We should be at 7.5% unemployment

[boedicca]

This is a good time to remind everyone of the historical comparisons:

Obamanomics made things worse. Much much worse than if he had done nothing at all.

 

[rdean]

Why are right wingers so fucking stupid? They give Bush a complete free pass on Iraq and and the lies about WMDs and bringing "freedom" to Iraq.

Then they complain and whine that Obama wasn't "perfectly correct".

What the fuck? They prefer the lies? Bush wasn't handed trillions in debt. Democrats didn't help move millions of jobs to China. It was Republicans working with China who gave seminars teaching American business how to move to China on the subsidies and tax breaks Republicans put in place.

Come on people. Stop with the delusions. It's all about "We hate Obama". It has NOTHING to do with his policies.

 

[shintao]

This is a good time to remind everyone of the historical comparisons:

Obamanomics made things worse. Much much worse than if he had done nothing at all.

Your graph only shows up to 2007, which was the Bush watch.

 

[MaggieMae]

Well I see the Fed is now saying the the high unemployment numbers are here to stay for quite awhile.
Gloomy Fed employment forecast overshadows upbeat GDP data
Gloomy Fed jobs forecast overshadows upward revision on U.S. economic growth - latimes.com
The artice states that the American worker is facing competition from robots, computers and foreign workers.
And as this goes on, the US trade deficit grows.
So instead of putting 100% of the blame on Obama, Free Trade is certainly to blame and of course the outsourcing of American jobs overseas.

Just what is Obama doing to keep me from outsoucing 3 jobs?

Nothing. Outsource away. But that's not to say there aren't attempts to do something about it to make outsourcing less attractive to American businesses.

H.R. 4213 and H.R. 5622 Congressional Acts
•This legislation of the American Jobs and Closing Tax Loophole Act -- H.R. 4213 -- introduced to the House of Representatives would eliminate tax loopholes and tax evasion by companies that outsource American jobs. Furthermore, the Stop Outsourcing and Create American Jobs Act of 2010 -- H.R. 5622 -- would harden civil and criminal penalties for tax fraud, among other violations. Neither proposed bill has passed with a majority vote in the House of Representatives as of 2010.

Read more: Tax Penalties for Outsourcing American Jobs | eHow.com Tax Penalties for Outsourcing American Jobs | eHow.com

 

[rdean]

All of the experts agree that the manufacturing jobs lost during this recession will not be coming back. That means retraining of much of the workforce that has been in limbo these past two years in areas of production that will keep jobs HERE, not THERE. So what industry(ies) will that be? Since the U.S. dragged its feet in pursuing green energy, China now far surpasses us in those endeavors, so what else are we prepared to do that other countries can't do just as well but cheaper? Any answers?

Green energy is a myth.

Why do you say that?

Because apparently, "Climate Change" is a myth and "Noah's Ark" and "Magical Creation" are real. 6% of scientists tell us so.

 

[MaggieMae]

All it demonstrates is that the previous regime left things in a bigger mess than most people thought.

Yup.........but only those in the minority think that. If the majority thought that you wouldnt get..................


THIS......................

Oh yeh that's right....

Obama promises unemployment will not go over 8%.....when it does it's Bush's fault
Obama says it will be a summer of recovery and it's not.....It's Bush's fault...
Obama lies and says there are shovel ready jobs then admits his lie....It's Bush's fault
Biden promises there will be 500,000 jobs a month due to stimulus it didn't...Bush's fault

You can spin all you want, but most THINKING adults are fully aware that the economic catastrophe was a bit longer in the making than just the last two years. Household assets dropped sharply after reaching an $81 trillion peak in June 2007. By the last full quarter of 2008 and one full year into the current recession about $15 trillion in private family assets and wealth had evaporated. It was the sharpest wealth decline in more than 50 years, and was just the beginning of an even further downward spiral when Obama took over.

 

[rdean]

Yup.........but only those in the minority think that. If the majority thought that you wouldnt get..................


THIS......................

Oh yeh that's right....

Obama promises unemployment will not go over 8%.....when it does it's Bush's fault
Obama says it will be a summer of recovery and it's not.....It's Bush's fault...
Obama lies and says there are shovel ready jobs then admits his lie....It's Bush's fault
Biden promises there will be 500,000 jobs a month due to stimulus it didn't...Bush's fault

You can spin all you want, but most THINKING adults are fully aware that the economic catastrophe was a bit longer in the making than just the last two years. Household assets dropped sharply after reaching an $81 trillion peak in June 2007. By the last full quarter of 2008 and one full year into the current recession about $15 trillion in private family assets and wealth had evaporated. It was the sharpest wealth decline in more than 50 years, and was just the beginning of an even further downward spiral when Obama took over.

It's difficult for people to hear you when they have a finger in each ear and are endlessly singing "La la la la....La la la la", as loud as they can.

Look at this, "Obama promises unemployment will not go over 8%.....", ask for a link and all they hear is, "La la la la.....La la la la".

Yea, he "promised". He said, "I promise.....". Sure he did.

 

[MaggieMae]

Once the campaign started, there was no way we were going to recover quickly.

All the consumer heard was "gloom and doom on the horizon"...and "the GOP took us to the brink of a recession"

They say elections have consequences...

I say campaigns have consequences.

True to all that, but policy has consequences too.

The Stimulus not only got us more in debt, it actually made things much worse.

Trickle up poverty.

Oh riiiiight....

America's millionaires rebound in 2009 - Mar. 9, 2010

U.S. households worth $1 million or more grew to 7.8 million in 2009, up 16% from 2008, according to a survey from Spectrem Group, a Chicago-based market research and consulting firm. The firm's report also found that the number of ultra high-net-worth households, worth $5 million or more, jumped 17% to 980,000.

And some of them had the balls to collect unemployment compensation!!!

Some 3,000 Millionaires Claim Jobless Benefits, IRS Data Show - Bloomberg

 

[MaggieMae]

Well I see the Fed is now saying the the high unemployment numbers are here to stay for quite awhile.
Gloomy Fed employment forecast overshadows upbeat GDP data
Gloomy Fed jobs forecast overshadows upward revision on U.S. economic growth - latimes.com
The artice states that the American worker is facing competition from robots, computers and foreign workers.
And as this goes on, the US trade deficit grows.
So instead of putting 100% of the blame on Obama, Free Trade is certainly to blame and of course the outsourcing of American jobs overseas.

So you are saying that the USA cannot compete successfully in the world market? I seem to remember that being said while Carter was in office, too.

The key here is not shutting out those who you percieve to be more ingenious and creative than their American Counterparts but rather for their American Couterparts to be more ingenious and creative than they are.

How might we do this as a country and how might the government help this along?

Should the government confiscate 5% of the GDP, impose punitive taxes on the small business owners and tax the estates of the rich to assure that no wealth is passed generationally from one entrepeneur to the next or should the government do everything possible to entice the creative and the ingenious to create and build here in the USA?

You're probably right. Let's just give up and pass the torch to the Chinese. Our turn is over.

How about one of you telling me and others just how the Bush tax cuts "assured" that businesses could expand, when every indicator says they did not serve that purpose? How about one of you trying to explain exactly how those tax windfalls WERE spent? How was it possible, if private industry was so successful during the Bush years, so many were unable to withstand the recession and had to close their doors or do massive layoffs? If they were swimming in black ink as a result of tax cuts, they could have survived.

Last but not least, how about we stop pretending our quality of education can even sustain the next generation of entrepreneurs?

 

[MaggieMae]

All it demonstrates is that the previous regime left things in a bigger mess than most people thought.

It might demonstrate that. That will be a point of debate over the next two years.

Something that it definitely does demonstrate is that the current administration did not understand the size or complexity of the problem, did not have a solution for it, has not figured it out yet and is showing no sign that it either understands the problem or has a solution.

Another thing that is pretty clear is the the American people have noticed that the Emperor has no clothes.

When do you think he'll figure out that the jig is up?

I'm posting this again because I suggest particularly YOU read it. When someone from "your" side has all the answers, please send up flares.

Who can magically fix the economy? No one - Full version - Oct. 15, 2010

 

[shintao]

Green energy is a myth.

Why do you say that?

Because apparently, "Climate Change" is a myth and "Noah's Ark" and "Magical Creation" are real. 6% of scientists tell us so.

I am not much on climate change myself. I see it happening, but I have a problem with the "causation" of the changes. I am in favor of alternate power sources like solar, water, geothermal, but not using bio-fuels. I want to see the perpetual nuclear energy source perfected, and I think it is possible because we can think of it, we just need to research it more extensively. As far as coal & oil go, we don't need them, but the battery powered energies is a wrong way to go, because of battery's.

 

[MaggieMae]

Comrades! The 5-Year Plan is bearing fruit! Do not slacken your efforts -- we must strive to defeat the imperialists and bring glory to the Motherland! And, uh, don't forget to pay your union dues!

As usual, nothing but childish junk as your response.

 

[MaggieMae]

Remember this?

We should be at 7.5% unemployment right now. Remember before all this "in the ditch" nonsense was created, the above chart says what the Obama Economic team said would happen. They assured us they were the best experts on the planet, and they assured us that the Stimulus plan would work.

Remember this, it didn't. Unemployment is at 9.6% and despite all the predictions, rhetoric, and excuses, it's still flat at a rate higher than what they said it would be if we agreed to their plan.

Another key thing they got wrong is the time they expected things to get better with or without the Stimulus. Early in the 4th quarter of 2010 the unemployment rate was predicted to go down with or without the Stimulus and yet it's still flat. Obviously we'll never know if it would have gone down without the Stimulus, but it's clear that they were wrong on the results and wrong on the timeline. Remember this whenever Obama and his economic team decide to change things because "we can't stay on the current course." Keep the current course and get out of the way, it's obvious he can't make things better and I propose we consider that they actually made things worse.

We probably would be at 7.5 if people would take the jobs available and quit holding out for management positions.

In most states, once the initial 26-weeks have expired, someone unemployed can no longer hold out for a similar job, paying similar wages. S/he must take what's available that the person is qualified to do, or have a good reason not to. Otherwise, bye bye unemployment compensation.

 

[MaggieMae]

Well I see the Fed is now saying the the high unemployment numbers are here to stay for quite awhile.
Gloomy Fed employment forecast overshadows upbeat GDP data
Gloomy Fed jobs forecast overshadows upward revision on U.S. economic growth - latimes.com
The artice states that the American worker is facing competition from robots, computers and foreign workers.
And as this goes on, the US trade deficit grows.
So instead of putting 100% of the blame on Obama, Free Trade is certainly to blame and of course the outsourcing of American jobs overseas.

All of the experts agree that the manufacturing jobs lost during this recession will not be coming back. That means retraining of much of the workforce that has been in limbo these past two years in areas of production that will keep jobs HERE, not THERE. So what industry(ies) will that be? Since the U.S. dragged its feet in pursuing green energy, China now far surpasses us in those endeavors, so what else are we prepared to do that other countries can't do just as well but cheaper? Any answers?

Green energy is a myth.

Ya think?

Reports detail global investment and other trends in green energy

Renewables accounted for 60 per cent of newly installed capacity in Europe and more than 50 per cent in the USA in 2009. This year or next, experts predict, the world as a whole will add more capacity to the electricity supply from renewable than non-renewable sources.

 

[MaggieMae]

Well I see the Fed is now saying the the high unemployment numbers are here to stay for quite awhile.
Gloomy Fed employment forecast overshadows upbeat GDP data
Gloomy Fed jobs forecast overshadows upward revision on U.S. economic growth - latimes.com
The artice states that the American worker is facing competition from robots, computers and foreign workers.
And as this goes on, the US trade deficit grows.
So instead of putting 100% of the blame on Obama, Free Trade is certainly to blame and of course the outsourcing of American jobs overseas.

All of the experts agree that the manufacturing jobs lost during this recession will not be coming back. That means retraining of much of the workforce that has been in limbo these past two years in areas of production that will keep jobs HERE, not THERE. So what industry(ies) will that be? Since the U.S. dragged its feet in pursuing green energy, China now far surpasses us in those endeavors, so what else are we prepared to do that other countries can't do just as well but cheaper? Any answers?

Develop a potent energy source & grid, develop a glass highway for transportation, double our food supplies, quadruple our fresh water supply, explore the moon for usable mineral sources. Learn how to be diplomats.

If we waited for private businesses to do any of that without subsidies, the country would turn into a dust bowl before that kind of modernization happened. But the cons don't want government interference; i.e., seed money for private industry to take the lead. But they won't take the lead without it. Catch-22.

 

[MaggieMae]

This is a good time to remind everyone of the historical comparisons:

Obamanomics made things worse. Much much worse than if he had done nothing at all.

Neither you nor anyone else can actually prove that.

 

[MaggieMae]

Why are right wingers so fucking stupid? They give Bush a complete free pass on Iraq and and the lies about WMDs and bringing "freedom" to Iraq.

Then they complain and whine that Obama wasn't "perfectly correct".

What the fuck? They prefer the lies? Bush wasn't handed trillions in debt. Democrats didn't help move millions of jobs to China. It was Republicans working with China who gave seminars teaching American business how to move to China on the subsidies and tax breaks Republicans put in place.

Come on people. Stop with the delusions. It's all about "We hate Obama". It has NOTHING to do with his policies.

I tend to agree, but the latter refers to lessons in blind ideology, which is a whole separate subject.

 

[MaggieMae]

Oh yeh that's right....

Obama promises unemployment will not go over 8%.....when it does it's Bush's fault
Obama says it will be a summer of recovery and it's not.....It's Bush's fault...
Obama lies and says there are shovel ready jobs then admits his lie....It's Bush's fault
Biden promises there will be 500,000 jobs a month due to stimulus it didn't...Bush's fault

You can spin all you want, but most THINKING adults are fully aware that the economic catastrophe was a bit longer in the making than just the last two years. Household assets dropped sharply after reaching an $81 trillion peak in June 2007. By the last full quarter of 2008 and one full year into the current recession about $15 trillion in private family assets and wealth had evaporated. It was the sharpest wealth decline in more than 50 years, and was just the beginning of an even further downward spiral when Obama took over.

It's difficult for people to hear you when they have a finger in each ear and are endlessly singing "La la la la....La la la la", as loud as they can.

Look at this, "Obama promises unemployment will not go over 8%.....", ask for a link and all they hear is, "La la la la.....La la la la".

Yea, he "promised". He said, "I promise.....". Sure he did.

A projection is not a promise. Nor is not meeting the projection a lie.

 

[boedicca]

This is a good time to remind everyone of the historical comparisons:

Obamanomics made things worse. Much much worse than if he had done nothing at all.

Your graph only shows up to 2007, which was the Bush watch.

You can't even read a graph. The 2007 refers to the START of the recession; which began in December 2007. Count the months from that point. You'll need to borrow somebody else's fingers and toes to accomplish this (for you) significant feat.

 

[MaggieMae]

Why do you say that?

Because apparently, "Climate Change" is a myth and "Noah's Ark" and "Magical Creation" are real. 6% of scientists tell us so.

I am not much on climate change myself. I see it happening, but I have a problem with the "causation" of the changes. I am in favor of alternate power sources like solar, water, geothermal, but not using bio-fuels. I want to see the perpetual nuclear energy source perfected, and I think it is possible because we can think of it, we just need to research it more extensively. As far as coal & oil go, we don't need them, but the battery powered energies is a wrong way to go, because of battery's.

Although climate change and renewable energy projects go hand in hand, we still need alternative energy because dependence primarily on oil for fuel has far too many variables, the failure of any one of which could cripple the economy (again). A terror attack on Saudi Arabia's refineries, a blockade by Venezuela, closing the Strait of Hormuz by Iran where all tanker traffic passes through to serve the rest of the world, another massive hurricane which destroys oil drilling and pipelines in the Gulf of Mexico from Houston eastward--all would have devastating effects.