Trying to understand the Repub view on tax hike for deficit...

[Avatar4321]

It's impossible to understand republicans. They don't understand you cut revenues, you cut your ablity to pay off the debt.

I think Rambunctious has addressed this point nicely. For whatever reason, you don't know how to increase revenues.

 

[auditor0007]

How is it justifiable to, on the one hand, slam the president for not reducing the deficit, but then on the other hand, refuse to up the taxes on the wealthy? How is that even rational? Please explain to me why the Repubs want to have their cake, eat it too, and throw a fit until its done? Anyone out there want to enlighten me?

Because they are all brainwashed. It's really quite that simple. When you look at the facts, it becomes obvious. We have the lowest tax rates since before the Great Depression and all they do is bitch about how taxes are way too high, and how it is destroying the economy. They blame everything on spending, and while spending is part of the problem, it is only part of the problem. When Obama proposes $1 in tax increases for $3 in spending cuts, they scoff at it. It's just amazing when they have their heads stuck so deep in the sand that they will never see the light.

 

[auditor0007]

How is it justifiable to, on the one hand, slam the president for not reducing the deficit, but then on the other hand, refuse to up the taxes on the wealthy? How is that even rational? Please explain to me why the Repubs want to have their cake, eat it too, and throw a fit until its done? Anyone out there want to enlighten me?

There are two ways to generate dollars into the federal governments coffers.
#1. Raise taxes
#2. Increase economic activity by lowering taxes for all and cut government regulation.
If you were to triple the income tax on the people earning $250.000 or more it would not come close to creating the kind of money that a growing and robust economy would bring into the federal government.
Set the people free, stop clipping their business wings and watch the government coffers swell. Tax them more, and get more of what we have now and worse.

Taxes have already been cut to the lowest rates since before the Great Depression? Where is all this new economic activity that is supposed to generate all these new revenues? I haven't seen them, have you? You want to cut more? Do more of the same that got us to this point? Are you out of your mind?

 

[Zander]

How is it justifiable to, on the one hand, slam the president for not reducing the deficit, but then on the other hand, refuse to up the taxes on the wealthy? How is that even rational? Please explain to me why the Repubs want to have their cake, eat it too, and throw a fit until its done? Anyone out there want to enlighten me?

Because they are all brainwashed. It's really quite that simple. When you look at the facts, it becomes obvious. We have the lowest tax rates since before the Great Depression and all they do is bitch about how taxes are way too high, and how it is destroying the economy. They blame everything on spending, and while spending is part of the problem, it is only part of the problem. When Obama proposes $1 in tax increases for $3 in spending cuts, they scoff at it. It's just amazing when they have their heads stuck so deep in the sand that they will never see the light.

The rhetoric from the left is so great- we'll cut spending AND raise taxes. It makes sense too. So why are conservatives opposed to higher taxes to balance the budget?? The problem is the tax increases happen immediately (if not sooner!) , and the spending cuts - well, they never, ever materialize. Instead, the new projected "revenue" gets spent- every penny plus a few percent more.


I'd gladly pay slightly more in taxes if we had a balanced budget amendment - and all federal expenditures capped at 17-18% of GDP.

 

[auditor0007]

How is it justifiable to, on the one hand, slam the president for not reducing the deficit, but then on the other hand, refuse to up the taxes on the wealthy? How is that even rational? Please explain to me why the Repubs want to have their cake, eat it too, and throw a fit until its done? Anyone out there want to enlighten me?

Because they are all brainwashed. It's really quite that simple. When you look at the facts, it becomes obvious. We have the lowest tax rates since before the Great Depression and all they do is bitch about how taxes are way too high, and how it is destroying the economy. They blame everything on spending, and while spending is part of the problem, it is only part of the problem. When Obama proposes $1 in tax increases for $3 in spending cuts, they scoff at it. It's just amazing when they have their heads stuck so deep in the sand that they will never see the light.

The rhetoric from the left is so great- we'll cut spending AND raise taxes. It makes sense too. So why are conservatives opposed to higher taxes to balance the budget?? The problem is the tax increases happen immediately (if not sooner!) , and the spending cuts - well, they never, ever materialize. Instead, the new projected "revenue" gets spent- every penny plus a few percent more.


I'd gladly pay slightly more in taxes if we had a balanced budget amendment - and all federal expenditures capped at 17-18% of GDP.

I appreciate and understand that frustration. I am not one to support ridiculous spending that we cannot afford. At the same time, we need to be realistic about where we are and what needs to be done. I have no problem attaching mandatory spending limits with additional tax increases.

 

[Zander]

Because they are all brainwashed. It's really quite that simple. When you look at the facts, it becomes obvious. We have the lowest tax rates since before the Great Depression and all they do is bitch about how taxes are way too high, and how it is destroying the economy. They blame everything on spending, and while spending is part of the problem, it is only part of the problem. When Obama proposes $1 in tax increases for $3 in spending cuts, they scoff at it. It's just amazing when they have their heads stuck so deep in the sand that they will never see the light.

The rhetoric from the left is so great- we'll cut spending AND raise taxes. It makes sense too. So why are conservatives opposed to higher taxes to balance the budget?? The problem is the tax increases happen immediately (if not sooner!) , and the spending cuts - well, they never, ever materialize. Instead, the new projected "revenue" gets spent- every penny plus a few percent more.


I'd gladly pay slightly more in taxes if we had a balanced budget amendment - and all federal expenditures capped at 17-18% of GDP.

I appreciate and understand that frustration. I am not one to support ridiculous spending that we cannot afford. At the same time, we need to be realistic about where we are and what needs to be done. I have no problem attaching mandatory spending limits with additional tax increases.

If only we ran things....

That being said, we really don't need higher rates to collect more revenue. We need a simplified system that eliminates loopholes and special deals so that individuals and corporations (like GE - that earned $14 Billion in profit in and paid ZERO in federal taxes) all pay their fair share.

 

[DiamondDave]

How is it justifiable to, on the one hand, slam the president for not reducing the deficit, but then on the other hand, refuse to up the taxes on the wealthy? How is that even rational? Please explain to me why the Repubs want to have their cake, eat it too, and throw a fit until its done? Anyone out there want to enlighten me?

The spending is the culprit.... the government is WAYYYYYY overbloated....

And we have ~48% of the adult citizenry that pays ZERO, nada, zilch in federal income taxes.... not really consistent with equal treatment by government

 

[DiamondDave]

It's impossible to understand republicans. They don't understand you cut revenues, you cut your ablity to pay off the debt.

Impossible to understand liberals.... They don't understand you keep spending more than you take in, at astronomical levels, you cut off your ability to pay off the debt....

 

[Wiseacre]

How is it justifiable to, on the one hand, slam the president for not reducing the deficit, but then on the other hand, refuse to up the taxes on the wealthy? How is that even rational? Please explain to me why the Repubs want to have their cake, eat it too, and throw a fit until its done? Anyone out there want to enlighten me?

My shot at answering your question, and I did read the other responses. IMHO, the main reason why the GOP is against raising taxes is because they believe it is counter productive for the economy. If you raise taxes, it is believed that GDP takes a hit, and historical data generally bears that out. Revenue from individual income tax has always remianed about 8% of GDP. You raise rates, then GDP drops and you don't get as much additional revenue as you expected.

The logic seems inescapable, especially in today's global economy. Entrepeneurs, innovators, new business owners, and investors will look for the most advantageous business climates to make money, and higher taxes is a key factor. Most new jobs come from startups, and you don't want to discourage new startups.

It is true that gov't spending is a component of the overall GDP calculation. But it is widely believed that the gov't is very inefficient and that the private sector can better use tax dollars to produce more goods and services, thereby crreating more wealth. I think there was research done that suggests the positive effect of every gov't dollar spent is a 1.6 dollar gain in GDP, but a dollar in the private sector gets you a 3 dollar gain.

That's the rationale as I perceive it. Lots of other reasons having to do with the size and role of gov't and the associated politics. I assume ypu know that the Bush tax cuts were projected to cost 3.7 trillion over ten years, but the cost for the top earners was only 700 billion of that. So it ain't exactly a panacea for our debt problem if you allow the Bush tax cuts to expire for the rich.

Plus, do you also know that in 2009 there were only about 38,000 people that earned over a million bucks, so when you're talking about raising taxes on the top guys you're primarily talking about people making under a million, most of whom are small business owners. I think they're paying enough already. Got those numbers from socialsecurity.gov.