What a great idea for improving Public School Test Scores

[Samson]

I like your idea but you know as well as I that the primary purpose of schools is no longer to educate. Its about free meals and keeping kids off the streets. I agree 100 percent that for kids who are not college bound, the curriculum is completely useless. But logic has no place in public education. Next year our school is going with all college prep classes. No more special ed or general tracks. Kids who can't tell time will be put in trig and physics classes. Kids who can barely read or write English will be required to take two years of a foreign language. And in 4-5 years, and millions for new programs, they'll say "oops"

Yes this is why I refer to "the insanity."

Public school see their mission more and more as college prep-schools. The theory is that the more they shove college-prep down the throats of an ever growing number of kids, then a certain proportion will actually succeed. Typical Beaurocracy, one-size-fits-all mentality.

Eventually, what will happen is the kids that are REALLY ready for college will begin graduating early, or taking college courses concurrently with their "sentences" to public school.

What pisses me off is that the trades are no longer taught at high schools. What use is college if you're gifted at the trades ? A carpenter can make more than most college graduates and many other trades are the same. I know when I went to high school, they had a plumbing trade class that had the student take his requirements, math, reading etc, and the other half of the day he was taught plumbing. I know many people who rose from poverty to the middle class because of those classes. Now they don't exist.

Yes this is my point precisely: In addition to being a "melting pot" for a democracy made of such a wide variety of social/ethnic/racial/religious origins, vocational studies are really the true mission of the American school systems. The notion of public college preparation has always been ridiculous, and always will be.

But, how does a politician gain office telling parents the truth about the fruit of their loins? No, our system rewards the liar: Tell parents that "EVERY CHILD CAN SUCCEED" = EVERY CHILD CAN GO TO COLLEGE. They will believe it because they WANT to believe it, regardless of how little sense it may make.

 

[keee keee]

user fees for parents who have children, going into system, using system and for ten years after using the system, everyone knows that when something is free it is not treasured and used to it fullest, this would encourage parent to make sure their children use and get the most out of their educational experience and also encourage parental involvement in the school system through PTA. This also would lower tax rates for people who do not have children and seniors who don't use the school systems, or haven't in years.

 

[chanel]

Some of these "magnet" and charter schools are offering trades and other interesting programs to keep the kids engaged. Regular public high schools cannot do that. It amazes me that public funding can go to "semi private" schools who don't have to play by the same rules. If I were a cynical person (ha ha) I might think they are trying to destroy the public schools on purpose.

My husband is a plumber and never went to college. He tried to hire some kids straight out of the Vocational School in town and was told they no longer offer plumbing. Go figure.

 

[Ravi]

Someone posted a link about Lt. Gov. Andre Bauer drawing a comparison to “feeding stray animals” during a speech about people on government assistance, which I thought had some ideas of merit. Here's onea:



What do you think?

So he is pretty much saying he wants to punish children who are growing up poor, with parents who probably don't care, and some who have parents that are drugs. I worked at a school where almost all the children were on free or reduced lunches, and there is only so much teachers can do. And I love how the solution to this guy is to not feed the children, because that is exactly what would happen if he got his way. When in reality, the only meals some of those kids eat are at school.

I wonder if he isn't onto something here? IF we say as a society, 'We are going to provide food, education, nurturing for the children of the disadvantaged," shouldn't there be some ownership? IF they don't want to do what they can, for example showing up for conferences, (worked around their work schedule if necessary), shouldn't 'we' as a society take the children and assume the rest of their care? Make sure they do complete their homework? Make sure they are supervised and enrolled in healthy activities? Take them out of homes where the parent doesn't care or care for?

And do what with them...put them in orphanages?

Can I be on the panel that decides if you are a good enough parent?

 

[Smartt33]

He has a serious deficiency in determining cause and effect

It may be true that free or reduced lunches in schools, or other such services, may not be the cause. I would agree. However, they may be a clue as to what really is happening regarding grades. Some people seem to get this idea that the Government "owes" them. They expect to be served. I believe this attitude is learned from the parents.

In that case, the problem is not the free meals or services, it is the lazy attitude of many of the people who receive them. There are some people who actually need help.

So, now, what is the cause? Laziness, teacher issues, school issues, or, whatever? Teacher to student ratio is a real issue. Overworked teachers is a real issue. low parental participation is a real problem. Apathy is a real problem. Standardized tests are a real problem. to much Government intervention is a real problem.

 

[midcan5]

Weird how Americans think that test scores are all there is to school. I admit the correlation but we need jobs and crafts and skills that matter in the world.

Also weird how right wing people are so social Darwinist in their thinking. It is a pattern that is not hopeful. And what the hell happened to the golden rule when it comes to charity and helping those less fortunate?

 

[editec]

Someone posted a link about Lt. Gov. Andre Bauer drawing a comparison to “feeding stray animals” during a speech about people on government assistance, which I thought had some ideas of merit. Here's onea:

Later in his speech, he said, “I can show you a bar graph where free and reduced lunch has the worst test scores in the state of South Carolina,” adding, “You show me the school that has the highest free and reduced lunch, and I'll show you the worst test scores, folks. It's there, period. So how do you fix it? Well, you say, ‘Look, if you receive goods or services from the government, then you owe something back.'”

Bauer said during the speech that there are no “repercussions” from accepting government assistance.

“We don't make you take a drug test. We ought to. We don't even make you show up to your child's parent-teacher conference meeting or to the PTA meeting,” Bauer said.

“You go to a school where there's an active participation of parents and guess what? They have the highest test scores. So what do you do? You say, ‘Look folks, if you receive goods or services from the government and you don't attend a parent-teacher conference, bam, you lose your benefits.' We're going to have to do things like that. We can't afford to keep just giving money away.”

S.C. Republican: Aid like feeding strays - CharlotteObserver.com

What do you think?

I think feeding kids is more important than punishing them for the faults of their parents.

You?

 

[Samson]

Some of these "magnet" and charter schools are offering trades and other interesting programs to keep the kids engaged. Regular public high schools cannot do that. It amazes me that public funding can go to "semi private" schools who don't have to play by the same rules. If I were a cynical person (ha ha) I might think they are trying to destroy the public schools on purpose.

My husband is a plumber and never went to college. He tried to hire some kids straight out of the Vocational School in town and was told they no longer offer plumbing. Go figure.

You can be the least of Cynics about anything else: But can anyone be too cynical about the American "Regular Public High School?"

This educational entity did not exist 100 years ago, and I cannot think of any other nation that has adopted it in the absurd form that exists in the USA. Nor can I imagine it existing in 100 years in ANY nation, including our own.

In fact, 100 years from now someone is going to start a thread on USMB about how the USA could ever have possibly been a "World Superpower," yet have such an incredibly ineffective, extraordinarily expensive, ridiculously administered "Public High School System."

And I'm certain, that uscitizen, reanimated head wired to a key-board, floating in a jar of greenish liquid, will use US Public Schools as an example of failed democracy: The US Public School System is the best example of local control of a government entity in the world.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

So you support letting the kids go hungry.... How else are you going to teach them not to be poor?

I am not letting anybody go hungry. Their parents are.

Not all poor people are on welfare and aid. Some folks who're poor, are at the level where they're still dirt poor, but not poor enough to get aid. Which is sad in my opinion, for these people, a couple bucks a day for 5 days a week for 9 months a year is impossible. I was in that situation a few times. It isn't fair to the children and it isn't the parents faults.

If it's not the parents' fault, whose is it?

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

And many poor people live a responsible and productive life, but because of the rules being what they are, many people who're a lil above the threshhold can't simply spare the money without the lights getting shut off, or the rent not being paid. Why should the child be forced to watch other children eat while they're starving, that's just inhuman and add to the fact that their parents or parent are contributing taxpayers.

No, they're parents are not contributing taxpayers. If they were they wouldn't be getting assistance. Furthermore, I guarantee that if the entire welfare system was suddenly gutted, few of these children would starve. It's amazing how fast their parents priorities would change and they would suddenly find a way to take care of them when forced to.