a smile or holding the door for someone. It makes me happy to see other people happy and it's so easy to be kind and helpful.

I think about my life and it's so full of good things... I just don't know what I could be missing. I wish I could get another job I liked, but if it doesn't happen I have a backup plan and everything will be fine. I know it will because I know God will take care of me. I hope every day that I can be a good enough person and maybe make a positive difference in someone's life. And I do it without any hope that it will get me a reward. I'm pretty sure that I'll never live up to God's expectations. I can't imagine being let into heaven, so I'm making this world my heaven, or as close as I get to it.

 

[Coloradomtnman]

Personally, I'm finding your argument missing. You haven't addressed what I asked. I don't think I've been indoctrinated... I'm a pretty crappy Christian by a lot of peoples standards. I have a lot of my own ideas about how things work that I got from talking to people, reading books and self reflection.

I believe in the power of unconditional love. I think God is the essence of that love. I think the more we love without any expectation the closer we get to God. I wake up every morning smiling because God is the first thing I think of. When I go through my day I try to send positive energy into the world with everything I do, whether it's just a smile or holding the door for someone. It makes me happy to see other people happy and it's so easy to be kind and helpful.

You sound like a hippie!

I think about my life and it's so full of good things... I just don't know what I could be missing. I wish I could get another job I liked, but if it doesn't happen I have a backup plan and everything will be fine. I know it will because I know God will take care of me. I hope every day that I can be a good enough person and maybe make a positive difference in someone's life. And I do it without any hope that it will get me a reward. I'm pretty sure that I'll never live up to God's expectations. I can't imagine being let into heaven, so I'm making this world my heaven, or as close as I get to it.

Yeah, whatever, go twirl, you dirty hippie!

 

[AllieBaba]

Believers don't find non-believers depressing. We pity them.

And once again Sky chirps up with something that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. She's like a Buddha parody, or one of those bad cartoons with Asians saying off-the-wall things prefixed with "Confucious say....."

 

[Coloradomtnman]

Believers don't find non-believers depressing. We pity them.

And once again Sky chirps up with something that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. She's like a Buddha parody, or one of those bad cartoons with Asians saying off-the-wall things prefixed with "Confucious say....."

It doesn't make sense to you, Allie, but it does to those who don't believe. Kinda like the Bible doesn't make sense to us, but makes sense to those with faith in the Christian god.

Nonbelievers find believers to sometimes be ethnocentric (Jesus is white), old fashioned (marriage because of pregnancy), ignorant (not knowing much about the world), uneducated (not knowing much about any of the branches of science), faithcentric (only the faithful will be rewarded, everyone else will be eternally punished), pushy (evangelicals), zealous (angry evangelicals), weird (speaking in tongues - c'mon, its sooo weird), and pathetic. Not all nonbelievers feel that way, and not all nonbelievers who feel that way feel that way about all believers. There are some believers whose spirituality I can respect, like editec, Immanuel, Abikersailor, Cardinal 101, and a few others on USMB.

But believers who represent themselves that way that Charlie Bass, Yukon, Cecilie1200, Againsheila, and you Allie, just turn us nonbelievers off and make us never wish to even consider putting faith in your particular type of exclusive, angry, and seemingly hateful Christian religion.

I wish nonbelievers like JBeukema, Huggy, Tofu Dog, and a couple others here on USMB wouldn't represent us nonbelievers the same way that you represent Christianity. I can understand their frustration and anger, I've been there. But I'm learning to accept that some people believe and they can't choose to not believe. I just hope some Christians would accept that some people don't believe and that they can't choose to believe.

 

[AllieBaba]

The exact same thing could be said about non-believers. Only we'd cite different examples of their stupidity.

 

[i/3ootleg]

Coloradomtnman, you stated that you stumble upon logic that supports the idea of a creator, but then through scrutiny you find flaws...

please if you care to share, what are these flaws that you find??? what is there that refutes the existence of a creator?

Well, I should've wrote "seems logical at the time but upon further scrutiny I find that it isn't."

The flaws I find are anything. For a couple of hours once I thought that the very existence of the Universe had to have a intelligent source behind it for various reasons. But then it occurred to me that, no, it didn't. The Universe could exist just because that is the nature of the Universe.

Nothing refutes the existence of a creator, but nothing supports it either.

What isn't logical about being initiated rather then poppin outta thin air into existence?

to observe the two statements, the ladder seems more unlogical don't you think?

 

[Kalam]

to observe the two statements, the ladder seems more unlogical don't you think?

This ladder seems illogical:

 

[TofuDog]

I agree with Amanda (and not just because she's a hot hippie), if peeps want to believe in an afterlife with 72 virgins or a heavenly blissful existence with all their dead relatives to help them make it through the day, then go for it, it's not hurting anyone. Ok, except maybe for muslims who like to blow peeps up... I might think it's really stupid to believe in an alien who turned into god, like mormons do, but as long as it doesn't hurt anyone, who cares? And anyways, it's just more peeps to make fun of.

kalam, I'll say it again, you very funny guy. That ladder is fucking hilarious.

 

[HUGGY]

Thanks, Huggy, you always have something worthwhile to contribute...

I think it would be worthwhile if people stopped wasting thier lives on fantasies. Foundations of truth would lead to better societies. Childish thought leads to childish action.

Yeah, well, I agree, but I try not to be so abrasive about it. It represent us non-believers poorly and only hurts our recruitment numbers. Oh shit, did I just say that out-loud? Damn, now the believers know our true agenda! Satan's gonna be pissed when he finds out about this...

What on earth is abrasive about my above reply?

 

[HUGGY]

Huggy speaks to the misuse of faith, not the use of it to make you happy.

That's an oversimplification. I am thoroughly convinced that there is no god. Therefore to me all religion is based on a lie. Don't look to me for respect. I do not respect liars or those that pass on lies.

A stark position. Certainly. There is no nice way to tell someone that everything they and thier ancestors believed is total crap.

But thats the way it is. I don't need to apologise for not being a moron. You that believe in invisible all powerful entities don't need to apologise either. Just wise up, stop propogating bullshit and join the real world.

 

[ABikerSailor]

You do not need to worry what Heaven looks like, you will not be going there. Only 144000 chosen will ascend to Heaven after Judgement day, as spirits.

The rest of those deemed worthy will be restored to a perfect health in a body and live on a restored Earth ruled by Jesus for God, aided by the 144000. There will be no sickness or disease, no death, no wanting for anything. Peace will envelope the Earth and mankind.

Those found to be evil or to have forsaken God will be permanently put to death. Satan and his evil Angels will also be destroyed for ever.

Those never taught the way will be restored to life and be instructed and given a chance to repent and join God through Jesus.

See.........this is what is wrong with the Jehovah's Witnesses as well as the FLDS........they think that they are the only ones with a lock on Heaven, when probably the opposite is true. If the Christians are right, then we're supposedly all (the sinners) supposed to be put into a lake of fire to burn for eternity.

Only trouble is, how can something that has a beginning (like us), be in existence before we're born? Therefore, eternal damnation is a myth.

Additionally, according to the Torah, NOBODY stays in hell forever, nor is it a place of eternal torment (see above about eternal). It is actually a place called Ghenninom, and it's not so much a place of torture, as a place of refinement. The fires are there to refine you and burn out the bad, so that you can enter Heaven. Kinda like going out into the earth, getting all muddy and dirty (i.e. sinning), and then having to go take a shower before being allowed into a country club (Heaven).

The current version of hell didn't come into being until the Catholic church started it. Why? They noticed that attendance was up when they spoke of eternal damnation and demons tearing you apart, because hey, everyone likes a good scary story. So, in the interest of keeping attendance up (as well as the pews full), they started to give fire and brimstone speeches.

The Rapture is yet another myth. It didn't exist until the mid 1800's, and some sects liked that so much that they started to spread that lie around until quite a few others adopted it.

And.........last.......Yeshua (Jesus) wasn't the only person to ascend into Heaven. The musLAMES think that Mohammed did, which is why they pray 5 times a day, and there was also a dude in the Old Testament (Elijah).

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