US Manufacturing Strong?

[GHook93]

Best article I have read in a long time about US manufacturing! Why most people think US manufacturing is dead is because of the "Wal-Mart Factor," something I am personally guilty of many times myself. But read this article and you will see we are still the manufacturing kings. I still think more things need to be done to increase manufacturing stateside, such as the fair tax, but things aren't as bleak as they appear or as Sealybobo who nevertheless state in this thread. In fact if we did what many of the left state and shift to protectionism then we would be hit hard by it.

I'm I blind that the manufacturing sector in America has taken a hit. No! However, the manufacturing sector worldwide has taken a huge hit because of the world recession, including China.

The myth of US industry's demise - MSN Money

Key Highlights of the Article
Here is the perception:

Despite headlines about low-wage workers in China and our factory jobs going to India -- which has happened in a lot of industries -- the U.S. is still far and away the biggest manufacturer in the world.

The largest world producer is American over 1/5 of the worlds goods are produced here. That is a heck of a lot larger than China who is a little over 1/10, which another high wage country, Japan, right on their backs (funny how the 2 countries economies we built up after WW II are 3 and 4 respectfully on the list.

U.S. workers produce 21% of all factory goods made globally, or about $1.7 trillion worth per year. That's significantly lower than the peak of 28% in 1985 but only slightly below the long-term average of 23% for 1970 through 2006.

China, the second-biggest global producer, doesn't even come close. It makes just 13% of the world's stuff, or $1 trillion worth. Japan is next with 11%. And Germany, the vaunted workshop of Europe, comes in fourth with a paltry 7.4%

Where Chinese manufacturing growth has come from!

China, the hottest contender for factory jobs, has been grabbing jobs from other Asian countries for the most part and not from the United States, says economist David Huether of the National Association of Manufacturers. So the U.S. lead over China in factory jobs may not have changed much since 2006.

Here's other evidence of the strength of the U.S. manufacturing base:

(1) During the previous economic boom, manufacturing contributed more to U.S. growth than any other sector, Huether says.
(2) Though lots of factory workers have lost their jobs in the recession, U.S. manufacturing still employed 12.1 million people as of the end of April.
(2) Factory workers' daily toil contributed to 11.5% of the United States' product last year.
(3) Many U.S. factory employees are big earners, which lets them consume more, contributing more to growth. They made an average of $71,000 in 2007, counting wages and benefits, or 20% more than the average of all other workers combined. States with the most factory jobs are California, Texas and New York.

Yep there are some cold hard realities we need to embrace also!

To be sure, this recession hasn't been easy on manufacturers or their workers. Hours have been cut and workers furloughed. Since December 2007, 1.6 million out of the 5.7 million job losses in the U.S. have been in manufacturing. But the big picture isn't all bleak

If the U.S. is still the world's greatest producer, why do so many people have a different perception?

Let's call it the Wal-Mart (WMT, news, msgs) effect. Most people do their "research" on the U.S. manufacturing base by turning over the tags on the stuff they buy. They naturally notice that most clothing and toys at retailers such as Wal-Mart come from abroad -- because those are two of the industries where production has moved abroad, in a big way.

The Key Behind US Manufacturing Strengthen

The catch here is that most of what's made in the U.S. is purchased by companies, not consumers. So unless consumers also happen to work as buyers at companies, they miss the fact that machinery, chemicals, fabricated metals and other sophisticated products are still manufactured in the U.S.

Why do so many U.S. companies still make so much stuff on their home turf when cheap labor beckons abroad? The 3 advantage of being state side!

The rationale offered by General Electric (GE, news, msgs) and boat maker Brunswick (BC, news, msgs) -- two companies on IndustryWeek's top 500 U.S. manufacturers list -- are typical.

(1) They say the highly motivated and well-trained U.S. work force is well worth the "extra" labor cost.

"Frankly, what we make is not that easy to produce," says Brunswick spokesman Dan Kubera. "A lot of science and art goes into it. So obviously we have to have workers who know what they are doing."

(2) Plus shipping long distances is not always that convenient. Large U.S. manufacturers such as Hershey (HSY, news, msgs), which sells most of its sweets in the U.S., prefer to produce close to their biggest consumers. This helps them keep shipping costs and energy use down, maintain freshness and fill orders quickly.

(3) Here's a third big advantage: Because of their skills and ability to learn how to use complex production equipment so often found in factories now, U.S. workers may not be as "expensive" as they seem. They remain by far the most productive in the world.

I by no means say that our manufacturing sector is not in trouble and the US government should not do something to strenghten it. I also don't think we should just concede small manufacturing goods to China, India and Mexico. Rather I think we need to create incentives like relaxing counter-productive regulations, reducing the corporate tax, reducing the payroll tax, reducing taxes in general (actually I in favor of elimating the corporate, income, payroll and capital gains tax and replacing it with the fair tax) etc. However things are not as bad as they seem!

 

[GHook93]

10 big companies that haven't quit on the US - MSN Money - Slide Show

Note: that all these companies are global leaders in their industries. THE GLOBAL LEADER!

(1) GE
(2) Brunswick - Boats
(3) Harley - Motorcycles
(4) Boeing - Airplanes
(5) Dow - Chemicals
(6) Caterpillar - Heavy Machinery
(7) Hershey - Chocolate
(8) Pfizer - Pharmeuticals
(9) US Steel
(10) Fender - Musical Instruments

 

[GHook93]

Why does a thread like this filled with facts get ignored by the libs who scream hysteria!

 

[sealybobo]

How come the trade imbalance then?

Despite headlines about low-wage workers in China and our factory jobs going to India -- which has happened in a lot of industries -- the U.S. is still far and away the biggest manufacturer in the world.

How come we went from the largest creditor nation to the largest debtor nation?

I am calling BS on this story.

I think you might be fudging the numbers. For example, if Ford sales in Europe count, then those jobs are not in America.

What about all the people in the Big 3 who lost their jobs? And all the suppliers?

 

[sealybobo]

10 big companies that haven't quit on the US - MSN Money - Slide Show

Note: that all these companies are global leaders in their industries. THE GLOBAL LEADER!

(1) GE
(2) Brunswick - Boats
(3) Harley - Motorcycles
(4) Boeing - Airplanes
(5) Dow - Chemicals
(6) Caterpillar - Heavy Machinery
(7) Hershey - Chocolate
(8) Pfizer - Pharmeuticals
(9) US Steel
(10) Fender - Musical Instruments

The recession is taking a harsh toll on corporate America as companies continue to scale down their operations and lay off workers in response to reduced profits.

Harley-Davidson on Friday became the latest U.S. corporate icon to announce lower profits and job cuts. The Milwaukee, Wis.-based motorcycle manufacturer said it will reduce its operations and cut 1,100 jobs over the next two years, though 70 percent of the layoffs are expected this year.

On Tuesday, IBM reported a 12 percent increase in earnings for the fourth quarter of 2008 compared with the same period in 2007. But the next day, the company began to lay off workers in what union officials estimate will amount to 2,900 job cuts.

General Electric announced Friday that fourth-quarter earnings fell 46 percent. Chairman and Chief Executive Officer Jeff Immelt said that he expects 2009 to be "extremely difficult" for the company.

Are GE's products made in the USA?

Harley-Davidson Sets Layoffs; GE Profits Plunge : NPR

Do you know what? This article stinks just like back in 2005 when you guys were saying the economy was great!!

Fuck this article. It defies all logic. Again, I call BS on this. Of course they have some jobs in America still. Do they have enough? Are they laying peopel off? Are they cutting wages?

 

[sealybobo]

To be sure, this recession hasn't been easy on manufacturers or their workers. Hours have been cut and workers furloughed. Since December 2007, 1.6 million out of the 5.7 million job losses in the U.S. have been in manufacturing. But the big picture isn't all bleak??

No, because the corporations can renig on pensions and cut wages. Its called disaster capitalism.

What became of the 1.6 million people who already lost their jobs?

Are they the last to lose their jobs or are more to come?

Why isn't the big picture bleak? What is the silver lining? When are wages going to go up? I thought Obama was going to bankrupt the economy? Now you say things are going ok? Wow!! 180!!!

 

[sealybobo]

States with the most factory jobs are California, Texas and New York

- Big export categories ($1.3 trillion last year) are heavy-construction equipment, turbines, locomotives, nuclear reactors, aircraft and aerospace equipment.

News of the U.S.’s Demise May Be Premature

How many people do these companies employ and how well do they pay?

And so should we continue to send more jobs out? Have we gone too far yet?

I say we have. Just look at unemployment and wages.

And you can't say companies aren't unfairly cutting our wages because otherwise, corporations would have shared some of the profits they made in 2005. Instead:

Workers' Wages Down, Corporate Profits Up

Political Affairs Magazine - Workers' Wages Down, Corporate Profits Up

 

[RodISHI]

10 big companies that haven't quit on the US - MSN Money - Slide Show

Note: that all these companies are global leaders in their industries. THE GLOBAL LEADER!

(1) GE
(2) Brunswick - Boats
(3) Harley - Motorcycles
(4) Boeing - Airplanes
(5) Dow - Chemicals
(6) Caterpillar - Heavy Machinery
(7) Hershey - Chocolate
(8) Pfizer - Pharmeuticals
(9) US Steel
(10) Fender - Musical Instruments

This does not account for companies like Maytag which closed it's doors here in Iowa after it was bought out by Whirlpool who in turn is shipping the jobs over to China. Or Siemans who closed their factory in Iowa moving south and then closing their southern plants also to send the work overseas. Or the sewing factory here who just in the last few months sold the clothing factory to an overseas entity leaving this local town near where we live with no factory jobs. Ten companies mean nothing to the millions who have lost their jobs in the last few years to companies taking the work out of this country. Ten companies do not make up for the thousands of other companies that have closed their doors here in the USA while corporates and politicians give away these people of this country the freedom of choice to sell, buy, work and live here in the USA with goods manufactured here in the USA. The stripping of the nations wealth for a few to profit is not reasonable nor can just a few companies sustain the freedoms our parents and their parents and their parents parents worked and died for.

 

[sealybobo]

10 big companies that haven't quit on the US - MSN Money - Slide Show

Note: that all these companies are global leaders in their industries. THE GLOBAL LEADER!

(1) GE
(2) Brunswick - Boats
(3) Harley - Motorcycles
(4) Boeing - Airplanes
(5) Dow - Chemicals
(6) Caterpillar - Heavy Machinery
(7) Hershey - Chocolate
(8) Pfizer - Pharmeuticals
(9) US Steel
(10) Fender - Musical Instruments

This does not account for companies like Maytag which closed it's doors here in Iowa after it was bought out by Whirlpool who in turn is shipping the jobs over to China. Or Siemans who closed their factory in Iowa moving south and then closing their southern plants also to send the work overseas. Or the sewing factory here who just in the last few months sold the clothing factory to an overseas entity leaving this local town near where we live with no factory jobs. Ten companies mean nothing to the millions who have lost their jobs in the last few years to companies taking the work out of this country. Ten companies do not make up for the thousands of other companies that have closed their doors here in the USA while corporates and politicians give away these people of this country the freedom of choice to sell, buy, work and live here in the USA with goods manufactured here in the USA. The stripping of the nations wealth for a few to profit is not reasonable nor can just a few companies sustain the freedoms our parents and their parents and their parents parents worked and died for.

It should say the 10 companies who haven't COMPLETELY given up on the usa YET.

And the funny thing is, all these companies have cut wages or sent jobs overseas.

Harley can't. That's their thing. They are American made.

And are these right wingers suggesting our steele industry isn't in trouble?

As recession spreads across the world, steel prices are falling and throwing the iron and steel industry, which is critical to global infrastructure of all kinds, off balance. As the industry struggles, geopolitical challenges will arise for the states that depend on it most heavily.

Free Article for Non-Members | STRATFOR

I don't want to have to post a link to everything I say, especially when the righties don't give links for any of their bullshit.

Or they find this one article that has maybe 100 holes in its story.

 

[GHook93]

How come the trade imbalance then?

Despite headlines about low-wage workers in China and our factory jobs going to India -- which has happened in a lot of industries -- the U.S. is still far and away the biggest manufacturer in the world.

How come we went from the largest creditor nation to the largest debtor nation?

I am calling BS on this story.

I think you might be fudging the numbers. For example, if Ford sales in Europe count, then those jobs are not in America.

What about all the people in the Big 3 who lost their jobs? And all the suppliers?

Oil contributes huge to the trade deficit, but as a liberal you ignore that. We still consume more than any other country so that could be it also.

But don't deny the fact hard numbers in the story, even through I know you are good at that sort of thing!

Ford sales in Europe don't count, since this is products made stateside.

 

[GHook93]

10 big companies that haven't quit on the US - MSN Money - Slide Show

Note: that all these companies are global leaders in their industries. THE GLOBAL LEADER!

(1) GE
(2) Brunswick - Boats
(3) Harley - Motorcycles
(4) Boeing - Airplanes
(5) Dow - Chemicals
(6) Caterpillar - Heavy Machinery
(7) Hershey - Chocolate
(8) Pfizer - Pharmeuticals
(9) US Steel
(10) Fender - Musical Instruments

The recession is taking a harsh toll on corporate America as companies continue to scale down their operations and lay off workers in response to reduced profits.

Harley-Davidson on Friday became the latest U.S. corporate icon to announce lower profits and job cuts. The Milwaukee, Wis.-based motorcycle manufacturer said it will reduce its operations and cut 1,100 jobs over the next two years, though 70 percent of the layoffs are expected this year.

On Tuesday, IBM reported a 12 percent increase in earnings for the fourth quarter of 2008 compared with the same period in 2007. But the next day, the company began to lay off workers in what union officials estimate will amount to 2,900 job cuts.

General Electric announced Friday that fourth-quarter earnings fell 46 percent. Chairman and Chief Executive Officer Jeff Immelt said that he expects 2009 to be "extremely difficult" for the company.

Are GE's products made in the USA?

Harley-Davidson Sets Layoffs; GE Profits Plunge : NPR

Do you know what? This article stinks just like back in 2005 when you guys were saying the economy was great!!

Fuck this article. It defies all logic. Again, I call BS on this. Of course they have some jobs in America still. Do they have enough? Are they laying peopel off? Are they cutting wages?

No one says the recession is hurting every sector of America! You would have to be blind to not see that. However, the recession has hit every sector of the global including China!

 

[RodISHI]

It should say the 10 companies who haven't COMPLETELY given up on the usa YET.

And the funny thing is, all these companies have cut wages or sent jobs overseas.

Harley can't. That's their thing. They are American made.

And are these right wingers suggesting our steele industry isn't in trouble?

As recession spreads across the world, steel prices are falling and throwing the iron and steel industry, which is critical to global infrastructure of all kinds, off balance. As the industry struggles, geopolitical challenges will arise for the states that depend on it most heavily.

Free Article for Non-Members | STRATFOR

I don't want to have to post a link to everything I say, especially when the righties don't give links for any of their bullshit.

Or they find this one article that has maybe 100 holes in its story.

Maybe the leftwingers should quit being sellouts. You tell'm sealy.

 

[GHook93]

To be sure, this recession hasn't been easy on manufacturers or their workers. Hours have been cut and workers furloughed. Since December 2007, 1.6 million out of the 5.7 million job losses in the U.S. have been in manufacturing. But the big picture isn't all bleak??

No, because the corporations can renig on pensions and cut wages. Its called disaster capitalism.

What became of the 1.6 million people who already lost their jobs?

Are they the last to lose their jobs or are more to come?

Why isn't the big picture bleak? What is the silver lining? When are wages going to go up? I thought Obama was going to bankrupt the economy? Now you say things are going ok? Wow!! 180!!!

Who said things are OK! I think things are horrible and are going to get worse with increasing he burden on business in America by Comrade Obama. I hear from the socialist on this board arguing US manufacturing is gone now is time to end free trade and increase protectionism. This article points out that we definitely have problems with the manufacturing sector, but its not a bleak as many people think!

 

[sealybobo]

How come the trade imbalance then?

Despite headlines about low-wage workers in China and our factory jobs going to India -- which has happened in a lot of industries -- the U.S. is still far and away the biggest manufacturer in the world.

How come we went from the largest creditor nation to the largest debtor nation?

I am calling BS on this story.

I think you might be fudging the numbers. For example, if Ford sales in Europe count, then those jobs are not in America.

What about all the people in the Big 3 who lost their jobs? And all the suppliers?

Oil contributes huge to the trade deficit, but as a liberal you ignore that. We still consume more than any other country so that could be it also.

But don't deny the fact hard numbers in the story, even through I know you are good at that sort of thing!

Ford sales in Europe don't count, since this is products made stateside.

Ford Europe is manufactured in Europe. I bet they count that because Ford gets the profits and those profits come home. Does very little for the rest of us if they are counting that. And you can't say for sure they are or are not.

Just like Bush fudged the numbers when he said wages were up. I knew that was a lie, now I have proof.

Reports: Real wages stagnant as corporate profits soar

Reports: Real wages stagnant as corporate profits soar | Oakland Tribune | Find Articles at BNET

Political Affairs Magazine - Workers' Wages Down, Corporate Profits Up

I think Bush was counting Blackwater jobs in Iraq and CEO pay. How else can you explain making up the losses in auto manufacturing? Show me wages were up in 2005, or are you now going to deny ever saying that?

And as for oil. Oil doesn't employ a lot of people. Oil is owned by the same robber barons that own our banks. They made record profits the last 8 years. Look at how much that has helped our economy. NOT!!!

 

[sealybobo]

To be sure, this recession hasn't been easy on manufacturers or their workers. Hours have been cut and workers furloughed. Since December 2007, 1.6 million out of the 5.7 million job losses in the U.S. have been in manufacturing. But the big picture isn't all bleak??

No, because the corporations can renig on pensions and cut wages. Its called disaster capitalism.

What became of the 1.6 million people who already lost their jobs?

Are they the last to lose their jobs or are more to come?

Why isn't the big picture bleak? What is the silver lining? When are wages going to go up? I thought Obama was going to bankrupt the economy? Now you say things are going ok? Wow!! 180!!!

Who said things are OK! I think things are horrible and are going to get worse with increasing he burden on business in America by Comrade Obama. I hear from the socialist on this board arguing US manufacturing is gone now is time to end free trade and increase protectionism. This article points out that we definitely have problems with the manufacturing sector, but its not a bleak as many people think!

Not yet.

 

[sealybobo]

How come the trade imbalance then?

Despite headlines about low-wage workers in China and our factory jobs going to India -- which has happened in a lot of industries -- the U.S. is still far and away the biggest manufacturer in the world.

How come we went from the largest creditor nation to the largest debtor nation?

I am calling BS on this story.

I think you might be fudging the numbers. For example, if Ford sales in Europe count, then those jobs are not in America.

What about all the people in the Big 3 who lost their jobs? And all the suppliers?

Oil contributes huge to the trade deficit, but as a liberal you ignore that. We still consume more than any other country so that could be it also.

But don't deny the fact hard numbers in the story, even through I know you are good at that sort of thing!

Ford sales in Europe don't count, since this is products made stateside.

Rumor from the IBEW hall of fame is sounding out that the members have authorized a pay-cut, as was requested by acting Anchorage Mayor Claman. Just last week Mayor Claman requested such for union contracts that were most recently re-negotiated and saw a 3% increase in pay, with the request for reductions in efforts to forgo a possible deficit due the economic slowdown. Up north, many of the oil field workers have already endured a pay cut. They have no say in the matter as they have chosen not to have representation

Alaska Chinook: IBEW OK on Pay-cuts


PS. Phone companies are asking their employees to take pay cuts and comparing themselves to GM. The only difference is, the phone companies made profits last year.

I guess its ok because you aren't in the phone industry, right?

And you guys don't think one sector affects all the rest? or

 

[sealybobo]

Do right wingers understand the difference between GM jobs and Blackwater/Haloburton jobs?

Blackwater/Haloburton jobs are overpaid jobs that the government has to pay. It is how the GOP bankrupted the treasury.

GM makes a product and consumers purchase their products. No government necessary.

But then the GOP fucked up the auto industry, which employed a lot of people and didn't need government as a customer like the defense companies do.

This isn't free market. These are government welfare jobs and no bid contracts so we didn't even get the best deal. Cheney did though. Suckers!!!

And you didn't cry very loud about giving the bankers $750 billion but you are crazy over $30 billion for the Big 3? I see how it is.

 

[GHook93]

How come the trade imbalance then?

Despite headlines about low-wage workers in China and our factory jobs going to India -- which has happened in a lot of industries -- the U.S. is still far and away the biggest manufacturer in the world.

How come we went from the largest creditor nation to the largest debtor nation?

I am calling BS on this story.

I think you might be fudging the numbers. For example, if Ford sales in Europe count, then those jobs are not in America.

What about all the people in the Big 3 who lost their jobs? And all the suppliers?

Oil contributes huge to the trade deficit, but as a liberal you ignore that. We still consume more than any other country so that could be it also.

But don't deny the fact hard numbers in the story, even through I know you are good at that sort of thing!

Ford sales in Europe don't count, since this is products made stateside.

Ford Europe is manufactured in Europe. I bet they count that because Ford gets the profits and those profits come home. Does very little for the rest of us if they are counting that. And you can't say for sure they are or are not.

Just like Bush fudged the numbers when he said wages were up. I knew that was a lie, now I have proof.

Reports: Real wages stagnant as corporate profits soar

Reports: Real wages stagnant as corporate profits soar | Oakland Tribune | Find Articles at BNET

Political Affairs Magazine - Workers' Wages Down, Corporate Profits Up

I think Bush was counting Blackwater jobs in Iraq and CEO pay. How else can you explain making up the losses in auto manufacturing? Show me wages were up in 2005, or are you now going to deny ever saying that?

And as for oil. Oil doesn't employ a lot of people. Oil is owned by the same robber barons that own our banks. They made record profits the last 8 years. Look at how much that has helped our economy. NOT!!!

If you read the article you will see that is not the case! But nice try!

 

[chopcrazy]

How come the trade imbalance then?

Despite headlines about low-wage workers in China and our factory jobs going to India -- which has happened in a lot of industries -- the U.S. is still far and away the biggest manufacturer in the world.

How come we went from the largest creditor nation to the largest debtor nation?

I am calling BS on this story.

I think you might be fudging the numbers. For example, if Ford sales in Europe count, then those jobs are not in America.

What about all the people in the Big 3 who lost their jobs? And all the suppliers?

Oil contributes huge to the trade deficit, but as a liberal you ignore that. We still consume more than any other country so that could be it also.

But don't deny the fact hard numbers in the story, even through I know you are good at that sort of thing!

Ford sales in Europe don't count, since this is products made stateside.

Rumor from the IBEW hall of fame is sounding out that the members have authorized a pay-cut, as was requested by acting Anchorage Mayor Claman. Just last week Mayor Claman requested such for union contracts that were most recently re-negotiated and saw a 3% increase in pay, with the request for reductions in efforts to forgo a possible deficit due the economic slowdown. Up north, many of the oil field workers have already endured a pay cut. They have no say in the matter as they have chosen not to have representation

Alaska Chinook: IBEW OK on Pay-cuts


PS. Phone companies are asking their employees to take pay cuts and comparing themselves to GM. The only difference is, the phone companies made profits last year.

I guess its ok because you aren't in the phone industry, right?

And you guys don't think one sector affects all the rest? or

Nice redirection of the debate....which phone companies gave pay cuts? Are phone companies classified as manufacturing?

 

[cbi0090]

One reason China's manufacturing boom looks so impressive is that much of the profits made are not distributed as they are here in the U.S. or Europe. Most profits made by public corporations here go to shareholders which includes pension plans, insurance, retirement accounts, etc. This comes right off the bottom line for each individual company. In China it's very different. A lion's share goes right into a government account from every manufacturer and they've been able to accumulate several trillions as a result. The owners, generally a hand full of people, make their money as well, and have created a wealthy class as a result, but the government takes the most.
Now that China had this huge pot of money what were they going to do with it? Some is obviously going to defense, some into infrastructure, much more could go to health care, but a big portion was going to secure investments. Something where they could get steady future returns. Bingo! Amercian mortgages! How steady and secure can you get in this world! Traditionally, it just doesn't get better.
And so the first domino of our present financial crisis fell.