Universal Background Checks

[PaulS1950]

There is an old chinese proverb that translates roughly to:
If you tell a lie 33000 times it becomes the truth. The anti gunners are trying to find out if it really works.

If you want to protect your rights go to:
Ruger - Protect Your Rights
click on the "Take action now" link.

 

[The Rabbi]

It has to involve gun manufacturers and bans/restrictions on the types of guns they can produce and sell. The same with people who sell guns--certain types of guns cannot be sold legally in the US.

Then there have to be laws with severe penalties to owners who allow their guns to be used by family members and friends. If the shooter's mother in Sandy Hook had lived and such laws were on the books, she would have to serve a jail term for teaching her mentally unbalanced child about guns and allowing him to be around them so he could access them. She should have had them locked away in a storage building off the premesis. She might also (and others like her) be charged with manslaughter for allowing access and teaching him how to use a gun. No person under 18 should be able to handle or own a gun.

There are other things that could be done also. In Israel, background checks involve mental health checks and the applicant has to see a doctor and be certified okay to own a gun. Every three years a person has to re-apply and also have the mental health check again. Also, people who are approved can only own one gun. All ownership is for handguns only (for personal use). Only professionals are allowed to have rifles and other types of weapons.

And how would that have prevented the shooting? How would any of what you propose prevent criminals from getting and having guns?

It wouldn't.
Next.

 

[The Rabbi]

i'm not really sure what to think about this. on the one hand, it seems to make sense and would help decrease the chance of wackos or criminals purchasing 'legal' guns. however, i believe it will simply cause those people to use illicit methods to purchase guns. somewhat like how prohibition 'worked'.

also, why should we be required to have our personal information opened up to the government for exercising a constitutional right? you can have an abortion with utmost privacy, but, if you buy a gun, your personal information can be posted for all to see in some jurisdictions.

there are less restrictions to vote than buying a gun and i dare say, voting is vastly more important.

I think EVERY person in America should be required to carry one form of ID, that ID would confirm your residency status, your eligibility to drive, your eligibility to vote, your home address , your passport information , EVERYTHING.

Actually, I change that , no one should be REQUIRED to have it, but if you don't then you have access to nothing.

End of discussion.

"Your papers, please!"

No thanks, not going there.

 

[Star]

It has to involve gun manufacturers and bans/restrictions on the types of guns they can produce and sell. The same with people who sell guns--certain types of guns cannot be sold legally in the US.

Then there have to be laws with severe penalties to owners who allow their guns to be used by family members and friends. If the shooter's mother in Sandy Hook had lived and such laws were on the books, she would have to serve a jail term for teaching her mentally unbalanced child about guns and allowing him to be around them so he could access them. She should have had them locked away in a storage building off the premesis. She might also (and others like her) be charged with manslaughter for allowing access and teaching him how to use a gun. No person under 18 should be able to handle or own a gun.

There are other things that could be done also. In Israel, background checks involve mental health checks and the applicant has to see a doctor and be certified okay to own a gun. Every three years a person has to re-apply and also have the mental health check again. Also, people who are approved can only own one gun. All ownership is for handguns only (for personal use). Only professionals are allowed to have rifles and other types of weapons.

I don't think it is a statistical anomaly that states with the stiffest gun control laws also have the least gun deaths.


Twelve facts about guns and mass shootings in the United States

9. States with stricter gun control laws have fewer deaths from gun-related violence.

Last year, economist Richard Florida dove deep into the correlations between gun deaths and other kinds of social indicators. Some of what he found was, perhaps, unexpected: Higher populations, more stress, more immigrants, and more mental illness were not correlated with more deaths from gun violence. But one thing he found was, perhaps, perfectly predictable: States with tighter gun control laws appear to have fewer gun-related deaths. The disclaimer here is that correlation is not causation. But correlations can be suggestive:

​

“The map overlays the map of firearm deaths above with gun control restrictions by state,” explains Florida. “It highlights states which have one of three gun control restrictions in place – assault weapons’ bans, trigger locks, or safe storage requirements. Firearm deaths are significantly lower in states with stricter gun control legislation. Though the sample sizes are small, we find substantial negative correlations between firearm deaths and states that ban assault weapons (-.45), require trigger locks (-.42), and mandate safe storage requirements for guns (-.48).”
.

 

[The Rabbi]

I don't think it is a statistical anomaly that states with the stiffest gun control laws also have the least gun deaths.


]

I do. And it isn't true. As the authors caution, their sample is small. You could show anything that way.

Check gun deaths in 2 cities with very different demographics but identical gun laws: Memphis and Knoxville TN. The difference is culture, as always.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

It has to involve gun manufacturers and bans/restrictions on the types of guns they can produce and sell. The same with people who sell guns--certain types of guns cannot be sold legally in the US.

Then there have to be laws with severe penalties to owners who allow their guns to be used by family members and friends. If the shooter's mother in Sandy Hook had lived and such laws were on the books, she would have to serve a jail term for teaching her mentally unbalanced child about guns and allowing him to be around them so he could access them. She should have had them locked away in a storage building off the premesis. She might also (and others like her) be charged with manslaughter for allowing access and teaching him how to use a gun. No person under 18 should be able to handle or own a gun.

There are other things that could be done also. In Israel, background checks involve mental health checks and the applicant has to see a doctor and be certified okay to own a gun. Every three years a person has to re-apply and also have the mental health check again. Also, people who are approved can only own one gun. All ownership is for handguns only (for personal use). Only professionals are allowed to have rifles and other types of weapons.

I don't think it is a statistical anomaly that states with the stiffest gun control laws also have the least gun deaths.


Twelve facts about guns and mass shootings in the United States

9. States with stricter gun control laws have fewer deaths from gun-related violence.

Last year, economist Richard Florida dove deep into the correlations between gun deaths and other kinds of social indicators. Some of what he found was, perhaps, unexpected: Higher populations, more stress, more immigrants, and more mental illness were not correlated with more deaths from gun violence. But one thing he found was, perhaps, perfectly predictable: States with tighter gun control laws appear to have fewer gun-related deaths. The disclaimer here is that correlation is not causation. But correlations can be suggestive:

​

“The map overlays the map of firearm deaths above with gun control restrictions by state,” explains Florida. “It highlights states which have one of three gun control restrictions in place – assault weapons’ bans, trigger locks, or safe storage requirements. Firearm deaths are significantly lower in states with stricter gun control legislation. Though the sample sizes are small, we find substantial negative correlations between firearm deaths and states that ban assault weapons (-.45), require trigger locks (-.42), and mandate safe storage requirements for guns (-.48).”
.

I don't either, I think it is an outright lie. Maybe we should find someone who actually understands math instead of a guy that thinks that government spending is good for the economy before we draw conclusions.

How many of those increased gun related deaths were the result of homeowners defending themselves from attack? How many were the result of police shootings? Was there an increase in violent crime after those gun restrictions went into effect? Were more people burglarized because they couldn't get into their government mandated gun safes before their home was invaded? Did the mandatory trigger locks cause more rapes?

Believe it or not, I have a study that actually addresses the first issue, and it comes from Harvard, so you can't claim the people that did it wanted to prove guns are good.

PDF

Banning guns may, or may not, have an effect on gun deaths, but there is no doubt that banning guns leads to an increase in violent crime and homicide. A study that concentrates on gun violence without putting it into context of the larger increase in violent crime that results from gun control is useless.

Not that anyone expects honesty from the anti gun nuts.

 

[OKTexas]

It has to involve gun manufacturers and bans/restrictions on the types of guns they can produce and sell. The same with people who sell guns--certain types of guns cannot be sold legally in the US.

Then there have to be laws with severe penalties to owners who allow their guns to be used by family members and friends. If the shooter's mother in Sandy Hook had lived and such laws were on the books, she would have to serve a jail term for teaching her mentally unbalanced child about guns and allowing him to be around them so he could access them. She should have had them locked away in a storage building off the premesis. She might also (and others like her) be charged with manslaughter for allowing access and teaching him how to use a gun. No person under 18 should be able to handle or own a gun.

There are other things that could be done also. In Israel, background checks involve mental health checks and the applicant has to see a doctor and be certified okay to own a gun. Every three years a person has to re-apply and also have the mental health check again. Also, people who are approved can only own one gun. All ownership is for handguns only (for personal use). Only professionals are allowed to have rifles and other types of weapons.

I don't think it is a statistical anomaly that states with the stiffest gun control laws also have the least gun deaths.


Twelve facts about guns and mass shootings in the United States

9. States with stricter gun control laws have fewer deaths from gun-related violence.

Last year, economist Richard Florida dove deep into the correlations between gun deaths and other kinds of social indicators. Some of what he found was, perhaps, unexpected: Higher populations, more stress, more immigrants, and more mental illness were not correlated with more deaths from gun violence. But one thing he found was, perhaps, perfectly predictable: States with tighter gun control laws appear to have fewer gun-related deaths. The disclaimer here is that correlation is not causation. But correlations can be suggestive:

​

“The map overlays the map of firearm deaths above with gun control restrictions by state,” explains Florida. “It highlights states which have one of three gun control restrictions in place – assault weapons’ bans, trigger locks, or safe storage requirements. Firearm deaths are significantly lower in states with stricter gun control legislation. Though the sample sizes are small, we find substantial negative correlations between firearm deaths and states that ban assault weapons (-.45), require trigger locks (-.42), and mandate safe storage requirements for guns (-.48).”
.

OK, now how about a map showing the overall violient crime rates in the states with the most restrictive laws, after all guns are only part of the overall crime picture. We know that blunt objects kill more people than rifles which seem to be the target of the anti-gunners this time around. We also know that in spite of the fact that gun ownership has tripled, overall violent crime is down more than 50%.

 

[saveliberty]

It really takes an idiot to think criminals and murderers will obey a gun law.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

How are private gun sellers/buyers going to perform these "universal background checks"?

They can't. They'd have to outlaw private sales.

No, they could start a new program for that- but I believe they're talking about dealers. Maybe we should wait and see. But what would the Pub 24/7 propaganda/fear mongering machine do? I think the Dems are in the real world.

A Licensed dealer has to follow all Federal and State laws AT ALL TIMES, including GUN SHOWS. You have been told this numerous times.

 

[Zoom]

How about we start with a Background Check on the President and his entire Cabinet to include all the czars?

Then PUBLISH that info for all to see?

Then go on to Congress, Military Leaders, other High Ranking Civilians.

Then go to States.

I would support you on this if you said this once during the bush nightmare. Just once.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

How about we start with a Background Check on the President and his entire Cabinet to include all the czars?

Then PUBLISH that info for all to see?

Then go on to Congress, Military Leaders, other High Ranking Civilians.

Then go to States.

I would support you on this if you said this once during the bush nightmare. Just once.

Ya cause well Bush and his appointees were all suspected of being non US Citizens and refused to release things like their school records.

 

[The Rabbi]

How about we start with a Background Check on the President and his entire Cabinet to include all the czars?

Then PUBLISH that info for all to see?

Then go on to Congress, Military Leaders, other High Ranking Civilians.

Then go to States.

I would support you on this if you said this once during the bush nightmare. Just once.

Ya cause well Bush and his appointees were all suspected of being non US Citizens and refused to release things like their school records.

People tend to forget little things like Obama is the most undocumented president in history. In that he brought all this crap and speculation on himself.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

How about we start with a Background Check on the President and his entire Cabinet to include all the czars?

Then PUBLISH that info for all to see?

Then go on to Congress, Military Leaders, other High Ranking Civilians.

Then go to States.

I would support you on this if you said this once during the bush nightmare. Just once.

The press investigated Bush pretty thoroughly, yet they glossed over things in Obama's past that raised legitimate questions.

 

[saveliberty]

Thousands upon thousands of illegals in this country and the gun haters are worried about background checks.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

The war on guns will become the new war on drugs if we're not careful. Criminals will benefit the most, both from being able to sell guns, and being able to use them.

Very true. I agree. The 2nd amendment does not pick and choose who can own a firearm. It would be a very dangerous thing to allow a government determined to ban all weapons to decide who is and who is not mentally fit to own one. This is precisely how they managed to do it in Russia with their mandatory mental evaluations.

A very dangerous trail to go down. I am not opposed in the least to someone who has had an issue of depression in the past or some sort of marriage counseling, etc, to be the owner of a gun but can see easily how they could use any counseling whatsoever to be a reason not to give one.

Now the ban should be on these psychotic drugs they are giving young people such as zoloft, paxil, ridalin, in 100% of the cases of these shooters at schools, etc they have been on these type drugs and I believe they are highly dangerous and should be outlawed. Go after the big pharmaceutical companies because there is your source. NOT GUN MANUFACTURERS & THE NRA!


I find it astonishing that while they continue to keep marijuana illegal ( which has never caused anyone to go out and kill another person! ) they are loading up our youth with these very dangerous drugs claiming they are safe. Oh! The irony of that one! I guess these pharmaceutical lobbyists are paying off some major players on the political scene to get away with this but will they get away with it when they have to face God and answer to him for these things? Nope. Every dog has its day. They will too. - Jeremiah

- Jeremiah

 

[GuyPinestra]

Multiple sources close to the talks tell The Huffington Post that the vice president will make universal background checks for all gun purchases the "top priority" of his suggestions. The idea has broad support among politicians in the wake of the shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School, as well as backing from some traditionally pro-gun rights voices.

The idea has broad support among those who would further diminish our Constitutional protections.

It's apparently not too constitutionally problematic because the last sentence says that many pro-gun groups support it.

I also like the idea, and hope it includes scrutiny on those w/mental health issues and the usual such as criminal records. I also support closing the gun show loophole which would prohibit the selling of firearms without a background check at a gun show.

The 'gun show loophole' is no such thing. ALL gun dealers, REGARDLESS of the physical location of a gun sale, (store, gun show, internet, where-ever) are required to perform a back ground check on ALL buyers.

What you are suggesting is requiring PRIVATE CITIZENS to perform those checks.

 

[Oddball]

People who steal their guns or buy them via the black markt need to pass a background check.

 

[saveliberty]

Gun control freaks just don't get it. For the most part you are just making guns harder to purchase for law abiding citizens.