We Are Witnessing the Failure of Socialism

[Si modo]

We have socialism (social democracy) jusy a crappy kind that panders to the rich and screws the nonrich...

What we are witnessing is the failure of savage capitalism, AGAIN!!. The social democracies of the EU were doing just fine until the greedy deregulation morons/cronies started the SECOND Pub Great Depression. And thanks again for screwing with the world recovery just to to get Obama.

So, if we have socialism, how is it that we are witnessing a failure of capitalism?

Hmmmmm?

 

[Ernie S.]

During the debt limit crisis that enthralled the nation just months ago liberal economists like Paul Krugman and leftists on this board proclaimed that increasing the national debt, which currently stands somewhere around $15 trillion--up $2 trillion since the debt limit was increased--was not only necessary but desperately needed for economic growth and improvement.

These people told us that the debt and deficit isn't detrimental at all.

"It’s politically fashionable to rant against government spending and demand fiscal responsibility. But right now, increased government spending is just what the doctor ordered, and concerns about the budget deficit should be put on hold." Op-Ed Columnist - Let’s Get Fiscal - NYTimes.com

If any of this were true then the socialist countries of Europe would be thriving. In reality unregulated deficit spending and debt is devastating the global market.

What is happening in Europe is a complete refutation of the left's steadfast faith that increased deficit spending during a time of glacial economic growth is what is needed to grow the economy.

Hell, what is happening today in America is a complete refutation of this administration's entire economic agenda.

What happened in Europe, happened everywhere. A small cadre of elite market engineers fleeced everyone..and then got bailed out by the people they fleeced. All captains of the corporatism you guys embrace so heartily.

I did a bit of research re. your claim. First, I googled "Most capitalist nations"
#1 was Hong Kong and #2 was Singapore.

Then I googled "Most successful economies"
#1 was Singapore and #2 was Kong Kong.

Draw your own conclusions.

 

[Dragon]

See my post above. The socialist countries of Europe ARE thriving.

As for Singapore and Hong Kong (Hong Kong, by the way, is now part of China and no longer an independent country), consider this:

As I noted above, Singapore has universal health care (socialized medicine).

S'pore govt to strengthen social safety net - Channel NewsAsia

Singapore has a social safety net that compares well with those in many European countries, along with its socialized medical care.

Once again, we see that most of the world's richest countries have a lot of socialist elements in their economies. Singapore is not an exception. The only exception other than a few oil-rich Middle East shiekdoms is in fact the United States -- and the U.S., which used to be no. 1 in per capita GDP, has dropped to no. 10 over the past 30 years, as we have abandoned many (but not all) of the socialist features that helped make us the richest country in the world, during the period from the end of World War II until the 1980s, when that was the case.

 

[Si modo]

See my post above. The socialist countries of Europe ARE thriving. ....

I guess you didn't bother reading the OP.

 

[francoHFW]

We have socialism (social democracy) jusy a crappy kind that panders to the rich and screws the nonrich...

What we are witnessing is the failure of savage capitalism, AGAIN!!. The social democracies of the EU were doing just fine until the greedy deregulation morons/cronies started the SECOND Pub Great Depression. And thanks again for screwing with the world recovery just to to get Obama.

So, if we have socialism, how is it that we are witnessing a failure of capitalism?

Hmmmmm?

A failure of SAVAGE capitalism, Cold War Dinosaur. Non dinos know socialism is always democratic, simply well regulated capitalism with protections for citizens, and gov't interest in necessities...

 

[Si modo]

We have socialism (social democracy) jusy a crappy kind that panders to the rich and screws the nonrich...

What we are witnessing is the failure of savage capitalism, AGAIN!!. The social democracies of the EU were doing just fine until the greedy deregulation morons/cronies started the SECOND Pub Great Depression. And thanks again for screwing with the world recovery just to to get Obama.

So, if we have socialism, how is it that we are witnessing a failure of capitalism?

Hmmmmm?

A failure of SAVAGE capitalism, Cold War Dinosaur. Non dinos know socialism is always democratic, simply well regulated capitalism with protections for citizens, and gov't interest in necessities...

So, again, which are we witnessing the failure of, eh?

 

[MikeK]

Socialism can only exist as long as the government's ability to afford it, which is directly limited to the amount of taxes--I'm sorry revenue-- that the government can forcibly take from the private sector.

Do you prefer the kind of laissez-faire capitalism which has evolved during the past three decades and is effectively undermining the American middle class?

These occupiers are delusional. A small group of people, estimated at 1%, are responsible for all the ills of the world. They control everything.

Do you doubt that a tiny fraction of the U.S. population owns and controls considerably more of the Nation's wealth than the vast majority?

I guess that's why they have expressed so much Antisemitism, they are conspiracy theorists akin to KKK members

There is a percentage of anti-Semites in every predominately gentile group. Do you believe that every member of the Occupy movement is anti-Semitic? If so, why?

Also, do you believe there are Jewish anti-gentiles?

 

[auditor0007]

It all boils down to making certain we have adequate revenues to fund our government while not overspending to the point of creating a larger and larger debt to pass on. While I would agree that just spending more with more borrowed money is not a good idea and would not be beneficial, I also do not see cutting government to the core as being beneficial either.

Of course you don't. You're a socialist, and you're probably sucking off the government tit.

You have no clue what a socialist is. If you did, you wouldn't promote such bullshit. But alas, you are correct; I am sucking off the government tit. My kids get SS because their mother, my wife, died. I realize I should not be receiving this money as I have no right to it, at least in your eyes, but guess what? Fuck you and your bullshit.

 

[Lakhota]

By Joshua Holland

Home loans didn't bring on the recession; gimmicky financial instruments bloated to 100 times their value are what caused all this pain.

Wall Street turned a few million home-loans into what Warren Buffet called "economic weapons of mass destruction," cratered the global economy and then, when the bubble burst, turned around and insisted on a massive bailout courtesy of the American tax-payer.

That rightly infuriated most Americans, but it has nonetheless become something of an article of faith among conservatives that Wall Street bears little blame for the Great Recession. The dominant narrative on the right today is that "big government" is ultimately responsible for the crash. In the words of one of Andrew Breitbart's bloggers, Democratic lawmakers like Barney Frank and Chris Dodd “brought down the banking industry by forcing banks to give loans to people who couldn’t afford them.”

That such a ludicrous claim could gain such wide traction is a testament to the intellectual debasement of modern conservative discourse. No bank was ever “forced” – or coerced or incentivized by the government in any way – to make a bad loan.

But the claim falls apart even before one digs into the particulars, for the simple reason that people's mortgages didn't bring down the banking system in the first place.

Much More: The Absurd Zombie Lie About the Economy Right-Wingers Desperately Cling To -- And Why It's Totally Wrong | Tea Party and the Right | AlterNet

 

[Lakhota]

Socialism for the rich; capitalism for the poor and middle class.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

We Are Witnessing the Failure of Socialism

Well.......except for.......

....bu$ine$$-owner$....

.....anyhow......


​

 

[asaratis]

If it is the death of socialism then it is the birth of ......what?

I never said death of socialism, it is alive and well here in the US. It is the failure of socialism, which is inevitable where ever it is applied.

After having power for 8 years in Spain the socialists have destroyed the economy and burdened the nation with unsustainable debt.

The conservative party won in a landslide.

Liberals don't bother reading carefully when their ways are being criticized.

Socialism is failing. Socialism has failed before. Socialism will fail again and again because delusional followers always seem to think it will work "this time".

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Socialism for the rich; capitalism for the poor and middle class.

.....While "conservatives" (and, other such Teabaggers/Dead-O-Heads) insist Capitalism is always......

.....such a good-thing.

*

"Some of the biggest companies in the United States have been firing workers and in some cases lobbying for rules that depress wages at the very time that jobs are needed, pay is low, and the federal budget suffers from a lack of revenue."​

 

[MikeK]

I did a bit of research re. your claim. First, I googled "Most capitalist nations"
#1 was Hong Kong and #2 was Singapore.

Then I googled "Most successful economies"
#1 was Singapore and #2 was Kong Kong.

Draw your own conclusions.

Now do a Google search for the "happiest" country in the world. Then let us know what you think.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

We Are Witnessing the Failure of Socialism

That's why the corporate-world prefers the term.....​

.....$ub$idie$.

"That’s how corporate socialism works – taxpayers contribute when the market rejects."​

 

[francoHFW]

Have you dupes heard of the SECOND Pub World Great Depression? Absolute idiocy...

 

[francoHFW]

Spain has liberal socialists and conservative socialists, since about 1985.......get a passport and change the channel, chumps.

 

[Darkwind]

During the debt limit crisis that enthralled the nation just months ago liberal economists like Paul Krugman and leftists on this board proclaimed that increasing the national debt, which currently stands somewhere around $15 trillion--up $2 trillion since the debt limit was increased--was not only necessary but desperately needed for economic growth and improvement.

These people told us that the debt and deficit isn't detrimental at all.

"It’s politically fashionable to rant against government spending and demand fiscal responsibility. But right now, increased government spending is just what the doctor ordered, and concerns about the budget deficit should be put on hold." Op-Ed Columnist - Let’s Get Fiscal - NYTimes.com

If any of this were true then the socialist countries of Europe would be thriving. In reality unregulated deficit spending and debt is devastating the global market.

What is happening in Europe is a complete refutation of the left's steadfast faith that increased deficit spending during a time of glacial economic growth is what is needed to grow the economy.

Hell, what is happening today in America is a complete refutation of this administration's entire economic agenda.

It all boils down to making certain we have adequate revenues to fund our government while not overspending to the point of creating a larger and larger debt to pass on. While I would agree that just spending more with more borrowed money is not a good idea and would not be beneficial, I also do not see cutting government to the core as being beneficial either.

we have adequate revenues to fund our government. The problem is, people want more than we can afford, and the politicians want power more than they care about the country.

 

[bripat9643]

I did a bit of research re. your claim. First, I googled "Most capitalist nations"
#1 was Hong Kong and #2 was Singapore.

Then I googled "Most successful economies"
#1 was Singapore and #2 was Kong Kong.

Draw your own conclusions.

Now do a Google search for the "happiest" country in the world. Then let us know what you think.

How was happiness measured? What are the units of happiness?

GDP can be measured. Quantities like "happiness" are pure moonshine.

 

[Mustang]

During the debt limit crisis that enthralled the nation just months ago liberal economists like Paul Krugman and leftists on this board proclaimed that increasing the national debt, which currently stands somewhere around $15 trillion--up $2 trillion since the debt limit was increased--was not only necessary but desperately needed for economic growth and improvement.

These people told us that the debt and deficit isn't detrimental at all.

"It’s politically fashionable to rant against government spending and demand fiscal responsibility. But right now, increased government spending is just what the doctor ordered, and concerns about the budget deficit should be put on hold." Op-Ed Columnist - Let’s Get Fiscal - NYTimes.com

If any of this were true then the socialist countries of Europe would be thriving. In reality unregulated deficit spending and debt is devastating the global market.

What is happening in Europe is a complete refutation of the left's steadfast faith that increased deficit spending during a time of glacial economic growth is what is needed to grow the economy.

Hell, what is happening today in America is a complete refutation of this administration's entire economic agenda.

Congratulations!

A. You don't know what you're talking about.
B. You're clueless about what you declare to be facts.
C. You wield your ignorance like a club.

The economic tactic that European nations embraced as aggregate spending was dropping due to a credit and spending shortfall was austerity. The effect of austerity is to FURTHER reduce aggregate spending within the entire economy by lowering spending in the public sector even as spending is decreasing in the private sector. In other words, while it's necessary to ultimately reduce debt, the absolute worst time to reduce spending in the public sector is when spending is also falling in the private sector because a reduction in spending (otherwise known as demand) is the very cause of the economic slump. It's a loss of demand which keeps unemployment high, investment low, and factories idle. Not only will austerity not fix the problem of reduced demand in the private sector, it actually increases the problem of an anemic economy because aggregate spending falls even further, thereby reducing spending even further in the private sector. It's like an economic death spiral.