Voting Rights Uprising: Activists in Three States Help GOP's Targets Get Voter ID

[del]

And those are the questions nobody can answer. How much should someone have to PAY for their right to vote and what is the acceptable ratio of disenfranchisement to fraud...

blah, blah, blah...disenfranchised, blah, republicans, blah de fucking blah

scotus doesn't have a problem with these laws, why should i?

 

[clevergirl]

It is a GOP talking point that creating an atmosphere making it hard for citizens to vote is in their favor. They do not want a high voter turnout.

Paul Weyrich - "I don't want everybody to vote" (Goo Goo) - YouTube

Bull shit! A voter ID is an easily obtainable piece of ID. It is democrat "community organizers" who don't want voter ID laws that would prevent them from rounding up drunks and addicts and paying them to vote!

With a porous border and lax registration laws, it is democrats who have sullied voter rights by taking advantage of the situation as evidenced by the number of fraudulent registrations just in the last election!


Everyone, including democrats, should want confidence in the system. If a vet or an old person can cash a check they need an ID. If they fly, they need an ID. The argument against a voter ID is a bogus one.

 

[teapartysamurai]

Everyone should have voter ID.

All this bullshit about keeping folks from voting is just that, bullshit.


You have to have ID to do anything in this counry. Should have ID to prove you are who you say you are when your exercising the most important right you have.

Its Just common sense.

And yet thousand and thousand of people don't have the ID required because the laws in their state is too restrictive. The veteran being just one example. The state wouldn't take his ID because it didn't have his address on it. My military ID doesn't have an address on it either. What if that were my only ID? The woman was denied the right to vote because she couldn't produce her marriage license.

Even if they make these photo IDs with addresses on them free to people unable or unwilling to pay for them, the paperwork required to get the ID isn't free. Birth certificates and marriage licenses aren't free. How much should someone have to PAY for the right to vote?

You keep claiming that, but all you can give us is two old people who simply were too irresponsible to go through the simple procedures to rectify their problems.

The only reason libs thinks the law is too strict is it keeps illegals and other vote fraud perps from voting!

 

[teapartysamurai]

And those are the questions nobody can answer. How much should someone have to PAY for their right to vote and what is the acceptable ratio of disenfranchisement to fraud...

You can't get a medical procedure done without a picture ID!

We have SO MUCH insurance card fraud in Ohio, they now require you present your insurance card AND YOUR PICTURE ID!

If a PICTURE ID will help prevent insurance card fraud, WHY CAN'T IT DO THE SAME FOR VOTING??????????

Your points are completely bogus!

 

[teapartysamurai]

Studies show that as many as 11 percent of eligible voters do not have government-issued photo ID. That percentage is even higher for seniors, people of color, people with disabilities, low-income voters, and students. Many citizens find it hard to get government photo IDs ..... We reported that 11 percent of voting-age American citizens—and an even greater percentage of African American, low-income, and older citizens—do not have current and valid government-issued photo IDs. These findings have been confirmed by multiple independent studies.

Voter ID | Brennan Center for Justice

"That percentage is even higher for
seniors,
people of color,
people with disabilities,
low-income voters,
and students."

Many of these groups just happen to coincide with those who were strong Obama supporters in 2008!

Bogus!

There is no reason not to have a picture ID.

My 22 year old daughter doesn't drive yet and went and got a picture ID!

ANYONE CAN GET A PICTURE ID.

The only reason not to get one, is you are too drunk, stoned, or irresponsible to get OFF YOUR ASS, go down to the DMV and GET ONE!

 

[DiamondDave]

11% of eligible voters find it 'hard' to get an ID

Why do I find this utter bullshit??

Maybe because I doubt anyone could find that 1 in 10 do not readily have a govt issued photo ID... I saw even the homeless with ID's when dealing with a lot of them at a previous job...

This is just more shit flinging and bullshit 'findings' to try and keep the status quo of vote fraud and voter registration fraud

 

[BarbaraHavers]

Policy Brief on the Truth About “Voter Fraud”

Summary

* Fraud by individual voters is both irrational and extremely rare.
* Many vivid anecdotes of purported voter fraud have been proven false or do not demonstrate fraud.
* Voter fraud is often conflated with other forms of election misconduct.
* Raising the unsubstantiated specter of mass voter fraud suits a particular policy agenda.
* Claims of voter fraud should be carefully tested before they become the basis for action.

-Brennan Center for Justice

 

[candycorn]

It's so predictable, that when somebody wants to prevent voting fraud, lefties call it "disenfranchising". Lefties need new words to lie with.

Can you list any cases of recent voter fraud that would be deterred by these restrictive ID laws?

The fact is that these laws WILL disenfranchise voters. They already have. What is the acceptable ratio of disenfranchisement to fraud? If you disenfranchise 10 voters for every one incident of fraud, is that worth it?

How will it disenfranchise voters?

 

[candycorn]

More: Voting Rights Uprising: Activists in Three States Help GOP's Targets Get Voter ID | | AlterNet

You are confused Lakhota. We oppose Fraud, by any means, not legitimate Voter Registration and Legitimate Ballots. I know it's a hard concept for you to Master, but you need to try harder.

But that's just it. Liberals are FOR fraud, because it's the only way they can win in red states and they know it.

Oh shut the fuck up. If the state is red, there isn't much liberal fraud going on then right?

He's trying to make it as easy for people to vote as possible. I can go along with that much. I would think that Lakhota is also for only having 3 or 4 letter words on college spelling exams too if this is the way he wants to treat voter registration.
Liberals aren't for fraud any more than conservatives are for preventing people to vote. The goal should be to have as sterile a process as possible; 1 person=1 vote. Thats the goal. The easiest way to get there from here is to have aggressive voter ID laws.

Either that or have no voter registration at all. Why register if you aren't going to enforce it at the time when the ballots are cast.

 

[candycorn]

Everyone should have voter ID.

All this bullshit about keeping folks from voting is just that, bullshit.


You have to have ID to do anything in this counry. Should have ID to prove you are who you say you are when your exercising the most important right you have.

Its Just common sense.

And yet thousand and thousand of people don't have the ID required because the laws in their state is too restrictive. The veteran being just one example. The state wouldn't take his ID because it didn't have his address on it. My military ID doesn't have an address on it either. What if that were my only ID? The woman was denied the right to vote because she couldn't produce her marriage license.

Even if they make these photo IDs with addresses on them free to people unable or unwilling to pay for them, the paperwork required to get the ID isn't free. Birth certificates and marriage licenses aren't free. How much should someone have to PAY for the right to vote?

So because of these bizarrely extreme cases, you're willing to let other fraud occur?
I'll say this; we should have uniform ballots from one county/parrish to the next. I'm for having different language ballots available as well. But the process needs to be sterile or as sterile as we can make it; 1 person=1 vote.

 

[candycorn]

And those are the questions nobody can answer. How much should someone have to PAY for their right to vote and what is the acceptable ratio of disenfranchisement to fraud...

Since you can't show anyone is really being disenfranchised who has a valid ID, it's a moot point. The examples you gave have remedies. But for the average dude or dudette walking down the street, your examples are meaningless.

 

[candycorn]

Studies show that as many as 11 percent of eligible voters do not have government-issued photo ID. That percentage is even higher for seniors, people of color, people with disabilities, low-income voters, and students. Many citizens find it hard to get government photo IDs ..... We reported that 11 percent of voting-age American citizens—and an even greater percentage of African American, low-income, and older citizens—do not have current and valid government-issued photo IDs. These findings have been confirmed by multiple independent studies.

Voter ID | Brennan Center for Justice

"That percentage is even higher for
seniors,
people of color,
people with disabilities,
low-income voters,
and students."

Many of these groups just happen to coincide with those who were strong Obama supporters in 2008!

Then that is their fault--the 11%. Sorry. Government can't do everything for you.

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

I keep seeing people bring up that a lack of convictions for voter fraud proves that it's not a problem. If you aren't doing anything to check up on the actual identification of the voter, how would anyone expect that fraudulent voters were actually being caught? Just a thought.

 

[Clementine]

Funny how the authoritarian left is fine with requiring ID to check into a hotel, get on an airliner, buy smokes and liquor, get a legit job, open a bank account, get a fishing license, on and on and on, yet showing one to vote is a conspiracy by republicans so they can "attack voting rights".

So, there is also a conspiracy to prevent the minorities from flying, staying in nice hotels, getting loans, buying alcohol and cigarettes, getting a job, getting a fishing license, buying a house (oops, forgot about the no-docs loans) or getting a credit card?

Why haven't the Dems bought this to the public's attention before now? There are people out there living with no access to so many things. It sure is a good thing the Republicans came up with this voter ID idea or we wouldn't know there are so many benighted people out there who can't even write a check or buy their Marlboro's at the local mini mart.

 

[Clementine]

I keep seeing people bring up that a lack of convictions for voter fraud proves that it's not a problem. If you aren't doing anything to check up on the actual identification of the voter, how would anyone expect that fraudulent voters were actually being caught? Just a thought.

A few years ago, states wanted to update the voter rolls and purge names of people who have died or moved out of state. The Dems had a fit and the states never did that. Without being able to validate the names on voter rolls, how will anyone know if someone is still casting a vote for their dead relative or that the ones who moved out of state aren't voting twice, once by absentee? Anyone getting a license was registered to vote, including illegal aliens, so where is the system to verify that the registered voters are actual citizens?

I don't believe there has been any real effort to identify voter fraud.

 

[Seawytch]

And those are the questions nobody can answer. How much should someone have to PAY for their right to vote and what is the acceptable ratio of disenfranchisement to fraud...

Since you can't show anyone is really being disenfranchised who has a valid ID, it's a moot point. The examples you gave have remedies. But for the average dude or dudette walking down the street, your examples are meaningless.

And nobody who could pass the Jim Crow tests to vote got disenfranchised either right?

I'm not vehemently opposed to Voter ID laws, I just think that many of the states passing them are making them far too restrictive. States are spending money on these voter ID laws to stop fraud that isn't actually happening and yet are not concerned about voting machines with no paper trail, getting cameras in tally rooms, two person integrity when in the presence of voted ballots, statewide voter databases, electronic poll books, post election manual audits, etc.

 

[Seawytch]

And those are the questions nobody can answer. How much should someone have to PAY for their right to vote and what is the acceptable ratio of disenfranchisement to fraud...

blah, blah, blah...disenfranchised, blah, republicans, blah de fucking blah

scotus doesn't have a problem with these laws, why should i?

No, the SCOTUS didn't have a problem with Indiana's voter ID law. Some of the states are currently passing laws more restrictive than Indiana's. Expect more of these laws to go before the SCOTUS...especially since there are now people denied the right to vote as a result.

 

[candycorn]

And those are the questions nobody can answer. How much should someone have to PAY for their right to vote and what is the acceptable ratio of disenfranchisement to fraud...

Since you can't show anyone is really being disenfranchised who has a valid ID, it's a moot point. The examples you gave have remedies. But for the average dude or dudette walking down the street, your examples are meaningless.

And nobody who could pass the Jim Crow tests to vote got disenfranchised either right?

I'm not vehemently opposed to Voter ID laws, I just think that many of the states passing them are making them far too restrictive. States are spending money on these voter ID laws to stop fraud that isn't actually happening and yet are not concerned about voting machines with no paper trail, getting cameras in tally rooms, two person integrity when in the presence of voted ballots, statewide voter databases, electronic poll books, post election manual audits, etc.

Those are separate issues.

As for the fraud "not happening", are you serious? According to whom?

I'll put it this way. The number of people who are disenfranchised by any voter ID laws when IDs are either free or as ubiquitous as they are today is less harmful than the voter fraud going on. Surely all federal and likely all statewide elections are not subject to fraud. However there may be local elections where turnout is low that is swayed by fraud.

I saw on another thread Florida was lost/won by 537 votes. A state of 20-25 million people (I don't have time to look it up) comes down to 537 people. It's easy to imagine a world where we didn't have the 2nd Iraq war if Gore would have won. Billions wasted and thousands of Americans dead--tens of thousands of Iraqis.

I'm not saying Bush participated in fraud or that Gore had fraud to make it that close.

Who knows?

Why not make it tighter so there is less likelihood that it would take place?

 

[starcraftzzz]

It's so predictable, that when somebody wants to prevent voting fraud, lefties call it "disenfranchising". Lefties need new words to lie with.

Can you list any cases of recent voter fraud that would be deterred by these restrictive ID laws?

The fact is that these laws WILL disenfranchise voters. They already have. What is the acceptable ratio of disenfranchisement to fraud? If you disenfranchise 10 voters for every one incident of fraud, is that worth it?

How will it disenfranchise voters?

Because it makes it so tens of millions of voters are unable to vote until they get a special ID

 

[Oddball]

A state DL or ID card isn't a "special ID", knucklehead.