Voting Rights Uprising: Activists in Three States Help GOP's Targets Get Voter ID

[starcraftzzz]

Since you can't show anyone is really being disenfranchised who has a valid ID, it's a moot point. The examples you gave have remedies. But for the average dude or dudette walking down the street, your examples are meaningless.

And nobody who could pass the Jim Crow tests to vote got disenfranchised either right?

I'm not vehemently opposed to Voter ID laws, I just think that many of the states passing them are making them far too restrictive. States are spending money on these voter ID laws to stop fraud that isn't actually happening and yet are not concerned about voting machines with no paper trail, getting cameras in tally rooms, two person integrity when in the presence of voted ballots, statewide voter databases, electronic poll books, post election manual audits, etc.

Those are separate issues.

As for the fraud "not happening", are you serious? According to whom?

I'll put it this way. The number of people who are disenfranchised by any voter ID laws when IDs are either free or as ubiquitous as they are today is less harmful than the voter fraud going on. Surely all federal and likely all statewide elections are not subject to fraud. However there may be local elections where turnout is low that is swayed by fraud.

I saw on another thread Florida was lost/won by 537 votes. A state of 20-25 million people (I don't have time to look it up) comes down to 537 people. It's easy to imagine a world where we didn't have the 2nd Iraq war if Gore would have won. Billions wasted and thousands of Americans dead--tens of thousands of Iraqis.

I'm not saying Bush participated in fraud or that Gore had fraud to make it that close.

Who knows?

Why not make it tighter so there is less likelihood that it would take place?

Fraud doesn't happen in the past 5 years there have been 70 cases of voter fraud. However in2008 alone 5 million people were unable to vote because they showed up at the polls with the wrong ID.
The reaosn to not make it tighter is because doing so make sit so millions of people cant vote in order to crack down on a problem that does not exist in reality

 

[Peach]

Funny how the authoritarian left is fine with requiring ID to check into a hotel, get on an airliner, buy smokes and liquor, get a legit job, open a bank account, get a fishing license, on and on and on, yet showing one to vote is a conspiracy by republicans so they can "attack voting rights".

Please cite the Constitutional interest in ANY of your named activities.

 

[Peach]

And those are the questions nobody can answer. How much should someone have to PAY for their right to vote and what is the acceptable ratio of disenfranchisement to fraud...

blah, blah, blah...disenfranchised, blah, republicans, blah de fucking blah

scotus doesn't have a problem with these laws, why should i?

No, the SCOTUS didn't have a problem with Indiana's voter ID law. Some of the states are currently passing laws more restrictive than Indiana's. Expect more of these laws to go before the SCOTUS...especially since there are now people denied the right to vote as a result.

It depends on INTERPRETATION also. I had had to cast a PROVISIONAL ballot in 2002, in Florida, because the rolls had a different address than my driver's license.

 

[Conservative]

As usual, you deserve an A for presentation and an F for content.

corrected...

As usual, I deserve an F for presentation and an F for content.

 

[Oddball]

Funny how the authoritarian left is fine with requiring ID to check into a hotel, get on an airliner, buy smokes and liquor, get a legit job, open a bank account, get a fishing license, on and on and on, yet showing one to vote is a conspiracy by republicans so they can "attack voting rights".

Please cite the Constitutional interest in ANY of your named activities.

You have no constitutional right to vote...Voting is a privilege extended to the hoi polloy by the ruling class.

Sad, but true.

 

[candycorn]

And nobody who could pass the Jim Crow tests to vote got disenfranchised either right?

I'm not vehemently opposed to Voter ID laws, I just think that many of the states passing them are making them far too restrictive. States are spending money on these voter ID laws to stop fraud that isn't actually happening and yet are not concerned about voting machines with no paper trail, getting cameras in tally rooms, two person integrity when in the presence of voted ballots, statewide voter databases, electronic poll books, post election manual audits, etc.

Those are separate issues.

As for the fraud "not happening", are you serious? According to whom?

I'll put it this way. The number of people who are disenfranchised by any voter ID laws when IDs are either free or as ubiquitous as they are today is less harmful than the voter fraud going on. Surely all federal and likely all statewide elections are not subject to fraud. However there may be local elections where turnout is low that is swayed by fraud.

I saw on another thread Florida was lost/won by 537 votes. A state of 20-25 million people (I don't have time to look it up) comes down to 537 people. It's easy to imagine a world where we didn't have the 2nd Iraq war if Gore would have won. Billions wasted and thousands of Americans dead--tens of thousands of Iraqis.

I'm not saying Bush participated in fraud or that Gore had fraud to make it that close.

Who knows?

Why not make it tighter so there is less likelihood that it would take place?

Fraud doesn't happen in the past 5 years there have been 70 cases of voter fraud. However in2008 alone 5 million people were unable to vote because they showed up at the polls with the wrong ID.
The reaosn to not make it tighter is because doing so make sit so millions of people cant vote in order to crack down on a problem that does not exist in reality

70 cases according to whom. There are people who come on the TV after an election copping to it? Are they asking people in exit polls, "did you commit fraud today?" I'm dubious of any statistic that relies on self-reporting of crime. I think you mean we've uncovered 70 cases of voter fraud.

 

[candycorn]

Can you list any cases of recent voter fraud that would be deterred by these restrictive ID laws?

The fact is that these laws WILL disenfranchise voters. They already have. What is the acceptable ratio of disenfranchisement to fraud? If you disenfranchise 10 voters for every one incident of fraud, is that worth it?

How will it disenfranchise voters?

Because it makes it so tens of millions of voters are unable to vote until they get a special ID

So I have a "special ID" if I have a driver's license?

I will say that the State should make IDs available to any and all who want them; free of charge. Anything else is a poll tax.

 

[Conservative]

I think Shitting Bull must have somehow forgotten that getting proper ID in order to vote is what the GOP wants. It proves people are actually who they claim they are at the polls, and safeguards their vote, making it impossible to challenge it's validity later.

 

[Conservative]

How will it disenfranchise voters?

Because it makes it so tens of millions of voters are unable to vote until they get a special ID

So I have a "special ID" if I have a driver's license?

I will say that the State should make IDs available to any and all who want them; free of charge. Anything else is a poll tax.

every voter ID law recently enacted includes the provision for a free id for voting.