We Need Factories for Making Products and Not for Making Jobs

expat_panama

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from: The Social Machine

Kevin D. Williamson March 21, 2017 4:00 AM

Jobs are a means, not an end.

Funny thing about American manufacturing: The good news about what’s happening at American factories often sounds like bad news to politicians.

American factories are one of the wonders of the world, and, in spite of what President Donald Trump, Senator Bernie Sanders, and other lightly informed populists claim, they are humming. U.S. manufacturing output is about 68 percent higher today in real terms (meaning inflation-adjusted terms) than it was before NAFTA was enacted; manufacturing output is about double in real terms what it was in the 1980s and more than three times what it was in the 1950s. As our factories grow more efficient, output per man-hour has grown, too, which is what troubles the populists and demagogues: Our factories employ a much smaller share of the U.S. work force than they once did

...The purpose of an automobile factory is not to “create jobs,” as the politicians like to say. Its function is not to add to the employment rolls with good wages and UAW benefits, adding to the local tax base and helping to sustain the community — as desirable as all those things are. The purpose of an automobile factory is not to create jobs — it is to create automobiles...

...people who have an explicit legal obligation to work not on our behalf but on behalf of their shareholders do a pretty good job of giving us what we want; the people who vow to work on our behalf do not. That is a paradox only if you do not think about it too much, and not thinking about it too much is the business that politicians are in...
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *​
This is why the rhetoric about 'we need more high paying manufacturing jobs' is so dumb.

Yeah, this thread will most probably bring out that old tired rant about "people need a living wage", "demand is what makes production", and "people live on Main St., not Wall St.". We've heard it a lot in today's discourse and it usually ends w/ investors throwing up their hands and saying "aw hell, if building factories can't make products I'll just give to charity and go home." Let's face it, high wages sound good to the worker but a factory sees wages as a cost, not an income.
 
Don't overheat your brain.

People build factories.....people work at the factories.

Factories make products......people buy the products.

Not that complicated when you think about it. ... :cool:
 
from: The Social Machine

Kevin D. Williamson March 21, 2017 4:00 AM

Jobs are a means, not an end.

Funny thing about American manufacturing: The good news about what’s happening at American factories often sounds like bad news to politicians.

American factories are one of the wonders of the world, and, in spite of what President Donald Trump, Senator Bernie Sanders, and other lightly informed populists claim, they are humming. U.S. manufacturing output is about 68 percent higher today in real terms (meaning inflation-adjusted terms) than it was before NAFTA was enacted; manufacturing output is about double in real terms what it was in the 1980s and more than three times what it was in the 1950s. As our factories grow more efficient, output per man-hour has grown, too, which is what troubles the populists and demagogues: Our factories employ a much smaller share of the U.S. work force than they once did

...The purpose of an automobile factory is not to “create jobs,” as the politicians like to say. Its function is not to add to the employment rolls with good wages and UAW benefits, adding to the local tax base and helping to sustain the community — as desirable as all those things are. The purpose of an automobile factory is not to create jobs — it is to create automobiles...

...people who have an explicit legal obligation to work not on our behalf but on behalf of their shareholders do a pretty good job of giving us what we want; the people who vow to work on our behalf do not. That is a paradox only if you do not think about it too much, and not thinking about it too much is the business that politicians are in...
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
This is why the rhetoric about 'we need more high paying manufacturing jobs' is so dumb.

Yeah, this thread will most probably bring out that old tired rant about "people need a living wage", "demand is what makes production", and "people live on Main St., not Wall St.". We've heard it a lot in today's discourse and it usually ends w/ investors throwing up their hands and saying "aw hell, if building factories can't make products I'll just give to charity and go home." Let's face it, high wages sound good to the worker but a factory sees wages as a cost, not an income.


Why does Germany have twice the percentage of manufacturing employment we do?
 
Don't overheat your brain.

People build factories.....people work at the factories.

Factories make products......people buy the products.

Not that complicated when you think about it. ... :cool:

Except the number of people employed in factories is dropping. Not because of the lack of production. The main issue is automation. Assemblyline workers have placed by machines.
 
Except the number of people employed in factories is dropping. Not because of the lack of production. The main issue is automation. Assemblyline workers have placed by machines.
I worked in factories all my life as a mechanical engineer.

Yes, low skill assembly line workers have been reduced in number,

But high skill jobs increased to develop, maintain, and service the machines. ... :cool:
 
Except the number of people employed in factories is dropping. Not because of the lack of production. The main issue is automation. Assemblyline workers have placed by machines.
I worked in factories all my life as a mechanical engineer.

Yes, low skill assembly line workers have been reduced in number,

But high skill jobs increased to develop, maintain, and service the machines. ... :cool:

But the net result is far fewer jobs.
 
Click on the link in my sig to see the hundreds of thousands of factory jobs trump created.

===
WinterBorn Long time, no see. How have you been?
 
But the net result is far fewer jobs.
In the short term, yes.

But investor's will make more money with efficient factories. Which will lead to the building of more factories. With the end result of more jobs created. ... :cool:

I'm not sure there will actually be an increase in jobs. Automation can remove hundreds of jobs. A few technicians and engineers can keep the line running.
 
Factories is where industrial innovation happens and it is in our best interest to take pride in our manufacturing base like Germany and Japan do with theirs. It creates wealth and vibrancy (and some jobs) in our economy. That should not be a hard concept to understand or support.
 
Click on the link in my sig to see the hundreds of thousands of factory jobs trump created.

===
WinterBorn Long time, no see. How have you been?

I'm better than I have any right to be. Happy as a clam. How are things in your world?


Same here - I have a perfect life. Have been away from this board and just recently started posting again. Always enjoyed your sanity, exkpecially since I .... never mind. :uhoh3:
 
Click on the link in my sig to see the hundreds of thousands of factory jobs trump created.

===
WinterBorn Long time, no see. How have you been?

I'm better than I have any right to be. Happy as a clam. How are things in your world?


Same here - I have a perfect life. Have been away from this board and just recently started posting again. Always enjoyed your sanity, exkpecially since I .... never mind. :uhoh3:

When I am the sane one, you have too many serious lunatics.
 
I'm not sure there will actually be an increase in jobs. Automation can remove hundreds of jobs. A few technicians and engineers can keep the line running.
No matter how automated your factory. You will also need fork truck drivers to unload and unload the semi trucks at the docks, office personal, janitorial services, building facilities maintenance men, security personal, grounds keepers, etc. ... :cool:
 
... janitorial services, building facilities maintenance men, security personal, grounds keepers, etc. .
Absolutely, and when a manager puts this work out on contract it's called a "factory layoff" even though the same folks are doing the same work at the same place. it makes the official tally of "manufacturing employment" appear lower and that of "service sectory" jobs appear to soar.

My bottom line for taking stock off U.S. econ trends over the past few decades is as long as total production and jobs grow along w/ average real incomes&wealth, then we must be doing something right.
 
...Assemblyline workers have placed by machines.
--and more workers are hired to design and build machines. Yeah it's a lot of work to change but imho work is good and change is good. My reason is that the long term trend is for Americans getting more job offers w/ bigger incomes where they can amass more wealth.
 
...hundreds of thousands of factory jobs trump created...
State control folks love to talk about all the jobs that their leader created and that when some guy says he built a factory they say "you didn't build that!".

imho it's a crock. The only way a job can be created is when someone decides to pay someone else to do something. If Mr. T did not go and offer to pay someone to work in a factory then he did not create a factory job.
 
from: The Social Machine

Kevin D. Williamson March 21, 2017 4:00 AM

Jobs are a means, not an end.

Funny thing about American manufacturing: The good news about what’s happening at American factories often sounds like bad news to politicians.

American factories are one of the wonders of the world, and, in spite of what President Donald Trump, Senator Bernie Sanders, and other lightly informed populists claim, they are humming. U.S. manufacturing output is about 68 percent higher today in real terms (meaning inflation-adjusted terms) than it was before NAFTA was enacted; manufacturing output is about double in real terms what it was in the 1980s and more than three times what it was in the 1950s. As our factories grow more efficient, output per man-hour has grown, too, which is what troubles the populists and demagogues: Our factories employ a much smaller share of the U.S. work force than they once did

...The purpose of an automobile factory is not to “create jobs,” as the politicians like to say. Its function is not to add to the employment rolls with good wages and UAW benefits, adding to the local tax base and helping to sustain the community — as desirable as all those things are. The purpose of an automobile factory is not to create jobs — it is to create automobiles...

...people who have an explicit legal obligation to work not on our behalf but on behalf of their shareholders do a pretty good job of giving us what we want; the people who vow to work on our behalf do not. That is a paradox only if you do not think about it too much, and not thinking about it too much is the business that politicians are in...
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
This is why the rhetoric about 'we need more high paying manufacturing jobs' is so dumb.

Yeah, this thread will most probably bring out that old tired rant about "people need a living wage", "demand is what makes production", and "people live on Main St., not Wall St.". We've heard it a lot in today's discourse and it usually ends w/ investors throwing up their hands and saying "aw hell, if building factories can't make products I'll just give to charity and go home." Let's face it, high wages sound good to the worker but a factory sees wages as a cost, not an income.
Pink Slips for White Collars

Your and Williamson's trite economic-elitist screeds could have been GIGOed by a robot. It's time automation kills the jobs of conformist scribbling parrots and puts them back in the cages owned by plutocrats' trophy wives. Most management hacks and Diploma Dumbo professionals are so narrow-minded that they, too, can be replaced by robots. The best professional in the business can create a website and program it to do what he does. That would put all his colleagues out of work, but being in the Aynal Randy every man for himself cult, I doubt if he'd care.
 
Except the number of people employed in factories is dropping. Not because of the lack of production. The main issue is automation. Assemblyline workers have placed by machines.
I worked in factories all my life as a mechanical engineer.

Yes, low skill assembly line workers have been reduced in number,

But high skill jobs increased to develop, maintain, and service the machines. ... :cool:

But the net result is far fewer jobs.
When a Fatcat Goes "Me! Me! Me!" the Rest of Us Go "Ow! Ow! Ow!"

Same number of workers with fewer hours but the same pay based on the machine-enhanced greater production. The lazy fatcat parasites better remember that they are far outnumbered and outgunned.
 
Except the number of people employed in factories is dropping. Not because of the lack of production. The main issue is automation. Assemblyline workers have placed by machines.
I worked in factories all my life as a mechanical engineer.

Yes, low skill assembly line workers have been reduced in number,

But high skill jobs increased to develop, maintain, and service the machines. ... :cool:

But the net result is far fewer jobs.
When a Fatcat Goes "Me! Me! Me!" the Rest of Us Go "Ow! Ow! Ow!"

Same number of workers with fewer hours but the same pay based on the machine-enhanced greater production. The lazy fatcat parasites better remember that they are far outnumbered and outgunned.

If you have an assemblyline, with 50 workers on it, and you bring in automation, you will lose workers. The machines with do the work, and there might be jobs for 5 or so maintaining the machines.

As for fewer hours, if it is not a full-time job you usually don't get any benefits.
 

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