Trump’s EPA allowing cities to dump more raw sewage in rivers.

[martybegan]

This is about rules regarding combined sewer overflows, and a lot of the cities getting relief from this are democrat controlled, large old urban centers. They will still have to upgrade their systems, but they will have more time and flexibility to meet the requirements, not ignore the requirements.

I work in wastewater engineering, so I know more about this than you do.

Thanks for proving the veracity of the article. Delaying the upgrades means more raw sewage in the rivers. Over the years as these systems age and breakdown more sewage will flow into the waterways unless upgrades are undertaken.

The work required to fix this isn't something that can happen overnight. The only real fix is to dig up every single street and separate the lines into sanitary sewer lines, and storm sewer lines. The other option is to build storage facilities that would be 10's or 100's of millions of gallons in size to contain even a moderate sized rainfall.

The even worse option is to size wastewater plants to handle the whole flow, which would make them 10 times the size they are now, and would make them inefficient to handle the normal "dry" flow that they would be designed for.

"Green" solutions, such as permeable soil, bioswales, rainwater use, and other reduction techniques can't be scaled up to meet the requirements of rainfall normally seen.

The article is biased, but at least gives the other side. Your post is disingenuous at best, and willfully ignorant at worst.

Which is why I posted to the link because it gave both sides. The first sentence of my initial post said it all.

You scandalized it to skew to your viewpoint. You exaggerated the scale of the issue, and you made it seem like this hasn't been going on for decades already.

The fact is you confirmed the accuracy of the NYT’s article. The rest of your posts have been nothing but deflection since.

The article has many facts in it, but reaches some questionable assumptions about motive and the ease of fixing this issue.

On the other hand, your claim that this will lead to "more" sewage being "dumped" into rivers oceans, and other receiving bodies is again an exaggeration at best, and a lie at worst. The municipalities in question won't be allowed to go backwards, they will just have more flexibility and time going forwards.

The thing is, the amount of water in a rainfall that forces combined sewer overflows/bypasses is usually enough to dilute the wastewater to the point the receiving body can treat the waste itself in a relatively short time. Things like swimming bans and such usually go into effect for a few days after a large rainfall, but the overall health of the body of water is usually not impacted.

 

[DOTR]

The Environmental Protection Agency has made it easier for cities to keep dumping raw sewage into rivers by letting them delay or otherwise change federally imposed fixes to their sewer systems, according to interviews with local officials, water utilities and their lobbyists.


E.P.A. Is Letting Cities Dump More Raw Sewage Into Rivers for Years to Come

*******************

Trump’s EPA is allowing this change because Trump supporters seemingly want more raw sewage in their rivers and waterways.

Trump supporter mantra: all environmental regulations bad.

Here is the consequence of that ignorance.

Lol misleading post,, do you not trust Americans? Any evidence they are dumping AFTER this ruling?

In their minds there is only one government....the Federal Government.

And without it the liberals running big cities will pollute like crazy...while passing global warming initiatives.

 

[JLW]

Here is a riddle for Trump supporters:

What is it that you accuse others of getting, that you say you never get, and that you will get in spades under Trump’s new regulations?

 

[martybegan]

Here is a riddle for Trump supporters:

What is it that you accuse others of getting, that you say you never get, and that you will get in spades under Trump’s new regulations?

These aren't new regulations, they are modifications to existing ones, and in some cases, proposed changes to existing ones.

 

[Likkmee]

I am sure states have laws against that. If not, they should.
Its always good to roll back federal power when they stole it to begin with.

The EPA roll back speaks for itself. It is expensive to update the infrastructure however there are others ways of dealing with sewer systems than allowing more raw sewage into our waterways.

The first fourth world nation. Upgrade that military ! Lets fight in space !

 

[progressive hunter]

I am sure states have laws against that. If not, they should.
Its always good to roll back federal power when they stole it to begin with.

The EPA roll back speaks for itself. It is expensive to update the infrastructure however there are others ways of dealing with sewer systems than allowing more raw sewage into our waterways.

thats right and those cities should do it,,

why is it you morons need the feds to do things for you,,,

 

[EvilCat Breath]

These aren't fixes. They are shitstain obama regulations and they should go.

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

I am sure states have laws against that. If not, they should.
Its always good to roll back federal power when they stole it to begin with.

Ohio had laws against pollution...it still resulted in one of their rivers literally catching on fire....more than once....


Which is what led to the EPA being created in the first place....

It seems like state agencies become a lot more easier and CHEAPER to corrupt and control once you remove federal enforcement from the equation....

 

[progressive hunter]

Why is the EPA responsible for what cities do with their waste? Shouldn’t you be screaming about these cities and states that are actually doing this? The EPA does not own sewage processing plants, cities do, so why not hold them accountable?

Last I looked waterways, rivers and lakes do not respect state borders. The federal government has to be involved.

thats just a stupid excuse for you to keep doing it,,,

 

[progressive hunter]

I am sure states have laws against that. If not, they should.
Its always good to roll back federal power when they stole it to begin with.

Ohio had laws against pollution...it still resulted in one of their rivers literally catching on fire....more than once....
View attachment 303184

Which is what led to the EPA being created in the first place....

It seems like state agencies become a lot more easier and CHEAPER to corrupt and control once you remove federal enforcement from the equation....

you sir are an ignorant fuck and need to educate yourself

 

[martybegan]

I am sure states have laws against that. If not, they should.
Its always good to roll back federal power when they stole it to begin with.

Ohio had laws against pollution...it still resulted in one of their rivers literally catching on fire....more than once....
View attachment 303184

Which is what led to the EPA being created in the first place....

It seems like state agencies become a lot more easier and CHEAPER to corrupt and control once you remove federal enforcement from the equation....

The EPA should stick to setting minimums, and handling items that cross State lines. The problem is like any bureaucracy, they seek to increase their power as time goes on, usually without any congressional approval to do so.

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

I am sure states have laws against that. If not, they should.
Its always good to roll back federal power when they stole it to begin with.

Ohio had laws against pollution...it still resulted in one of their rivers literally catching on fire....more than once....
View attachment 303184

Which is what led to the EPA being created in the first place....

It seems like state agencies become a lot more easier and CHEAPER to corrupt and control once you remove federal enforcement from the equation....

you sir are an ignorant fuck and need to educate yourself

So the EPA wasn't created after the Cuyahoga river caught on fire??

And the state regulations were working??

Gotta link?

Looks like you are the ignorant one...

 

[progressive hunter]

I am sure states have laws against that. If not, they should.
Its always good to roll back federal power when they stole it to begin with.

Ohio had laws against pollution...it still resulted in one of their rivers literally catching on fire....more than once....
View attachment 303184

Which is what led to the EPA being created in the first place....

It seems like state agencies become a lot more easier and CHEAPER to corrupt and control once you remove federal enforcement from the equation....

you sir are an ignorant fuck and need to educate yourself

So the EPA wasn't created after the Cuyahoga river caught on fire??

And the state regulations were working??

Gotta link?

Looks like you are the ignorant one...

like I said go educate yourself,,,

all the regs in the world dont stop crimes which is what happened,,,

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

I am sure states have laws against that. If not, they should.
Its always good to roll back federal power when they stole it to begin with.

Ohio had laws against pollution...it still resulted in one of their rivers literally catching on fire....more than once....
View attachment 303184

Which is what led to the EPA being created in the first place....

It seems like state agencies become a lot more easier and CHEAPER to corrupt and control once you remove federal enforcement from the equation....

The EPA should stick to setting minimums, and handling items that cross State lines. The problem is like any bureaucracy, they seek to increase their power as time goes on, usually without any congressional approval to do so.

So do you feel state laws will work better this time than in the past??

Because we keep forgetting that BEFORE federal regulation....rivers like the Cuyahoga, the Hudson...these were dead rivers.....after federal regulation, they are not dead rivers....

Now if there is a better way of doing it -- I am open to it -- but simply wanting to deregulate things for the sake of deregulation isn't a solution to me....

I am for effective regulations.....and it seems to me that if a large corporation in a small town that employs lots of people will have more sway over their city and state agencies than they would over federal.....just because of human nature....

Just ask Dupont or Dow Chemical....

 

[JLW]

To Trump Supporters:

What is it that you accuse others of getting, that you say you never get, and that you will get in spades under Trump’s new regulations/modifications?

Answer: FREE SHIT

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

I am sure states have laws against that. If not, they should.
Its always good to roll back federal power when they stole it to begin with.

Ohio had laws against pollution...it still resulted in one of their rivers literally catching on fire....more than once....
View attachment 303184

Which is what led to the EPA being created in the first place....

It seems like state agencies become a lot more easier and CHEAPER to corrupt and control once you remove federal enforcement from the equation....

you sir are an ignorant fuck and need to educate yourself

So the EPA wasn't created after the Cuyahoga river caught on fire??

And the state regulations were working??

Gotta link?

Looks like you are the ignorant one...

like I said go educate yourself,,,

all the regs in the world dont stop crimes which is what happened,,,

but we don't get rid of "laws" because they don't stop all crimes you moronic dic sucker

 

[martybegan]

I am sure states have laws against that. If not, they should.
Its always good to roll back federal power when they stole it to begin with.

Ohio had laws against pollution...it still resulted in one of their rivers literally catching on fire....more than once....
View attachment 303184

Which is what led to the EPA being created in the first place....

It seems like state agencies become a lot more easier and CHEAPER to corrupt and control once you remove federal enforcement from the equation....

The EPA should stick to setting minimums, and handling items that cross State lines. The problem is like any bureaucracy, they seek to increase their power as time goes on, usually without any congressional approval to do so.

So do you feel state laws will work better this time than in the past??

Because we keep forgetting that BEFORE federal regulation....rivers like the Cuyahoga, the Hudson...these were dead rivers.....after federal regulation, they are not dead rivers....

Now if there is a better way of doing it -- I am open to it -- but simply wanting to deregulate things for the sake of deregulation isn't a solution to me....

I am for effective regulations.....and it seems to me that if a large corporation in a small town that employs lots of people will have more sway over their city and state agencies than they would over federal.....just because of human nature....

Just ask Dupont or Dow Chemical....

Correlation does not equal causation. the EPA started out OK, but it has gone beyond it's original mandate.

A good example of "one size fits all" not working is wastewater plant discharges. Cities on the coast have the option of discharging to the ocean. Cities inland often discharge to rivers used for drinking water and agriculture. Should standards for discharges from plants all be based on the river discharges, even if this results in the effluent from plants on the coast being cleaner than the receiving water?

 

[martybegan]

To Trump Supporters:

What is it that you accuse others of getting, that you say you never get, and that you will get in spades under Trump’s new regulations/modifications?

Answer: FREE SHIT

Nice attempt, but fail.

This is about municipal wastewater systems, not industrial or commercial ones. It's one level of government against another.

 

[progressive hunter]

I am sure states have laws against that. If not, they should.
Its always good to roll back federal power when they stole it to begin with.

Ohio had laws against pollution...it still resulted in one of their rivers literally catching on fire....more than once....
View attachment 303184

Which is what led to the EPA being created in the first place....

It seems like state agencies become a lot more easier and CHEAPER to corrupt and control once you remove federal enforcement from the equation....

you sir are an ignorant fuck and need to educate yourself

So the EPA wasn't created after the Cuyahoga river caught on fire??

And the state regulations were working??

Gotta link?

Looks like you are the ignorant one...

like I said go educate yourself,,,

all the regs in the world dont stop crimes which is what happened,,,

but we don't get rid of "laws" because they don't stop all crimes you moronic dic sucker

so Im right and you are ignorant on the topic

 

[busybee01]

The Environmental Protection Agency has made it easier for cities to keep dumping raw sewage into rivers by letting them delay or otherwise change federally imposed fixes to their sewer systems, according to interviews with local officials, water utilities and their lobbyists.


E.P.A. Is Letting Cities Dump More Raw Sewage Into Rivers for Years to Come

*******************

Trump’s EPA is allowing this change because Trump supporters seemingly want more raw sewage in their rivers and waterways.

Trump supporter mantra: all environmental regulations bad.

Here is the consequence of that ignorance.

This is another reason why Trump will lose in November. Suburban voters will not tolerate Trump's dirty air and dirty water.