what could be done to unite this country and end the partisan bs?

[strollingbones]

as far as i can see...obama has not made any move to "unite" this country behind him or any recovery plan. with only 25% of the stimulus money released...(according to npr)
what is going on...i see this country being more and more divided. or perhaps its just the rantings of the extremes on both sides is driving the middle crazy. i have watched...why are liberals so stupid....why are conservatives so stupid...threads go out...people ..there is no differences in the parties....there are hot topic issues that the powers to be use to distract the people ...and i think its simply the political machine that has taken on a life of it's own...combined with people who are no longer citizens. by citizens, i mean people who take the time to research the issues and the candidates....it is impossible with today's media to get a clear picture of anything. our news is so controlled and censured....cnn and fox...it does not matter...one is spoon feeding the left....one is spoon feeding the right....so instead of looking at what is happening.....everyone simply continues the party rant. as long as you do that you will get the government you deserve.

keeping the people divided and distracted...like a gang of pickpockets in a crowd...how long are we gonna allow this? dont we all basically want the same things in life....happiness...security for our families....the ability to work hard and get a head.

i hate to be so fucking rah rha at this hour...but we need to remember this...we are americans before we are democrats or republicans or any other party. we are all americans first. we have americans dying on two war fronts, we need to remember that daily? we need to hold the current administration to the same reasoning...the causes of the wars have not change, the deaths still mount...yet there is little discussion of the death toll..which everyone did under bush? why has that changed?

does obama realize he has backed out of his promises made to a lot of "independent" voters? obama won by uniting a lot of groups....now the party will take the hit in 2010. 2 years of gridlock and we are where in 4 years...

 

[Skull Pilot]

get rid of political parties and have everyone finance their own campaigns.

No more "soft money" no more voting party over person

 

[RodISHI]

A good point. Take the big money out of it.

 

[strollingbones]

it always comes back to the "money"...that is why david duke ran...for the matching funds...but that would be a start....and stop these pac things...

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

It has nothing to do with money... it has to do with power; and the inability of a large segment of the electorate to recognize sound principle.

This notion that 'the nation is divided' and that such is 'the problem' sets aside the reason for the division; thus fails to recognize the principles of which that division is comprised; and as such, the means to resolve the issue, within the scope of your comfort zone, is unobtainable.

The ideological left is the problem.

Embrace it; and the problem is amplified; compromise with it and the problem is sustained...

Wherever there are those who simply lack the means to reason sound principle; you will find a division between that addle-minded ilk and those who do so as a matter of course.

Imagine; a segment of the population laments the spending of a given administration; declares that the 4-5.5% unemployment and the relevant indicators represent "THE WORST ECONOMY SINCE THE GREAT DEPRESSION...

So, they eventually utilize that mantra to gain a substantial, nearly unopposable majority in the legislature... one which sways VASTLY more influence than their opposition ever enjoyed and on top of that; also gains the Federal Executive....

So what does that segment do with their power? They spend 5 times that of the administration which they previously and vociferously opposed; they run unemployment beyond DOUBLE of that which they formerly decried... and while they were HOSTILE over the cost of fuel, which spiked only after they found power; they busy themselves in the implementation of policy which will run the cost of the necessary fuels that sustain the economy to well beyond that economy crushing level which they, again, railed steadfastly against.

There's no means to reason with such people... and there's no means for reasonable people to join with such people.

Thus the resolution to the problem of division, is one which I doubt you'd be all that comfortable with; and yet, you busy yourself going about the advocating of policy which will only, quite inevitably, lead directly to that long standing, quite natural and wholly unavoidable resolution.

Crazy huh...

 

[Xenophon]

Change will not come easily or peacably from such a system, too much money and power involved.

 

[Newby]

as far as i can see...obama has not made any move to "unite" this country behind him or any recovery plan. with only 25% of the stimulus money released...(according to npr)
what is going on...i see this country being more and more divided. or perhaps its just the rantings of the extremes on both sides is driving the middle crazy. i have watched...why are liberals so stupid....why are conservatives so stupid...threads go out...people ..there is no differences in the parties....there are hot topic issues that the powers to be use to distract the people ...and i think its simply the political machine that has taken on a life of it's own...combined with people who are no longer citizens. by citizens, i mean people who take the time to research the issues and the candidates....it is impossible with today's media to get a clear picture of anything. our news is so controlled and censured....cnn and fox...it does not matter...one is spoon feeding the left....one is spoon feeding the right....so instead of looking at what is happening.....everyone simply continues the party rant. as long as you do that you will get the government you deserve.

keeping the people divided and distracted...like a gang of pickpockets in a crowd...how long are we gonna allow this? dont we all basically want the same things in life....happiness...security for our families....the ability to work hard and get a head.

i hate to be so fucking rah rha at this hour...but we need to remember this...we are americans before we are democrats or republicans or any other party. we are all americans first. we have americans dying on two war fronts, we need to remember that daily? we need to hold the current administration to the same reasoning...the causes of the wars have not change, the deaths still mount...yet there is little discussion of the death toll..which everyone did under bush? why has that changed?

does obama realize he has backed out of his promises made to a lot of "independent" voters? obama won by uniting a lot of groups....now the party will take the hit in 2010. 2 years of gridlock and we are where in 4 years...

Great post, more people need to start thinking this way, but I'm afraid that things are going to have to get very bad before the general populace is motivated enough to join together regardless of politics and demand changes from our government. When you have their personal lives being more impacted in a 'less than subtle' way is when you will start to see a shift. Who knows what it's going to take? I predict that if the Cap & Trade gets ratified by the Senate and as the 'global warming' initiative starts to impact their lives in ways that hurt, then they'll start to sit up and take notice to what's been done in the name of 'environmentalism' and how they've been duped. By then it may be too late.

 

[Zoom-boing]

The pols don't want the bi-partisanship to end. They want the 'us and them' to remain 'Dems and Repubs'. What they don't want is for Americans to wake up because then the 'us and them' will truly become us - you and me - and them, the wealthy and the pols. They want the status quo to remain as is because it works . . . for them.

Bones - great, great post.

 

[Big Black Dog]

I have thought about this quite a bit here of late. Bones is correct in her reasoning and she tossed out some very good ideas and thoughts. I would like to build on that just a little if I can. One of the things I believe that is hurting the country quite a bit is the length of time some of these Congressmen and women have been camping out in either the House or the Senate. Many of them are political institutions unto themselves because of their power and status within Congress. Neither party is interested in working with the other party for the common good of the people who elected them. Their main interest, and their only interest is to stay in power. Anything else is second to that goal. What I think we need are term limits for all elected officials. Two terms in Congress is more than ample time for a person to accomplish any goal the Senator or Representative may have had. If they can't accomplish their goal in two terms, then their goal wasn't meant to be. We need new and different people in Congress. Everybody there needs to be cut loose and fresh people with new ideas and thought processes to put to the test. Another thing that really gets under my skin is all the perks that Congress folks get. Why should we give a Congress person any kind of a retirement benefit for serving in Conress. All a person has to do is get elected and they have that retirement for life. I think it is bullshit. It's an expense that we do not need to bear. There is big money to be made by being a member of Congress. Why else would somebody spend millions of dollars on a job that really doesn't pay that much? Same thing as President. Why should it cost so much money to elect these officials? We need to limit that aspect of the campaigns too.

 

[Coyote]

Obama has to contend with the Democrats in Congress and they seem to think that the election has given them an unlimited mandate to pursue their political agenda and political vendettas over what is best for the the country.

In other words they are acting with same arrogance as the Republicans did for the last decade rather than trying to reduce partisanship.

Some things never never change...go figure.

 

[Coloradomtnman]

It has nothing to do with money... it has to do with power; and the inability of a large segment of the electorate to recognize sound principle.

This notion that 'the nation is divided' and that such is 'the problem' sets aside the reason for the division; thus fails to recognize the principles of which that division is comprised; and as such, the means to resolve the issue, within the scope of your comfort zone, is unobtainable.

The ideological left is the problem.

Embrace it; and the problem is amplified; compromise with it and the problem is sustained...

Wherever there are those who simply lack the means to reason sound principle; you will find a division between that addle-minded ilk and those who do so as a matter of course.

Imagine; a segment of the population laments the spending of a given administration; declares that the 4-5.5% unemployment and the relevant indicators represent "THE WORST ECONOMY SINCE THE GREAT DEPRESSION...

So, they eventually utilize that mantra to gain a substantial, nearly unopposable majority in the legislature... one which sways VASTLY more influence than their opposition ever enjoyed and on top of that; also gains the Federal Executive....

So what does that segment do with their power? They spend 5 times that of the administration which they previously and vociferously opposed; they run unemployment beyond DOUBLE of that which they formerly decried... and while they were HOSTILE over the cost of fuel, which spiked only after they found power; they busy themselves in the implementation of policy which will run the cost of the necessary fuels that sustain the economy to well beyond that economy crushing level which they, again, railed steadfastly against.

There's no means to reason with such people... and there's no means for reasonable people to join with such people.

Thus the resolution to the problem of division, is one which I doubt you'd be all that comfortable with; and yet, you busy yourself going about the advocating of policy which will only, quite inevitably, lead directly to that long standing, quite natural and wholly unavoidable resolution.

Crazy huh...

Great reasonsing, PI. Way to go beyond the bounds of partisanship to end partisanship. You're violent hatred of those of differing ideologies from yours demonstrates your Christian compassion and ability to understand and compromise. You're more like Hitler than you'd ever wish to admit. Or maybe, you're more like Stalin.

 

[RodISHI]

I have thought about this quite a bit here of late. Bones is correct in her reasoning and she tossed out some very good ideas and thoughts. I would like to build on that just a little if I can. One of the things I believe that is hurting the country quite a bit is the length of time some of these Congressmen and women have been camping out in either the House or the Senate. Many of them are political institutions unto themselves because of their power and status within Congress. Neither party is interested in working with the other party for the common good of the people who elected them. Their main interest, and their only interest is to stay in power. Anything else is second to that goal. What I think we need are term limits for all elected officials. Two terms in Congress is more than ample time for a person to accomplish any goal the Senator or Representative may have had. If they can't accomplish their goal in two terms, then their goal wasn't meant to be. We need new and different people in Congress. Everybody there needs to be cut loose and fresh people with new ideas and thought processes to put to the test. Another thing that really gets under my skin is all the perks that Congress folks get. Why should we give a Congress person any kind of a retirement benefit for serving in Conress. All a person has to do is get elected and they have that retirement for life. I think it is bullshit. It's an expense that we do not need to bear. There is big money to be made by being a member of Congress. Why else would somebody spend millions of dollars on a job that really doesn't pay that much? Same thing as President. Why should it cost so much money to elect these officials? We need to limit that aspect of the campaigns too.

I think fully taking away the benefit of a retirement pension would be an error. I do think terms limits should be installed. Elect new officials that keep their promises or out they go. It is not like one states reps do no harm to another state people when they make these ridiculous legislative rules that damage the people and take away personal freedoms.

 

[Douger]

A good "terra atak" by Al CIA duh seemed to do the trick a while back. It gets all the sheep to hug, say prayers, and most importantly, wave that flag.

 

[tigerbob]

A good point. Take the big money out of it.

Was politics not partizan before the advent of the corporate dollar?

 

[jillian]

does obama realize he has backed out of his promises made to a lot of "independent" voters? obama won by uniting a lot of groups....now the party will take the hit in 2010. 2 years of gridlock and we are where in 4 years...

he pissed off the left, too, in FAVOR of the right. but he doesn't get credit for that.

2 years of gridlock was better than the unrestrained abuse of power of the 6 years prior, i'd think.

at some point, difficult decisions have to be made. my own major criticism is that he tries to please the right when they won't do anything but trash him anyway, so he should focus on the left and middle.

 

[Barb]

as far as i can see...obama has not made any move to "unite" this country behind him or any recovery plan. with only 25% of the stimulus money released...(according to npr)
what is going on...i see this country being more and more divided. or perhaps its just the rantings of the extremes on both sides is driving the middle crazy. i have watched...why are liberals so stupid....why are conservatives so stupid...threads go out...people ..there is no differences in the parties....there are hot topic issues that the powers to be use to distract the people ...and i think its simply the political machine that has taken on a life of it's own...combined with people who are no longer citizens. by citizens, i mean people who take the time to research the issues and the candidates....it is impossible with today's media to get a clear picture of anything. our news is so controlled and censured....cnn and fox...it does not matter...one is spoon feeding the left....one is spoon feeding the right....so instead of looking at what is happening.....everyone simply continues the party rant. as long as you do that you will get the government you deserve.

keeping the people divided and distracted...like a gang of pickpockets in a crowd...how long are we gonna allow this? dont we all basically want the same things in life....happiness...security for our families....the ability to work hard and get a head.

i hate to be so fucking rah rha at this hour...but we need to remember this...we are americans before we are democrats or republicans or any other party. we are all americans first. we have americans dying on two war fronts, we need to remember that daily? we need to hold the current administration to the same reasoning...the causes of the wars have not change, the deaths still mount...yet there is little discussion of the death toll..which everyone did under bush? why has that changed?

does obama realize he has backed out of his promises made to a lot of "independent" voters? obama won by uniting a lot of groups....now the party will take the hit in 2010. 2 years of gridlock and we are where in 4 years...

Party politics is like being in court. Both sides see their lawyer waving his arms and making wonderfully acerbic points against the opposition. They go home after smirking at the "others" thinking to themselves that they've got damned good representation. Meanwhile, back at the country club, both attorneys are dining with the judge. There's a difference. One orders Grey Goose martinis, and the other Merlot. As for the press, I could send you some stuff. Forget about them. No matter how liberal the journalist, their boss owns a corporation, and the editor works for him.

All that said, I think you're giving our President a bum steer. 6 Months to fix 8 years of scorched earth and the plowing of fields with salt is a tad on the impatient side. He has tried to work with others, I think hes gone a bit too far with that, and if he hadn't he'd have gotten more through. Still, he has to look at 2010, and he's trying not to be an asshole. Its a fine line, that "pussy democrat" vs. "dictator in chief." That he's being so careful speaks well of his political savvy. With the kind of majority he's working with, I'd have come right out with the, "we won because you screwed the pooch so completely, now shut up and let us fix this mess, and shut up shutting up."

 

[Missourian]

To many people are trapped by ideology.

It amazes me how people will defend the most wrong-headed thinking just because the political party they support tells them too.

Figure out what is really important to you and support that, not the party.

Think for yourselves.

 

[KittenKoder]

So long as there are still morons who cling to Republican and Democrat parties there will always be nothing but partisan bickering among the people and the government will remain in control of our lives.

 

[tigerbob]

It has nothing to do with money... it has to do with power; and the inability of a large segment of the electorate to recognize sound principle.

This notion that 'the nation is divided' and that such is 'the problem' sets aside the reason for the division; thus fails to recognize the principles of which that division is comprised; and as such, the means to resolve the issue, within the scope of your comfort zone, is unobtainable.

The ideological left is the problem.

Embrace it; and the problem is amplified; compromise with it and the problem is sustained...

Wherever there are those who simply lack the means to reason sound principle; you will find a division between that addle-minded ilk and those who do so as a matter of course.

Imagine; a segment of the population laments the spending of a given administration; declares that the 4-5.5% unemployment and the relevant indicators represent "THE WORST ECONOMY SINCE THE GREAT DEPRESSION...

So, they eventually utilize that mantra to gain a substantial, nearly unopposable majority in the legislature... one which sways VASTLY more influence than their opposition ever enjoyed and on top of that; also gains the Federal Executive....

So what does that segment do with their power? They spend 5 times that of the administration which they previously and vociferously opposed; they run unemployment beyond DOUBLE of that which they formerly decried... and while they were HOSTILE over the cost of fuel, which spiked only after they found power; they busy themselves in the implementation of policy which will run the cost of the necessary fuels that sustain the economy to well beyond that economy crushing level which they, again, railed steadfastly against.

There's no means to reason with such people... and there's no means for reasonable people to join with such people.

Thus the resolution to the problem of division, is one which I doubt you'd be all that comfortable with; and yet, you busy yourself going about the advocating of policy which will only, quite inevitably, lead directly to that long standing, quite natural and wholly unavoidable resolution.

Crazy huh...

I was about to rep you until I got to the 3rd paragraph. Blaming the "ideological left" for everything is as absurd as blaming Bush for everything, or Clinton for everything.

In fact, the problem is blame. Everyone spends so much time citing examples of 'failed' policy from a week, a month, a decade ago that nobody tries to find a commonly acceptable solution, and heaven forbid anyone ever thinks of compromise.

This board is a perfect example. By the time any thread gets to the end of page 1 you have the idealists from one side kicking the shit out of their counterparts from the other side.

"It was Bush that fucking started this you asshole."

"Oh yeah, well how come the policy started with the Clinton administration, you partizan hack?"

"Clinton never meant for it to go this far - it's the GOP that took a sound policy to the extreme. Are you really this stupid?"

"Me stupid? I'm not the one who just voted for a President who is destroying the economy for the next 30 years!"

And so the debate goes on without a single poster focusing on current policy or its merits. Why? Because that's the way politics is done. It is far easier to kick your opponent over past policy (20/20 hindsight being a wonderful thing) than it is to rationally discuss current policy and potential future implications.

Despite everyone on message boards having Google available to make them look like they know a lot, most people really aren't that smart when it comes to discussing the impact of future policy. So they simply line up behind their party of choice, listen to what Sean or Keith tell then and parrot it because they think they agree with it, or they cite it because they think it is an example of how stupid the other side is.

Blame culture is the problem, IMO.

 

[RodISHI]

It has nothing to do with money... it has to do with power; and the inability of a large segment of the electorate to recognize sound principle.

This notion that 'the nation is divided' and that such is 'the problem' sets aside the reason for the division; thus fails to recognize the principles of which that division is comprised; and as such, the means to resolve the issue, within the scope of your comfort zone, is unobtainable.

The ideological left is the problem.

Embrace it; and the problem is amplified; compromise with it and the problem is sustained...

Wherever there are those who simply lack the means to reason sound principle; you will find a division between that addle-minded ilk and those who do so as a matter of course.

Imagine; a segment of the population laments the spending of a given administration; declares that the 4-5.5% unemployment and the relevant indicators represent "THE WORST ECONOMY SINCE THE GREAT DEPRESSION...

So, they eventually utilize that mantra to gain a substantial, nearly unopposable majority in the legislature... one which sways VASTLY more influence than their opposition ever enjoyed and on top of that; also gains the Federal Executive....

So what does that segment do with their power? They spend 5 times that of the administration which they previously and vociferously opposed; they run unemployment beyond DOUBLE of that which they formerly decried... and while they were HOSTILE over the cost of fuel, which spiked only after they found power; they busy themselves in the implementation of policy which will run the cost of the necessary fuels that sustain the economy to well beyond that economy crushing level which they, again, railed steadfastly against.

There's no means to reason with such people... and there's no means for reasonable people to join with such people.

Thus the resolution to the problem of division, is one which I doubt you'd be all that comfortable with; and yet, you busy yourself going about the advocating of policy which will only, quite inevitably, lead directly to that long standing, quite natural and wholly unavoidable resolution.

Crazy huh...

I was about to rep you until I got to the 3rd paragraph. Blaming the "ideological left" for everything is as absurd as blaming Bush for everything, or Clinton for everything.

In fact, the problem is blame. Everyone spends so much time citing examples of 'failed' policy from a week, a month, a decade ago that nobody tries to find a commonly acceptable solution, and heaven forbid anyone ever thinks of compromise.

This board is a perfect example. By the time any thread gets to the end of page 1 you have the idealists from one side kicking the shit out of their counterparts from the other side.

"It was Bush that fucking started this you asshole."

"Oh yeah, well how come the policy started with the Clinton administration, you partizan hack?"

"Clinton never meant for it to go this far - it's the GOP that took a sound policy to the extreme. Are you really this stupid?"

"Me stupid? I'm not the one who just voted for a President who is destroying the economy for the next 30 years!"

And so the debate goes on without a single poster focusing on current policy or its merits. Why? Because that's the way politics is done. It is far easier to kick your opponent over past policy (20/20 hindsight being a wonderful thing) than it is to rationally discuss current policy and potential future implications.

Despite everyone on message boards having Google available to make them look like they know a lot, most people really aren't that smart when it comes to discussing the impact of future policy. So they simply line up behind their party of choice, listen to what Sean or Keith tell then and parrot it because they think they agree with it, or they cite it because they think it is an example of how stupid the other side is.

Blame culture is the problem, IMO.

I think that is why the pot gets stirred with non issues. Truthfully though Bob I'm getting pretty sick of this hatred slinging against those who believe in God. That is the majority in this nation whether they believe fully or believe but do not totally understand. I can personally say a lot of people who profess to believe do not fully represent what I believe. So it all goes back to shit slinging contest and who wants to go there instead of real issues that need to be dealt with.