War on Terrorism, What is Terrorism?

[rtwngAvngr]

You're just using a tactic to justify wrong/evil behavior.

You conservatives will destroy this nation with your fear mongering and rationalizations. You just don't understand that principals are more important in the long run than immeadiate gratification.

Like the immediate gratification libs teach people it is ok to let rule their lives? Like letting the masses sink to lowest common denominator of behavior, justifying their bad behavior, exonerating them from the responsibility of their own lives to win their vote? Like fanning the flames of every kind of racial, and economic divisiveness you can think of to win elections? Like distoring history and embracing moral relativism to destroy all value systems except your state-centric monstrousity of a worldview?

One day you will wake up and realize the price of bankrupt philosphy, but it will probably be too late to do anything about it. When the USA goes fascist, that's the ball game.

Wade.

You have the mentality of a twelve year old. Quit wrapping your crap in a faux concern for our safety.

 

[wade]

Like the immediate gratification libs teach people it is ok to let rule their lives? Like letting the masses sink to lowest common denominator of behavior, justifying their bad behavior, exonerating them from the responsibility of their own lives to win their vote? Like fanning the flames of every kind of racial, and economic divisiveness you can think of to win elections? Like distoring history and embracing moral relativism to destroy all value systems except your state-centric monstrousity of a worldview?

What a bunch of crap. I have not advocated any of these things.

What immeadiate gratification the the "libs" teach people it's okay to let rule their lives?

You're so full of shit you cannot even constitute a decent argument. Why not accuse all who are not right-wing blinder wearers like yourself of being devil-worshipers? It'a about the only thing you haven't accused them of.

You have the mentality of a twelve year old. Quit wrapping your crap in a faux concern for our safety.

If I have the mentality of a 12 year old, you're still wearing diapers, and they need changing bad!

Quit wrapping yourself in that coat of exagerated fear to justify stuffing your pockets at everyone elses expense.

Guys like you are Bin-Ladin's biggest ally. You will destroy this country just like he planned in the guise of seeking to defend us from him.

Wade.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

What a bunch of crap. I have not advocated any of these things.

What immeadiate gratification the the "libs" teach people it's okay to let rule their lives?

Any kind of immediate gratification.

You're so full of shit you cannot even constitute a decent argument.

No. My arguments are good. Your view of history is quite distorted.

Why not accuse all who are not right-wing blinder wearers like yourself of being devil-worshipers? It'a about the only thing you haven't accused them of.

I don't believe it's accurate. That's why not.

If I have the mentality of a 12 year old, you're still wearing diapers, and they need changing bad!

Quit wrapping yourself in that coat of exagerated fear to justify stuffing your pockets at everyone elses expense.

Oh that's right I forgot. This war was invented in texas.

Guys like you are Bin-Ladin's biggest ally. You will destroy this country just like he planned in the guise of seeking to defend us from him.

Wade.

No. You are.

You've lost all crediblity at this point.

Who are you voting for?

 

[JIHADTHIS]

You're just using a tactic to justify wrong/evil behavior.

You conservatives will destroy this nation with your fear mongering and rationalizations.

Wade.

Fear Mongering? Care to elaborate?

 

[theim]

no no no, Wade is correct. What we need is a whole new approach to the war on terror. Obviously the one we are currently using is doing just what bin Laden wants. So here is a new strategy that WILL work:

Phase 1: Operation Make France Love Us Again

This is most crucial to our success. For too long have we acted unilaterally with nations such as Britain, Italy, Czech Republic, Hungary, etc. Everyone knows these nations do not count. How that moron Bush thought he could invade a country without the awesome military might of the French Army is beyond me, but this needs to be rectified.

Phase 2: Operation Sing Along

We must show togetherness in this time of trouble. Bin Laden wants us to be divided. So to that end, every friday night at 6:00 PM ET a mandatory sing along will be held. Everyone must join hands with their neighbor and sing "Kumbaya" so loudly the entire world will here. This militant terrorists will be drowned in a sea of love and compassion, and they will be unable to kill such peace-loving people.

Phase 3: Operation Fairness

We need to recognize the fact that at this moment an 89 year-old German lady named Annika is just as likely to commit a terrorist act in the US as 20 year-old Abu Muhammed al-Kaboom. WE must repeal the Patriot Act in its entireity. After all, hurting peoples feelings is more dangerous than not knowing that the latter person has checked out books on bomb-making and popular tourist sights.

escuse me for a moment...

OK now

Phase 4: Operation UNification

The United States is an overly nagative force in the world today. I heard that from a 23 year-old liberal college rich kid. And they know everything. So to end America's evil influence on the world, a constitutional ammendment must be passed that makes America 100% subordinate to the UN. With the UN demonstrating excellent ability to produce positive results in Rwanda and Sudan, ability to enforce resolutions, and their super third-grade-esque plan of "give the naught kid responsibility to straighten him out" for Libya and the Human Rights council, I think they would be more than fit to lead the US. When this happens we can finally control Iran and North Korea by passing Resolution Number 29347250283: "OK, now this is REALLY your last chance. We mean it this time. Seriously, this is your LAST last chance. Really. We are not kidding. Please? We are not joking. Really. We are gonna do something this time."


I firmly believe that with this strategy in place the US and the world will be better off.

 

[JIHADTHIS]

You work for the Kerry campaign? Sounds like his ideas :teeth:

 

[wade]

Fear Mongering? Care to elaborate?

I'm not saying there is nothing to fear, just that the whole thing has been blown out of all perspective. Our gaurd was down and we got a bloody nose. We learn to keep our gaurd up. That is no reason to subvert the constitution and morgage the next generations future.

To listen to the right wingers, there is an army of 10's of thousands of terrorists assailing our borders. This just isn't the case at all. It certainly doesn't justify destroying the USA in the name of saving it.

-----------------

Thiem - you are totally misreprenting my positions. Typical of the right-wingers - exagerate and lie rather than discuss. Use whatever smokescreen is available to push through your self serving agenda.

As for Bush - I don't think he should ever have even been allowed to run for president in the first place. One law for all is a founding principal of this democracy - yet it has not been applied to the Bush family. It's a travisty that this man is president, espeically with his hippocritical policies.

Wade.

 

[Comrade]

Thiem - you are totally misreprenting my positions. Typical of the right-wingers - exagerate and lie rather than discuss. Use whatever smokescreen is available to push through your self serving agenda.

:read:

"Democracy has generally failed, not suceeded, dating all the way back to the Greeks." :usa:

"We have no idea what might have happend if the USA had chosen communism back in the 1780's instead of a democratic republic for its form of government. "

"In the pursuit of our own interests in VN, we screwed the pooch. We were, in effect, telling the SV peasents they would have to continue to live under the same oppressive social and economic situation they'd lived with under French rule" :spank3:

"And the US decided to side with Diem, basically on the side of the landlords against the peasents. This is the problem with American installed "democracies" in third world nations. "


"Hmmm...you insult me, then you get outraged when I insult you back. Either don't start it in the first place, which I'd prefer, or stop being a cry baby."

"What a bunch of crap." :fu2:

"You're so full of shit you cannot even constitute a decent argument." :fu2:

"Guys like you are Bin-Ladin's biggest ally." :fu2:



Have a nice day.

 

[JIHADTHIS]

I'm not saying there is nothing to fear, just that the whole thing has been blown out of all perspective. Our gaurd was down and we got a bloody nose. We learn to keep our gaurd up. That is no reason to subvert the constitution and morgage the next generations future.

To listen to the right wingers, there is an army of 10's of thousands of terrorists assailing our borders. This just isn't the case at all. It certainly doesn't justify destroying the USA in the name of saving it.

So you feel that their is NO threat from the Islamists that would like nothing better to see you dead because you are not a muslim? Hate to burst your bubbble, the threat is REAL and wishing it would go away isn't going to make the problem go away.

As for Bush - I don't think he should ever have even been allowed to run for president in the first place. One law for all is a founding principal of this democracy - yet it has not been applied to the Bush family. It's a travisty that this man is president, espeically with his hippocritical policies.

Wade.

What valid arguement can you make that Bush has somehow subverted the law by running and becoming president?

 

[wade]

So you feel that their is NO threat from the Islamists that would like nothing better to see you dead because you are not a muslim? Hate to burst your bubbble, the threat is REAL and wishing it would go away isn't going to make the problem go away.

No. I didn't say that. The threat is real, but none-the-less it has been blown out of proportion. Al-Queda took advantage of a weekness in our society, namely that we had these big bombs flying around with almost no security. That has been rectified. That was the best idea they had, they used it, and it is spent.

The response is out of proportion to the threat. Should we take action to prevent future attacks - of course we should! But should we morgage our futures and throw away our principals because of it? Of course not!

What valid arguement can you make that Bush has somehow subverted the law by running and becoming president?

G. W. Bush was arrested in Harris county in 1972 for cocaine possession. At least 3 unrelated sources close to the Bush family have independantly made this claim. It appears that he was put into a informal diversion program called PULL, a Houston program for troubled youths (not adults) at the MLK Jr. Community in Houstons dirt poor 3rd ward, where he did a year of community service.

Not one other adult cocaine offender was allowed to enter a diversion program rather than serve felony jail time in Harris county in 1972. Clearly the law that applies to the rest of us does not apply to the Bush family. He should have a felony on his record, and thus he should not be able to run for public office.

When questioned on this matter, G.W. Bush has consistantly avoided answering the question "were you arrested for cocaine possession?", but he has never denied it. Instead he will point to the fact he has never been convicted of cocaine possession - which is true since he was granted diversion and thus never convicted. But the issue remains, no one else was granted diversion - it is flat out wrong that he should not be held to the same standards of the law that everyone else is just because his family was rich and politically well connected. This flies in the face of one of the most basic the principals of this country - equal treatment for all under the law.

Wade.

 

[wade]

Comrade,

You are one head case. You lump comments I made to you with comments to someone else and take offense to them all as if they were all made to you.

And again, you fail to back up your position. Lets face it, if it doesn't fit into your right-wing picture of the universe, you simply won't accept it.

You right-wingers are all the same. First figure out what it is you want, then use fantasy and falsehoods and outright lies to justify your getting it regardless of how unethical the means. If anything doesn't fit with your picture of reality, it must be ignored. If anyone argues with you and shows that your views are extremely narrow, insult them, and if they insult you back, pretend they started it.

Wade.

 

[theim]

Oh please spare us your self-righteous bullshit.

And you would do well to know that the book in which your coke charge originated, Fortunate Son, never named the sources, arresting officer, presiding judge, police station, or exact date. Now ignore that question of why three of Bush's friends would seek to ruin his candidacy. And in this book a numerous number of quotes from the conveniently unnamed sources seem to be somewhat cooked. Examples:

Source 1: "I was wondering when someone was going to get around to uncovering the truth," he replied, surprisingly unruffled by my direct approach. ... "There's only a handful of us that know the truth."

Source 2: "Take this any way it sounds, but do you think George would take time out from speeding around town in his TR-6 convertible sports car, bedding down just about every single woman--and few married ones--and partying like there's no tomorrow to go work full-time as a mentor to a bunch of streetwise black kids? Get real, man, this is a white-bread boy from the other side of town we're talking about. ... The judge, a good ol' Texas boy and a friend of George's politically influential daddy, purged the record. It happened a lot in Texas years ago and George damn sure wasn't the first rich kid who got caught with a little snow and because of his family's connections had his record taken care of by the judge."

Source 3: "Be careful and watch your back every step of the way," he warned, speaking almost in a whisper. "Without sounding paranoid, I think I would be amiss if I didn't remind you that George Bush's old man was once director of the CIA. Shit, man, they named the building after the guy not too long ago. Besides, W.'s raised almost a staggering sixty million dollars for his White House run in a matter of only a few months and his corporate sponsors and GOP fat cats aren't going to roll over and play dead when you expose the truth about their investment. ... You know what makes me sick about all this shit? It's the hypocrisy. Cocaine use is illegal, but as governor of Texas, he's toughened penalties for people convicted of selling or possessing less than a gram of coke (a crime previously punished by probation). Ok'd the housing of sixteen-year-olds in adult correctional facilities and slashed funding for inmate substance abuse-programs. Texas currently spends over one point four-five million dollars per day keeping drug offenders behind bars and another twenty-eight thousand dollars a day incarcerating young people on drug offenses," he said angrily.


Now no one can prove that anonymous quotes are false, but these sound pretty damn close. Look at the insertion of too much detail ("around town in his TR-6 convertible sports car" ; "Texas currently spends over one point four-five million dollars" ) and the non-conversational tone of the language ("raised almost a staggering sixty million dollars").

And Bush has denied it. Now if he denied it he KNEW there was no way to prevent people close to the case from coming forward, a judge, lawyer, cop, etc. And he would be ruined. He would never be able to get away with that cover-up in the midst of the campaign. Oh thats right, they are all probly already dead by the hands of GOP Black Ops.

Hope you enjoyed the lesson.

 

[wade]

And Bush has denied it. Now if he denied it he KNEW there was no way to prevent people close to the case from coming forward, a judge, lawyer, cop, etc. And he would be ruined. He would never be able to get away with that cover-up in the midst of the campaign. Oh thats right, they are all probly already dead by the hands of GOP Black Ops.

As few as two or three police officers and a Judge and a lawyer could have been involved - and they could simply be hushed up with money and intimidation, and well before Bush Jr. ran for office they may have passed away naturally or otherwise. Your contention that a large number of people had to be involved is falacious. If Bush had half a brain, he didn't call attention to himself when arrested and used his phone call wisely. Remember, at that time he was a nobody.

-----

No Bush has not denied it. Instead he says things like "I've never been convicted of cocaine possession" or that he hasn't used cocaine in the last 7 years (made in 2000). He said "I could have passed the [FBI] background check on the standards applied on the most stringent conditions when my dad was president of the United States - a 15-year period", which would run back 15 years from the end of his dad's term in 1994. Never had he actually said that he was not arrested for cocaine possession, he ducks that question or gives ambigous answers such as "there was no diversion program that year", which still does not actually deny the accusation.

Likewise his father, when asked about it, said "It's totally ridiculous what he suggested and it's not true" - very reminciant of Clinton's response when asked about the Jennifer Flowers affair which later when testifying under oath. It turned out that Clinton was denying that all the details of the story were true, not denying that there had been an affair.

Bush himself had never denied the accusations. His campaign workers have, but that is not the same thing at all.

If it's not true, why did G.W. Bush, who up to 1972 was a solid playboy republican, spend exactly one year work for a liberal charity in an inner city getto, never to return once that year was completed? It doesn't make sense!

Bush could clear the whole thing up easily enough by directing the Harris county court to make public all records concerning him, including sealed records. Diversion programs are intended to give people a second chance and thus the records are normally sealed after successful completion, but they are maintained in case the person repeats the offense to prevent them from being able to use the diversion out a second time. Of course, Bush will never do this, as it'd expose him for what he is, American royalty who does not have to answer to the same law everyone else does.

Wade.

 

[tim_duncan2000]

And you would do well to know that the book in which your coke charge originated, Fortunate Son, never named the sources, arresting officer, presiding judge, police station, or exact date. Now ignore that question of why three of Bush's friends would seek to ruin his candidacy. And in this book a numerous number of quotes from the conveniently unnamed sources seem to be somewhat cooked.

Why should that matter? We all know that if it's in a book and it makes a Republican look bad, it must be true.

Oh thats right, they are all probly already dead by the hands of GOP Black Ops.

I thought it was the CIA.

If the mainly liberal hate-Bush media isn't even still focussing on that, there is probably a good reason.

 

[wade]

For whatever reason, the "liberal Bush-hating media" never focused on Bush's past drug use to any significant degree at all. Months were spent on whether or not Clinton inhaled or not, even though he would not have been breaking US law even had he done so (he was not in the USA). But Bush just got a pass on the issue of his past Cocaine and Marijana use.

This issue was never pursued because the court records are sealed, so there is no way to prove it. But it should have been pursued until either Bush dropped out or made the harris county court release the sealed records if they existed. At the very least, they should have pursued it until he either personally said "I was never arrested for cocaine possession" or stepped down.

Wade.

 

[theim]

Gee, maybe they didn't cover it because there is virtually no credible proof to suspect he did, other than the ramblings of tinfoil hat-wearing libbies such as yourself? If you are a major news boss and someone comes to you and says :"hey boss! some guy wrote a book with three anonymous sources that say Bush did coke, even though he gives no info that can be used to prove the case true! Should we run with it?" what do you say?

Oh what the hell wade. You have uncovered our evil conspiracy. I suggest tightening your tinfoil hat to protect your brain from the microwaves the government sends out to keep us sheep in line; and beware the GOP Black Ops. If you see any black vans/sedans near your home, run.

 

[wade]

Exactly - when your dad has been head of the CIA, credible proof dissapears.

I got an idea. Let's not elect Bush as President. Let's elect him as King!

 

[rtwngAvngr]

For whatever reason, the "liberal Bush-hating media" never focused on Bush's past drug use to any significant degree at all. Months were spent on whether or not Clinton inhaled or not, even though he would not have been breaking US law even had he done so (he was not in the USA). But Bush just got a pass on the issue of his past Cocaine and Marijana use.

This issue was never pursued because the court records are sealed, so there is no way to prove it. But it should have been pursued until either Bush dropped out or made the harris county court release the sealed records if they existed. At the very least, they should have pursued it until he either personally said "I was never arrested for cocaine possession" or stepped down.

Wade.

Alcohol and drug problems do not point to character flaws the way the overt lying, political stagecraft and left leaning salesoutmanship of John Kerry do.

Oh and the media is overwhelmingly and verifiably liberal. The hole in the ground you stick your head in has become too shallow, dig deeper, rabid retardolib.

 

[wade]

Alcohol and drug problems do not point to character flaws the way the overt lying, political stagecraft and left leaning salesoutmanship of John Kerry do.

Oh and the media is overwhelmingly and verifiably liberal. The hole in the ground you stick your head in has become too shallow, dig deeper, rabid retardolib.

Overt lying? Pres. Bush is the biggest lair in American history! He took this country to war in Iraq on the basis of a lie. He said that Saddam had huge stockpiles of WMD, he said he knew this for an absolute fact. Now he has backpeddled and claims they were mistaken. This might work if he'd said he "thought" there were WMD's in Iraq, but he did not, he said he knew for a "fact" they were there - and that was a lie and there is no way you can get around that fact.

That's right, use the right-winger tactic - obfuscate the issues and attack anyone who does not agree with you.

 

[theim]

you just keep telling yourself all that...maybe one day it will come true.