US Taxes Must Rise Drastically

Madeline

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Cleveland. Feel mah pain.
WASHINGTON -- Just in time to dash holiday cheer, recently unveiled debt-reduction plans underscore how huge are the fiscal challenges facing the U.S. They also make clear how tough the tradeoffs must be to tame federal budget deficits and the national debt.

Major overhauls of the entire U.S. tax code are at the heart of all these plans. They'd eliminate popular deductions and radically change taxation across the board.

The most influential panel is the National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform. Earlier this month, the panel's co-chairmen -- Democrat Erskine Bowles and Republican Alan Simpson -- released their preliminary report on how to bring down deficits and debt. It sent shock waves rumbling nationwide.

"We can't grow ourselves out of this problem. We can't tax our way out of it," Bowles told PBS' Charlie Rose Tuesday. "People who want to do just taxes, you'd have to raise the maximum marginal rates to 80 percent. You'd have to raise the corporate rate to 70 percent. You'd have to raise the capital gains rate to 50 percent if you're just going to do taxes.

"We can't cut our way out of it. People say, 'Oh, well, let's just cut the budget.' If you just rely on deficit reduction through cutting, and you want to exclude Social Security, Medicare and defense and of course interest, then you'd have to cut everything else by about 60 to 65 percent. You can't do that, either," Bowles said.

"What we've got to do is some combination. Alan and I have come out with a plan that's balanced that takes $4 trillion out of the deficit over the next 10 years. I think that's the kind of thing we have to do. And if we don't, the markets are going to force us to."

Driving all the plans is this cruel reality: The federal deficit is projected at $1.3 trillion this year, almost as much as last year -- a scale not seen since the end of World War II. Left untamed, experts insist, this monstrous debt threatens the nation's future prosperity and security. Simply paying interest on the nearly $14 trillion national debt will cost more than $1 trillion in 2020 -- 17 percent of all federal spending -- unless big changes are made.

Debt-cutting plans share this: Taxes will go up for everyone | cleveland.com

There are some hard choices ahead, folks. Best find your Big Girl Panties and Big Boy Underoos and face facts.

Those of you who are married to the idea that the deficit must be reduced but that your slice of the federal spending pie should not be touched, I find you to be unpatriotic and selfish. IMO, almost all of us should bear this burden, and no one's cow is sacred.

Your thoughts?
 
Flat tax. Everyone bleeds the same % Flat tax fro the rich and the poor alike.
 
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Eliminating deductions moves us in that direction, syrenn. I don't think we'll ever have a flat tax as the lobbyists would have nothing to fiddle with if we did, but o well.

More importantly, the message is this: most pundits believe that to replace the US government's current revenues from income taxes on individuals, we'd need a flat tax rate of about 14%. Assuming that's correct, what these researchers are saying is that the level of taxes must rise.....say to the 20% point. Mebbe even 25%. And that despite this, deep cuts must still be made in government spending, including Medicare and Social Security. And states and localities also need to follow suit, raising taxes and cutting services.

It is a grim future we face, but if we refuse to take our medicine now, we are basically agreeing to transform the US into a third world nation. This is not a partisan issue, IMO.

It's a national tragedy.
 
WASHINGTON -- Just in time to dash holiday cheer, recently unveiled debt-reduction plans underscore how huge are the fiscal challenges facing the U.S. They also make clear how tough the tradeoffs must be to tame federal budget deficits and the national debt.

Major overhauls of the entire U.S. tax code are at the heart of all these plans. They'd eliminate popular deductions and radically change taxation across the board.

The most influential panel is the National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform. Earlier this month, the panel's co-chairmen -- Democrat Erskine Bowles and Republican Alan Simpson -- released their preliminary report on how to bring down deficits and debt. It sent shock waves rumbling nationwide.

"We can't grow ourselves out of this problem. We can't tax our way out of it," Bowles told PBS' Charlie Rose Tuesday. "People who want to do just taxes, you'd have to raise the maximum marginal rates to 80 percent. You'd have to raise the corporate rate to 70 percent. You'd have to raise the capital gains rate to 50 percent if you're just going to do taxes.

"We can't cut our way out of it. People say, 'Oh, well, let's just cut the budget.' If you just rely on deficit reduction through cutting, and you want to exclude Social Security, Medicare and defense and of course interest, then you'd have to cut everything else by about 60 to 65 percent. You can't do that, either," Bowles said.

"What we've got to do is some combination. Alan and I have come out with a plan that's balanced that takes $4 trillion out of the deficit over the next 10 years. I think that's the kind of thing we have to do. And if we don't, the markets are going to force us to."

Driving all the plans is this cruel reality: The federal deficit is projected at $1.3 trillion this year, almost as much as last year -- a scale not seen since the end of World War II. Left untamed, experts insist, this monstrous debt threatens the nation's future prosperity and security. Simply paying interest on the nearly $14 trillion national debt will cost more than $1 trillion in 2020 -- 17 percent of all federal spending -- unless big changes are made.

Debt-cutting plans share this: Taxes will go up for everyone | cleveland.com

There are some hard choices ahead, folks. Best find your Big Girl Panties and Big Boy Underoos and face facts.

Those of you who are married to the idea that the deficit must be reduced but that your slice of the federal spending pie should not be touched, I find you to be unpatriotic and selfish. IMO, almost all of us should bear this burden, and no one's cow is sacred.

Your thoughts?

My real estate taxes went up 20%. If my state doesn't get revenue from wage earners..the hit people that own land (or a co-op in my case).
 
WASHINGTON -- Just in time to dash holiday cheer, recently unveiled debt-reduction plans underscore how huge are the fiscal challenges facing the U.S. They also make clear how tough the tradeoffs must be to tame federal budget deficits and the national debt.

Major overhauls of the entire U.S. tax code are at the heart of all these plans. They'd eliminate popular deductions and radically change taxation across the board.

The most influential panel is the National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform. Earlier this month, the panel's co-chairmen -- Democrat Erskine Bowles and Republican Alan Simpson -- released their preliminary report on how to bring down deficits and debt. It sent shock waves rumbling nationwide.

"We can't grow ourselves out of this problem. We can't tax our way out of it," Bowles told PBS' Charlie Rose Tuesday. "People who want to do just taxes, you'd have to raise the maximum marginal rates to 80 percent. You'd have to raise the corporate rate to 70 percent. You'd have to raise the capital gains rate to 50 percent if you're just going to do taxes.

"We can't cut our way out of it. People say, 'Oh, well, let's just cut the budget.' If you just rely on deficit reduction through cutting, and you want to exclude Social Security, Medicare and defense and of course interest, then you'd have to cut everything else by about 60 to 65 percent. You can't do that, either," Bowles said.

"What we've got to do is some combination. Alan and I have come out with a plan that's balanced that takes $4 trillion out of the deficit over the next 10 years. I think that's the kind of thing we have to do. And if we don't, the markets are going to force us to."

Driving all the plans is this cruel reality: The federal deficit is projected at $1.3 trillion this year, almost as much as last year -- a scale not seen since the end of World War II. Left untamed, experts insist, this monstrous debt threatens the nation's future prosperity and security. Simply paying interest on the nearly $14 trillion national debt will cost more than $1 trillion in 2020 -- 17 percent of all federal spending -- unless big changes are made.

Debt-cutting plans share this: Taxes will go up for everyone | cleveland.com

There are some hard choices ahead, folks. Best find your Big Girl Panties and Big Boy Underoos and face facts.

Those of you who are married to the idea that the deficit must be reduced but that your slice of the federal spending pie should not be touched, I find you to be unpatriotic and selfish. IMO, almost all of us should bear this burden, and no one's cow is sacred.

Your thoughts?

My "slice of the federal spending pie should not be touched?"

Shit, I have a slice of pie?

Where?
 
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Samson wrote:

My "slice of the federal spending pie should not be touched?"

Shit, I have a slice of pie?

Where?

You will have to plan for retirement without depending on Social Security and with a much-reduced Medicare plan (likely no more than major medical), and it is likely you'll be nearly 70 before you can afford to retire. Your children will face steeply higher college costs and far less access to student loans. (Anyone living in a state that offers a tax free savings plan for higher ed which "freezes" tuition costs as today's levels should be participating, IMO, if they have children.)

You will pay more to use a park, get a hunting license, renew a driver's license, etc. You will pay more for cigarettes and liquor, and if you gamble, you will have far less chance of winning and when you do, will likely owe more tax.

Shall I go on?
 
Eliminating deductions moves us in that direction, syrenn. I don't think we'll ever have a flat tax as the lobbyists would have nothing to fiddle with if we did, but o well.

More importantly, the message is this: most pundits believe that to replace the US government's current revenues from income taxes on individuals, we'd need a flat tax rate of about 14%. Assuming that's correct, what these researchers are saying is that the level of taxes must rise.....say to the 20% point. Mebbe even 25%. And that despite this, deep cuts must still be made in government spending, including Medicare and Social Security. And states and localities also need to follow suit, raising taxes and cutting services.

It is a grim future we face, but if we refuse to take our medicine now, we are basically agreeing to transform the US into a third world nation. This is not a partisan issue, IMO.

It's a national tragedy.



How hard is it. If 25% is the number, you cut all government spending 25% . That is all government salaries. All government pensions. All government programs. NO sacred cows.

If income tax is 25% then EVERYONE pays it. NO exception and no deductions.


 
Eliminating deductions moves us in that direction, syrenn. I don't think we'll ever have a flat tax as the lobbyists would have nothing to fiddle with if we did, but o well.

More importantly, the message is this: most pundits believe that to replace the US government's current revenues from income taxes on individuals, we'd need a flat tax rate of about 14%. Assuming that's correct, what these researchers are saying is that the level of taxes must rise.....say to the 20% point. Mebbe even 25%. And that despite this, deep cuts must still be made in government spending, including Medicare and Social Security. And states and localities also need to follow suit, raising taxes and cutting services.

It is a grim future we face, but if we refuse to take our medicine now, we are basically agreeing to transform the US into a third world nation. This is not a partisan issue, IMO.

It's a national tragedy.



How hard is it. If 25% is the number, you cut all government spending 25% . That is all government salaries. All government pensions. All government programs. NO sacred cows.

If income tax is 25% then EVERYONE pays it. NO exception and no deductions.



Are you saying I had kids for nothing?:(
 
Eliminating deductions moves us in that direction, syrenn. I don't think we'll ever have a flat tax as the lobbyists would have nothing to fiddle with if we did, but o well.

More importantly, the message is this: most pundits believe that to replace the US government's current revenues from income taxes on individuals, we'd need a flat tax rate of about 14%. Assuming that's correct, what these researchers are saying is that the level of taxes must rise.....say to the 20% point. Mebbe even 25%. And that despite this, deep cuts must still be made in government spending, including Medicare and Social Security. And states and localities also need to follow suit, raising taxes and cutting services.

It is a grim future we face, but if we refuse to take our medicine now, we are basically agreeing to transform the US into a third world nation. This is not a partisan issue, IMO.

It's a national tragedy.


How hard is it. If 25% is the number, you cut all government spending 25% . That is all government salaries. All government pensions. All government programs. NO sacred cows.

If income tax is 25% then EVERYONE pays it. NO exception and no deductions.


There is no way to avoid increasing taxes by cutting government spending, syrenn. Far too much is already committed to servicing the national debt. It will be possible to soften the blow to a degree by such measures.....but still, we are in for a shock.
 
Eliminating deductions moves us in that direction, syrenn. I don't think we'll ever have a flat tax as the lobbyists would have nothing to fiddle with if we did, but o well.

More importantly, the message is this: most pundits believe that to replace the US government's current revenues from income taxes on individuals, we'd need a flat tax rate of about 14%. Assuming that's correct, what these researchers are saying is that the level of taxes must rise.....say to the 20% point. Mebbe even 25%. And that despite this, deep cuts must still be made in government spending, including Medicare and Social Security. And states and localities also need to follow suit, raising taxes and cutting services.

It is a grim future we face, but if we refuse to take our medicine now, we are basically agreeing to transform the US into a third world nation. This is not a partisan issue, IMO.

It's a national tragedy.



How hard is it. If 25% is the number, you cut all government spending 25% . That is all government salaries. All government pensions. All government programs. NO sacred cows.

If income tax is 25% then EVERYONE pays it. NO exception and no deductions.



Are you saying I had kids for nothing?:(

Hopefully you will still like them even if they don't yield a deduction, Samson.
 
A more rational approach than the one promoted by Maddy:

The goals of an ideal economic-growth agenda are simple and well known: a large and thriving private sector and a small government; reduced government spending, which means lower taxes (or at least not higher ones) and smaller deficits; open trade and investment; taxes and regulations that don’t distort decisions, discourage capital formation or work, or provide rents to the politically powerful; deep and flexible labor markets; a reformed financial sector that channels savings to where they can do the most good; a society in which education and innovation flourish, and the most talented people in the world want to become Americans; a stable, low-regulation legal environment, in which monetary policy is sound and business decisions issue from customers and competitors rather than regulators and judges....

Thus Does the Economy Grow - Keith Hennessey - National Review Online


Advocating for Higher Taxes to reduce the deficit is just a smoke screen to expand Government Control.
 
Or government spending must decrease drastically. I'm personally in favor of that option.
 
Eliminating deductions moves us in that direction, syrenn. I don't think we'll ever have a flat tax as the lobbyists would have nothing to fiddle with if we did, but o well.

More importantly, the message is this: most pundits believe that to replace the US government's current revenues from income taxes on individuals, we'd need a flat tax rate of about 14%. Assuming that's correct, what these researchers are saying is that the level of taxes must rise.....say to the 20% point. Mebbe even 25%. And that despite this, deep cuts must still be made in government spending, including Medicare and Social Security. And states and localities also need to follow suit, raising taxes and cutting services.

It is a grim future we face, but if we refuse to take our medicine now, we are basically agreeing to transform the US into a third world nation. This is not a partisan issue, IMO.

It's a national tragedy.


How hard is it. If 25% is the number, you cut all government spending 25% . That is all government salaries. All government pensions. All government programs. NO sacred cows.

If income tax is 25% then EVERYONE pays it. NO exception and no deductions.


There is no way to avoid increasing taxes by cutting government spending, syrenn. Far too much is already committed to servicing the national debt. It will be possible to soften the blow to a degree by such measures.....but still, we are in for a shock.


If they want the public to bleed, then the government can bleed the very same. Tough shit about what is committed, service's will get a 25% less money. If they want all of us to do with 25% less..so can they. See how that works? Don't you think my 25% is already committed. Ist your 25% committed?
 
How hard is it. If 25% is the number, you cut all government spending 25% . That is all government salaries. All government pensions. All government programs. NO sacred cows.

If income tax is 25% then EVERYONE pays it. NO exception and no deductions.



Are you saying I had kids for nothing?:(

Hopefully you will still like them even if they don't yield a deduction, Samson.

:eusa_eh:




:eusa_eh:





:eusa_eh:





:hellno:
 
WASHINGTON -- Just in time to dash holiday cheer, recently unveiled debt-reduction plans underscore how huge are the fiscal challenges facing the U.S. They also make clear how tough the tradeoffs must be to tame federal budget deficits and the national debt.

Major overhauls of the entire U.S. tax code are at the heart of all these plans. They'd eliminate popular deductions and radically change taxation across the board.

The most influential panel is the National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform. Earlier this month, the panel's co-chairmen -- Democrat Erskine Bowles and Republican Alan Simpson -- released their preliminary report on how to bring down deficits and debt. It sent shock waves rumbling nationwide.

"We can't grow ourselves out of this problem. We can't tax our way out of it," Bowles told PBS' Charlie Rose Tuesday. "People who want to do just taxes, you'd have to raise the maximum marginal rates to 80 percent. You'd have to raise the corporate rate to 70 percent. You'd have to raise the capital gains rate to 50 percent if you're just going to do taxes.

"We can't cut our way out of it. People say, 'Oh, well, let's just cut the budget.' If you just rely on deficit reduction through cutting, and you want to exclude Social Security, Medicare and defense and of course interest, then you'd have to cut everything else by about 60 to 65 percent. You can't do that, either," Bowles said.

"What we've got to do is some combination. Alan and I have come out with a plan that's balanced that takes $4 trillion out of the deficit over the next 10 years. I think that's the kind of thing we have to do. And if we don't, the markets are going to force us to."

Driving all the plans is this cruel reality: The federal deficit is projected at $1.3 trillion this year, almost as much as last year -- a scale not seen since the end of World War II. Left untamed, experts insist, this monstrous debt threatens the nation's future prosperity and security. Simply paying interest on the nearly $14 trillion national debt will cost more than $1 trillion in 2020 -- 17 percent of all federal spending -- unless big changes are made.

Debt-cutting plans share this: Taxes will go up for everyone | cleveland.com

There are some hard choices ahead, folks. Best find your Big Girl Panties and Big Boy Underoos and face facts.

Those of you who are married to the idea that the deficit must be reduced but that your slice of the federal spending pie should not be touched, I find you to be unpatriotic and selfish. IMO, almost all of us should bear this burden, and no one's cow is sacred.

Your thoughts?

How much of your retirement money do you plan to kick in?
 
asterism wrote:

How much of your retirement money do you plan to kick in?

I expect to lose my medical benefits and to have my cash benefit cut. Hopefully not too deeply. I have been expecting this, as I knew the numbers were unsustainable.

I am living lean and can cut back, won't have to give up my home, etc.

Any other nosey personal questions?
 
asterism wrote:

How much of your retirement money do you plan to kick in?

I expect to lose my medical benefits and to have my cash benefit cut. Hopefully not too deeply. I have been expecting this, as I knew the numbers were unsustainable.

I am living lean and can cut back, won't have to give up my home, etc.

Any other nosey personal questions?

Yes. Spending more money for your healthcare isn't what you are demanding the rest of us do. How much cash are you planning to give the federal government since you say that if I don't give more cash than I already am I'm "unpatriotic?" How patriotic are you?
 

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