CDZ Virginia Beach shooting demonstrates the need for armed citizens...

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by 2aguy, Jun 1, 2019.

  1. sartre play
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    sartre play Gold Member

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    A good guy with a gun wont fix it, a Really totally well trained expert maybe, with a good guy with a gun any thing can happen even get him self killed.
     
  2. Damaged Eagle
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    Damaged Eagle You got lucky Babe Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    Waiting for the police didn't help the kids at Douglas school in Florida.

    *****SMILE*****



    :)
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2019
  3. Pilot1
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    Pilot1 Gold Member

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    Not true at all. People defend themselves successfully, and LEGALLY with firearms all the time. The media largely does not report it, or the perp runs away and no shots are fires, so it never gets reported.

    You don't have much experience with guns, nor legal gun owners, do you?
     
  4. Flash
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    Flash Platinum Member

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    Notice how the talk about the shooting has mostly been swept under the rug by the Liberal press? It is because the shooter was a Negro and that doesn't fit into the Liberal narrative. If the shooter was White they would be talking about it for weeks.

    Two big failures of Liberal polices that we have seen with this shooting.

    1. Having a gun free zone allowed the shooter to commit murder and the victims not being able to protect themselves.

    2. The shooter passed a background check when he purchased the guns. Another example of how firearms background checks are absolutely worthless. Nothing more than a Liberal fantasy.
     
  5. Flash
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    Flash Platinum Member

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    Speak for yourself.

    Without a gun you have no chance. With a gun you may be able to protect yourself. It is your responsibility to make sure you are proficient enough to use it.
     
  6. Flash
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    Flash Platinum Member

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    True We saw what happen in Parkland when the police officer refused to do his job.
     
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  7. M14 Shooter
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    M14 Shooter The Light of Truth

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    Virtually every mass shooting is stopped by a good guy with a gun.
    The idea that only the good guys with guns employed by the state can stop a mass shooting has no basis in fact.
     
  8. 2aguy
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    2aguy Diamond Member

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    I am not sure where you get your information, but you are incorrect. Actual research shows the exact opposite of what you just posted.....

    Armed Citizens Are Successful 94% Of The Time At Active Shooter Events [FBI]

    Of all the active shooter events there were 33 at which an armed citizen was present. Of those, Armed Citizens were successful at stopping the Active shooter 75.8% of the time (25 incidents) and were successful in reducing the loss of life in an additional 18.2% (6) of incidents. In only 2 of the 33 incidents (6.1%) was the Armed Citizen(s) not helpful in any way in stopping the active shooter or reducing the loss of life.

    Thus the headline of our report that Armed Citizens Are Successful 94% Of The Time At Active Shooter Events.



    In the 2 incidents at which the armed citizen “failed” to stop or slow the active shooter, one is the previously mentioned incident with hunters. The other is an incident in which the CCWer was shot in the back in a Las Vegas Walmart when he failed to identify that there were 2 Active Shooters involved in the attack. He neglected to identify the one that shot him in the back while he was trying to ambush the other perpetrator.

    We also decided to look at the breakdown of events that took place in gun free zones and the relative death toll from events in gun free zones vs non-gun-free zones.

    Of the 283 incidents in our data pool, we were unable to identify if the event took place in a gun-free zone in a large number (41%) of the events. Most of the events took place at a business, church, home, or other places at which as a rule of law it is not a gun free zone but potentially could have been declared one by the property owner. Without any information in the FBI study or any indication one way or the other from the news reports, we have indicated that event with a question mark.

    If you look at all of the Active Shooter events (pie chart on the top) you see that for those which we have the information, almost twice as many took place in gun free zones than not; but realistically the vast majority of those for which we have no information (indicated as ?) are probably NOT gun free zones.

    If you isolate just the events at which 8 or more people were killed the data paints a different picture (pie chart on the bottom). In these incidents, 77.8% took place in a gun-free zone suggesting that gun free zones lead to a higher death rate vs active shooter events in general

    =====

    One of the final metrics we thought was important to consider is the potential tendency for armed citizens to injure or kill innocent people in their attempt to “save the day.” A common point in political discussions is to point out the lack of training of most armed citizens and the decrease in safety inherent in their presence during violent encounters.

    As you can see below, however, at the 33 incidents at which Armed Citizens were present, there were zero situations at which the Armed Citizen injured or killed an innocent person. It never happened.
     
  9. sartre play
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    sartre play Gold Member

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    I am a legal gun owner.
     
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  10. Silver Blooded
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    Silver Blooded Senior Member

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    When it comes to taking on a career criminal, yes, but not a mass shooter. Mass shooters tend to be self-loathing, forgive the term, losers. I mean, if we stop fearing them and start fighting back they will crap their pants and run. I mean, read this article about the synagogue shooting and watch the testimony: Accused San Diego synagogue shooter appears in court, may face state and U.S. death penalty

    When the border patrol officer ran up to him and yelled at him, he freaked so much that he ran away instead of reloading or fighting back. That would not happen with a career criminal, but with mass shooters like Nikolas Cruz and Dylann Roof? Look at the pictures of these 2 mass shooters and tell me that they won't run away screaming the second that they are threatened with a punch, let alone seeing a gun pointed at them.

    I think that there are better solutions to our mass shooter problem than just arming everyone, but I think that someone pointing a gun at a mass shooter is a simple solution for stopping the event. I think the best solutions are deterrents and preventions.
     
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