We’re All Right-Wing Bastards Now

[chanel]

Not sure diuretic. Catholic schools are closing; but charter schools are booming. I'd prefer to fix public ed., but I don't think there's enough fortitude. New world order. Reward failure; punish success.

 

[Diuretic]

When it comes to educational theory the US has a remarkable track record. Dewey, Bruner at al. It would be a shame if ideology pushed good learning aside.

 

[editec]

My oh my! how you right wing apologists fear unions.

 

[mudwhistle]

Stop paying it.
Last I looked you can't be forced to join the union.

But you are forced to pay. 85% for non-union employees. What would you do?

Also to be perfectly honest - most people stay in the union because they FIGHT FOR HEALTH BENEFITS. That was one of the main reasons I left private industry to go into public services. I took a huge cut in pay, but health insurance was important to us. And I know for a fact that is why many other people go into teaching, social work, etc.

However, with the country headed toward socialized medicine, why would anyone want go into public service and join a union? It will have an effect on the quality of employees from teachers to cops to city planners. Unintended consequences?

You mean like affordable health care for all...heaven FORBID!!!

AFFORDABLE.......that's a good one.....you crack me up.

 

[Bfgrn]

But you are forced to pay. 85% for non-union employees. What would you do?

Also to be perfectly honest - most people stay in the union because they FIGHT FOR HEALTH BENEFITS. That was one of the main reasons I left private industry to go into public services. I took a huge cut in pay, but health insurance was important to us. And I know for a fact that is why many other people go into teaching, social work, etc.

However, with the country headed toward socialized medicine, why would anyone want go into public service and join a union? It will have an effect on the quality of employees from teachers to cops to city planners. Unintended consequences?

You mean like affordable health care for all...heaven FORBID!!!

AFFORDABLE.......that's a good one.....you crack me up.

OK, then please explain to me WHY affordable health care is unattainable in America, WHO is to blame?

 

[Dr.Traveler]

...the teachers’ unions consistently blocked meaningful education reform and accusing the NEA of trying to end enforcement of the No Child Left Behind act.

Small point: I interact with a lot of high school mathematics teachers thanks to one aspect of my job. Almost universally what I hear is that they like the idea of NCLB, but hate the fact that it was an unfunded mandate. The NEA was right to complain about that law.

The NEA is problematic. On the upside, they've done a lot to increase pay and compensation for teachers and improve the workplace. On the other hand, they work too hard at protecting bad teachers.

If you think that's limited to the NEA though, you'd be mistaken. Unions are always 50% good, 50% bad. Most of the really positive changes in the workplace came from Union negotiations, while at the same time the Unions have been behind some boneheaded plays.

 

[mudwhistle]

You mean like affordable health care for all...heaven FORBID!!!

AFFORDABLE.......that's a good one.....you crack me up.

OK, then please explain to me WHY affordable health care is unattainable in America, WHO is to blame?

The goal is not to make it affordable.

If you can show me evidence that they plan on doing what it takes to make it affordable then MAYBE I'll believe you. Just because they put "AFFORDABLE" before health care in every speech doesn't mean that's their purpose.

Everyone can agree that health care is expensive and that states and corps. are going broke trying to provide coverage. Fining us and throwing us in jail is not gonna make it cheaper.

Nothing these people say is believable. We've caught them lying to us too many times to even consider trusting them. When the President spends the first 9 months of his presidency tripling the deficit then starts saying that we must cut spending and talks about how he's afraid of how it may effect the economy, yet refuses to drop this massive health care program.....I tend not to believe him. The only reason the bill wasn't done deal months ago is because they wanted to be able to blame the GOP for it. Somehow I think he knows what it will do and he's going to have to have somebody to blame for it.

 

[California Girl]

Not sure diuretic. Catholic schools are closing; but charter schools are booming. I'd prefer to fix public ed., but I don't think there's enough fortitude. New world order. Reward failure; punish success.

I was fortunate enough to attend a Catholic school. Nuns are scary but hells teeth, educationally speaking it was a great education.

 

[mudwhistle]

not sure diuretic. Catholic schools are closing; but charter schools are booming. I'd prefer to fix public ed., but i don't think there's enough fortitude. New world order. Reward failure; punish success.

i was fortunate enough to attend a catholic school. Nuns are scary but hells teeth, educationally speaking it was a great education.

amen

 

[Diuretic]

...the teachers’ unions consistently blocked meaningful education reform and accusing the NEA of trying to end enforcement of the No Child Left Behind act.

Small point: I interact with a lot of high school mathematics teachers thanks to one aspect of my job. Almost universally what I hear is that they like the idea of NCLB, but hate the fact that it was an unfunded mandate. The NEA was right to complain about that law.

The NEA is problematic. On the upside, they've done a lot to increase pay and compensation for teachers and improve the workplace. On the other hand, they work too hard at protecting bad teachers.

If you think that's limited to the NEA though, you'd be mistaken. Unions are always 50% good, 50% bad. Most of the really positive changes in the workplace came from Union negotiations, while at the same time the Unions have been behind some boneheaded plays.

Just on the point that teachers unions protect bad teachers, and by extension unions protect bad workers, it's always seemed to me that the union shouldn't judge their member, but should provide a solid defence so that any allegations can be tested and, if proven, dismissal can follow. I don't think a union should facilitate the dismissal process given that it's an adversarial process.

 

[chanel]

Listen. I am not going to defend the unions position on defending "bad teachers" but in my limited ecperience, it is not necessarily the "bad teachers" that need defending. The lazy, apathetic ones rarely get called out. When teachers don't enforce the rules and have a 100 percent passing rate, the kids administrators, and parents are happy. Its the one that drug tests the kid, fails a kid, or breaks up a fight, that usually finds themself in litigation. The lawyers keep unions in business too.

I realize all states operate differently, but here in NJ.the unions help shape curriculum and standards while making sure every kid gets a diploma. High graduation rates are good PR. And keeping every rapist and arsonist in school meets that goal as well as needing lots and lots of "alternative programs" with teachers to babysit them.