We swore an oath

[Delta4Embassy]

Couldn't have said this better myself so am reprinting a post from another board (url excluded obviously.) And while this is for active-duty, dunno about you but I never swore an oath negating the first one when I got out.

If a veteran feels proud of their service they should. But if they then bash a sitting President their breaking a solemn oath before God. Don't have to like President Obama or any other, but we do have to respect the Office of the President. When we salute those higher in rank, we're not saluting the person but the rank or office or position.

Just keep that in mind.

I, [your name] do solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God.



"I know that the veterans' forum is supposed to be apolitical, and I'm saying this, not because I have any love for our new Commander-In-Chief, but because all of us took an oath and, regardless of the whims of the electorate, that oath is what makes us who we are. Towards that end, I am reminding all currently serving military personnel, myself included, of the text of Articles 88 and 94 of the UCMJ:

ART. 88. CONTEMPT TOWARD OFFICIALS
Any commissioned officer who uses contemptuous words against the President, the Vice President, Congress, the Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of a military department, the Secretary of Transportation, or the Governor or legislature of any State, Territory, Commonwealth, or possession in which he is on duty or present shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.

ART. 94. MUTINY OR SEDITION
(a) Any person subject to this chapter who--
(1) with intent to usurp or override lawful military authority, refuses, in concert with any other person, to obey orders or otherwise do his duty or creates any violence or disturbance is guilty of mutiny;
(2) with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of lawful civil authority, creates, in concert with any other person, revolt, violence, or disturbance against that authority is guilty of sedition;
(3) fails to do his utmost to prevent and suppress a mutiny or sedition being committed in his presence, or fails to take all reasonable means to inform his superior commissioned officer or commanding officer of a mutiny or sedition which he knows or has reason to believe is taking place, is guilty of a failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition.
(b) A person who is found guilty of attempted mutiny, mutiny, sedition, or failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a court- martial may direct.

I have no doubt that the executive branch will now be scrutinizing the armed forces for breaches of conduct in this area. I advise all military personnel to ensure that our disagreements with the policies and positions of our new chain of command be expressed in a respectful and professional manner, and that we remember that we speak only for ourselves and not our branches of service."

 

[longknife]

Just show me ONE place in the above that says military personnel MUST personally respect the Commander-in-Chief.

It DOES say that personnel in uniform will show proper respect by saluting when required.

NOW, as I am no longer subject to the oath of office - having been duly retired from active duty - there is no law or constitution requirement that I show "proper respect" to any authority figure - military or civilian.

I was always taught - even in the military - is that respect is EARNED - not granted. I served under a couple of officers whom I had no respect for whatsoever. But, because they were my superiors, I saluted when appropriate and used respectful language when responding to the orders. AND, I ALWAYS OBEYED THEIR ORDERS.

The individual currently elected to the OFFICE of the President of the United States has not, in any way, shape, or form, earned my respect. I will therefore refer to him in that matter which is to me appropriate - disrespectful.

 

[usmcstinger]

Couldn't have said this better myself so am reprinting a post from another board (url excluded obviously.) And while this is for active-duty, dunno about you but I never swore an oath negating the first one when I got out.

If a veteran feels proud of their service they should. But if they then bash a sitting President their breaking a solemn oath before God. Don't have to like President Obama or any other, but we do have to respect the Office of the President. When we salute those higher in rank, we're not saluting the person but the rank or office or position.

Just keep that in mind.

I, [your name] do solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God.



"I know that the veterans' forum is supposed to be apolitical, and I'm saying this, not because I have any love for our new Commander-In-Chief, but because all of us took an oath and, regardless of the whims of the electorate, that oath is what makes us who we are. Towards that end, I am reminding all currently serving military personnel, myself included, of the text of Articles 88 and 94 of the UCMJ:

ART. 88. CONTEMPT TOWARD OFFICIALS
Any commissioned officer who uses contemptuous words against the President, the Vice President, Congress, the Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of a military department, the Secretary of Transportation, or the Governor or legislature of any State, Territory, Commonwealth, or possession in which he is on duty or present shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.

ART. 94. MUTINY OR SEDITION
(a) Any person subject to this chapter who--
(1) with intent to usurp or override lawful military authority, refuses, in concert with any other person, to obey orders or otherwise do his duty or creates any violence or disturbance is guilty of mutiny;
(2) with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of lawful civil authority, creates, in concert with any other person, revolt, violence, or disturbance against that authority is guilty of sedition;
(3) fails to do his utmost to prevent and suppress a mutiny or sedition being committed in his presence, or fails to take all reasonable means to inform his superior commissioned officer or commanding officer of a mutiny or sedition which he knows or has reason to believe is taking place, is guilty of a failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition.
(b) A person who is found guilty of attempted mutiny, mutiny, sedition, or failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a court- martial may direct.

I have no doubt that the executive branch will now be scrutinizing the armed forces for breaches of conduct in this area. I advise all military personnel to ensure that our disagreements with the policies and positions of our new chain of command be expressed in a respectful and professional manner, and that we remember that we speak only for ourselves and not our branches of service."

Once you are honorably released from active duty you are Veteran. The oath we took was specific to our active military service. When I served in Vietnam, I honored my oath. When I became a civilian again, I didn't lose my right to free speech.

By the way, when serving in combat the issue cared about was keeping yourself and buddies a live .

 

[RetiredGySgt]

You realize your first claim only applies to active or reserve OFFICERS? As for the other one can not mutiny if one is not on active or reserve duty. Keep proving just how stupid you are.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

Once you are honorably released from active duty you are Veteran. The oath we took was specific to our active military service. When I served in Vietnam, I honored my oath. When I became a civilian again, I didn't lose my right to free speech.

By the way, when serving in combat the issue cared about was keeping yourself and buddies a live .

That's a valid legal arguement, but because the oath was to God it might be moot. Afaik, oaths sworn to God cannot be undone.

 

[PratchettFan]

Couldn't have said this better myself so am reprinting a post from another board (url excluded obviously.) And while this is for active-duty, dunno about you but I never swore an oath negating the first one when I got out.

If a veteran feels proud of their service they should. But if they then bash a sitting President their breaking a solemn oath before God. Don't have to like President Obama or any other, but we do have to respect the Office of the President. When we salute those higher in rank, we're not saluting the person but the rank or office or position.

Just keep that in mind.

I, [your name] do solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God.



"I know that the veterans' forum is supposed to be apolitical, and I'm saying this, not because I have any love for our new Commander-In-Chief, but because all of us took an oath and, regardless of the whims of the electorate, that oath is what makes us who we are. Towards that end, I am reminding all currently serving military personnel, myself included, of the text of Articles 88 and 94 of the UCMJ:

ART. 88. CONTEMPT TOWARD OFFICIALS
Any commissioned officer who uses contemptuous words against the President, the Vice President, Congress, the Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of a military department, the Secretary of Transportation, or the Governor or legislature of any State, Territory, Commonwealth, or possession in which he is on duty or present shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.

ART. 94. MUTINY OR SEDITION
(a) Any person subject to this chapter who--
(1) with intent to usurp or override lawful military authority, refuses, in concert with any other person, to obey orders or otherwise do his duty or creates any violence or disturbance is guilty of mutiny;
(2) with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of lawful civil authority, creates, in concert with any other person, revolt, violence, or disturbance against that authority is guilty of sedition;
(3) fails to do his utmost to prevent and suppress a mutiny or sedition being committed in his presence, or fails to take all reasonable means to inform his superior commissioned officer or commanding officer of a mutiny or sedition which he knows or has reason to believe is taking place, is guilty of a failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition.
(b) A person who is found guilty of attempted mutiny, mutiny, sedition, or failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a court- martial may direct.

I have no doubt that the executive branch will now be scrutinizing the armed forces for breaches of conduct in this area. I advise all military personnel to ensure that our disagreements with the policies and positions of our new chain of command be expressed in a respectful and professional manner, and that we remember that we speak only for ourselves and not our branches of service."

The oath is to support and defend the Constitution. You only have to obey the orders of the President and officer appointed above you in accordance with the UCMJ, which only applies to active duty. Nowhere in that oath does it say anything about respecting. I obeyed the orders of a couple of officers I didn't respect. IMO, any veteran who respects an elected official just because they are an elected official is violating their oath.

 

[usmcstinger]

Once you are honorably released from active duty you are Veteran. The oath we took was specific to our active military service. When I served in Vietnam, I honored my oath. When I became a civilian again, I didn't lose my right to free speech.

By the way, when serving in combat the issue cared about was keeping yourself and buddies a live .

That's a valid legal arguement, but because the oath was to God it might be moot. Afaik, oaths sworn to God cannot be undone.

You continue to make no sense!

 

[Delta4Embassy]

You continue to make no sense!

Einstein got that a lot too.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

Lemme see if I can put this in a way that even a United States Marine can understand (go Navy hhe)

There's the legal obligations of the oath

There's the religious obligations of the oath.

I'm talking about the religous obligations, NOT the legal one.

Get it now, or dya need sign language too?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Lemme see if I can put this in a way that even a United States Marine can understand (go Navy hhe)

There's the legal obligations of the oath

There's the religious obligations of the oath.

I'm talking about the religous obligations, NOT the legal one.

Get it now, or dya need sign language too?

There is no oath taken that requires respect.All it says is we have to obey the legal orders of the President and the Officers appointed over us. And that ends when we get out or retire.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

There is no oath taken that requires respect.All it says is we have to obey the legal orders of the President and the Officers appointed over us. And that ends when we get out or retire.

Who's talking about respect? Are you fucking retarded? Try reading shit once in a while.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

There is no oath taken that requires respect.All it says is we have to obey the legal orders of the President and the Officers appointed over us. And that ends when we get out or retire.

Who's talking about respect? Are you fucking retarded? Try reading shit once in a while.

This is a direct result of the first thread you started about this and you demanded that the oath required we respect the President. Keep on lying.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Couldn't have said this better myself so am reprinting a post from another board (url excluded obviously.) And while this is for active-duty, dunno about you but I never swore an oath negating the first one when I got out.

If a veteran feels proud of their service they should. But if they then bash a sitting President their breaking a solemn oath before God. Don't have to like President Obama or any other, but we do have to respect the Office of the President. When we salute those higher in rank, we're not saluting the person but the rank or office or position.

Just keep that in mind.

I, [your name] do solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God.



"I know that the veterans' forum is supposed to be apolitical, and I'm saying this, not because I have any love for our new Commander-In-Chief, but because all of us took an oath and, regardless of the whims of the electorate, that oath is what makes us who we are. Towards that end, I am reminding all currently serving military personnel, myself included, of the text of Articles 88 and 94 of the UCMJ:

ART. 88. CONTEMPT TOWARD OFFICIALS
Any commissioned officer who uses contemptuous words against the President, the Vice President, Congress, the Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of a military department, the Secretary of Transportation, or the Governor or legislature of any State, Territory, Commonwealth, or possession in which he is on duty or present shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.

ART. 94. MUTINY OR SEDITION
(a) Any person subject to this chapter who--
(1) with intent to usurp or override lawful military authority, refuses, in concert with any other person, to obey orders or otherwise do his duty or creates any violence or disturbance is guilty of mutiny;
(2) with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of lawful civil authority, creates, in concert with any other person, revolt, violence, or disturbance against that authority is guilty of sedition;
(3) fails to do his utmost to prevent and suppress a mutiny or sedition being committed in his presence, or fails to take all reasonable means to inform his superior commissioned officer or commanding officer of a mutiny or sedition which he knows or has reason to believe is taking place, is guilty of a failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition.
(b) A person who is found guilty of attempted mutiny, mutiny, sedition, or failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a court- martial may direct.

I have no doubt that the executive branch will now be scrutinizing the armed forces for breaches of conduct in this area. I advise all military personnel to ensure that our disagreements with the policies and positions of our new chain of command be expressed in a respectful and professional manner, and that we remember that we speak only for ourselves and not our branches of service."

Damn, you are stupid.

Your attempt to equate my oath to the support and defend the Constitution with criticizing any person, living or dead, is so ludicrous that I lack the words to describe it.

By the way, the UCMJ does not apply to me anymore, unless they decide to bring me back onto active duty, which is never going to happen because my health would preclude it.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Einstein got that a lot too.

You are no Einstein, you aren't even smart enough to be the village idiot.

 

[PratchettFan]

There is no oath taken that requires respect.All it says is we have to obey the legal orders of the President and the Officers appointed over us. And that ends when we get out or retire.

Who's talking about respect? Are you fucking retarded? Try reading shit once in a while.

You were.... "If a veteran feels proud of their service they should. But if they then bash a sitting President their breaking a solemn oath before God. Don't have to like President Obama or any other, but we do have to respect the Office of the President. When we salute those higher in rank, we're not saluting the person but the rank or office or position."

Try reading your own shit once in a while.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Lemme see if I can put this in a way that even a United States Marine can understand (go Navy hhe)

There's the legal obligations of the oath

There's the religious obligations of the oath.

I'm talking about the religous obligations, NOT the legal one.

Get it now, or dya need sign language too?

There are no religious obligations in the oath. Even if there were, there is nothing in the oath about respecting anyone. That makes you wrong, a position you are eminently suited to be in.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Who's talking about respect? Are you fucking retarded? Try reading shit once in a while.

Did you read the OP you posted?

 

[whitehall]

Just show me ONE place in the above that says military personnel MUST personally respect the Commander-in-Chief.

It DOES say that personnel in uniform will show proper respect by saluting when required.

NOW, as I am no longer subject to the oath of office - having been duly retired from active duty - there is no law or constitution requirement that I show "proper respect" to any authority figure - military or civilian.

I was always taught - even in the military - is that respect is EARNED - not granted. I served under a couple of officers whom I had no respect for whatsoever. But, because they were my superiors, I saluted when appropriate and used respectful language when responding to the orders. AND, I ALWAYS OBEYED THEIR ORDERS.

The individual currently elected to the OFFICE of the President of the United States has not, in any way, shape, or form, earned my respect. I will therefore refer to him in that matter which is to me appropriate - disrespectful.

Guess what? Veterans are not bound by the articles of the UCMJ. If they were John Kerry would be behind bars in Levenworth.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

Good point (though slightly flawed) made by the OP. I say flawed because, in the best of worlds, all Americans would be patriotic and loyal to their country. But as you can see, the anti-America Pootarians have no end of excuses for their traitorous words.

OTOH, our First Amendment gives them the right to be stupid. Just as it gives them the right to be disloyal to the point that they figuratively hump the leg of America's enemies.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

I'm thinking back to when W was prez. I really despised what he was doing to my country. I hated when I would hear his voice on the news, being so incredibly stupid and making me feel ashamed that the rest of the world was seeing him as the leader of the free world and representing America. His voice did then and still does make my skin crawl.

When we watched the twin towers go down, many on line said that he was a coward for going into hiding. I said that's exactly what he should do because nothing was more important at that moment than his survival. Not the man. Hell, W could have been replaced by a roll of paper towels and the country would have been better off. But, the man who occupied that role was, at that moment, the most important person our planet and he needed to be protected, shielded from attack.

Once he left office though, I finally felt I could say what I believed about him. I don't lie about him because the truth is ore than enough to damn him forever and on a lot of different levels.

RWs don't care about our country. They care only about their own agenda - crushing the middle class, forcing our govt to fail, kissing Pootin's jackboots and making it known around the world that they hate their own country. They vote for those who they believe will work to those ends.

If the day ever comes when their country comes first, then they will see the president differently. Until then, they just make noise. Like a constant, low fart. And, yeah, they smell really really bad.