U.S. Foreign Policy Created the Taliban Problem

[Kevin_Kennedy]

U.S. officials are now concerned not only with a Taliban resurgence in Afghanistan but also a Taliban takeover in Pakistan. These problems, however, were caused by the U.S. Empire itself.

While most Americans now view President Bush’s Iraq War as a “bad war,” the common perception is that Bush’s invasion of Afghanistan was a “good war” (despite the fact that he went to war without the constitutionally required congressional declaration of war). The notion is that the U.S. government was justified in invading Afghanistan and ousting the Taliban regime from power because the Taliban and al-Qaeda conspired to commit the 9/11 attacks.

There’s just one big problem with that belief: it’s unfounded.

U.S. Foreign Policy Caused the Taliban Problem by Jacob G. Hornberger

 

[Epsilon Delta]

Please Kevin, take your hateful left-wing propaganda out of this board.

Venezuela and the United States have an extradition agreement. Nonetheless, the U.S. government is refusing to extradite Posada to Venezuela. The reason? It says that it fears that Venezuelan authorities will torture Posada. (Another reason might be that Posada was a CIA operative.)

But if fear of torture is a valid reason for refusing an extradition request from Venezuela, then why wouldn’t the same reason apply with respect to the Taliban’s refusal to extradite bin Laden to the United States?

Because when WE do it, it's ok, when THEY do it, it isn't. Duh. Didn't this guy learn anything in history class?

 

[Epsilon Delta]

Jeez, seriously, how hateful of America do you have to be to say something like this:

What would have been the ideal way of handling bin Laden? The same way that the United States handled Ramzi Yousef, one of the terrorists who committed the 1993 terrorist attack on the World Trade Center. Treating that attack as a criminal offense, U.S. officials simply waited Yousef out, relied on good police work, and finally were able to effect his arrest in Pakistan. He is now residing in a U.S. federal penitentiary. No bombs, no missiles, no destruction, no killing of Pakistani wedding parties, and no needless production of new enemies for the United States.

Common sense is a criminal offense. Crucify this so called "Jacob Hornberger"! More like Ayatollah Adolf bin Jughashvili-il!!

 

[Toro]

The Taliban won't take over Pakistan. The Pakistani army is too powerful and too secular to allow that to happen.

 

[editec]

We have been handling terrorists and insurgents like complete nitwits since I was in the NAV and before.

We're sort of like the Hessians.

We keep fighting the wrong wars on behalf of the wrong people the wrong way for all the wrong reasons.

But hey! ~ such policy mistakes make some very few of us very wealthy, and since only those people matter, we can expect to continue these idiotic policies until the USA is such a third world nation, it will no longer be relevant.

So sunshine patriots will just keep plastering their cars with support the troops bumper stickers and sending their children off to fight wars to make their masters wealthy and to make 12th century Islamic fiefdoms safe from modernity.

Because that's what know-nothing tools do, after all.

They drink the families values kool-aid and their sell their souls for a pittance and help their masters turn this nation into the a third world nation.

And they keep telling us this American debate is all about capitalism v. socialism because, after all, that's about how deeply they can fathom these troubled waters we're ALL adrift in.

 

[geauxtohell]

The Taliban won't take over Pakistan. The Pakistani army is too powerful and too secular to allow that to happen.

And once the Taliban leaves Waziristan/FATA, they quickly lose their tactical advantage.

 

[geauxtohell]

I don't agree with much of what the OP says, but he's not incorrect in saying that we are culpable for the rise of the Taliban.

On the advice of the ISI-D we exclusively funded Pashtun warlords, the two that received the bulk of the funding were Hekmatyar (of the HIG) and Juliddan Haqqani (who has the captured soldier in his custody now). We ignored more moderate (and effective) Mujahadeen like Massoud.

Then, to make matters worse, after we'd allowed the pashtun thugs to build up an army and funded it, we ignored them after the Soviets pulled out. These Pashtun Warlords would go on to become the Taliban, which were also supported by ISI-D to stabilize Afghanistan.

This might stick in the craw of some people, but it's well documented. I recommend Ghost Wars by Coll if you are interested in the details.

 

[Tommy Lucchese]

The Taliban won't take over Pakistan. The Pakistani army is too powerful and too secular to allow that to happen.

The Pakistani military is not secular. Not by a long shot.

 

[Tommy Lucchese]

I don't agree with much of what the OP says, but he's not incorrect in saying that we are culpable for the rise of the Taliban.

On the advice of the ISI-D we exclusively funded Pashtun warlords, the two that received the bulk of the funding were Hekmatyar (of the HIG) and Juliddan Haqqani (who has the captured soldier in his custody now). We ignored more moderate (and effective) Mujahadeen like Massoud.

Then, to make matters worse, after we'd allowed the pashtun thugs to build up an army and funded it, we ignored them after the Soviets pulled out. These Pashtun Warlords would go on to become the Taliban, which were also supported by ISI-D to stabilize Afghanistan.

This might stick in the craw of some people, but it's well documented. I recommend Ghost Wars by Coll if you are interested in the details.

Basically, we lost interest in Afghanistan after the Soviets collapsed. One of life's little ironies, though admittedly Poppy Bush had much bigger issues on his plate at the time, like restructuring the entire international system.

 

[Skull Pilot]

ALL and I do mean ALL of our problems in the Middle east are the culmination of decades of meddlesome foreign policy where we did nothing but bed hop between governments and leaders we sought to control.

The best way to fix it is to get the fuck out of the Middle East and stay out.

 

[xsited1]

U.S. Foreign Policy Created the Taliban Problem

Instead, treating the capture of bin Laden as a military problem, U.S. officials invaded the country, killed and maimed countless innocent people, wreaked untold destruction on Afghanistan, effected regime change, created new enemies for the United States ... and failed to capture bin Laden.

And Obama increased the number of troops.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

ALL and I do mean ALL of our problems in the Middle east are the culmination of decades of meddlesome foreign policy where we did nothing but bed hop between governments and leaders we sought to control.

The best way to fix it is to get the fuck out of the Middle East and stay out.

Afghanistan is NOT in the middle east.

 

[Skull Pilot]

ALL and I do mean ALL of our problems in the Middle east are the culmination of decades of meddlesome foreign policy where we did nothing but bed hop between governments and leaders we sought to control.

The best way to fix it is to get the fuck out of the Middle East and stay out.

Afghanistan is NOT in the middle east.

Close enough.

And we are fighting in Afghanistan as a direct result of our failed Middle East policies.

 

[Neser Boha]

ALL and I do mean ALL of our problems in the Middle east are the culmination of decades of meddlesome foreign policy where we did nothing but bed hop between governments and leaders we sought to control.

The best way to fix it is to get the fuck out of the Middle East and stay out.

I kinda sorta agree with your statement. However, don't you think it's a bit fucked up to mess that region up as badly as U.S. did with the help of other countries such as France, Britain, etc. and then just say "oooh, we finally learned our lesson, let's get the fuck out and let the innocent citizens of these countries pay for our criminal mistakes!" I think that's very damn fucked up... US can't disengage from that region, but it certainly needs "to pull it's big dick out of somebody else's desert" (Ani DiFranco)... that is for fucking sure. US and others - such as France, and GB (and possibly many other European countries) have a LOT of fucking atoning to do...

Now, when somebody starts bitching about all the immigrants and refugees from the Middle East and Africa, I tell them... the reason why they're here is our own damn fault, suck it up, bitch.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

ALL and I do mean ALL of our problems in the Middle east are the culmination of decades of meddlesome foreign policy where we did nothing but bed hop between governments and leaders we sought to control.

The best way to fix it is to get the fuck out of the Middle East and stay out.

Afghanistan is NOT in the middle east.

Close enough.

And we are fighting in Afghanistan as a direct result of our failed Middle East policies.

I have an idea. You don't like our country? LEAVE. But just a little warning you dumb ass, If we fall to the Islamic Jihad no where you go will fair any better.

The days we could just ignore the World have been gone a LONG fucking time now. You would think 2 World Wars would wake you dumb as rocks fuckers up to that.

If we just let the thugs, dictators and terrorists over run everyone unable to stop them, who the FUCK do you think we will be trading with after that? You retards are aware , I would hope, that the US is not able to independently do much of anything on its own, we live off a world wide trading system. If we allow everywhere else to fall, we will be paying tribute to those dictators, thugs and terrorists and we will be paying the amounts they dictate. You think foreign aid is bad? Wait till you have to pay off people that actively hate your guts. And how long do you think those that want us to cease to exist will continue doing business with us at any price?

You people have the brains God gave a mite. Dumb as rocks.

 

[geauxtohell]

ALL and I do mean ALL of our problems in the Middle east are the culmination of decades of meddlesome foreign policy where we did nothing but bed hop between governments and leaders we sought to control.

The best way to fix it is to get the fuck out of the Middle East and stay out.

Afghanistan is NOT in the middle east.

That depends on who you ask, at any rate, I think we understood the point Skull Pilot made, though I don't necessarily agree. We couldn't allow the Soviets to take over Pakistan (which was their goal after Afghanistan), we had to oppose them.

Where we screwed up was in picking who we got into bed with and then wiping our hands of the matter after we had stopped the Soviets.

 

[Neser Boha]

Hartman, Andrew (2002). "The Red Template: US Policy in Soviet-Occupied Afghanistan." Third World Quarterly.

ABSTRACT 'The red template' examines the policies of the United States in Soviet-occupied Afghanistan in the context of the Cold War The available documentation tends to support the thesis of this paper: that US policy in Afghanistan, consistent with US policy elsewhere both during and after the Cold War, is geared to protect US private power and thus US access to oil. When the Soviet Union invaded Afghanistan on 25 December 1979, the belief among US foreign policy-makers that the Soviet Union was finally embarking on their longtime mission of advancing upon the oil of the Persian Gulf and the warm water ports of the Arabian Sea was finally supported a propaganda defeat for the Soviet Union. America's response to finance and arm the most fundamental and dangerous Muslims that could be rounded up is a decision that continues to shake the world. The possibilities of the resulting 'blowback' in the form of well-documented terror and the not so well-known heroin trade-were ignored in the drive to support those who would struggle against Soviet-dominated communism. This paper details the cold calculus of US decision-makers and the negative effects on the people of Afghanistan and beyond. The rise of the Taliban can be directly attributed to this process and America's so-called 'War on Terrorism' is yet another harsh penalty the people of this war-ravaged country must accept at the hands of the world's sole remaining superpower.

PS: I have the full article. It is not freely available on the net, only through scholarly journals databases accessible only through school accounts, atd. If you really really wanna read it, lemme know.

 

[Neser Boha]

Afghanistan is NOT in the middle east.

Close enough.

And we are fighting in Afghanistan as a direct result of our failed Middle East policies.

I have an idea. You don't like our country? LEAVE. But just a little warning you dumb ass, If we fall to the Islamic Jihad no where you go will fair any better.

The days we could just ignore the World have been gone a LONG fucking time now. You would think 2 World Wars would wake you dumb as rocks fuckers up to that.

If we just let the thugs, dictators and terrorists over run everyone unable to stop them, who the FUCK do you think we will be trading with after that? You retards are aware , I would hope, that the US is not able to independently do much of anything on its own, we live off a world wide trading system. If we allow everywhere else to fall, we will be paying tribute to those dictators, thugs and terrorists and we will be paying the amounts they dictate. You think foreign aid is bad? Wait till you have to pay off people that actively hate your guts. And how long do you think those that want us to cease to exist will continue doing business with us at any price?

You people have the brains God gave a mite. Dumb as rocks.

Chill the fuck out, man. Just like criticizing Israeli foreign policies doesn't make one an anti-semite, criticizing US foreign policies doesn't make one anti-American nor stupid.

While I agree that managing foreign affairs calls many times for allying yourself with the 'lesser evil' against the perceived 'greater evil', there have been some gross mistakes made! And they weren't made 'in order to create a better world', but simply for OIL! There are times when you can't just criticize US foreign policies and call it evil, but there are times when US has acted like a mindless plunderer with no foresight and no mind to give a shit about the local population.... and that is FUCKING wrong.

Yeah, it's not all black and white, there are many a shades of gray... and both sides here need to chill the fuck out.

And... overall, I agree with you, US can't just disengage and lay back... there's a lot of shit to be cleaned up...

 

[editec]

ALL and I do mean ALL of our problems in the Middle east are the culmination of decades of meddlesome foreign policy where we did nothing but bed hop between governments and leaders we sought to control.

The best way to fix it is to get the fuck out of the Middle East and stay out.

You're spot on with that point, Skull.

Now ask yourself: on whose behalf we keep doing these things?

Here's a clue..it's not for welfare mothers.

You want to know who benefits?

The very same people that some on this board weap for because they think they pay too high a perrcentage of the overall tax burden.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

ALL and I do mean ALL of our problems in the Middle east are the culmination of decades of meddlesome foreign policy where we did nothing but bed hop between governments and leaders we sought to control.

The best way to fix it is to get the fuck out of the Middle East and stay out.

You're spot on with that point, Skull.

Now ask yourself: on whose behalf we keep doing these things?

Here's a clue..it's not for welfare mothers.

You want to know who benefits?

The very same people that some on this board weap for because they think they pay too high a perrcentage of the overall tax burden.

Envy is such an ugly emotion. Stupidity and envy are even worse. Remind us again commisar, how the US Government should just seize every and anything related to health care, Nationalize and run it forever more.