warning : discussion of race in America, likely to be unpleasant

[digger]

Not a lot of benefit from racism IMHO. And to suggest that those who are not actively dismantling racism are participating in it is ridiculous. Most of us have lives to live and families to take care of, and have no time to fix societies ills, which includes a lot more issues than racism. There is an inherent feeling in this country from it's inception that you fix your own problems. So why not stop obsessing about race and get on with making yourself a better person.


PS: this isn't politics, so why is this thread here?

That's cold, man. You have a dim view of our founding principles. I don't know where in any of the founding documents you can find that everyone's in it on their own. I think that's more of a modern conservative concept that is falsely overlaid on our history. I think we're founded on the principle that by working together we can promote the common good. Providing for the general welfare is right there in the first sentence of the constitution.

The reason that those of us who are privileged have the responsibility to dismantle racism is that we benefit from it. Do you agree that we benefit from other people's loss every day. Doesn't that make you feel bad?

My basic problem with your outlook on racism is that you're expecting somebody else to take responsibility for an inequality they did not create. I will not accept responsibility for somebody else's discriminatory or racist actions, either past, present, or future. I will support laws that preclude such actions and punsh transgressors. And I would support using public money, primarily loans, to help finance programs that teach people a trade or in some effective way give them a chance to succeed. But not if it turns into a way of living, moving from one program to the next on my tax dollars. I don't care who you are or what color your skin is, you are responsibile for your actions and should pay for the consequences of your decisions, whatever they may be.

You didn't answer my questions. Do you agree that we benefit form other people's loss every day? Doesn't that make you feel bad?

It's just this funny thing I have. When I see injustice, I think that people have the responsibility to correct it. You wouldn't walk past a drowning child and do nothing to help. Why would you watch children be born into an unjust world and not try to do something about it?

I can't force you to do anything. You have every right to ignore the plight of your common man. But I think less of you for it.

 

[Robert]

That's cold, man. You have a dim view of our founding principles. I don't know where in any of the founding documents you can find that everyone's in it on their own. I think that's more of a modern conservative concept that is falsely overlaid on our history. I think we're founded on the principle that by working together we can promote the common good. Providing for the general welfare is right there in the first sentence of the constitution.

The reason that those of us who are privileged have the responsibility to dismantle racism is that we benefit from it. Do you agree that we benefit from other people's loss every day. Doesn't that make you feel bad?

My basic problem with your outlook on racism is that you're expecting somebody else to take responsibility for an inequality they did not create. I will not accept responsibility for somebody else's discriminatory or racist actions, either past, present, or future. I will support laws that preclude such actions and punsh transgressors. And I would support using public money, primarily loans, to help finance programs that teach people a trade or in some effective way give them a chance to succeed. But not if it turns into a way of living, moving from one program to the next on my tax dollars. I don't care who you are or what color your skin is, you are responsibile for your actions and should pay for the consequences of your decisions, whatever they may be.

You didn't answer my questions. Do you agree that we benefit form other people's loss every day? Doesn't that make you feel bad?

It's just this funny thing I have. When I see injustice, I think that people have the responsibility to correct it. You wouldn't walk past a drowning child and do nothing to help. Why would you watch children be born into an unjust world and not try to do something about it?

I can't force you to do anything. You have every right to ignore the plight of your common man. But I think less of you for it.

You can't even define what is unjust in our Nation yet you ask other people to be responsible for it and to fix it.

 

[Wiseacre]

You didn't answer my questions. Do you agree that we benefit form other people's loss every day? Doesn't that make you feel bad?

Yes and yes, to some extent. Shit happens, like all the tornados lately. Sure I feel bad for those less fortunate, or those who have lost so much. But you're not talking about natural disasters, you're talking about racism, which is already against the law for the most part. I see no gain from racism on anybody's part, no benefit at all. In today's scoiety, being racist is much more likeyl to cost you than help you.

It's just this funny thing I have. When I see injustice, I think that people have the responsibility to correct it. You wouldn't walk past a drowning child and do nothing to help. Why would you watch children be born into an unjust world and not try to do something about it?


I would never walk past a drowning child of any race. But - if you bring a child into this world then the responsibility for that baby is on you, entirely on you. Sure, it's an unjust world out there, what do you expect me to do about it?


I can't force you to do anything. You have every right to ignore the plight of your common man. But I think less of you for it.


And I think less of you for not helping yourself.

 

[auditor0007]

There is a big problem with Black society, and an awful lot of us see it everyday. While there are a good percentage of people who are racist, I think you will find that there is a much bigger percentage of whites who I would call prejudiced. Some will say there is no difference, but there is a great difference. Those who are racist believe that Blacks are inferior and shouldn't be treated equally because they are not equal, and they are not capable of being equal to anyone else. Those who are prejudiced usually base their prejudice on the actions taken by those in Black society. When you go to work and see five Black employees who never put in a full day's work while everyone else does, it creates negative feelings. I'll put myself in that group. And yes there are exeptions; not all Blacks are lazy.

The bottom line is this; as a society, we have done many things to try to help advance Blacks by giving them all types of breaks. While a few have taken advantage of those breaks to better themselves, most just abuse those breaks and waste them away. Until there is a wholehearted change, nothing will ever change. Whites, and most others will continue to have prejudiced or racist attitudes toward Blacks.

As an example, Bill Cosby has made clear how Black America has wasted away educational opportunities over the years. It's time for Black America to step up and improve themselves instead of constantly blaming their situation on White America.

Bill Cosby speaks bluntly about black people and education - National Education | Examiner.com

That's an interesting point, the distinction between racism and prejudice. I'm not sure if you're using the right words. But there is a distinction there that's good to make, and I'll go with your words since I'm talking to you.

But I'm not comfortable with blaming Black people for prejudice. I mean sure, if more of them worked harder, some people would perceive them as harder working. But only some. I'm not familiar with any statistics on how productive Black people are compared to White people, and I'm not willing to take your anecdotal evidence.

Basically what you're saying is that people think they're lazy because they're lazy. But wasn't that one of the charges from the start, when they were slaves? Isn't that part of the whole racial caricature? So if all of your evidence for that is anecdotal, than think about the fact that anecdotes are subjective. You form your memories based on what you already believe. Perhaps you were preconditioned to perceive Black people as lazy?

I'm familiar with Cosby's perspective. I know that a lot of Black people are upset with him for holding that view. That doesn't make him wrong, of course. But I think maybe you're misrepresenting it. Cosby is saying that Black people have to do what they can about better their own lot, instead of just complaining about it. But that doesn't free us of our obligation to do what we can, from the part of the privileged, to end racism.

As a society, we've done some things to help Black people. But as a society, we've done a whole lot more to hurt them. And we continue to do that today. Do you agree?

Oh, and I'll ignore Bucs if you do. We might actually get away with having a mature conversation.

I base my views on mostly personal experience. I am white, but I have had a great deal of interaction with blacks, African Americans, whichever term you prefer. My sister's Godfather is a black man, and I have a great deal of respect for him. He was always a very hard worker and supported his family. He was married to a white woman and they divorced after about 15 years of marriage. She was a bit of a nutcase, so I blame the divorce on her, not him. But even after the divorce, he finished raising his kids, and they all have turned out to be well adjusted productive people.

In my work, I have had many blacks as employees. When I say they are lazy, I have seen it personally. Again, it's not every single one of them, but it is the majority. And it's not because they can't do the work. To me, it seems that so many have an attitude that if they show up for work, that is good enough. They don't believe they actually have to do any work though. While I support giving blacks opportunities, I think we have taken it too far in many cases, making it too easy for many of them to skate by. In the long run, it has helped them accept a life that they see as normal, but most of the rest of society does not.

Last of all, I raised my late wife's half nephew, who was mixed. His mother was 15 when she had him and it was just a very bad situation. As much as my late wife and I did for him, he wanted to be Black, and I do mean that in a negative way. He wanted to be part of the Black culture. I'm not talking about Black historical culture, but the gang type hoods. After my wife died, he stole all of her jewelry including our wedding rings and her engagement ring. He pawned them off for drug money. He dropped out of school, although I did see to it that he went back to graduate through a high school that offered a program for troubled youth. But after that, he just continued on with that Black street mentality. He is now 25 years old, has two illegitimate kids, and has been in and out of prison two times for burglary. He actually ended up worse than most in general.

I realize that his story can be told over and over again amongst whites also. It's not only black kids that turn out bad and make bad choices. But we see this over and over again in the black community. There is a reason that so many black men end up in our prisons, and it's not just because they weren't given any opportunities. In most cases, it is because they chose not to take advantage of those opportunities. And then in the end, they blame it on everyone except themselves.

To me, it is very easy to determine where any group of people may be headed. All you need do is take a close look at their heroes. If their heroes are upstanding citizens, then they will try to emulate that type of person. For most blacks, their heroes are either guys who end up in prison or those who blame white society for all of their shortcomings.

 

[sitarro]

Hey digger, what are you and your self righteousness doing to address the giant boogie man you describe in your OP? I myself am bored with the overuse of the word racism and really don't give a shit what you or black people perceive. I have noticed in my 57 years of life here that when one doesn't allow themselves to be a willing participant in the practice of victimhood, the sky is truly the limit........ it doesn't matter what your skin's color is.

It amazes me how quickly blacks will defend incredibly bad actions taken by those with the same skin color as them. Tiger Woods(yes they claim him even though he has 1/8th black blood)...... I have discussed his stupid moves by both black women and men(I work with both), all of them agree, Tiger is innocent, he was tempted by all those slut white women. Michael Vick........ innocent, they are only dogs and dog fighting is something blacks are raised watching....!!!!?????? Those 2 black girls that attacked the transgendered white...... they have the right to defend themselves against this guy who went into the women's restroom(one version). The other story is the 18 year old's boyfriend was talking to the tranny and she jumped her for talking to her man. Barack Obama........they defend this ass all day long. It's George Bush's fault that none of Obama's people's ideas aren't working.


The biggest obstacle that blacks in America face is themselves. The automatic responses of blaming whites for everything is only part of it. I know a few blacks that tend to be conservative and they all are successful and yet the majority feel conservatives are racist that hate them....... it's what they were taught and they can't seem to think their way out of those beliefs. It has become so ingrained in their mind set that when a real, exceptional black person comes along...... Condoleezza Rice, Herman Cain or Colonel Allen West....... they marginalize them by calling them Aunt Jemima, pizza guy or oreo.


I can't believe that blacks aren't insulted by the fake pandering done by the democrat party..... don't they know they are being manipulated by people that only care bout their vote?

 

[Lasher]

Racism in America. Everyone says it's there. But not very many people will fess up to it. There was that couple in Alabama that picked me up hitch hiking. They were not ashamed of being racist. I asked them why they were racist. They said hey, Black people are just stupid and lazy. What about Miles Davis? They gave me Miles Davis.

But that's not most racism in America. Most people who consider themselves racists don't talk about it publicly, because they know it's not acceptable, except I guess in Alabama. I think that most racists today don't even consider themselves racist. And yet racism continues.

There is something in America that persistently disadvantages Black people. It happens all the time and everywhere, in thousands of ways, big and small. I would be interested to hear someone who is perceived as Black speak to this.

Color blindness seems to be popular nowadays. Just don't talk about race. I don't see very many Black people taking this view. It seems to be a comfortable thing for the privileged to think. And I don't agree. To be color blind is to deny that people who are perceived differently have had different experiences. It's a different country if you're Black. A much worse place to live.

I think that those who benefit from racism, and do nothing to dismantle it, are participating. They may not consider themselves racist. They may not even look at Black people differently from White people. But they are complacent. It's like buying a used bicycle for 20 bucks when it's worth 2000. You may not have stolen it. But if you're honest with yourself, you know that someone else did, and you're participating in the crime.

I, Lasher, am a racist, and have no qualms whatsoever about saying so. Most people think being a racist is hating people of another race and wish bad things for them, but that is not the real meaning of racism. True racists believe that their race is inherently, and naturally, superior to other races, which doesn't necessarily denote hate for other races, but indicates a pride in the acomplishments of his own race, and an awareness of the differences in all races as a whole.

Certainly, there are individual negroes who are more intelligent than some of the less intellectually endowed Caucasian people, but to discuss race in a universal way, demands that average be compared to average, not individual to individual, and it is a well documented fact that the average negro IQ is from 15 to 30 % lower than that of whites, depending on the geographic location of the negroes.

While it is true that the IQs of Jewish people have been reported to be a wee bit higher than that of white gentiles, we must remember that these data are usually recorded by Jews themselves, and while certain Asians do score a bit higher on some tests, neither they nor the Jews have done for the world what the great, magnificent white race has.

I will not iterate or enumerate these acts and deeds of the white people of history and the present day; that has been done in here before by myself and others to the jeers of those who have no idea who has done what for the benefit of the world and civilization; let it suffice to say that any fair-minded person would readily admit that few beneficial things have not borne the stamp of the Caucasian race.

I, and most white racists, do not hate for the sake of hating, but we hate the acts and behavior of our inferiors of the lesser races whose cultures are so different from ours and we realize that the "diversity" of races living in sweet harmony is an impossible dream by the idealistic and unrealistic liberals and one-worlders who are seldom right about anything.

There have been many good and honorable white men (Abe Lincoln, for one) who recognized the folly of the white and black races ever living in harmony, and it would behoove us all to heed their words. If you haven't read about these men, you don't have a good education.

 

[IanC]

Racism in America. Everyone says it's there. But not very many people will fess up to it. There was that couple in Alabama that picked me up hitch hiking. They were not ashamed of being racist. I asked them why they were racist. They said hey, Black people are just stupid and lazy. What about Miles Davis? They gave me Miles Davis.

But that's not most racism in America. Most people who consider themselves racists don't talk about it publicly, because they know it's not acceptable, except I guess in Alabama. I think that most racists today don't even consider themselves racist. And yet racism continues.

There is something in America that persistently disadvantages Black people. It happens all the time and everywhere, in thousands of ways, big and small. I would be interested to hear someone who is perceived as Black speak to this.

Color blindness seems to be popular nowadays. Just don't talk about race. I don't see very many Black people taking this view. It seems to be a comfortable thing for the privileged to think. And I don't agree. To be color blind is to deny that people who are perceived differently have had different experiences. It's a different country if you're Black. A much worse place to live.

I think that those who benefit from racism, and do nothing to dismantle it, are participating. They may not consider themselves racist. They may not even look at Black people differently from White people. But they are complacent. It's like buying a used bicycle for 20 bucks when it's worth 2000. You may not have stolen it. But if you're honest with yourself, you know that someone else did, and you're participating in the crime.

the answer to that question is simple. intelligence.

dumb people arent as successful as smart people. there are more dumb blacks than smart blacks compared to the rates of other races. therefore it is no surprise that blacks dont do as well as the other races.

 

[Avatar4321]

Or maybe people aren't as bad as you seem to think we are.

Nah, people are pretty shitty.

Maybe you should start treating them with respect instead and you'll get a different reaction.

If it's the goal, it's time to start living the goal. Goals are worthless if you don't bother achieving them.

Fake it 'till you make it, huh?

No. Don't need to fake it at all. You just need to actually work toward it instead of never getting around to it.

Central to our society? Hardly. In fact, race is one of the least central aspects to our society. It's a distraction from the real problems we face, problems which cut across racial lines like poverty, corruption, violence, etc.

Race decides where we live, where we go to school, who our friends are, who we marry, what sort of opportunities we have, and what obstacles. You may not want it to matter. But you'll have a hard time showing me that it doesn't.

No it doesn't. That's total bullcrap. We live where we choose to live. We associate with who we choose to associate. We marry who we choose to marry. You want to pretend that we have no ability to make choices in our life and that's the biggest bunch of crap I've heard today. We make the decisions that determine our life. We choose our associates. We choose our spouse(s). We decide what type of career we want to pursue.

Or we can make excuses and pretend we are victims. But it's still your choice to be a victim or not be one.

How do you intend to stop people who don't want to listen?

Good question. Any ideas?

You don't. You simply continue to speak. Continue to reach out. And pray that they learn it. Making laws won't change people, though they may encourage people to hide their true feelings. If you want to change the hearts of others it has to be through persuasion, long suffering, gentleness and meekness, and by geniune love. If you want to defeat evil in the lives of people, you don't do it by doing evil to them, you do it by doing good to them.

It takes time. But it brings lasting results and changes hearts instead of passing laws that create an appearance of results, but don't really change anyones feelings.

 

[Avatar4321]

You didn't answer my questions. Do you agree that we benefit form other people's loss every day? Doesn't that make you feel bad?

It's just this funny thing I have. When I see injustice, I think that people have the responsibility to correct it. You wouldn't walk past a drowning child and do nothing to help. Why would you watch children be born into an unjust world and not try to do something about it?

I can't force you to do anything. You have every right to ignore the plight of your common man. But I think less of you for it.

Why do you presume government is the only way to solve injustice? And how can you solve the injustice of the world until you eliminate the injustice in your own life?

 

[sitarro]

Except Blacks and white libs.

Interesting, isn't it? White people saying that racism is over and it's time for color blindness. Black people, for some reason, still seem to think that racism is an issue. Maybe it's all the young unarmed Black men getting shot by cops. Or any of the countless horrible injustices that happen all the time.

No question that black males get stopped and questioned more often than white males. I can walk in any neighborhood in America and not get questioned by cops. If a black male is walking in a white neighborhood, he is likely to be stopped.
Shootings go both ways. Cops are shot by black males and are likely to be quick on the trigger when confronting young, black males.

Yea, you can walk through any neighborhood without being questioned by police......... you may get investigated by police and they will be the ones to request the coroner in a lot of inner city neighborhoods because of the color of your skin. These two British guys had traveled all over South and Central America without incident, they came to the United States to be brutally beaten and shot by animals that just happen to have really dark skin.

Florida shooting: British friends murdered in Sarasota marched at gunpoint to ghetto where they were killed, police believe - mirror.co.uk


THE two British friends murdered in Florida were marched at gunpoint to a ghetto before being shot, police believe.

Detectives are probing why holidaymakers James Cooper, 25, and James Kouzaris, 24, were on the crime-ridden estate.

They fear alleged killer Shawn Tyson, 16, ambushed the pair on a main road as they walked to an all-night restaurant.

He is then thought to have forced them into the notorious housing project in Sarasota with a machine gun at their back.

Mr Cooper and Mr Kouzaris were shot multiple times as they fled after being made to turn out their pockets.

Almost a week after the shocking deaths, police remain convinced they died as a result of a botched robbery. Captain Paul Sutton said: “It’s entirely possible a confrontation took place outside the housing project and they were then taken to where their bodies were eventually found.

Exactly how naive are you? The police will question suspicious people, it doesn't matter what color your skin is. White people get questioned on the show "Cops" all the time because they are in predominately black or hispanic neighborhoods, are they trying to buy drugs, a nasty ass hooker? I dare you to go walk through Southwest Houston where the angels from New Orleans migrated after Katrina, the crime rate in that part of town is off the charts and they really don't like white people...... prove me wrong.

 

[The Gadfly]

Let me explain that whole "I have Black friends" thing. It's not that people consider the phrase itself racist. But it's an indicator. The conversation happens a lot. Someone will say something racist, get called on it, and then say "but I have Black friends." It a very recognizable pattern, and it makes people groan. Especially since if you press the person, it usually turns out that they're pretty racist, regardless of who their friends are. Very racist people often have good friends that they don't apply their racist beliefs to. Once someone becomes an individual, that trumps people's preconceived notions of them.

It's kind of like when someone says "I don't want to offend you, but," you know they're about to offend you. It's not that they said "I don't want to offend you" that makes them offensive. It's what they say next.

Republicans do tend more towards racism than Democrats. It's a demographics thing, I think. Republicans are older and live in the South. That sort of thing perpetuates itself. Republicans play to their base, which isn't Black. So Blacks vote for Democrats. And the whole thing just keeps going. Not necessarily overt racism, but the parties looking out for different people's interests. Urban vs. rural is often Black vs. White, for instance.

This last part Digger, is part of the current problem; race, like it or not, is still an issue for a lot of people (Black and White) . Now, combine it with political animosity, and that only further inflames the situation; it creates one more reason for division, rather than anything for people to come together around. Unfortunately the interests of urban America and rural America are so different, that frankly there's little hope of reconciling them. What's good for big-city America, is bad for those of us out here in flyover country, and what's good for us, is bad for big-city America. From my perspective, rural America gets the short end of the stick. Do we resent that? Of course. Race only gets into it to the extent that Black people overwhelmingly support a party we regard as our mortal political enemy (for good reason) and that can lead to the idea that the friend of my enemy must also be my enemy. That may not be true, but the perception exists, and goes both ways.

Unfortunately the Urban vs. rural (and to some extent suburban) America can only get worse, and the racial divide may well do likewise. I see no real willingness to compromise on either side, and I am beginning to wonder if there is any further point in discussing the matter.

 

[Grace]

Interesting reading, this thread. Lots of great answers. With that said, I have to agree with The Gadfly. What's the point of discussing it? There is no compromise.

 

[brokenarrow]

[While it is true that the IQs of Jewish people have been reported to be a wee bit higher than that of white gentiles, we must remember that these data are usually recorded by Jews themselves, and while certain Asians do score a bit higher on some tests, neither they nor the Jews have done for the world what the great, magnificent white race has.

.

The most published book in the world is all about the Jews too! They like to grab publicity.

 

[rightwinger]

You didn't answer my questions. Do you agree that we benefit form other people's loss every day? Doesn't that make you feel bad?

It's just this funny thing I have. When I see injustice, I think that people have the responsibility to correct it. You wouldn't walk past a drowning child and do nothing to help. Why would you watch children be born into an unjust world and not try to do something about it?

I can't force you to do anything. You have every right to ignore the plight of your common man. But I think less of you for it.

Why do you presume government is the only way to solve injustice? And how can you solve the injustice of the world until you eliminate the injustice in your own life?

Actualy, most of the progress in the racial tolerance of this country came about because of government mandates. People did not integrate on their own free will

 

[IanC]

[While it is true that the IQs of Jewish people have been reported to be a wee bit higher than that of white gentiles, we must remember that these data are usually recorded by Jews themselves, and while certain Asians do score a bit higher on some tests, neither they nor the Jews have done for the world what the great, magnificent white race has.

.

The most published book in the world is all about the Jews too! They like to grab publicity.

actually the ashkenazi jews are roughly as far ahead as blacks are behind.

 

[Mr Liberty]

I don't consider myself racist, but I do consider myself judgemental. Or prejudiced I guess could fit in some ways. Depends on the situation.
I was semi in love with a black man years ago. But, he was married and so was I. He didn't cheat, and neither did I. So, that kind of left us both in a bad place. He moved to detroit and his wife passed away. I was divorced but here in California. Many years had passed by then. He moved on with his life, as I did mine. So no. I am not racist.
Seeing vids of black women act like lowlifes in a McD's? Or how they talk? "I called the POH leese" or "I axed my fren" or "Ma went off in da amboo lance" or "come to my betroom" and "ho" and "nigguh" and other terms (enbonics) make me shudder. Am I judgemental? Yes. Is it racist? I don't honestly know.

I think racism is rampant and it is on both sides. Black this, black that...but the same is not allowed for white this or white that. I'm tired of being blamed for something I didn't do. Slavery was before my time. I have never been bigoted in how I treat anyone, regardless of their skin color but I have been treated poorly by blacks if I was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Honky, cracker, whitey. Do I hold that against ALL blacks? No. I want equality for all.
So what am I?

An individual.

 

[The Gadfly]

You didn't answer my questions. Do you agree that we benefit form other people's loss every day? Doesn't that make you feel bad?

It's just this funny thing I have. When I see injustice, I think that people have the responsibility to correct it. You wouldn't walk past a drowning child and do nothing to help. Why would you watch children be born into an unjust world and not try to do something about it?

I can't force you to do anything. You have every right to ignore the plight of your common man. But I think less of you for it.

Why do you presume government is the only way to solve injustice? And how can you solve the injustice of the world until you eliminate the injustice in your own life?

Actualy, most of the progress in the racial tolerance of this country came about because of government mandates. People did not integrate on their own free will

Let's suppose for the moment that your last statement is entirely accurate, RW. What do you think that implies for the future?If it's done by government force, what happens, when that force is no longer applied (or possibly no longer can be applied)? What happens then; something like the former Yugoslavia? If you have to force people together, do you not raise the question of what happens if they don't like it, but only do it because they are made to? Is America to be kept together only by force of arms? Is it then worth that?

I wonder if this nation will exist, a generation from now, in anything like its present form. Won't make much difference to either of us, of course; we won't be here to see it.

 

[rightwinger]

Why do you presume government is the only way to solve injustice? And how can you solve the injustice of the world until you eliminate the injustice in your own life?

Actualy, most of the progress in the racial tolerance of this country came about because of government mandates. People did not integrate on their own free will

Let's suppose for the moment that your last statement is entirely accurate, RW. What do you think that implies for the future?If it's done by government force, what happens, when that force is no longer applied (or possibly no longer can be applied)? What happens then; something like the former Yugoslavia? If you have to force people together, do you not raise the question of what happens if they don't like it, but only do it because they are made to? Is America to be kept together only by force of arms? Is it then worth that?

I wonder if this nation will exist, a generation from now, in anything like its present form. Won't make much difference to either of us, of course; we won't be here to see it.

I think we know the answer to that question.

If Government force were removed....life would go on like usual

- People realized it was no big deal for their children to attend schools with blacks
- The military worked just fine once it was integrated
- The world did not end when blacks and whites were allowed to marry

 

[William Joyce]

Racism in America. Everyone says it's there. But not very many people will fess up to it. There was that couple in Alabama that picked me up hitch hiking. They were not ashamed of being racist. I asked them why they were racist. They said hey, Black people are just stupid and lazy. What about Miles Davis? They gave me Miles Davis.

Miles Davis once said that if he had one hour left on Earth, he'd like to spend it choking a white man, slowly.

Still want Miles Davis?

 

[William Joyce]

This would happen whether we talked about it or not. Further more, it's not just a mistake. There are still those who are proudly racist. And they're not just going to stop because we stop talking about race. We have a responsibility to stop them, in word and in deed, and to do that we need to talk about it.

You're not proposing a conversation here, you're proposing the thought police. "We have a responsibility to stop them"? Stop WHAT? Their thoughts? Their words?

WHAT isn't "likely to be pleasant"? The extermination of whites? Yeah, I noticed.