UK: Patients forced to live in agony

[WillowTree]

Say what you will, but when pressed on this issue, you tend to resort to the most base type of posting. You've even insisted we do your research for you, which we've done, only to be answered with idiotic smilies.

so you agree with her statement? it's used to relieve the localized pain of the injection itself? is that what I am to infer?

About the "local anesthetic"?

Absolutely. Local anesthetic (i.e. lidocaine) is used to relieve localized pain (small areas).

That's why it's called "LOCAL ANESTHETIC".

She didn't claim the local anesthetic is for the anti-inflammatory effect or the spine. That's what the steroids are used for.

You appear to have misunderstood her post.

no i didn't,, i clearly said they combine anesthetics with the steroids when they inject them

 

[geauxtohell]

so you agree with her statement? it's used to relieve the localized pain of the injection itself? is that what I am to infer?

About the "local anesthetic"?

Absolutely. Local anesthetic (i.e. lidocaine) is used to relieve localized pain (small areas).

That's why it's called "LOCAL ANESTHETIC".

She didn't claim the local anesthetic is for the anti-inflammatory effect or the spine. That's what the steroids are used for.

You appear to have misunderstood her post.

no i didn't,, i clearly said they combine anesthetics with the steroids when they inject them

Right, the local anesthetic is to relieve the pain of the injection.

Emma cited the relevant text for you in the previous post.

Note:

This is due to the mechanical process of needle insertion as well as initial irritation form the steroid itself.

 

[WillowTree]

What is actually injected?

The injection consists of a mixture of local anesthetic (like lidocaine or bupivacaine) and the steroid medication (triamcinolone – Aristocort® or methylprednisolone – Depo-medrol®, Celestone-Soluspan).

What should I expect after the injection?

Immediately after the injection, you may feel your legs slightly heavy and may be numb. Also, you may notice that your pain may be gone or quite less. This is due to the local anesthetic injected. This will last only for a few hours. Your pain will return and you may have a "sore back" for a day or two. This is due to the mechanical process of needle insertion as well as initial irritation form the steroid itself. You should start noticing pain relief starting the 3rd day or so.

How long the effect of the medication last?

The immediate effect is usually from the local anesthetic injected. This wears off in a few hours. The cortisone starts working in about 3 to 5 days and its effect can last for several days to a few months.

http://www.reddinganesthesia.com/ESB.htm

And you were saying?

I was saying



Percutaneous procedures for the diagnosis and treatment of lower back pain: diskography, facet-joint injection, and epidural injection -- el-Khoury and Renfrew 157 (4): 685 -- American Journal of Roentgenology




asswipe,, you don't know a damn thing you are talking about, I hope they don't let you anywhere near people

 

[WillowTree]

About the "local anesthetic"?

Absolutely. Local anesthetic (i.e. lidocaine) is used to relieve localized pain (small areas).

That's why it's called "LOCAL ANESTHETIC".

She didn't claim the local anesthetic is for the anti-inflammatory effect or the spine. That's what the steroids are used for.

You appear to have misunderstood her post.

no i didn't,, i clearly said they combine anesthetics with the steroids when they inject them

Right, the local anesthetic is to relieve the pain of the injection.

Emma cited the relevant text for you in the previous post.

Note:

This is due to the mechanical process of needle insertion as well as initial irritation form the steroid itself.
I didn't say a word about local aneththetic,, I talked about the anesthetic agents they mix with the steroids and inject into the facets to relieve back pain.. so now both of you are talking out of your asses.

 

[geauxtohell]

I was saying



Percutaneous procedures for the diagnosis and treatment of lower back pain: diskography, facet-joint injection, and epidural injection -- el-Khoury and Renfrew 157 (4): 685 -- American Journal of Roentgenology

Actually, you seem to have supported what Emma was saying:

Injection of steroids and anesthetic into the facet joints of the lumbar spine is useful to diagnose or treat patients with facet syndrome

The steroid injection is used for a specific indication, not back pain of an unkown etiology.

 

[WillowTree]

I was saying



Percutaneous procedures for the diagnosis and treatment of lower back pain: diskography, facet-joint injection, and epidural injection -- el-Khoury and Renfrew 157 (4): 685 -- American Journal of Roentgenology

Actually, you seem to have supported what Emma was saying:

Injection of steroids and anesthetic into the facet joints of the lumbar spine is useful to diagnose or treat patients with facet syndrome

The steroid injection is used for a specific indication, not back pain of an unkown etiology.

that's why they call you DUmmies! it's used in the treatment of back pain, and oh btw they inject it into shoulders too,, and methinks a knee or two has seen the same kind of treatment.. hee haw.

 

[geauxtohell]

I didn't say a word about local aneththetic,, I talked about the anesthetic agents they mix with the steroids and inject into the facets to relieve back pain.. so now both of you are talking out of your asses.

Am I the only one that is confused here?

 

[Emma]

What is actually injected?

The injection consists of a mixture of local anesthetic (like lidocaine or bupivacaine) and the steroid medication (triamcinolone – Aristocort® or methylprednisolone – Depo-medrol®, Celestone-Soluspan).

What should I expect after the injection?

Immediately after the injection, you may feel your legs slightly heavy and may be numb. Also, you may notice that your pain may be gone or quite less. This is due to the local anesthetic injected. This will last only for a few hours. Your pain will return and you may have a "sore back" for a day or two. This is due to the mechanical process of needle insertion as well as initial irritation form the steroid itself. You should start noticing pain relief starting the 3rd day or so.

How long the effect of the medication last?

The immediate effect is usually from the local anesthetic injected. This wears off in a few hours. The cortisone starts working in about 3 to 5 days and its effect can last for several days to a few months.

http://www.reddinganesthesia.com/ESB.htm

And you were saying?

I was saying



Percutaneous procedures for the diagnosis and treatment of lower back pain: diskography, facet-joint injection, and epidural injection -- el-Khoury and Renfrew 157 (4): 685 -- American Journal of Roentgenology




asswipe,, you don't know a damn thing you are talking about, I hope they don't let you anywhere near people

And I never said anesthetics weren't combined in with the steroid being injected. I gave you the REASON why they are.

 

[WillowTree]

I didn't say a word about local aneththetic,, I talked about the anesthetic agents they mix with the steroids and inject into the facets to relieve back pain.. so now both of you are talking out of your asses.

Am I the only one that is confused here?

I'm not confused..

 

[Emma]

I didn't say a word about local aneththetic,, I talked about the anesthetic agents they mix with the steroids and inject into the facets to relieve back pain.. so now both of you are talking out of your asses.

Am I the only one that is confused here?

She has no clue what she's babbling about. Clearly she thinks the purpose of the local anesthetic that is combined with the steroid is to treat/alleviate the back pain itself. Which it will... for a few hours

 

[geauxtohell]

that's why they call you DUmmies! it's used in the treatment of back pain, and oh btw they inject it into shoulders too,, and methinks a knee or two has seen the same kind of treatment.. hee haw.

The 1/2 life of anesthetic is extremely fast. It's used to stop pain for procedures, not for the treatment of chronic pain. You apparently either don't understand this, or want to argue in circles because you have realized you are wrong.

I wouldn't and haven't denied that steroids are injected into joints for specific indications (like controlling RA), but that is generally falling by the wayside since steroids have a lot of adverse side effects.

 

[geauxtohell]

She has no clue what she's babbling about. Clearly she thinks the purpose of the local anesthetic that is combined with the steroid is to treat/alleviate the back pain itself. Which it will... for a few hours

I feel like that Country Joe song:

"1,2,3, what are we fighting for?....."

 

[WillowTree]

What is actually injected?

The injection consists of a mixture of local anesthetic (like lidocaine or bupivacaine) and the steroid medication (triamcinolone – Aristocort® or methylprednisolone – Depo-medrol®, Celestone-Soluspan).

What should I expect after the injection?

Immediately after the injection, you may feel your legs slightly heavy and may be numb. Also, you may notice that your pain may be gone or quite less. This is due to the local anesthetic injected. This will last only for a few hours. Your pain will return and you may have a "sore back" for a day or two. This is due to the mechanical process of needle insertion as well as initial irritation form the steroid itself. You should start noticing pain relief starting the 3rd day or so.

How long the effect of the medication last?

The immediate effect is usually from the local anesthetic injected. This wears off in a few hours. The cortisone starts working in about 3 to 5 days and its effect can last for several days to a few months.

http://www.reddinganesthesia.com/ESB.htm

And you were saying?

I was saying



Percutaneous procedures for the diagnosis and treatment of lower back pain: diskography, facet-joint injection, and epidural injection -- el-Khoury and Renfrew 157 (4): 685 -- American Journal of Roentgenology




asswipe,, you don't know a damn thing you are talking about, I hope they don't let you anywhere near people

And I never said anesthetics weren't combined in with the steroid being injected. I gave you the REASON why they are.

which is wrong wrong wrong

 

[WillowTree]

that's why they call you DUmmies! it's used in the treatment of back pain, and oh btw they inject it into shoulders too,, and methinks a knee or two has seen the same kind of treatment.. hee haw.

The 1/2 life of anesthetic is extremely fast. It's used to stop pain for procedures, not for the treatment of chronic pain. You apparently either don't understand this, or want to argue in circles because you have realized you are wrong.

I wouldn't and haven't denied that steroids are injected into joints for specific indications (like controlling RA), but that is generally falling by the wayside since steroids have a lot of adverse side effects.

talking out yer azz again

 

[Emma]

I didn't say a word about local aneththetic,, I talked about the anesthetic agents they mix with the steroids and inject into the facets to relieve back pain.. so now both of you are talking out of your asses.

Am I the only one that is confused here?

I'm not confused..

If your contention here is that the purpose of the anesthetic agent is to alleviate or treat the back pain (or cause of the pain), you are sadly mistaken. It's to lessen the pain of the procedure and the steroid itself during and in the immediate several hours post-procedure.

 

[Emma]

I was saying



Percutaneous procedures for the diagnosis and treatment of lower back pain: diskography, facet-joint injection, and epidural injection -- el-Khoury and Renfrew 157 (4): 685 -- American Journal of Roentgenology

Actually, you seem to have supported what Emma was saying:

Injection of steroids and anesthetic into the facet joints of the lumbar spine is useful to diagnose or treat patients with facet syndrome

The steroid injection is used for a specific indication, not back pain of an unkown etiology.

that's why they call you DUmmies! it's used in the treatment of back pain, and oh btw they inject it into shoulders too,, and methinks a knee or two has seen the same kind of treatment.. hee haw.

Soooo, you don't know what 'etiology' means, either

 

[Emma]

BTW, willowtree...

You didn't happen to take a recent week-long vacation to the beach, did you?

 

[Emma]

that's why they call you DUmmies! it's used in the treatment of back pain, and oh btw they inject it into shoulders too,, and methinks a knee or two has seen the same kind of treatment.. hee haw.

The 1/2 life of anesthetic is extremely fast. It's used to stop pain for procedures, not for the treatment of chronic pain. You apparently either don't understand this, or want to argue in circles because you have realized you are wrong.

I wouldn't and haven't denied that steroids are injected into joints for specific indications (like controlling RA), but that is generally falling by the wayside since steroids have a lot of adverse side effects.

Now she's just trolling lol.

 

[geauxtohell]

Now she's just trolling lol.

I think she's just trashing the thread since it's pretty obvious that she's wrong about the anesthetic thing.

Or she's extremely confused.

Or both.

 

[Emma]

Now she's just trolling lol.

I think she's just trashing the thread since it's pretty obvious that she's wrong about the anesthetic thing.

Or she's extremely confused.

Or both.

Both I'd say.