Voter rolls

[AmyNation]

The OP was in response to another thread about citizen challenges to voters made in Ohio, based solely off of city documents.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

If someone's issued a death certificate, if a building is rezoned as commercial, or condemned, change of addresses, felony convictions, etc etc. If the state had a streamlined updated system, the voter rolls could update themselves, thus preventing the cursed "voter fraud" as well as freeing up actual people from doing the work a computer could do and do better. Not to mention preventing actual voters from being kicked off the roles in these sweeps many states seem fond of.

you have clue how voter fraud is supposed to work.

data is data. it's already used. as a tool, digital computer programs are also only a tool..and a very fallible one fraught with dangers known and unknown. computer programs have major liabilities in this area.

actual voters would be kicked off rolls during clean sweeps because computer programs are programmed by humans.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

The OP was in response to another thread about citizen challenges to voters made in Ohio, based solely off of city documents.

then you should have responded in that thread. this is another thread. the OP is what it is. sort of like data .. shit in shit out.

There is no magic bullet. Mistakes and errors will ALWAYS be made. relying on one tool is silly,

being young also means being ignorant and immature as well as other things...

so much for having magical answers. btw, many older people know how to use technology far better than any snot-nosed 'young' person sitting home posting idiocy on the web
just sayin'

 

[whitehall]

Why are our states so far behind technology? How is it someone can be dead for years, trailer parks shut down and boarded up, but rolls aren't updated?

Perhaps because I'm young, and have always had the Internet at my fingertips, but it seems ludicrous to me that we haven't yet streamlined the way our government processes documents.

They liberalized the registration system in the last couple of years. At one time you had to go down to the county registrar and produce I.D. and sign some papers. Today there is a cottage industry in voter registration not to mention the motor voter law. Unfortunately the geniuses who created the mess didn't fund a way to check if the registrations are real. The best way to get through the mess is simply to require a photo I.D. to vote but the geniuses who created the pile of voter registrations don't seem to like it. Guess why?

 

[candycorn]

It's because we have cut spending to the bone in most states. Somethings have to be chunked overboard. Removing the dead from voting rolls is probably the first thing to get chunked..the dead don't have much of a constituency.

And your proof of this is?

Other than common sense? Gee, if you're changing your address with the county clerk, would you like for them to take care of you or be working on the stack of death notices? Now imagine 3 out of the 4 people in that office gone.

Think.

 

[Seawytch]

If someone's issued a death certificate, if a building is rezoned as commercial, or condemned, change of addresses, felony convictions, etc etc. If the state had a streamlined updated system, the voter rolls could update themselves, thus preventing the cursed "voter fraud" as well as freeing up actual people from doing the work a computer could do and do better. Not to mention preventing actual voters from being kicked off the roles in these sweeps many states seem fond of.

I tend to think that in matters such as this; you have to get away from the automation process too much. How many John Smiths die each day? I'm not sure. I bet it's a lot. Then there are overlapping jurisdictions between state, federal, local agencies. Who says they are all on the same page as to the right John Smith? I heard somewhere that over the next 10 years, 18,000 Americans will be turning 65 each day. I don't know how accurate that is but really...this is going to get worse.

When I moved into this Condo, my phone was not switched due to some reason. So I got a new number. Some guy/gal named Tillis had the number first. They likely have this address too. If a Tillis turns up dead; they may bump me off the voting rolls based on my address. Maybe not.

I think the point is that we want more government than we're willing to pay for and we want a government to be able to take swift action in some cases while being totally ignorant of our personal lives in others.

Until we determine that it is worth paying a few extra employees to tend to the voter rolls, tend to the unpaid parking tickets, unpaid taxes, malfeasance, etc...we're going to have instances like this.

I started working at an election office in 2006. There were four people doing the same job I'm doing. Now there is one. Removing dead voters is low on the priority scale.

 

[candycorn]

First it's not nearly as complicated as you make it out to be...I've done voter rolls for campaigns....so it's not that hard

Second they have roughly 2 years to update between elections.....wtf??? How can you not keep it smooth?

I totally agree with you on voter rolls. As you may know, I'm all for having to produce a picture ID to vote along with your voter registration card. I think the VRC should have a photo on it and all of this nonsense would be wiped away.

According to this site (I didn't cross check it) ItsMyLife.com - How Many People Die in America, 2,600 people pass away every day.

Lets call it 2500 just for the sake of mathematical ease. 2,500/50 = 50 persons per state on average. You would have to pay someone (1 person at least) to look up each decedent and clear them off the books. Frankly, I'm all for it myself. No problem. The conservatives want to eliminate every government job they can and I'm sure that this would be one such job. Then when they bump off the wrong person, someone has to answer the phone call from the Joan Smith who got bumped off incorrectly. Again, I'm all for it. We need to do whatever is practical and necessary to have nearly a completely sterile voting process.

I'm willing to pay for it.

Are you?

Yeah we already have election commisions...have one of them do it. You dont need many people..
You can ditch a useless school counselor or government burecrat to pay for it.....easy

Ahh...so you're willing to pay for it. Just cut someone else and term them as "useless".

 

[candycorn]

A pictured voter's registration card will eliminate all of this. No card; no vote. It's that simple.

 

[OKTexas]

A pictured voter's registration card will eliminate all of this. No card; no vote. It's that simple.

If they can go for a photo for a voter registration they can get a photo for a regular ID, can they not?

How about we tie all voter registration to the national social security data base, the states could up load felons that have lost their voting rights and when someone goes to vote, do their check in the computer can do an instant check to see if they voted in another state under that ssn or if they are inelegible for any other reason, like SSA shows them deceased. If we can do a reliable instant check for a gun purchase, why not for voting?

 

[Clementine]

Why are our states so far behind technology? How is it someone can be dead for years, trailer parks shut down and boarded up, but rolls aren't updated?

Perhaps because I'm young, and have always had the Internet at my fingertips, but it seems ludicrous to me that we haven't yet streamlined the way our government processes documents.

States tried to update the rolls. Holder sued them to stop the effort.

The time to prevent cheating is before the election by insisting that only eligible voters are on the rolls to begin with.

ACORN goes out and registers people and end up creating tons of fake registrations.

Anyone can register and they need only an electric bill to prove who they are. The left does not care if the person is a US citizen or not.

We have no system in place to ensure that citizens are not disenfranchised by having their votes canceled out by illegal, dead or non-existent voters.

 

[candycorn]

A pictured voter's registration card will eliminate all of this. No card; no vote. It's that simple.

If they can go for a photo for a voter registration they can get a photo for a regular ID, can they not?

How about we tie all voter registration to the national social security data base, the states could up load felons that have lost their voting rights and when someone goes to vote, do their check in the computer can do an instant check to see if they voted in another state under that ssn or if they are inelegible for any other reason, like SSA shows them deceased. If we can do a reliable instant check for a gun purchase, why not for voting?

We're for smaller government so adding more tasks to the government is a no-go; nobody wants to pay for it.

 

[JoeB131]

Why are our states so far behind technology? How is it someone can be dead for years, trailer parks shut down and boarded up, but rolls aren't updated?

Perhaps because I'm young, and have always had the Internet at my fingertips, but it seems ludicrous to me that we haven't yet streamlined the way our government processes documents.

The problem, I think, is a lot of these agencies aren't allowed to share information. For instance, the Census Bureau just got done cataloging everyone, but they can't tell the voter rolls any specific information about who is dead and who is alive.

Also, because voting is still controlled on the state level, the states are usually more strapped.

 

[Seawytch]

Why are our states so far behind technology? How is it someone can be dead for years, trailer parks shut down and boarded up, but rolls aren't updated?

Perhaps because I'm young, and have always had the Internet at my fingertips, but it seems ludicrous to me that we haven't yet streamlined the way our government processes documents.

States tried to update the rolls. Holder sued them to stop the effort.

Bovine feces. States update their rolls all the time. Florida used a bad list chock full of qualified voters. If the list had been a good one, the JUDGE in the case would have told Holder to pound sand. He didn't.

The time to prevent cheating is before the election by insisting that only eligible voters are on the rolls to begin with.

ACORN goes out and registers people and end up creating tons of fake registrations.

Yeah, how many convictions? You do realize that ACORN was never found to have done anything wrong, just some of its employees.

Anyone can register and they need only an electric bill to prove who they are. The left does not care if the person is a US citizen or not.

Yes, they can provide a utility bill...not when they register but when they go to vote at the polling place.

And yes, we do care if they are a citizen or not. Did you know that non citizens get drivers licenses in every state in the United States? How do you stop them from registering and voting?

We have no system in place to ensure that citizens are not disenfranchised by having their votes canceled out by illegal, dead or non-existent voters.

The answer is not to have in place a system that disenfranchises thousands of qualified voters just to stop that one that isn't. Do you have any idea how incredibly rare in person voter fraud is?

 

[candycorn]

Maybe we could take the State employee who doles out gun licenses (I assume this is a State employee) and make him/her take the dead off voter rolls and stop issuing such licenses. Few really need a gun but apparently purging the dead is job number one.

 

[Seawytch]

Maybe we could take the State employee who doles out gun licenses (I assume this is a State employee) and make him/her take the dead off voter rolls and stop issuing such licenses. Few really need a gun but apparently purging the dead is job number one.

I love a clean voter roll. It saves us money, a lot of money. Each Sample Ballot alone is a couple of bucks and EVERY SINGLE voter is sent one.

I enjoy having the luxury of looking through the obits every day to purge voters. Haven't had enough personnel for that in over three years. We rely on lists we get from the local vital statistics office of people who died in the county. But what if the voter dies out of county? Then we have to rely on notification from family members. That sometimes takes years.

And when push comes to shove and you don't have enough time to add new voters AND take dead people off, guess which one takes precedence?

Keep starving your local governments, folks and having dead people on the rolls will be the least of the problems.

 

[candycorn]

Maybe we could take the State employee who doles out gun licenses (I assume this is a State employee) and make him/her take the dead off voter rolls and stop issuing such licenses. Few really need a gun but apparently purging the dead is job number one.

I love a clean voter roll. It saves us money, a lot of money. Each Sample Ballot alone is a couple of bucks and EVERY SINGLE voter is sent one.

I enjoy having the luxury of looking through the obits every day to purge voters. Haven't had enough personnel for that in over three years. We rely on lists we get from the local vital statistics office of people who died in the county. But what if the voter dies out of county? Then we have to rely on notification from family members. That sometimes takes years.

And when push comes to shove and you don't have enough time to add new voters AND take dead people off, guess which one takes precedence?

Keep starving your local governments, folks and having dead people on the rolls will be the least of the problems.

Any number of circumstances could retard accurate recording of such information.

 

[Seawytch]

Maybe we could take the State employee who doles out gun licenses (I assume this is a State employee) and make him/her take the dead off voter rolls and stop issuing such licenses. Few really need a gun but apparently purging the dead is job number one.

I love a clean voter roll. It saves us money, a lot of money. Each Sample Ballot alone is a couple of bucks and EVERY SINGLE voter is sent one.

I enjoy having the luxury of looking through the obits every day to purge voters. Haven't had enough personnel for that in over three years. We rely on lists we get from the local vital statistics office of people who died in the county. But what if the voter dies out of county? Then we have to rely on notification from family members. That sometimes takes years.

And when push comes to shove and you don't have enough time to add new voters AND take dead people off, guess which one takes precedence?

Keep starving your local governments, folks and having dead people on the rolls will be the least of the problems.

Any number of circumstances could retard accurate recording of such information.

Of course. And at the end, the information has to be entered by a person...and they make mistakes. Every big election we hear from someone who is recorded as deceased wondering why they haven't gotten any election materials this election. So far, nobody has been pissed about it. The woman I spoke with a couple of weeks ago thought it was funny. It was her husband who had passed away, not her. We had him as deceased too though.

 

[OKTexas]

I love a clean voter roll. It saves us money, a lot of money. Each Sample Ballot alone is a couple of bucks and EVERY SINGLE voter is sent one.

I enjoy having the luxury of looking through the obits every day to purge voters. Haven't had enough personnel for that in over three years. We rely on lists we get from the local vital statistics office of people who died in the county. But what if the voter dies out of county? Then we have to rely on notification from family members. That sometimes takes years.

And when push comes to shove and you don't have enough time to add new voters AND take dead people off, guess which one takes precedence?

Keep starving your local governments, folks and having dead people on the rolls will be the least of the problems.

Any number of circumstances could retard accurate recording of such information.

Of course. And at the end, the information has to be entered by a person...and they make mistakes. Every big election we hear from someone who is recorded as deceased wondering why they haven't gotten any election materials this election. So far, nobody has been pissed about it. The woman I spoke with a couple of weeks ago thought it was funny. It was her husband who had passed away, not her. We had him as deceased too though.

What state are you in, here the only thing sent to a voter is a registration card, if I want a sample ballot, it has to be picked up or downloaded from the net.

 

[Seawytch]

Any number of circumstances could retard accurate recording of such information.

Of course. And at the end, the information has to be entered by a person...and they make mistakes. Every big election we hear from someone who is recorded as deceased wondering why they haven't gotten any election materials this election. So far, nobody has been pissed about it. The woman I spoke with a couple of weeks ago thought it was funny. It was her husband who had passed away, not her. We had him as deceased too though.

What state are you in, here the only thing sent to a voter is a registration card, if I want a sample ballot, it has to be picked up or downloaded from the net.

CA law requires that each voter be sent a SB. You can opt out of paper and get it online, but it is voluntary.

 

[candycorn]

I love a clean voter roll. It saves us money, a lot of money. Each Sample Ballot alone is a couple of bucks and EVERY SINGLE voter is sent one.

I enjoy having the luxury of looking through the obits every day to purge voters. Haven't had enough personnel for that in over three years. We rely on lists we get from the local vital statistics office of people who died in the county. But what if the voter dies out of county? Then we have to rely on notification from family members. That sometimes takes years.

And when push comes to shove and you don't have enough time to add new voters AND take dead people off, guess which one takes precedence?

Keep starving your local governments, folks and having dead people on the rolls will be the least of the problems.

Any number of circumstances could retard accurate recording of such information.

Of course. And at the end, the information has to be entered by a person...and they make mistakes. Every big election we hear from someone who is recorded as deceased wondering why they haven't gotten any election materials this election. So far, nobody has been pissed about it. The woman I spoke with a couple of weeks ago thought it was funny. It was her husband who had passed away, not her. We had him as deceased too though.

I received a jury summons forwarded to me from the state where I used to live. The rumor was that you were put onto the potential juries by virtue of having registered to vote. So three years after I left the State, a friend of mine who still lived in the apartment sent me my jury summons. I had to call Houston and tell them I was no longer living there.