VAT Tax coming

[RetiredGySgt]

I don't mind a VAT .... it treats all people the same.....same tax regardless....

Except it does not. Low income and middle Income are hit hardest by a VAT , why? Because they have less money to spend to begin with and are more likely to buy the things the VAT tax covers on a continuing basis.

It is a tax that will be felt more by the non rich, then by the rich, something Obama promised not to do. Another lie exposed.

It would be means tested giving lazy middle classers and poor credits. You don't think Satan would tax his base do you?

You are a fool. If you think that the plan is to means test it your an idiot and a fool. How exactly does one means test a VAT? Fill out paperwork on every purchase so that a decision can be made whether or not to tax that person? That would make the tax cost more then it brought in.

Further this idea that you know what would be excluded is hilarious. They will push for as much to be taxed as possible. The idea is to raise tons of revenue.

 

[editec]

is there any form of taxation liberals are opposed to?

Yes, there are.

Flat income taxes for one and VAT taxes on goods for another.

VAT taxes are simply flat taxes applied to goods and services.

Now before you point out to me that CLINTON supports a VAT tax, let me inform you that CLINTON is NO LIBERAL.

I mean, I know to a lot of you right wingers WJC must appear to be a liberal, but from a truly liberal perspective?

Clinton was merely Republican-lite

 

[PeterS]

So poor people do not buy furniture, electrical goods and appliances, electronics, clothing, etc etc? The middle class do not buy these items? Exactly who will be hurt by these items being further taxed? Not the rich, the poor and middle class.

They do...but they don't spend $2000.00 on a suit...they buy a Men's Wearhouse suit...they don't buy Ethan Allen furniture or Stockwell wool carpeting, they buy Jerome Brother's stuff and Carpet Barn from China....they don't buy MacIntosh Stereo equipment...they buy Panasonic.... with a 2% VAT added on to these things the rich will bear a higher proportional burden on their purchases. I'm not saying the lower income groups escape the tax altogether...I'm saying the rich don't care how much their stuff costs.

seems to me that it would push nice things further out of reach of the people who are trying to climb the ladder.

Hey, Fair Tax is a conservative idea. Why are you guys now opposed to it?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

They do...but they don't spend $2000.00 on a suit...they buy a Men's Wearhouse suit...they don't buy Ethan Allen furniture or Stockwell wool carpeting, they buy Jerome Brother's stuff and Carpet Barn from China....they don't buy MacIntosh Stereo equipment...they buy Panasonic.... with a 2% VAT added on to these things the rich will bear a higher proportional burden on their purchases. I'm not saying the lower income groups escape the tax altogether...I'm saying the rich don't care how much their stuff costs.

seems to me that it would push nice things further out of reach of the people who are trying to climb the ladder.

Hey, Fair Tax is a conservative idea. Why are you guys now opposed to it?

VAT is not a fair tax, quit making idiotic claims.

 

[PeterS]

is there any form of taxation liberals are opposed to?

Yes, there are.

Flat income taxes for one and VAT taxes on goods for another.

VAT taxes are simply flat taxes applied to goods and services.

Now before you point out to me that CLINTON supports a VAT tax, let me inform you that CLINTON is NO LIBERAL.

I mean, I know to a lot of you right wingers WJC must appear to be a liberal, but from a truly liberal perspective?

Clinton was merely Republican-lite

Clinton also once proposed a revenue neutral flat tax. Cons fell all over themselves killing that one. It was actually a good idea though as it would have balanced the budget and there would be none of this nonsense we now see...

 

[PeterS]

seems to me that it would push nice things further out of reach of the people who are trying to climb the ladder.

Hey, Fair Tax is a conservative idea. Why are you guys now opposed to it?

VAT is not a fair tax, quit making idiotic claims.

Fair Tax is a VAT tax. " Why is it idiotic to call it what it is?

 

[skookerasbil]

Ooooooooooooops!!!!!


Retiredgysgnt pwning the lefties........................once again!!!


progressives suck

 

[code1211]

Podesta Says Value-Added Tax ‘More Plausible’ as Deficits Grow

\Who Is John Podesta ?2

Sept. 25 (Bloomberg) -- John Podesta compared the nation’s current budget crisis to the situation former President Bill Clinton faced in 1993 and said some form of a value-added tax is “more plausible today than it ever has been.”

“There’s going to have to be revenue in this budget,” said Podesta, Clinton’s former chief of staff and co-chairman of President Barack Obama’s transition team, said in an interview on Bloomberg Television’s “Political Capital with Al Hunt,” airing today.

A so-called consumption tax would “create a balance” with European and Japanese economies and “could potentially have a substantial effect on competitiveness,” said Podesta. Value- added taxes in Europe and Japan encourage savings by taxing consumption.

Podesta said such a tax may be regressive, but can be balanced by exempting some products and using “the money to support low-wage workers.”

Podesta Says Value-Added Tax ‘More Plausible’ as Deficits Grow - Bloomberg.com


Why not ? All those great powerhouse economies in Europe have one.

Isn't this the 'fair tax' conservatives have been pushing for? Wanna bet not a single one will like it if Obama proposes it?

I thik that the Fair Tax was a flat rate tax on Income. VAT is a consumption tax and would function exactly like Cap and Trade where every product consumed would become more expensive.

Under a VAT, there would probably be tinkering with the rates according to the kind of product in question. Bread would be lower and Luxury cars higher in all likelihood. This would reduce the regressive aspects of it. Maybe the first $10 is tax free for any product and the tax rises on each succeeding incremental increase.

Cap and Trade, on the other hand, would pass the costs of Government applied penalties for Carbon Production on through the supply chain to the consumer. Toilet paper and bread as well as Mercedes and yaughts would all go up in price.

If inflation takes hold, newspapers might gain popularity again as an alternative to Cap and Trade inflated triple ply soft. The most popular paper will be the one with ink that won't rub off.

 

[PeterS]

Except it does not. Low income and middle Income are hit hardest by a VAT , why? Because they have less money to spend to begin with and are more likely to buy the things the VAT tax covers on a continuing basis.

It is a tax that will be felt more by the non rich, then by the rich, something Obama promised not to do. Another lie exposed.

It would be means tested giving lazy middle classers and poor credits. You don't think Satan would tax his base do you?

You are a fool. If you think that the plan is to means test it your an idiot and a fool. How exactly does one means test a VAT? Fill out paperwork on every purchase so that a decision can be made whether or not to tax that person? That would make the tax cost more then it brought in.

Further this idea that you know what would be excluded is hilarious. They will push for as much to be taxed as possible. The idea is to raise tons of revenue.

Yeah but you cons are getting ready for the great take over. Satan and his minions will soon be disposed and government will be yours once again. Certainly you do think the people you elect will unfairly tax you do you? And since Fair Tax claims to be means tested I am assuming you guys have already worked out those details.

Hey you guys don't come up with many ideas that Satan agrees with. Well heres one and its timed perfect for your great take over. Cheer up!

 

[code1211]

is there any form of taxation liberals are opposed to?

Yes, there are.

Flat income taxes for one and VAT taxes on goods for another.

VAT taxes are simply flat taxes applied to goods and services.

Now before you point out to me that CLINTON supports a VAT tax, let me inform you that CLINTON is NO LIBERAL.

I mean, I know to a lot of you right wingers WJC must appear to be a liberal, but from a truly liberal perspective?

Clinton was merely Republican-lite

To me the Liberalness or the Conservativeness (are these real words?) has nothing to do with BJ's on the O-Office or with Sabre Rattling in the Middle East. It has only to do with whether or not the guy at the top is spending more or less than he is collecting in tax.

By this measure, WJC was a Conservative, Bush was a Liberal and Obama is Chicago political hack.

Of the three, give me Clinton. Now, the historical position of the guy is a different matter. It's possible that nobody would have been able to spend tax dollars faster than the dot coms were creating them in the nineties. The results, though, are what they are.

When all the spending is done, a positive number is a positive thing. Also, it's a good thing if the guy at the top remembers that a tax is confiscation of someone else's money rather than retrieval of govenment funds that somehow got into the wrong hands.

 

[PeterS]

Podesta Says Value-Added Tax ‘More Plausible’ as Deficits Grow

\Who Is John Podesta ?2

Sept. 25 (Bloomberg) -- John Podesta compared the nation’s current budget crisis to the situation former President Bill Clinton faced in 1993 and said some form of a value-added tax is “more plausible today than it ever has been.”

“There’s going to have to be revenue in this budget,” said Podesta, Clinton’s former chief of staff and co-chairman of President Barack Obama’s transition team, said in an interview on Bloomberg Television’s “Political Capital with Al Hunt,” airing today.

A so-called consumption tax would “create a balance” with European and Japanese economies and “could potentially have a substantial effect on competitiveness,” said Podesta. Value- added taxes in Europe and Japan encourage savings by taxing consumption.

Podesta said such a tax may be regressive, but can be balanced by exempting some products and using “the money to support low-wage workers.”

Podesta Says Value-Added Tax ‘More Plausible’ as Deficits Grow - Bloomberg.com


Why not ? All those great powerhouse economies in Europe have one.

Isn't this the 'fair tax' conservatives have been pushing for? Wanna bet not a single one will like it if Obama proposes it?

I thik that the Fair Tax was a flat rate tax on Income. VAT is a consumption tax and would function exactly like Cap and Trade where every product consumed would become more expensive.

Under a VAT, there would probably be tinkering with the rates according to the kind of product in question. Bread would be lower and Luxury cars higher in all likelihood. This would reduce the regressive aspects of it. Maybe the first $10 is tax free for any product and the tax rises on each succeeding incremental increase.

Cap and Trade, on the other hand, would pass the costs of Government applied penalties for Carbon Production on through the supply chain to the consumer. Toilet paper and bread as well as Mercedes and yaughts would all go up in price.

If inflation takes hold, newspapers might gain popularity again as an alternative to Cap and Trade inflated triple ply soft. The most popular paper will be the one with ink that won't rub off.

Fair tax is a consumption tax. Americans For Fair Taxation: The test on tax reform ...and since it is supported by real Americans I am assuming it a good idea...

 

[Xenophon]

It never takes long for a 'progressive' to say that a new tax is needed for something.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

a value tax is regressive and ABSOLUTELY would break obama's promise not to tax the middle class more...

congress won't do this.

yeah right.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

They do...but they don't spend $2000.00 on a suit...they buy a Men's Wearhouse suit...they don't buy Ethan Allen furniture or Stockwell wool carpeting, they buy Jerome Brother's stuff and Carpet Barn from China....they don't buy MacIntosh Stereo equipment...they buy Panasonic.... with a 2% VAT added on to these things the rich will bear a higher proportional burden on their purchases. I'm not saying the lower income groups escape the tax altogether...I'm saying the rich don't care how much their stuff costs.

seems to me that it would push nice things further out of reach of the people who are trying to climb the ladder.

Hey, Fair Tax is a conservative idea. Why are you guys now opposed to it?

Fair tax as a replacement of the income tax, not this , this just humping the people dry.
We would never have voted for the system we have now.
It should be replaced , Now they just want everything you got.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

Isn't this the 'fair tax' conservatives have been pushing for? Wanna bet not a single one will like it if Obama proposes it?

I thik that the Fair Tax was a flat rate tax on Income. VAT is a consumption tax and would function exactly like Cap and Trade where every product consumed would become more expensive.

Under a VAT, there would probably be tinkering with the rates according to the kind of product in question. Bread would be lower and Luxury cars higher in all likelihood. This would reduce the regressive aspects of it. Maybe the first $10 is tax free for any product and the tax rises on each succeeding incremental increase.

Cap and Trade, on the other hand, would pass the costs of Government applied penalties for Carbon Production on through the supply chain to the consumer. Toilet paper and bread as well as Mercedes and yaughts would all go up in price.

If inflation takes hold, newspapers might gain popularity again as an alternative to Cap and Trade inflated triple ply soft. The most popular paper will be the one with ink that won't rub off.

Fair tax is a consumption tax. Americans For Fair Taxation: The test on tax reform ...and since it is supported by real Americans I am assuming it a good idea...

Oh you're an idiot ,I didn't know, sorry.

 

[WillowTree]

I don't mind a VAT .... it treats all people the same.....same tax regardless....

except they will give those who refuse to pay taxes vouchers at your expense. we will always have parasites.

 

[Wry Catcher]

I don't mind a VAT .... it treats all people the same.....same tax regardless....

Except it does not. Low income and middle Income are hit hardest by a VAT , why? Because they have less money to spend to begin with and are more likely to buy the things the VAT tax covers on a continuing basis.

It is a tax that will be felt more by the non rich, then by the rich, something Obama promised not to do. Another lie exposed.

I respectfully disagree with the highlighted statement Gunny...I live in the Far East and see the VAT in place in Singapore, Malaysia, Thailand and the P.I. For the most part the low/middle income are hardly impacted by it. For starters it's designed to tax the tourists and those who buy discretionary type items...in other words there is no VAT on food, shelter and electricity. Now we don't know what a U.S. VAT would look like at this point but I would think it would be simular to what one sees in Singapore or the EU. In other words...hotels, dining out, cars, jewelry, furniture, appliances, electronics, designer goods, clothing etc. would have a VAT added at check out.

Patek,
In your experience, does the VAT apply to services too?

 

[chanel]

Good question. I do know they are considering a tax on plastic surgery. NJ already has one. We call it the "big boobie tax".

 

[Polk]

I don't mind a VAT .... it treats all people the same.....same tax regardless....

Except it does not. Low income and middle Income are hit hardest by a VAT , why? Because they have less money to spend to begin with and are more likely to buy the things the VAT tax covers on a continuing basis.

It is a tax that will be felt more by the non rich, then by the rich, something Obama promised not to do. Another lie exposed.

You guys really need to learn to keep your arguments straight. At one point, you claim that a VAT taxes everyone equally, then you claim it would have disproportionate effect on the poor (which is the correct answer, but you arrived at it for the wrong reasons).

Also, how did Obama lie? This isn't an administration proposal. It's some guy from a think-tank talking. Podesta has close ties to the White House, but that doesn't mean he speaks for them.

 

[Polk]

Except it does not. Low income and middle Income are hit hardest by a VAT , why? Because they have less money to spend to begin with and are more likely to buy the things the VAT tax covers on a continuing basis.

It is a tax that will be felt more by the non rich, then by the rich, something Obama promised not to do. Another lie exposed.

It would be means tested giving lazy middle classers and poor credits. You don't think Satan would tax his base do you?

You are a fool. If you think that the plan is to means test it your an idiot and a fool. How exactly does one means test a VAT? Fill out paperwork on every purchase so that a decision can be made whether or not to tax that person? That would make the tax cost more then it brought in.

Further this idea that you know what would be excluded is hilarious. They will push for as much to be taxed as possible. The idea is to raise tons of revenue.

You could means test it by giving everyone a tax credit to offset the tax up to a certain level.