What do normal people - think of Israel?

[Beelzebub]

Phukk you, Muslim ass-kisser. I would not have denigrated you in such a manner, but, given that you fired the first shot, have at it, pissant.
..
Punk.

Funny.

So you are a foul mouthed idiot who is unable to see the flaw in his own sad argument, even when it is put in front of him highlighted clearly.

I have no problem kissing Muslim ass, so long as she is ready, willing, able and a looker. However, I would not be worrying about her choice of faith at that time. (Even if she seemed to be calling on the deity).

As to 'punk' well, yes, in my day. Not so much now though.

 

[Kondor3]

...So you are a foul mouthed idiot who is unable to see the flaw in his own sad argument, even when it is put in front of him highlighted clearly...

No.

I am a mild-mannered Israel supporter who only turns foul-mouthed when lying Muslim propagandists and useful idiots try to pass off one as-yet-unresolved incident involving 2/1 of One Percent of all Gaza War II civilian Gazan casualties as representative of the whole, and when I am called an idiot for labeling their pathetic attempts at dissimulation for what they are.

 

[Beelzebub]

"As yet unresolved" = "IDF not found an excuse that even their own supporters could pretend to believe".

You are maybe genuinely credulous of the Israeli propaganda. But that does not make you innocent of disseminating it.

 

[Kondor3]

"As yet unresolved" = "IDF not found an excuse that even their own supporters could pretend to believe".

You are maybe genuinely credulous of the Israeli propaganda. But that does not make you innocent of disseminating it.

Typical Muslim propagandist convoluted logic.

If you have an authoritative conclusion or verdict or investigative finding to point to, that says otherwise, now's the time to trot it out.

Otherwise, it remains as I have said - accurate in both letter and spirit.

 

[RoccoR]

Billo_Really, et al,

Who in competent authority actually says that? (I'm sure that if the Palestinians abrogate the Oslo Accords, that would suit them just fine.)

Israel is considering that very question.

Israel Should Annul the Oslo Accords

JERUSALEM — THIS month marks 20 years since the signing of the first of the Oslo Accords between the State of Israel and the Palestine Liberation Organization. Two decades after Yitzhak Rabin and Yasir Arafat …New York Times · 9/20/2013

The Geneva Convention may --- or may NOT --- be applicable, since the Settlements are an outcome of a totally separate Israel-Palestinian set of agreements (Oslo Accords).

There may be a separate grievance concerning Jerusalem.

It is stipulated that about 10% of the Security Wall had encroached across the demarcation line; which is the portion of the Wall that might be "illegal." And that is the portion in which the ICJ questions recognition. The other 90%, built inside Israel, is absolutely legal (excluding the question of Jerusalem, claimed as the capitol by both).

Most Respectfully,
R

Ever since Israel was found in breach of the Oslo Accords, they are basically null and void.

(COMMENT)

Agreements and grievance/disputes don't work that way.

There is a means of dispute resolution embedded in the Oslo Accords. Before they can be voided, the process must be attempted. Remember the Oslo Accords are between Israel and the Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO). And what is the PLO?

• Decides to accord to Palestine non-member observer State status in the United Nations, without prejudice to the acquired rights, privileges and role of the Palestine Liberation Organization in the United Nations as the representative of the Palestinian people, in accordance with the relevant resolutions and practice; (A/RES/67/19 4 December 2012)

The PLO is, in effect, the State of Palestine; the representative of the Palestinian people.

Palestinian Authority (PA) President Mahmoud Abbas, is now in the tenth year of his four-year term in office, does not really have a mandate from the Palestinian People to negotiate, sign, or make any binding agreement with Israel. Nor does HAMAS for that matter. It is a decade long illustration of the State that is incompetent; a white sheet of paper in a snow storm.

It is up to the PLO to decide if the Oslo Accords are still in play. If the Oslo Accords are "null and void" then the line that separate Areas "A" - "B" and "C" are erased. What are the consequences of that?

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Beelzebub]

"As yet unresolved" = "IDF not found an excuse that even their own supporters could pretend to believe".

You are maybe genuinely credulous of the Israeli propaganda. But that does not make you innocent of disseminating it.

Typical Muslim propagandist convoluted logic.

If you have an authoritative conclusion or verdict or investigative finding to point to, that says otherwise, now's the time to trot it out.

Otherwise, it remains as I have said - accurate in both letter and spirit.

Actually matey, that is the most commonly held view. That is why half the world is calling for Israel to be up for war crimes. Most of the other half would also agree, except they are comfortable being overtly partizan in Israel's favour. There are only a very few would believe Israel didn't really intend all the civilian deaths and associated terror.

The Dahiya Doctrine is a bit of a give-away...

 

[toastman]

"As yet unresolved" = "IDF not found an excuse that even their own supporters could pretend to believe".

You are maybe genuinely credulous of the Israeli propaganda. But that does not make you innocent of disseminating it.

Typical Muslim propagandist convoluted logic.

If you have an authoritative conclusion or verdict or investigative finding to point to, that says otherwise, now's the time to trot it out.

Otherwise, it remains as I have said - accurate in both letter and spirit.

Actually matey, that is the most commonly held view. That is why half the world is calling for Israel to be up for war crimes. Most of the other half would also agree, except they are comfortable being overtly partizan in Israel's favour. There are only a very few would believe Israel didn't really intend all the civilian deaths and associated terror.

The Dahiya Doctrine is a bit of a give-away...

That is why half the world is calling for Israel to be up for war crimes

Link ?

 

[toastman]

"As yet unresolved" = "IDF not found an excuse that even their own supporters could pretend to believe".

You are maybe genuinely credulous of the Israeli propaganda. But that does not make you innocent of disseminating it.

Typical Muslim propagandist convoluted logic.

If you have an authoritative conclusion or verdict or investigative finding to point to, that says otherwise, now's the time to trot it out.

Otherwise, it remains as I have said - accurate in both letter and spirit.

Deluded pro Palestinians accusing someone else of posting propaganda never ceases to amaze me. I'm sure that people who don't have any dog in this fight know that when it comes to propaganda, Palestinians and their supporters are the undefeated world champions.

 

[Kondor3]

...Actually matey, that is the most commonly held view...

Immaterial. Commonly-held views do not signify at-law. If there is proof, that's one thing. A lack of proof is quite another.

...That is why half the world is calling for Israel to be up for war crimes...

Half of which is Muslim, and programmed and predisposed to hostility to both Jews and their State, not to mention the Muslim busy-body injunction to come to the aid of other Muslims, which has ruined many a Muslim state and killed many a million of Muslims over the centuries.

...Most of the other half would also agree, except they are comfortable being overtly partizan in Israel's favour...

Yes. They would certainly agree, if they did not disagree.

They are comfortable in their partisan favoritism towards Israel because they see Israel as worthier of their support, by several orders of magnitude.

...There are only a very few would believe Israel didn't really intend all the civilian deaths and associated terror...

Immaterial. What they believe does not signify at-law. If there is proof, that's one thing. A lack of proof is quite another.

...The Dahiya Doctrine is a bit of a give-away...

Yes, isn't it?

It tells us that the Israelis will use vast and overwhelmingly disproportionate force against any area from which rockets and operations are launched.

The US and several other Western countries also, oftentimes, employ high-kill-ratio tactics, as retaliation for unprovoked hostile fire.

If you're stupid enough to launch rockets from a given area, we're going to flatten that area, and Allah help those who haven't left by the time that targeting operations begin.

This is how we win.

We kill you at 100-to-1 or 1000-to-1 ratios, so that you learn the sheer and utter folly of attempting to hurt us.

Don't want to sustain such kill-ratios?

Don't try hurting us.

Simple.

Sooner or later, the lesson will sink into those thick skulls.

Until then, they can continue to die at 100-to-1 or 1000-to-1 ratios, as much as they like.

Their choice.

Happy to oblige.

 

[Beelzebub]

...Actually matey, that is the most commonly held view...

Immaterial. Commonly-held views do not signify at-law. If there is proof, that's one thing. A lack of proof is quite another.

...That is why half the world is calling for Israel to be up for war crimes...

Half of which is Muslim, and programmed and predisposed to hostility to both Jews and their State, not to mention the Muslim busy-body injunction to come to the aid of other Muslims, which has ruined many a Muslim state and killed many a million of Muslims over the centuries.

...Most of the other half would also agree, except they are comfortable being overtly partizan in Israel's favour...

Yes. They would certainly agree, if they did not disagree.

They are comfortable in their partisan favoritism towards Israel because they see Israel as worthier of their support, by several orders of magnitude.

...There are only a very few would believe Israel didn't really intend all the civilian deaths and associated terror...

Immaterial. What they believe does not signify at-law. If there is proof, that's one thing. A lack of proof is quite another.

...The Dahiya Doctrine is a bit of a give-away...

Yes, isn't it?

It tells us that the Israelis will use vast and overwhelmingly disproportionate force against any area from which rockets and operations are launched.

The US and several other Western countries also, oftentimes, employ high-kill-ratio tactics, as retaliation for unprovoked hostile fire.

If you're stupid enough to launch rockets from a given area, we're going to flatten that area, and Allah help those who haven't left by the time that targeting operations begin.

This is how we win.

We kill you at 100-to-1 or 1000-to-1 ratios, so that you learn the sheer and utter folly of attempting to hurt us.

Don't want to sustain such kill-ratios?

Don't try hurting us.

Simple.

Sooner or later, the lesson will sink into those thick skulls.

Until then, they can continue to die at 100-to-1 or 1000-to-1 ratios, as much as they like.

Their choice.

Happy to oblige.

Y U USE SO MANY WORDS TO SAY NUTHIN OF INTEREST?

Dear dear.
Anyway, your "You can't prove nuthin' sucker!" Line on the IDF targeting civilians will not wash. As you admit that terrorizing Palestinians is IDF strategy you again give the game away.

As pointed out, trying to make peace with Israel is tantamount to surrender. Israel just encroaches more until Palestinians are forced to resist again. Every time. As laid out by Throdor Herzel's plan, by Moshe Dayan's strategy and Bibi's policies.

You cannot clear out the best part of 6 million Palestinians now, without destroying Israel. Therefore they will be a state there, either part of Israel or their own state of Palestine. You cannot stop that. You cannot prevent the erosion of Israel by the corrosive effect of either apartheid or of attempted racial segregation by "homelands" as South Africa tried.

Israel is trying to be a racial / ethnic state, and just cannot do that, any more than Alabama can in the modern world.

Your threats to kill and terrorise to achieve this are really very sad, and very desperate. Your enemy will be made more ferocious by this, and you will not be able to kill enough to stop them, only to delay. And in the process Israel will destroy all the moral basis for its existence.

It really is time to consider being decent, and considering Palestinian rights as equal to those of Israelis, and greater, where they have been dispossessed of land and water and life by your selfish ambitions.

But thank you, once again, for laying your ruthlessness bare for the world to see. Israel is in a pickle, and the courage or desperation of Palestinians - or both - makes it impossible for you to win through, no matter how much you embrace murder and evil.

 

[cnm]

It is your contention that Israel intentionally targeted all (or a large percentage of) the civilians that it hit?

The only way that can not be the case is if Israel didn't know what it was doing.

 

[cnm]

As pointed out, trying to make peace with Israel is tantamount to surrender. Israel just encroaches more until Palestinians are forced to resist again. Every time. As laid out by Throdor Herzel's plan, by Moshe Dayan's strategy and Bibi's policies.

Normal people think this of Israel.

 

[Kondor3]

U USE SO MANY WORDS TO SAY NUTHIN OF INTEREST?...

Never mind the literary critique, Bubbles.

...Dear dear. Anyway, your "You can't prove nuthin' sucker!" Line on the IDF targeting civilians will not wash. As you admit that terrorizing Palestinians is IDF strategy you again give the game away...

Nonsense.

The Israelis target locations from which rockets and militia operations are launched.

They rarely fire first... they usually engage in return-fire, on a broad and overwhelming scale.

...As pointed out, trying to make peace with Israel is tantamount to surrender...

Correct. The Israelis have won. The Palestinians have lost. The losers should, indeed, surrender.

Time to run-up a white flag, and cut the best Bad Deal that you can, while a narrow window of opportunity still exists.

... Israel just encroaches more until Palestinians are forced to resist again. Every time. As laid out by Throdor Herzel's plan, by Moshe Dayan's strategy and Bibi's policies...

Yep.

This (above) is what they want. Get back on your side of the River and there will be peace.

Or continue to suffer.

Your choice.

Get out.

...You cannot clear out the best part of 6 million Palestinians now, without destroying Israel...

Sure they can. As a matter of fact, clearing-out the best part of 6 million Palestinians now will be the Saving of Israel.

With you on your side of the river (east), and they on theirs (west).

...Therefore they will be a state there, either part of Israel or their own state of Palestine. You cannot stop that...

Please feel free to continue to believe that.

It will make the end of Rump Palestine all the more comical, when the time comes.

...You cannot prevent the erosion of Israel by the corrosive effect of either apartheid or of attempted racial segregation by "homelands" as South Africa tried...

With no Muslim-Arabs in the West Bank, East Jerusalem or Gaza, this will become moot.

...Israel is trying to be a racial / ethnic state, and just cannot do that, any more than Alabama can in the modern world...

In this, they mimic many Islamic states.

What's good for the goose, is good for the gander.

...Your threats to kill and terrorise to achieve this are really very sad, and very desperate...

They're not sad and desperate.

They're not threats.

They're very real, and both historically and presently operative.

Launch rockets at the Israelis and they will phukk you up, at highly-favorable kill-ratios.

Don't fire rockets and you won't get killed in such highly unfavorable proportion.

It's entirely your choice.

So far, you have been choosing poorly, but, that, too, is expected of you.

...Your enemy will be made more ferocious by this...

The Palestinian enemies of Israel are pussies who hide behind the skirts of their women and children.

Not surprising, given the Great Arab Skeddadle of 1948.

They were pussies then, and they're pussies today.

..and you will not be able to kill enough to stop them...

Oh, I dunno...the IDF just did a nice job on Hamas, forcing them back to the table with Fatah.

...only to delay. And in the process Israel will destroy all the moral basis for its existence...

I suspect that, like most nations, Israel defines its own moral basis for existence, without help from either you or I.

...It really is time to consider being decent, and considering Palestinian rights as equal to those of Israelis, and greater, where they have been dispossessed of land and water and life by your selfish ambitions...

Sure.

No problem.

Time to compensate the Palestinians for their trouble, then help them to relocate to the east side of the Jordan valley - in Jordan.

...But thank you, once again, for laying your ruthlessness bare for the world to see...

Da nada.

No problem.

People, and nations, usually ARE quite ruthless, in defense of their own, and don't much give a damn who knows it.

Only fools, little children, and pussies who can't hold their own in a fight, as well as a handful of sincere peaceable types, really believe otherwise, in the final analysis.

It's a tough old world out there - money talks, and bullshit walks - those capable of enforcing their will are the ones that survive the test of time.

...Israel is in a pickle, and the courage or desperation of Palestinians - or both - makes it impossible for you to win through...

Again, please feel free to continue believing that. It will grease the wheels, to make the end of Rump Palestine all that much easier, and faster to arrive.

...no matter how much you embrace murder and evil.

It's not the embracing of murder and evil.

It's the embracing of Expulsion for the Palestinians, and the completion of the Reconquista of Eretz Yisrael for the Jews.

And, meanwhile, so long as your foolhardy advocacy clients are stupid enough to think they are going to get a favorable outcome, and continue to try to kill Israels, the IDF will continue to kill your clients, at kill-ratios highly favorable to Israel, so as to discourage your clients insanity, insofar as may be practicable before Expulsion Day.

 

[Beelzebub]

U USE SO MANY WORDS TO SAY NUTHIN OF INTEREST?...

Never mind the literary critique, Bubbles.

...Dear dear. Anyway, your "You can't prove nuthin' sucker!" Line on the IDF targeting civilians will not wash. As you admit that terrorizing Palestinians is IDF strategy you again give the game away...

Nonsense.

The Israelis target locations from which rockets and militia operations are launched.

They rarely fire first... they usually engage in return-fire, on a broad and overwhelming scale.

...As pointed out, trying to make peace with Israel is tantamount to surrender...

Correct. The Israelis have won. The Palestinians have lost. The losers should, indeed, surrender.

Time to run-up a white flag, and cut the best Bad Deal that you can, while a narrow window of opportunity still exists.

... Israel just encroaches more until Palestinians are forced to resist again. Every time. As laid out by Throdor Herzel's plan, by Moshe Dayan's strategy and Bibi's policies...

Yep.

This (above) is what they want. Get back on your side of the River and there will be peace.

Or continue to suffer.

Your choice.

Get out.

...You cannot clear out the best part of 6 million Palestinians now, without destroying Israel...

Sure they can. As a matter of fact, clearing-out the best part of 6 million Palestinians now will be the Saving of Israel.

With you on your side of the river (east), and they on theirs (west).

...Therefore they will be a state there, either part of Israel or their own state of Palestine. You cannot stop that...

Please feel free to continue to believe that.

It will make the end of Rump Palestine all the more comical, when the time comes.

...You cannot prevent the erosion of Israel by the corrosive effect of either apartheid or of attempted racial segregation by "homelands" as South Africa tried...

With no Muslim-Arabs in the West Bank, East Jerusalem or Gaza, this will become moot.

...Israel is trying to be a racial / ethnic state, and just cannot do that, any more than Alabama can in the modern world...

In this, they mimic many Islamic states.

What's good for the goose, is good for the gander.

...Your threats to kill and terrorise to achieve this are really very sad, and very desperate...

They're not sad and desperate.

They're not threats.

They're very real, and both historically and presently operative.

Launch rockets at the Israelis and they will phukk you up, at highly-favorable kill-ratios.

Don't fire rockets and you won't get killed in such highly unfavorable proportion.

It's entirely your choice.

So far, you have been choosing poorly, but, that, too, is expected of you.

...Your enemy will be made more ferocious by this...

The Palestinian enemies of Israel are pussies who hide behind the skirts of their women and children.

Not surprising, given the Great Arab Skeddadle of 1948.

They were pussies then, and they're pussies today.

..and you will not be able to kill enough to stop them...

Oh, I dunno...the IDF just did a nice job on Hamas, forcing them back to the table with Fatah.

...only to delay. And in the process Israel will destroy all the moral basis for its existence...

I suspect that, like most nations, Israel defines its own moral basis for existence, without help from either you or I.

...It really is time to consider being decent, and considering Palestinian rights as equal to those of Israelis, and greater, where they have been dispossessed of land and water and life by your selfish ambitions...

Sure.

No problem.

Time to compensate the Palestinians for their trouble, then help them to relocate to the east side of the Jordan valley - in Jordan.

...But thank you, once again, for laying your ruthlessness bare for the world to see...

Da nada.

No problem.

People, and nations, usually ARE quite ruthless, in defense of their own, and don't much give a damn who knows it.

Only fools, little children, and pussies who can't hold their own in a fight, as well as a handful of sincere peaceable types, really believe otherwise, in the final analysis.

It's a tough old world out there - money talks, and bullshit walks - those capable of enforcing their will are the ones that survive the test of time.

...Israel is in a pickle, and the courage or desperation of Palestinians - or both - makes it impossible for you to win through...

Again, please feel free to continue believing that. It will grease the wheels, to make the end of Rump Palestine all that much easier, and faster to arrive.

...no matter how much you embrace murder and evil.

It's not the embracing of murder and evil.

It's the embracing of Expulsion for the Palestinians, and the completion of the Reconquista of Eretz Yisrael for the Jews.

And, meanwhile, so long as your foolhardy advocacy clients are stupid enough to think they are going to get a favorable outcome, and continue to try to kill Israels, the IDF will continue to kill your clients, at kill-ratios highly favorable to Israel, so as to discourage your clients insanity, insofar as may be practicable before Expulsion Day.

Why so many words Kondor, for your opinion piece that you know is just partizan tripe?

Just tell me you hate me, and use some bad language again. It will save us both time.

Edit:
Actually, now I have bothered to read it (well scan it really) it seems more like your own confession to the use of murder terror and militarism to ruthlessly meet some odd god-given state of perfection.

Is this REALLY what a decent god would want you to do? Really?

Anyway, if you were in court, I think your post would convince any jury to convict you on all counts Kondor.

 

[cnm]

Well one can certainly see why the results of these polls are as they are.

 

[Kondor3]

Why so many words Kondor, for your opinion piece that you know is just partizan tripe?...

Coming from a hyper-partisan and Hamas propagandist, I take that as high praise, indeed.

...Just tell me you hate me, and use some bad language again. It will save us both time...

Other than counterpointing you from time to time, I really don't think of you at all. Hating you would require far more energy than it's worth.

...Actually, now I have bothered to read it (well scan it really) it seems more like your own confession to the use of murder terror and militarism to ruthlessly meet some odd god-given state of perfection...

Yes... coming from the angle of the Losing Side, such protestations are both predictable and comical. If you cannot control your barbarian clients then they will continue to die in droves. If they stop launching rockets, etc., then the Israelis will not bomb the shit out of them. Simple, really.

...Is this REALLY what a decent god would want you to do? Really?...

Probably not. But he hasn't been persecuted and slaughtered for 2000 years, and been kept in Dhimmitude for much of the past 1300 or so in various parts of the Muslim domains, so, he's just gonna have to understand. When the Palestinians get back on their side of the river and acknowledge Israel's right to exist, then we can dissect theological concerns.

...Anyway, if you were in court, I think your post would convince any jury to convict you on all counts Kondor.

That's nice.

Wake me up when you've got a case in the ICC that will stand on its own merits.

 

[Kondor3]

Well one can certainly see why the results of these polls are as they are...

Yes.

Most countries are not surrounded on three sides by mortal enemies.

Most countries have not experienced their neighbors swearing sacred oaths to drive them into the sea - every man, woman and child.

Most countries do not have large hostile and unwanted populations in the midst, living cheek by jowl with them.

Most countries have not had the UN breathing down its neck every time that they've tried to suppress insurrection and internal danger.

Most countries aren't populated by the generic and/or spiritual descendants of the owners of the land, dating back 2000 years or more, after it was wrenched away from them.

Most countries aren't populated by a Returned People who had been wandering for the better part of 2000 years prior to that Return.

Most countries are not at risk of collapsing if they compromise with an internal enemy.

Most countries aren't the object of hatred of a barbaric, savage, medieval, misogynistic carpet-toting belief-system that was formerly the master of so many of them.

Most countries aren't populated by the survivors and descendants of survivors of a 6,000,000 strong attempted genocide still within Living Memory.

Most countries haven't been lied to as much and tried and been betrayed in land-for-peace deals as much in a brief 66 year-long period as has Israel.

And on and on and on.

Many reasons for those countries to align against Israel.

Although some of those nations are, in truth, quite friendly in their relations with Israel, and will have her back, in any End-Game contest with the Muslims.

 

[cnm]

Hilarious. Israel has informed the UNSecGen that it does not intend to become a state party to the Statute of the Court. I think that is the best indication of the merit of the cases.

 

[Beelzebub]

You'd think, with all those problems, with all those people, organisations and international bodies opposed to what Israel is doing, even with Jews throughout the diaspora split against Israel - many absolutely against what Israel is and is doing, ...

.... they might pause and wonder if they are doing something wrong.

 

[cnm]

Many reasons for those countries to align against Israel.

Yeah, right. Like China.