What exactly does the "Left" want?

[DiamondDave]

Ok, let me propose a hypothetical situation -

Let's say I am, white, male, employed making 100k+/year, fully insured and pays taxes. Why would I support all of these "leftist" issues if almost none of them were directly benefiting me? As in, I am part of the population that does pay taxes, I don't need "free" healthcare, I am not looking to marry a man, etc...

Please, logically explain why I would support a "leftist agenda" if I fit the description of the person above.

There is no logical explanation. But, my gut would be... the need to be seen as "caring". Typical emotive mumbo-jumbo.

Well said

 

[Oddball]

Ok, let me propose a hypothetical situation -

Let's say I am, white, male, employed making 100k+/year, fully insured and pays taxes. Why would I support all of these "leftist" issues if almost none of them were directly benefiting me? As in, I am part of the population that does pay taxes, I don't need "free" healthcare, I am not looking to marry a man, etc...

Please, logically explain why I would support a "leftist agenda" if I fit the description of the person above.

Because you're a fool, with either an over-inflated sense of your altruism and/or has some guilt issues. Probably coupled with a sense that all the world's problems simply overwhelm you, to the point where you believe that it's someone else's responsibility to fix them all.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

"I care, therefore I demand that you pay"

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

I don't remember who said it, and I am paraphrasing... but, "a person with a good heart doesn't need to wrestle you to the ground and force you to acknowledge it; it is readily observed"

This is why many of us view you with such cynicism.

 

[RDD_1210]

Wow, So not a single reasonable response. Why am I not surprised.

What I proved is that when your theory that all democrats are just looking for are handouts or to promote some personal agenda is debunked because someone who is white, male, straight, and well-off must be doing it all out of guilt. Guilt!! LOL! That was much easier than I thought. I'm glad to see your theories and ideas are so well thought out.

And to think I was expecting a half-way intelligent answer from one of you. But what do I get....."Guilt". Amazing! These are the "minds" of the far right wing. Be proud that you have such a strong grasp on what the country is really like.

 

[Oddball]

Wow, So not a single reasonable response. Why am I not surprised.

What I proved is that when your theory that all democrats are just looking for are handouts or to promote some personal agenda is debunked because someone who is white, male, straight, and well-off must be doing it all out of guilt. Guilt!! LOL! That was much easier than I thought. I'm glad to see your theories and ideas are so well thought out.

And to think I was expecting a half-way intelligent answer from one of you. But what do I get....."Guilt". Amazing! These are the "minds" of the far right wing. Be proud that you have such a strong grasp on what the country is really like.

Wow...Such a clear and well thought out explanation as to why you support people who clearly work against your own interests (See? Others can do that too!).

You asked and got the speculations, without ever taking a position or explaining why you do so ...Well, how 'bout it?

 

[westwall]

Don't you fools realize that a stable, prosperous citizenry supports a stable, prosperous economy? WHY don't you get that??? We know you guys are ok with this country sliding into a third world oligarchy ruled by megacorporations, but we just don't understand why. Do you really think it is healthy for a nation's top 5% to control 95% of the wealth? That is where we are headed.

In my collection of literature is a 1932 US Communist Party newspaper that claims 2% of the population controlled 76% of the nations wealth. When Clinton was president there was a reading into the Congressional Record that 1% of the population controls 90% of the wealth (this was in 1994 I believe).

So what happened all those decades? First of all the Democratic Party won control of both Houses of Congress for 40 continuous years. They also controlled the Presidency for roughly half of that time. They clearly were not working for the poor as the percentage of the poor in this country has remained basically the same...even after LBJ's "War on Poverty" which squandered a trillion dollars for no effect. If you look at the wealthiest members of Congress there are more Democrats on the list than there are Republicans and it is the Congress that writes tax law. So they have a vested interest in perpetuating their advantage.

Tax law effects the poor and the middle class...not the wealthy. When David Rockefeller inherited he had to pay slightly over 100,000 in taxes. And he was pissed off that he had to do so. This on a fortune that is in the billions.

Inheritance taxes benefit the very wealthy not the poor. It stratifies wealth at the highest level. Only those who were not rich enough to put together a Complex Irrevocable Trust (like the Rockefellers and the Kennedy's, and the other super rich have) will pay taxes and thus the super rich stay super rich and those who would try to break into the club are denied.

If you look at most laws that are supposed to control the bad corporations you see that they only truly effect the small businesses in the country, and in fact they drive most of them out of business. A regulation that is supposed to control pollution for instance is so expensive to implememnt that a small business folds. the corporation on the other hand hires a couple of people to make sure the paperwork is properly filed, raises their prices to pay for the inconvenience, and what most people never figure out is the regulation was suggested by the corporation. The corporation knows it can handle the job quite easily and also knows that the local small business can't thus they close and the big corporation eliminates a competitor. Why do you think that no matter where you go in the US you see the same crappy stores? There are no regional differences anymore.

The US is becoming a carbon copy image all across this country of ours and the very people who complain about it are the very ones driving the bus.

 

[RDD_1210]

Wow, So not a single reasonable response. Why am I not surprised.

What I proved is that when your theory that all democrats are just looking for are handouts or to promote some personal agenda is debunked because someone who is white, male, straight, and well-off must be doing it all out of guilt. Guilt!! LOL! That was much easier than I thought. I'm glad to see your theories and ideas are so well thought out.

And to think I was expecting a half-way intelligent answer from one of you. But what do I get....."Guilt". Amazing! These are the "minds" of the far right wing. Be proud that you have such a strong grasp on what the country is really like.

Wow...Such a clear and well thought out explanation as to why you support people who clearly work against your own interests (See? Others can do that too!).

You asked and got the speculations, without ever taking a position or explaining why you do so ...Well, how 'bout it?

So I support people who "work against my own interests"? So perhaps I support those interests then because I feel they are just the right thing to do for the good of the entire country? Did you consider that? Would that seem more plausible than the notion that I support "liberal ideas" out of some sort of guilt?

And are you saying that you only support people who work in favor of your self interests?

 

[Oddball]

Wow, So not a single reasonable response. Why am I not surprised.

What I proved is that when your theory that all democrats are just looking for are handouts or to promote some personal agenda is debunked because someone who is white, male, straight, and well-off must be doing it all out of guilt. Guilt!! LOL! That was much easier than I thought. I'm glad to see your theories and ideas are so well thought out.

And to think I was expecting a half-way intelligent answer from one of you. But what do I get....."Guilt". Amazing! These are the "minds" of the far right wing. Be proud that you have such a strong grasp on what the country is really like.

Wow...Such a clear and well thought out explanation as to why you support people who clearly work against your own interests (See? Others can do that too!).

You asked and got the speculations, without ever taking a position or explaining why you do so ...Well, how 'bout it?

So I support people who "work against my own interests"? So perhaps I support those interests then because I feel they are just the right thing to do for the good of the entire country? Did you consider that? Would that seem more plausible than the notion that I support "liberal ideas" out of some sort of guilt?

Yeah, you feel, with no further elaboration as to why....'Nuf said.

And are you saying that you only support people who work in favor of your self interests?

You mean that what's in it for me should be of a lesser importance than your feelings?...How selfish can you get?

 

[Twofox]

Some good discussion here. Please try to remain to topic.

I'm seeing a pattern here between the 2 sides, but will withhold comment on it for now.

Also, I'd like to hear more from the DEMS out there.

 

[RDD_1210]

Wow...Such a clear and well thought out explanation as to why you support people who clearly work against your own interests (See? Others can do that too!).

You asked and got the speculations, without ever taking a position or explaining why you do so ...Well, how 'bout it?

So I support people who "work against my own interests"? So perhaps I support those interests then because I feel they are just the right thing to do for the good of the entire country? Did you consider that? Would that seem more plausible than the notion that I support "liberal ideas" out of some sort of guilt?

Yeah, you feel, with no further elaboration as to why....'Nuf said.

And are you saying that you only support people who work in favor of your self interests?

You mean that what's in it for me should be of a lesser importance than your feelings?...How selfish can you get?

LOL, that's all you got? LMAO!!!!

So now I have to prove what I think is best for the country? It's my opinion, which also happens to go completely against everything the right wingers on this board claim democrats to be and makes your ridiculous theories that liberals just want handouts to be absurd.

And I never said what I wanted is more important than what you want. I did however say that I see the value in what the country needs is more important than what I need. That's whats called being American.....look it up, you've seemed to have forgotten.

Thanks for helping me prove my point so easily though!

 

[Oddball]

What I got was you describing what makes you support the left in emotional terms....You can't un-type it.

People making their decisions on the caprice emotional responses, rather than reason, simply have no ethical compass. Therefore, your opinion of what's best for the country, let alone yourself, is suspect at best. Moreover, if your you can't explain what's in it for someone else to go along with you, other than their particular emotional response, then it's safe to say that you care little to nothing for the reasoned opinions of others.

 

[Meister]

So I support people who "work against my own interests"? So perhaps I support those interests then because I feel they are just the right thing to do for the good of the entire country? Did you consider that? Would that seem more plausible than the notion that I support "liberal ideas" out of some sort of guilt?

Yeah, you feel, with no further elaboration as to why....'Nuf said.

And are you saying that you only support people who work in favor of your self interests?

You mean that what's in it for me should be of a lesser importance than your feelings?...How selfish can you get?

LOL, that's all you got? LMAO!!!!

So now I have to prove what I think is best for the country? It's my opinion, which also happens to go completely against everything the right wingers on this board claim democrats to be and makes your ridiculous theories that liberals just want handouts to be absurd.

And I never said what I wanted is more important than what you want. I did however say that I see the value in what the country needs is more important than what I need. That's whats called being American.....look it up, you've seemed to have forgotten.

Thanks for helping me prove my point so easily though!

Oh brother......Being American isn't paying for the other guy. It's giving the other guy a chance to pay for himself, I'm all for that. If the other guy doesn't want to jump on the opportunity, then he gets what he gets. As for those who aren't able for one reason or another, we already have a safety net for them.
But, in the end no matter what your claim as what an American IS.....you sound strangely like a redistribution of wealth sort of a person.

 

[RDD_1210]

What I got was you describing what makes you support the left in emotional terms....You can't un-type it.

People making their decisions on the caprice emotional responses, rather than reason, simply have no ethical compass. Therefore, your opinion of what's best for the country, let alone yourself, is suspect at best. Moreover, if your you can't explain what's in it for someone else to go along with you, other than their particular emotional response, then it's safe to say that you care little to nothing for the reasoned opinions of others.

So you want me to explain my rationale for each topic to you? LOL, feel free to look up my rationale in any of the other threads on this site if you so desperately need to know what drives my opinions.

The fact is you have no leg to stand on and have resorted to senseless rambling. You have already proven that your best explanation for my viewpoints is absurd and poorly thought out and now you're actually asking for proof of my own viewpoints. Talk about desperation mode. Ha!!! Then you proceeded to tell us about your selfish views and the fact that what's best for you is more important than whats best for the nation.

So I've already shown that you don't understand who a liberal is and at the same time showing what kind of conservative you truly are. Care to ramble on any further and dig your hole deeper?

 

[Meister]

What I got was you describing what makes you support the left in emotional terms....You can't un-type it.

People making their decisions on the caprice emotional responses, rather than reason, simply have no ethical compass. Therefore, your opinion of what's best for the country, let alone yourself, is suspect at best. Moreover, if your you can't explain what's in it for someone else to go along with you, other than their particular emotional response, then it's safe to say that you care little to nothing for the reasoned opinions of others.

So you want me to explain my rationale for each topic to you? LOL, feel free to look up my rationale in any of the other threads on this site if you so desperately need to know what drives my opinions.

The fact is you have no leg to stand on and have resorted to senseless rambling. You have already proven that your best explanation for my viewpoints is absurd and poorly thought out and now you're actually asking for proof of my own viewpoints. Talk about desperation mode. Ha!!! Then you proceeded to tell us about your selfish views and the fact that what's best for you is more important than whats best for the nation.

So I've already shown that you don't understand who a liberal is and at the same time showing what kind of conservative you truly are. Care to ramble on any further and dig your hole deeper?

huh?

 

[Wicked Jester]

I would like to repeal Corporations' unlimited access to the election media procees. I would also like to end farm subsidies for corn, soybeans and wheat. I would like for big agra to be stringently regulated. No more genetically moderated food or fish and the company will HAVE to tell you exactly which grocery store they sold their recalled biohazards to. I would really like to see a national drive to come up with energy options other than oil. We need to legalize hemp and put it to use - tax it, regulate it, whatever. We need a serious non-profit public option for health insurance. That industry can morph into a supplemental / boutique insurance provider. I would also like to see gay marriage legal.

THIS!......is the reason we have a douchebag now occupying the oval office.

THIS!......is the reason why mental testing and IQ tests should be required before ANY BODY is allowed to cast a ballot, anywhere, AT ANY TIME!

Friggin' liberal moonbats!

 

[RDD_1210]

Yeah, you feel, with no further elaboration as to why....'Nuf said.


You mean that what's in it for me should be of a lesser importance than your feelings?...How selfish can you get?

LOL, that's all you got? LMAO!!!!

So now I have to prove what I think is best for the country? It's my opinion, which also happens to go completely against everything the right wingers on this board claim democrats to be and makes your ridiculous theories that liberals just want handouts to be absurd.

And I never said what I wanted is more important than what you want. I did however say that I see the value in what the country needs is more important than what I need. That's whats called being American.....look it up, you've seemed to have forgotten.

Thanks for helping me prove my point so easily though!

Oh brother......Being American isn't paying for the other guy. It's giving the other guy a chance to pay for himself, I'm all for that. If the other guy doesn't want to jump on the opportunity, then he gets what he gets. As for those who aren't able for one reason or another, we already have a safety net for them.
But, in the end no matter what your claim as what an American IS.....you sound strangely like a redistribution of wealth sort of a person.

And what safety net is that exactly?

And conservatives sound like redistribution of wealth people to me too, except that wealth is going from the bottom up.

 

[Meister]

LOL, that's all you got? LMAO!!!!

So now I have to prove what I think is best for the country? It's my opinion, which also happens to go completely against everything the right wingers on this board claim democrats to be and makes your ridiculous theories that liberals just want handouts to be absurd.

And I never said what I wanted is more important than what you want. I did however say that I see the value in what the country needs is more important than what I need. That's whats called being American.....look it up, you've seemed to have forgotten.

Thanks for helping me prove my point so easily though!

Oh brother......Being American isn't paying for the other guy. It's giving the other guy a chance to pay for himself, I'm all for that. If the other guy doesn't want to jump on the opportunity, then he gets what he gets. As for those who aren't able for one reason or another, we already have a safety net for them.
But, in the end no matter what your claim as what an American IS.....you sound strangely like a redistribution of wealth sort of a person.

And what safety net is that exactly?

And conservatives sound like redistribution of wealth people to me too, except that wealth is going from the bottom up.

Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid and Welfare. WTF?
The bottom 50% (or there abouts) of income earners pay no income tax. The top 10% pay something like 70% (if not more) of the income tax.
Dude, when is enough, enough for your liberal mind?

 

[RDD_1210]

Oh brother......Being American isn't paying for the other guy. It's giving the other guy a chance to pay for himself, I'm all for that. If the other guy doesn't want to jump on the opportunity, then he gets what he gets. As for those who aren't able for one reason or another, we already have a safety net for them.
But, in the end no matter what your claim as what an American IS.....you sound strangely like a redistribution of wealth sort of a person.

And what safety net is that exactly?

And conservatives sound like redistribution of wealth people to me too, except that wealth is going from the bottom up.

Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid and Welfare. WTF?

So you've got the elderly covered and people below the poverty line. What about middle class Americans?

 

[Toro]

What I got was you describing what makes you support the left in emotional terms....You can't un-type it.

People making their decisions on the caprice emotional responses, rather than reason, simply have no ethical compass. Therefore, your opinion of what's best for the country, let alone yourself, is suspect at best. Moreover, if your you can't explain what's in it for someone else to go along with you, other than their particular emotional response, then it's safe to say that you care little to nothing for the reasoned opinions of others.

Absolute nonsense. Even if I disagree with him, ethics is not based solely on reason and logic. Some of the greatest crimes against humanity were based on reason and logic.

FFS, there are so many examples of emotion from the right its hard to know where to start. People don't support the death penalty because of reason and logic. They support the death penalty because of emotional responses. People aren't opposed to gay marriage because of reason and logic. They oppose it because of emotional responses. People aren't Christians because of reason and logic. They are Christians because of emotions.