Vietnam War - how did US benefit from it?

[RetiredGySgt]

Well if your definition of a lie is the same as someone else on this board , being that any statement that turns out wrong, even when the person making it believed it to be true, is a lie, your right. Of course that means every one everywhere is a serial liar every day of their lives.

As to weapons programs, your the one with your head in the sand. We have irrefutable proof, from captured documents, equipment, and scientists, that Saddam Hussein was waiting for sanctions to be lifted to return to mass production of chemical and biological weapons and return to a nuclear program. Sanctions that France, Germany, Russia and China all were working on lifting even as we prepared for war.

I love the quote from Bush on the other Governments, since it is TRUE. Every Government including the UN believed he had weapons, believed he was hiding them from inspectors. Hell several European Countries believed he was close to having a Nuclear weapon.

I notice you didn't quote the plethoria of leading Democrats that made similar statements and claims right up to the Invasion. I wonder why that is? I suggest you learn reading comprehension BEFORE you try to tell others what Bush said. And perhaps a lesson in hearing all the others that agreed and said the same things. From all over the world and from the Democratic Party here in the States.

The ostrich is not me. I would tell you to look in a mirror, but you can't with your head as far down in the sand as it is.

 

[Ruby]

Funny part is, your entire post is nothing but proof that it is YOU who has their buried in the sand. I wouldn't even no where to start rebutting your longwinded fantasyworld CRAP.

LOL hardly surprising mr. cellophane.

 

[Ruby]

Well if your definition of a lie is the same as someone else on this board , being that any statement that turns out wrong, even when the person making it believed it to be true, is a lie, your right. Of course that means every one everywhere is a serial liar every day of their lives.

As to weapons programs, your the one with your head in the sand. We have irrefutable proof, from captured documents, equipment, and scientists, that Saddam Hussein was waiting for sanctions to be lifted to return to mass production of chemical and biological weapons and return to a nuclear program. Sanctions that France, Germany, Russia and China all were working on lifting even as we prepared for war.

I love the quote from Bush on the other Governments, since it is TRUE. Every Government including the UN believed he had weapons, believed he was hiding them from inspectors. Hell several European Countries believed he was close to having a Nuclear weapon.

I notice you didn't quote the plethoria of leading Democrats that made similar statements and claims right up to the Invasion. I wonder why that is? I suggest you learn reading comprehension BEFORE you try to tell others what Bush said. And perhaps a lesson in hearing all the others that agreed and said the same things. From all over the world and from the Democratic Party here in the States.

The ostrich is not me. I would tell you to look in a mirror, but you can't with your head as far down in the sand as it is.

They said they KNEW FOR A FACT, obviously they didnt KNOW for a fact. They also used intelligence that they already were told was FALSE and FORGERIES by our own CIA. Seriously, its pretty obvious.

Its also not true that EVERY govt thought he had WMD, if that were the case the US wouldnt have had a problem getting a go-ahead to invade from the UN. Everyone seemed to agree in containment and inspections...both were in force.

And lets not forget about those mobile biological weapons labs that were really just hydrogen gas generators used to inflate weather balloons!

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/lieofthecentury.html

Now we could call it a mistake BUT they were actually sold to Iraq by Britain and we KNEW that already. I mean are you actually trying to say that the US is sooooo stupid that it dosent know the difference between a mobile biological weapons lab and a weather balloon inflator???

Or wait it gets even more alice in wonderland...

Powell also claimed to the United Nations that the photo on the left showed "Decontamination Vehicles". But when United Nations inspectors visited the site after the invasion, they located the vehicles and discovered they were just firefighting equipment.

Now we are claiming firefighting equipement to be decontamination vehicles???

All of this was roundly debunked as soon as people were actually able to review the "evidence" offered.

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/lieofthecentury.html

Its a good link there, it lays out the lies very well.

You have to believe our entire intelligence community, our entire govt and the entire Bush administration are DUMB as doornails or they knowingly lied. I dont believe them to be moral, but I dont believe they are ALL quite that dumb.

None of our "evidence" held up to scrutiny cause it was all bogus.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Sure thing, thats why Congress in a Bipartisan investigation determined no lie occurred. Delusional would be you. I guess all those democrats that all said the same thing were in on it too?

 

[Ruby]

Sure thing, thats why Congress in a Bipartisan investigation determined no lie occurred. Delusional would be you. I guess all those democrats that all said the same thing were in on it too?

And you actually expect a corrupt govt to police itself? Wow, you are VERY delusional. Of course the democrats arent any better....I certainly never claimed they were.

Just keep ignoring the SOLID evidence, the documented quotes, the evidence they tried to pass off but didnt actually pass at all. I understand why our corrupt politicians do it....I cant think of a feasible excuse for you though.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

And you actually expect a corrupt govt to police itself? Wow, you are VERY delusional. Of course the democrats arent any better....I certainly never claimed they were.

Just keep ignoring the SOLID evidence, the documented quotes, the evidence they tried to pass off but didnt actually pass at all. I understand why our corrupt politicians do it....I cant think of a feasible excuse for you though.

So you were just APPALLED when President Clinton for 8 years had the Secret Service and security round up dissenters at any public event he was at and rope them off out of sight and sound of him and the press? And you were APPALLED at the MSM for refusing to air the "Swiftboat Veterans" ads and speeches?

And I ask again, where do you live? And why do you live there?

Your list of "evidence" is delusional.

 

[Ruby]

So you were just APPALLED when President Clinton for 8 years had the Secret Service and security round up dissenters at any public event he was at and rope them off out of sight and sound of him and the press? And you were APPALLED at the MSM for refusing to air the "Swiftboat Veterans" ads and speeches?

And I ask again, where do you live? And why do you live there?

Your list of "evidence" is delusional.

Yes I was appalled at MANY things Clinton did. He also had no right to shut out dissent. He did other things as well such as NAFTA etc that I also was APPALLED OVER. He deserves his nickname slick willy.

MSM media are just corporations, you wont really find true media there so I am not sure what your point is there. They are private businesses who look for their own profit interests and nothing more and nothing less.

I am concerned when the GOVT does all it can to silence dissent and I certainly take issue with american citizens who want to help FURTHER that cause.

I live in Sweden cause I married a Swedish man. Why the PERSONAL questions...what does my personal life have to do with the merits of the issue? Or maybe you just want to bring it down to a personal thing cause you are having trouble sticking with the merits of the issue...so predictable.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Yes I was appalled at MANY things Clinton did. He also had no right to shut out dissent. He did other things as well such as NAFTA etc that I also was APPALLED OVER. He deserves his nickname slick willy.

MSM media are just corporations, you wont really find true media there so I am not sure what your point is there. They are private businesses who look for their own profit interests and nothing more and nothing less.

I am concerned when the GOVT does all it can to silence dissent and I certainly take issue with american citizens who want to help FURTHER that cause.

I live in Sweden cause I married a Swedish man. Why the PERSONAL questions...what does my personal life have to do with the merits of the issue? Or maybe you just want to bring it down to a personal thing cause you are having trouble sticking with the merits of the issue...so predictable.

Ohh so now your backing away from a previous statement you made that you are GLAD you got you and your family OUT of the United States?

And last I checked the Government is NOT silencing her at all AND further YOU want freedom of expression BUT just from people you agree with. Or you would not be so irritated with the opinions of a few people that think she should be punished for the REAL laws she has broken on many occasions.

 

[Ruby]

Ohh so now your backing away from a previous statement you made that you are GLAD you got you and your family OUT of the United States?

And last I checked the Government is NOT silencing her at all AND further YOU want freedom of expression BUT just from people you agree with. Or you would not be so irritated with the opinions of a few people that think she should be punished for the REAL laws she has broken on many occasions.

No I am not backing away from any statement, I am glad with my choice and my son is much better off here. I live in sweden because I married a swedish man...whats so confusing to you?

I didnt say the govt was silencing her although I do and will continue to complain about all efforts to do so by govt (free speech zones etc).

My comments were about the POSTERS who were wishing her in jail and seemed to support the idea of silencing her because they dont like the content of what she has to say. Thats not exactly embracing freedom and democratic principles. Maybe you should go back and re-read it so you can absorb better understanding and comprehension.

The REAL laws are just the typical ones over dissent and the dissent is FAR more important than nuisance laws. Its also NEVER been viewed that breaking nuisance laws made a person a CRIMINAL worthy of prison.

Face it, you just simply support silencing her and will grasp at any straw to justify it that you can. You are quite ready to completely disregard the importance of dissent in a society based on democratic principles....is that somthing a person who cherishes democratic principles would do?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

No I am not backing away from any statement, I am glad with my choice and my son is much better off here. I live in sweden because I married a swedish man...whats so confusing to you?

I didnt say the govt was silencing her although I do and will continue to complain about all efforts to do so by govt (free speech zones etc).

My comments were about the POSTERS who were wishing her in jail and seemed to support the idea of silencing her because they dont like the content of what she has to say. Thats not exactly embracing freedom and democratic principles. Maybe you should go back and re-read it so you can absorb better understanding and comprehension.

The REAL laws are just the typical ones over dissent and the dissent is FAR more important than nuisance laws. Its also NEVER been viewed that breaking nuisance laws made a person a CRIMINAL worthy of prison.

Face it, you just simply support silencing her and will grasp at any straw to justify it that you can. You are quite ready to completely disregard the importance of dissent in a society based on democratic principles....is that somthing a person who cherishes democratic principles would do?

Well except for the whole jail time component of numerous laws she has broken, you might have had a point.

Now as to MY opinion? Let her rant and rave all she wants. Arrest her ass when she breaks the law BUT treat her like anyone else that gets arrested for the same laws she breaks. If jail is a standard component of a law she broke and others routinely get jail time for it, SO SHOULD SHE.

As to Prison, your right. None of the laws involve anything higher than county jail, I believe.

Now as to reading comprehension and assumptions, you should read what I have written, I never gave an opinion on "prison" I simply stated she has broken numerous laws and that some of them do in fact have jail time as a component of punishment for them.

But thanks for proving your inability to comprehend the written word and your ability to assume what ever you feel at the moment.

 

[Ruby]

Well except for the whole jail time component of numerous laws she has broken, you might have had a point.

Now as to MY opinion? Let her rant and rave all she wants. Arrest her ass when she breaks the law BUT treat her like anyone else that gets arrested for the same laws she breaks. If jail is a standard component of a law she broke and others routinely get jail time for it, SO SHOULD SHE.

As to Prison, your right. None of the laws involve anything higher than county jail, I believe.

Now as to reading comprehension and assumptions, you should read what I have written, I never gave an opinion on "prison" I simply stated she has broken numerous laws and that some of them do in fact have jail time as a component of punishment for them.

But thanks for proving your inability to comprehend the written word and your ability to assume what ever you feel at the moment.

None of the laws she broke even have a "jail time sentence" to them. Its usually a brief detainment with a fine.

Activists will OF COURSE be repeat offenders, if they werent then that would mean our govt is successful at discouraging dissent to the point that it dosent really exist in any effective way anymore and THAT would a real crime.

 

[dilloduck]

None of the laws she broke even have a "jail time sentence" to them. Its usually a brief detainment with a fine.

Activists will OF COURSE be repeat offenders, if they werent then that would mean our govt is successful at discouraging dissent to the point that it dosent really exist in any effective way anymore and THAT would a real crime.

Why do "dissenters" feel it necessary to interrupt others right to speak? Do they not know how to take turns ?

 

[Ruby]

Why do "dissenters" feel it necessary to interrupt others right to speak? Do they not know how to take turns ?

There is no "turn" for them to wait for. Dissent means you will have to speak up and be a nuisance. Those "other" people get plenty of voice and chances to speak and be heard, its the average american who dosent get that chance and has to stand up in dissent to have themselves heard.

Rather sad to see so little regard for dissent. Its such a cornerstone of democracy.

 

[dilloduck]

There is no "turn" for them to wait for. Dissent means you will have to speak up and be a nuisance. Those "other" people get plenty of voice and chances to speak and be heard, its the average american who dosent get that chance and has to stand up in dissent to have themselves heard.

Rather sad to see so little regard for dissent. Its such a cornerstone of democracy.

Bullshit--dissenters have PLENTY of opportunities to speak and be heard. I have respect for dissent. I don't for silly asses dressed in pink who insist on interrupting others who are trying to express their ideas.

 

[Ruby]

Bullshit--dissenters have PLENTY of opportunities to speak and be heard. I have respect for dissent. I don't for silly asses dressed in pink who insist on interrupting others who are trying to express their ideas.

Well thanks, you just made it clear that you dont understand what dissent is.

 

[dilloduck]

Well thanks, you just made it clear that you dont understand what dissent is.

Dissent is a bunch of silly assed women dressed in pink interrupting government procedings ???
Maybe you would be nice enough to explain what exactly dissent is.

 

[Ruby]

Dissent is a bunch of silly assed women dressed in pink interrupting government procedings ???
Maybe you would be nice enough to explain what exactly dissent is.

It is causing a nuisance, making SURE your voices get heard and you get attention of those who are in office and not listening and not acting in the publics best interest. It is refusing to stop, cease or be silent. It should never be violent but it can certainly be DISRUPTIVE.

 

[Gunny]

It is causing a nuisance, making SURE your voices get heard and you get attention of those who are in office and not listening and not acting in the publics best interest. It is refusing to stop, cease or be silent. It should never be violent but it can certainly be DISRUPTIVE.

Really? Show me where in the Constitution it says you have the right to be disruptive. Fact is, you don't have that right and I for one cheer everytime some group of morons is tossed in jail for it.

 

[dilloduck]

It is causing a nuisance, making SURE your voices get heard and you get attention of those who are in office and not listening and not acting in the publics best interest. It is refusing to stop, cease or be silent. It should never be violent but it can certainly be DISRUPTIVE.

Then the democrats have succeeded. All they are is a nuisance. It might be wise to have something to say BEFORE you find a chance to be heard too.

Disruption and noise isn't dissent. It's a pain in the ass.

 

[manu1959]

Could I say that Vietnam war was worth militarily, ideologically or otherwise to USA now that we can analyze it historically? Or was the war unnecessary, costly blunder?

vietnam was the US cleaning up yet another french mess....

vietnam taugtht the US to use afganistan to cripple the soviets.....

unfotunately, we then went there ourselves....