Trump-backed prison reform bill sails through House

[KJohnson]

"The bill, which would provide training programs for prisoners with the goal of reducing recidivism rates, easily passed the House in a 360-59 vote."


That's all fair and nice but it won't do any good since companies are all demanding FBI fingerprinting to get jobs these days. And therefore, it won't matter if prisoners obtain a PHD, they still won't get the job!


One might wonder why so many are out of work these days given the fact everywhere one looks there are help wanted signs in the window or on billboard signs.

Well, one of the biggest problems, is that nowadays just about everyone is demanding FBI fingerprinted back ground checks otherwise known as level 2. Many people are boxed in and unable to get a job due to this. Some with only one conviction in their past as far back as fifty years ago which is completely idiotic. How many in society has never committed some type of crime? Just because they weren't caught, doesn't mean they were innocent...it just means they were luckier than the guy handcuffed and dragged off to jail.

And the real travesty is many had plea bargained and agreed to plea guilty in exchange for having their records sealed and expunged claiming they would never have to worry because it would never show up when filling out an application which may have been the case years ago but not today with level 2 FBI fingerprinting.

So, either they should be allowed to have their records expunged from FBI records as well or they should at the very least be able to go before a judge to let him rule whether to destroy the record altogether.




https://www.politico.com/story/2018...ison-reform-bill-backed-by-white-house-603333

 

[Rambunctious]

Its a great bill...even dems are praising it....the nation has thousands of craftsmen and blue collar business owners that can buffer their retirement instructing in our state and federal prisons.....we need craftsmen and builders and plumbers and carpet layers...etc etc etc

 

[Zander]

There is no elevator to success...you have to take the STAIRS.

Crime is like a tattoo.....

 

[MikeK]

My late wife was a clinical psychologist. Among her friends and colleagues was a fellow who worked for the New York City Department of Correction, then moved to the State system. I recall him telling her the majority of prison inmates have mental problems ranging from simple to severe, that typical prison confinement can only intensify their pathologies, and that releasing them into society represents a serious risk to the public. He said nothing short of intensive, long-term psychotherapy (many months) under optimal conditions can minimize that risk.

I recall some of the participants in this forum mentioning they are former correction officers and some who are former prison inmates, so I think it would be interesting to hear from these individuals.

 

[Lewdog]

"The bill, which would provide training programs for prisoners with the goal of reducing recidivism rates, easily passed the House in a 360-59 vote."


That's all fair and nice but it won't do any good since companies are all demanding FBI fingerprinting to get jobs these days. And therefore, it won't matter if prisoners obtain a PHD, they still won't get the job!


One might wonder why so many are out of work these days given the fact everywhere one looks there are help wanted signs in the window or on billboard signs.

Well, one of the biggest problems, is that nowadays just about everyone is demanding FBI fingerprinted back ground checks otherwise known as level 2. Many people are boxed in and unable to get a job due to this. Some with only one conviction in their past as far back as fifty years ago which is completely idiotic. How many in society has never committed some type of crime? Just because they weren't caught, doesn't mean they were innocent...it just means they were luckier than the guy handcuffed and dragged off to jail.

And the real travesty is many had plea bargained and agreed to plea guilty in exchange for having their records sealed and expunged claiming they would never have to worry because it would never show up when filling out an application which may have been the case years ago but not today with level 2 FBI fingerprinting.

So, either they should be allowed to have their records expunged from FBI records as well or they should at the very least be able to go before a judge to let him rule whether to destroy the record altogether.




https://www.politico.com/story/2018...ison-reform-bill-backed-by-white-house-603333

Yeah there is a movement called "ban the box" that has to do with getting rid of the question on applications that ask if a person is a convicted felon. Did you know however, in some states the state will pay part of a person's wage to a company if they hire a felon?

 

[protectionist]

"The bill, which would provide training programs for prisoners with the goal of reducing recidivism rates, easily passed the House in a 360-59 vote."


That's all fair and nice but it won't do any good since companies are all demanding FBI fingerprinting to get jobs these days. And therefore, it won't matter if prisoners obtain a PHD, they still won't get the job!


One might wonder why so many are out of work these days given the fact everywhere one looks there are help wanted signs in the window or on billboard signs.

Well, one of the biggest problems, is that nowadays just about everyone is demanding FBI fingerprinted back ground checks otherwise known as level 2. Many people are boxed in and unable to get a job due to this. Some with only one conviction in their past as far back as fifty years ago which is completely idiotic. How many in society has never committed some type of crime? Just because they weren't caught, doesn't mean they were innocent...it just means they were luckier than the guy handcuffed and dragged off to jail.

And the real travesty is many had plea bargained and agreed to plea guilty in exchange for having their records sealed and expunged claiming they would never have to worry because it would never show up when filling out an application which may have been the case years ago but not today with level 2 FBI fingerprinting.

So, either they should be allowed to have their records expunged from FBI records as well or they should at the very least be able to go before a judge to let him rule whether to destroy the record altogether.
https://www.politico.com/story/2018...ison-reform-bill-backed-by-white-house-603333

Lots of companies also require credit checks, and high credit scores for employment. This idiocy keeps lots of good people out of jobs. I have a relatively low credit score (600), despite having zero bad credit. I just don't have any (RECENT) good credit accounts.

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

Let's test it out on Hillary, Obama, Holder, Comey, Brennan, Rice, Clapper...
But leopards don't change their spots.

 

[candycorn]

"The bill, which would provide training programs for prisoners with the goal of reducing recidivism rates, easily passed the House in a 360-59 vote."


That's all fair and nice but it won't do any good since companies are all demanding FBI fingerprinting to get jobs these days. And therefore, it won't matter if prisoners obtain a PHD, they still won't get the job!


One might wonder why so many are out of work these days given the fact everywhere one looks there are help wanted signs in the window or on billboard signs.

Well, one of the biggest problems, is that nowadays just about everyone is demanding FBI fingerprinted back ground checks otherwise known as level 2. Many people are boxed in and unable to get a job due to this. Some with only one conviction in their past as far back as fifty years ago which is completely idiotic. How many in society has never committed some type of crime? Just because they weren't caught, doesn't mean they were innocent...it just means they were luckier than the guy handcuffed and dragged off to jail.

And the real travesty is many had plea bargained and agreed to plea guilty in exchange for having their records sealed and expunged claiming they would never have to worry because it would never show up when filling out an application which may have been the case years ago but not today with level 2 FBI fingerprinting.

So, either they should be allowed to have their records expunged from FBI records as well or they should at the very least be able to go before a judge to let him rule whether to destroy the record altogether.




https://www.politico.com/story/2018...ison-reform-bill-backed-by-white-house-603333

Good post and good point. Welcome

 

[SavannahMann]

I have always believed that we should forgive, if not forget, the crime of the individual once the debt has been paid. The problem is that too many people think that the punishment is not enough, or that the individual is a slobbering sadist. So they don’t forgive, and they certainly won’t ever forget.

 

[KJohnson]

I have always believed that we should forgive, if not forget, the crime of the individual once the debt has been paid. The problem is that too many people think that the punishment is not enough, or that the individual is a slobbering sadist. So they don’t forgive, and they certainly won’t ever forget.

Laws need to be changed that anyone who is not a career criminal and hasn't been charged in 10 or more years, that file should get buried where the FBI can't even report it. It should only be kept for law enforcement to view in the case of new crimes committed. It shouldn't be left to the employer to make that decision. If they have a choice between someone who has a completely clean record and one that has a smudge, they will take the clean every time,

All humans make mistakes ...most just don't get caught. At the very least everyone should get a second chance in a case where no violence was involved. My nephew made a mistake in his early twenties and he's now in his late thirties trying to raise a family and has his nose clean but has a very difficult time due to one thing on his record from sixteen years ago. He's a great guy, dad, and husband. Needs another chance and shouldn't be tagged "Felon" forever..

 

[Crepitus]

Its a great bill...even dems are praising it....the nation has thousands of craftsmen and blue collar business owners that can buffer their retirement instructing in our state and federal prisons.....we need craftsmen and builders and plumbers and carpet layers...etc etc etc

It's a watered down version of a better bill that was allowed to die after Putin got tRump elected.

 

[Rambunctious]

It's a watered down version of a better bill that was allowed to die after Putin got tRump elected

 

[Penelope]

"The bill, which would provide training programs for prisoners with the goal of reducing recidivism rates, easily passed the House in a 360-59 vote."


That's all fair and nice but it won't do any good since companies are all demanding FBI fingerprinting to get jobs these days. And therefore, it won't matter if prisoners obtain a PHD, they still won't get the job!


One might wonder why so many are out of work these days given the fact everywhere one looks there are help wanted signs in the window or on billboard signs.

Well, one of the biggest problems, is that nowadays just about everyone is demanding FBI fingerprinted back ground checks otherwise known as level 2. Many people are boxed in and unable to get a job due to this. Some with only one conviction in their past as far back as fifty years ago which is completely idiotic. How many in society has never committed some type of crime? Just because they weren't caught, doesn't mean they were innocent...it just means they were luckier than the guy handcuffed and dragged off to jail.

And the real travesty is many had plea bargained and agreed to plea guilty in exchange for having their records sealed and expunged claiming they would never have to worry because it would never show up when filling out an application which may have been the case years ago but not today with level 2 FBI fingerprinting.

So, either they should be allowed to have their records expunged from FBI records as well or they should at the very least be able to go before a judge to let him rule whether to destroy the record altogether.
https://www.politico.com/story/2018...ison-reform-bill-backed-by-white-house-603333

Lots of companies also require credit checks, and high credit scores for employment. This idiocy keeps lots of good people out of jobs. I have a relatively low credit score (600), despite having zero bad credit. I just don't have any (RECENT) good credit accounts.

You have a point there, no credit is considered bad credit. It works the same way with renting, ins, everything, the lower your score the more you pay, even if you pay all your bills on time and do not go into debt.

 

[Penelope]

So then we all agree

My late wife was a clinical psychologist. Among her friends and colleagues was a fellow who worked for the New York City Department of Correction, then moved to the State system. I recall him telling her the majority of prison inmates have mental problems ranging from simple to severe, that typical prison confinement can only intensify their pathologies, and that releasing them into society represents a serious risk to the public. He said nothing short of intensive, long-term psychotherapy (many months) under optimal conditions can minimize that risk.

I recall some of the participants in this forum mentioning they are former correction officers and some who are former prison inmates, so I think it would be interesting to hear from these individuals.

I guess the Obama era was right all along with the Promise program, seems you all think so now.

 

[MikeK]

I guess the Obama era was right all along with the Promise program, seems you all think so now.

Not necessarily.

Ingraham: 'PROMISE Program' Hailed By Obama Admin Led to Florida Schools Ignoring Violent Students

 

[protectionist]

You have a point there, no credit is considered bad credit. It works the same way with renting, ins, everything, the lower your score the more you pay, even if you pay all your bills on time and do not go into debt.

Credit reform bill needed, along with prison reform.Somebody needs to get a handle on the way credit bureaus are running our lives like a bunch of fascist dictators. Also, wrong information is quite common on credit reports.

But how easy is it to get that fixed? Suppose a CB has dinged you for a large loan that you never even took out. What if somebody was out to get you, and they reported false info to a CB ? Well, the CB is getting PAID by the alleged creditor (accuser), and they're not getting a dime out of you, are they ?

So the CB has a vested interest in reporting you for that so-called bad credit.

Let's compare this with a court judge who, like the CB, also makes a value judgement on you. If you were a defendant in a court case, and, like with CBs, the accuser was PAYING the judge, and the judge was pocketing that money, that judge would be removed from the case, disbarred, and probably imprisoned (for doing what credit bureaus do every single day).

 

[protectionist]

So then we all agree

My late wife was a clinical psychologist. Among her friends and colleagues was a fellow who worked for the New York City Department of Correction, then moved to the State system. I recall him telling her the majority of prison inmates have mental problems ranging from simple to severe, that typical prison confinement can only intensify their pathologies, and that releasing them into society represents a serious risk to the public. He said nothing short of intensive, long-term psychotherapy (many months) under optimal conditions can minimize that risk.

I recall some of the participants in this forum mentioning they are former correction officers and some who are former prison inmates, so I think it would be interesting to hear from these individuals.

I guess the Obama era was right all along with the Promise program, seems you all think so now.

"Right with the Promise program" ? Are you nuts ? The Obamans killed 17 people in Parkland, because of the crazy Promise Program, which allowed Nicholas Cruz to buy his guns. It was because of that insane program that the gun sellers got no warning about Cruz's long history of violence problems, and contacts with the police.

 

[Penelope]

I guess the Obama era was right all along with the Promise program, seems you all think so now.

Not necessarily.

Ingraham: 'PROMISE Program' Hailed By Obama Admin Led to Florida Schools Ignoring Violent Students

school to prison does not work. I don't give a rip what Ingraham says, she hated gays until she watched her brothers boyfriend die from aids, and she is wrong, he was not in the promise program.

 

[EvilCat Breath]

I have always believed that we should forgive, if not forget, the crime of the individual once the debt has been paid. The problem is that too many people think that the punishment is not enough, or that the individual is a slobbering sadist. So they don’t forgive, and they certainly won’t ever forget.

Laws need to be changed that anyone who is not a career criminal and hasn't been charged in 10 or more years, that file should get buried where the FBI can't even report it. It should only be kept for law enforcement to view in the case of new crimes committed. It shouldn't be left to the employer to make that decision. If they have a choice between someone who has a completely clean record and one that has a smudge, they will take the clean every time,

All humans make mistakes ...most just don't get caught. At the very least everyone should get a second chance in a case where no violence was involved. My nephew made a mistake in his early twenties and he's now in his late thirties trying to raise a family and has his nose clean but has a very difficult time due to one thing on his record from sixteen years ago. He's a great guy, dad, and husband. Needs another chance and shouldn't be tagged "Felon" forever..

Get a pardon from the governor. Every governor has an entire department that does nothing but hand out pardons. These ex cons just can't hold it together for five years.

 

[KJohnson]

I have always believed that we should forgive, if not forget, the crime of the individual once the debt has been paid. The problem is that too many people think that the punishment is not enough, or that the individual is a slobbering sadist. So they don’t forgive, and they certainly won’t ever forget.

Laws need to be changed that anyone who is not a career criminal and hasn't been charged in 10 or more years, that file should get buried where the FBI can't even report it. It should only be kept for law enforcement to view in the case of new crimes committed. It shouldn't be left to the employer to make that decision. If they have a choice between someone who has a completely clean record and one that has a smudge, they will take the clean every time,

All humans make mistakes ...most just don't get caught. At the very least everyone should get a second chance in a case where no violence was involved. My nephew made a mistake in his early twenties and he's now in his late thirties trying to raise a family and has his nose clean but has a very difficult time due to one thing on his record from sixteen years ago. He's a great guy, dad, and husband. Needs another chance and shouldn't be tagged "Felon" forever..

Get a pardon from the governor. Every governor has an entire department that does nothing but hand out pardons. These ex cons just can't hold it together for five years.

If that were you, where you had no where to turn, couldn't get a job, and starving or living on the streets, what would you do? Of course you would re-offend thinking why does it matter at that point if you have one or 20 convictions because either way, no one will ever forget and give you a second chance so what's the point of following the law? Five years would be an eternity in that case.