US Pres Will Have the Right To Shut Down Internet

[Charles_Main]

Both Cable companies and the companies that provide DSL commonly send their signals over satellite at some point in the chain.

No they don't.

Um yes they do. My Local cable company connects to its own network and others via a satellite dish, not cables running all over the world lol.

Drive down to your local Cable company and look at the massive dish or dishes there.

So the signal travels by Cable locally but world wide connections are usually made over satellite from your local cable company to its home office or another. At least that is what I always assumed. I mean do you really think when your computer is connecting to a server in say China that it is by Wire the whole way? I am pretty sure it is jumped over the pond via Satellite.

 

[Kalam]

Both Cable companies and the companies that provide DSL commonly send their signals over satellite at some point in the chain.

No they don't.

Um yes they do. My Local cable company connects to its own network and others via a satellite dish, not cables running all over the world lol.

Drive down to your local Cable company and look at the massive dish or dishes there.

So the signal travels by Cable locally but world wide connections are usually made over satellite from your local cable company to its home office or another. At least that is what I always assumed. I mean do you really think when your computer is connecting to a server in say China that it is by Wire the whole way? I am pretty sure it is jumped over the pond via Satellite.

Nope, data is transmitted via undersea cables and I'm fairly certain that this accounts for the majority of intercontinental connections. Satellite is more expensive and less reliable in many cases. The scale of cable networks is sort of mind-boggling but yeah, they're truly global. I'd give you a link or something, but I'm posting this from my phone.

 

[MaggieMae]

How fucking stupid do you have to be to think that it's possible to "shut down the internet"?

Some of us might benefit from reading up on what "the internet" actually is before heading for the hills.

Oh I don't know, Internet Explorer seems to be able to magically do it with no problem.

Seriously, why wouldn't it be as simple as cutting satellite communication by and/or to all servers? Isn't that what China does?

Because the overwhelming majority of internet connections don't use satellites, and cutting all satellite communications in a country can't be a simple matter anyway. China is somewhat able to filter the information that their internet users can access because all of their ISPs are state-owned. This doesn't really stop anyone from circumventing their blocks, though. It's impossible for America to "shut down the internet" because doing so would require complete control over countless millions of private and foreign computer networks and the various types of infrastructure that connect them. This is scaremongering. Extremely lame and ignorant scaremongering.

It's hardly lame and ignorant. THIS scares me a helluva lot more than any attempt to shut down the Internet.

The Enemy Within - Magazine - The Atlantic

 

[MaggieMae]

Both Cable companies and the companies that provide DSL commonly send their signals over satellite at some point in the chain.

No they don't. DSL uses telephone lines and cable internet uses the same infrastructure as cable tv... terrestrial lines and signals from terrestrial antennae. This is all off the top of my head but I see no reason why either type of connection would need to involve a satellite.

So, it would actually be easier to shut down those. Frankly, if this ever came to pass because of a genuine cyber threat, I believe that there will be 100% cooperation by the servers. I think they would rather preserve their technology than risk having to reconstruct the whole thing and start all over if a worm were able to completely obliterate the networks.

 

[MaggieMae]

No they don't.

Um yes they do. My Local cable company connects to its own network and others via a satellite dish, not cables running all over the world lol.

Drive down to your local Cable company and look at the massive dish or dishes there.

So the signal travels by Cable locally but world wide connections are usually made over satellite from your local cable company to its home office or another. At least that is what I always assumed. I mean do you really think when your computer is connecting to a server in say China that it is by Wire the whole way? I am pretty sure it is jumped over the pond via Satellite.

Nope, data is transmitted via undersea cables and I'm fairly certain that this accounts for the majority of intercontinental connections. Satellite is more expensive and less reliable in many cases. The scale of cable networks is sort of mind-boggling but yeah, they're truly global. I'd give you a link or something, but I'm posting this from my phone.

Now I know you're wrong in your assumptions. Satellite is much less expensive than cable. I have Dish Network, receive 35 more channels for $20 a month less than I did with Comcast. AND, it is far, FAR more reliable. My cable was always going out; the only time my Dish goes out is during a heavy snow storm and that's only at the very most for about an hour asa it searches for another signal. Only God knows why Comcast just decides to go down all the time. Maybe some big fishies get hung up on the cable.

 

[Kalam]

Now I know you're wrong in your assumptions. Satellite is much less expensive than cable.

Are you really arguing that transmitting data via satellite isn't more expensive and less reliable than cable in many cases? If so, you're incorrect.

 

[Kalam]

So, it would actually be easier to shut down those.

What are you talking about? Even if it were possible, do you realize how absurdly long it would take for the government to seize all of that infrastructure?

 

[MaggieMae]

Now I know you're wrong in your assumptions. Satellite is much less expensive than cable.

Are you really arguing that transmitting data via satellite isn't more expensive and less reliable than cable in many cases? If so, you're incorrect.

I can only relate from my personal experience. The answer is yes, much less by satellite (either Dish Network or Direct TV). AND, one of the reasons I switched from cable is that Comcast kept raising its rate. When my bill increased for the third time in a year, I had had it with them. I've had Dish Network for nearly three years, and they raised their rate just once, and that was a whopping $1.00 additional charge for the FREE DVR I was given on signing. It went from $5.00 a month to $6.00.

 

[MaggieMae]

So, it would actually be easier to shut down those.

What are you talking about? Even if it were possible, do you realize how absurdly long it would take for the government to seize all of that infrastructure?

I have no idea how or how long it would take. But as I said, in the case of a breach that creates a severe national security threat, my guess is nothing would need to be "seized" at all.

My biggest concern is not how, but why people are so nonchalant about the possibility that it would be necessary at all.

 

[Kalam]

Now I know you're wrong in your assumptions. Satellite is much less expensive than cable.

Are you really arguing that transmitting data via satellite isn't more expensive and less reliable than cable in many cases? If so, you're incorrect.

I can only relate from my personal experience.

Believe it or not, meteorological conditions and ease of access to cable infrastructure vary depending on where you live...

 

[Kalam]

I have no idea how or how long it would take. But as I said, in the case of a breach that creates a severe national security threat, my guess is nothing would need to be "seized" at all.

Let's make this simple. The government wants to "shut down the internet." How, in your mind, do they do this?

 

[MaggieMae]

Are you really arguing that transmitting data via satellite isn't more expensive and less reliable than cable in many cases? If so, you're incorrect.

I can only relate from my personal experience.

Believe it or not, meteorological conditions and ease of access to cable infrastructure vary depending on where you live...

Both Dish Network and Comcast post their rates online, so you could always check out the difference yourself. Neither says anything about what part of the country you live in regarding accessibility and/or rates.

 

[SFC Ollie]

Now I know you're wrong in your assumptions. Satellite is much less expensive than cable.

Are you really arguing that transmitting data via satellite isn't more expensive and less reliable than cable in many cases? If so, you're incorrect.

I can only relate from my personal experience. The answer is yes, much less by satellite (either Dish Network or Direct TV). AND, one of the reasons I switched from cable is that Comcast kept raising its rate. When my bill increased for the third time in a year, I had had it with them. I've had Dish Network for nearly three years, and they raised their rate just once, and that was a whopping $1.00 additional charge for the FREE DVR I was given on signing. It went from $5.00 a month to $6.00.

OK, I get to use my time in service here. 22 years in the US Army Signal Corps, I ran more miles of cable than most people have walked. I have operated line of site radio systems, multiple encrypted radio systems, Satellite systems all over the world, and even a cellular network. (among other things)

Satellite beats cable hands down for reliability, and most communications that are going long distance these days goes through some satellite link up somewhere. To think everything goes by hard wire is just so 1980ish.

 

[Kalam]

I can only relate from my personal experience.

Believe it or not, meteorological conditions and ease of access to cable infrastructure vary depending on where you live...

Both Dish Network and Comcast post their rates online, so you could always check out the difference yourself. Neither says anything about what part of the country you live in regarding accessibility and/or rates.

Subscription rates aren't really the best indicator of reliability or availability, especially since the services offered by both companies differ considerably in other ways.

 

[Kalam]

Satellite beats cable hands down for reliability

As long as you have a clear view of the sky, correct? Are satellite communications more reliable in part of the world that are especially storm-prone, for instance?

 

[SFC Ollie]

I can remember one instance in the late 80's where the first 2 people into a certain nameless area were two of my troops carrying a manpack satellite. They had Communications established with Corps Rear at Ft Bragg 30 minutes before ground troops hit the ground. Yes Satellite is reliable in almost every part of the world with the exception of the poles. And the old East-Pac bird. that damned thing should have fallen from the sky decades ago.

 

[RadiomanATL]

Fine line here, We have to have some way to shut it down in the event of a major Cyber attack, and that way can't be slow so it has to be the President I think. I just hope it is never abused, but imagine how bad it could be if we had a concerted Major attack and could not shut the damn thing down.

Yeah, cause ICBM's might start to suddenly fly out of our monitors!

They're death traps I tell ya!

 

[MaggieMae]

Believe it or not, meteorological conditions and ease of access to cable infrastructure vary depending on where you live...

Both Dish Network and Comcast post their rates online, so you could always check out the difference yourself. Neither says anything about what part of the country you live in regarding accessibility and/or rates.

Subscription rates aren't really the best indicator of reliability or availability, especially since the services offered by both companies differ considerably in other ways.

Indeed they do. That's why I chose satellite over cable.

 

[MaggieMae]

Satellite beats cable hands down for reliability

As long as you have a clear view of the sky, correct? Are satellite communications more reliable in part of the world that are especially storm-prone, for instance?

Comcast went down when there was good weather! I've already said that my dish will go down during a snowstorm, but when that happens, the system automatically looks for a better signal (angle), and it usually succeeds in less than an hour. You can watch it run through the process on screen. In more remote wooded areas, the dish has to sometimes be placed in a weird place, like on a fencepost, because of the trees. It's up to the installer to find the right direction, and there's no extra charge for his time to locate one. Also, some apartment complexes use the large "commercial" dish and tie all the residents into the one. In my opinion, the difference is tantamount to broadband vs. dialup.

 

[MaggieMae]

Fine line here, We have to have some way to shut it down in the event of a major Cyber attack, and that way can't be slow so it has to be the President I think. I just hope it is never abused, but imagine how bad it could be if we had a concerted Major attack and could not shut the damn thing down.

Yeah, cause ICBM's might start to suddenly fly out of our monitors!

They're death traps I tell ya!

I think the reason would be overload, by everyone yaking to their friends and contacts, going on message boards and blogs, to talk about the cyber attack. Do we really know what would happen if everyone who owns a computer suddenly went online all at once? Do you want to find out? I don't.