Totally unacceptable

[RetiredGySgt]

This is ignorant and Unconstitutional.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070908/ap_on_re_us/sex_offender_housing

This law should be thrown out.

 

[maineman]

what part of the story upsets you the most?

Do you believe that sex offenders CAN be rehabilitated?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Our legal system states that once you have served your sentence you have paid your debt to society. These laws deny that basic principle. They are cruel and unusual punishment outside the legal grounds of a court. They violate the basic human rights of the people effected by the laws, people that have served their sentence and been released , which again, in our system means they paid their debt.

The law seeks to permanently work corruption on a person even though legally they have paid their debt as required by our laws and our Constitution. It creates a subclass of people unable to find a place to live or work even though they are no longer in prison nor on parole or probation. It violates the rights of the person so effected. Violates in contrivance of our Constitution.

There was a 6 year old in the last few years that falls under this law. His crime? He kissed a classmate. It is ignorant and unacceptable.

 

[maineman]

so you do believe that criminals can be rehabilitated?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Amendment V applies as well...

Amendment V

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

Due process of law has not occurred to deny these people liberty or property. One can not pass a law that denies them this protection. These laws do JUST that. The original charge and conviction has been served. The Government can not now deny them liberty without a trial and specific charges.

And do not play the State versus Federal game either. The 14th Amendment negates that claim.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

By the way Maineman, I can not read what you post ( the whole Ignore thing) so no idea if your agreeing or disagreeing. Of course my experience with you is that anything I say you disagree with just to disagree with it.

 

[maineman]

I am trying to have a polite discussion with you...

and if you are not involved in that somehow, who the hell are you posting to?

do you believe in rehabilitation? It would seem that you do, to some degree.

and if you believe that, once criminals have paid their debt to society, that they ought to be treated no differently than any other citizen (whose "debts" are paid up), then do you support allowing them to vote?

 

[actsnoblemartin]

he is being polite, he is asking if you think criminals can be rehabilitated.

By the way Maineman, I can not read what you post ( the whole Ignore thing) so no idea if your agreeing or disagreeing. Of course my experience with you is that anything I say you disagree with just to disagree with it.

 

[actsnoblemartin]

I do not believe sex offenders can be re-habbed.

 

[actsnoblemartin]

this is exactly what maineman said

I am trying to have a polite discussion with you...

and if you are not involved in that somehow, who the hell are you posting to?

do you believe in rehabilitation? It would seem that you do, to some degree.

and if you believe that, once criminals have paid their debt to society, that they ought to be treated no differently than any other citizen (whose "debts" are paid up), then do you support allowing them to vote?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

this is exactly what maineman said

I am trying to have a polite discussion with you...

and if you are not involved in that somehow, who the hell are you posting to?

do you believe in rehabilitation? It would seem that you do, to some degree.

and if you believe that, once criminals have paid their debt to society, that they ought to be treated no differently than any other citizen (whose "debts" are paid up), then do you support allowing them to vote?

My personal opinion is that the right to Vote SHOULD be returned automaticly at the end of any penalties imposed. But voting is not a right persay. I think it should be though.

As for rehab, it does not matter one way or the other. If we think someone is a threat then the sentence should take care of the threat. Not some law that unconstitutional removes rights and protections promised to everyone. Someone serves their time, to include parole or probation then thats the end of their punishment for THAT crime. Thats how our system is supposed to work.

It is illegal and unconstitutional to punish them further without their having a day in court. A court has to punish them with a sentence after a trial. Laws can not be adapted that punish in this manner with no action by a court and no redress for the accused.

You want a law that does this? Make it part of the authorized sentence. Of course then you face the 8th amendment to the US Constitution, which these laws try to skirt.

 

[maineman]

I do not disagree with a single word of that.

Oddly enough, given the fact that RGS has me on ignore, he'll never know that fact.

 

[William Joyce]

It is illegal and unconstitutional to punish them further without their having a day in court. A court has to punish them with a sentence after a trial. Laws can not be adapted that punish in this manner with no action by a court and no redress for the accused.

You want a law that does this? Make it part of the authorized sentence. Of course then you face the 8th amendment to the US Constitution, which these laws try to skirt.

Agreed.

I am not soft on crime. If someone's a threat to society, can them. If not, free them. But this limbo-land is not working. The whole sex-offender "notification" crap is just a scarlet letter designed to make hyperactive mini-van moms feel good and let politicians preen.

Why not offer bad sex offenders a choice: stay in jail, or be castrated and go free?

 

[trobinett]

Agreed.

I am not soft on crime. If someone's a threat to society, can them. If not, free them. But this limbo-land is not working. The whole sex-offender "notification" crap is just a scarlet letter designed to make hyperactive mini-van moms feel good and let politicians preen.

Why not offer bad sex offenders a choice: stay in jail, or be castrated and go free?

Not sure I agree with the punishment, but I DO agree that what we have now isn't working.

Sex offenders, are a blight on society, and should be kept out of "main stream" society.

More times than not, William makes sense.................

 

[Alucard]

This is ignorant and Unconstitutional.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070908/ap_on_re_us/sex_offender_housing

This law should be thrown out.

What the hell is wrong with you people...???

This shitbag was convicted of two rapes and molesting a 10-year-old girl.

So this son of a bitch ruined the lives of 3 people and is released under the conditions that he wear an ankle bracelet and not live within 2,000' of a school, beach, or park, and thats unacceptable...?

First of all he did not pay his debt to society... he is paying it now... and being forced to move to a remote area is pretty mild punishment... He should have been given 30 days to find housing that meets the requirements of the law or be returned to prison ...

And I only say that to keep the bleedingheart liberals happy... In my opinion we should of killed the bastard after his first conviction.

 

[maineman]

And I only say that to keep the bleedingheart liberals happy... In my opinion we should of killed the bastard after his first conviction.

that sentence is really quite funny coming from a guy with an avatar like that!

Do you think that is the course of action that Jesus would recommend?

 

[ScreamingEagle]

that sentence is really quite funny coming from a guy with an avatar like that!

Do you think that is the course of action that Jesus would recommend?

Mohammed would.

If you don't believe in the death penalty, then how about he works his butt off busting rocks in jail for the rest of his life without parole? That might maybe pay back a small portion of the debt he owes to society and the 3 people he harmed.

After the crime is committed, a lifetime of forced work is the best rehab for shitbags like him and it will keep society safe. Get them off the streets permanently and make them useful to society. Why the hell should we offer rehab? He doesn't deserve it. The deed is done and there are no guarantees he won't do it again. If someone thinks he has a problem and wants to deal with it, he'd better get himself to a shrink before he commits a crime and winds up permanently in the slammer. Wouldn't that be a better approach?

I am sick of these bastards getting out and living the good life in ankle bracelets while their victims are either dead or destroyed for the rest of their lives... plus they're probably out there figuring devious new ways to get to their next victims without being caught.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

However he was NOT sentenced to life. That is the whole point. The legislature doesn't get to punish people outside the judiical system. He served his time and is on probation. Any "law" that makes it impossible to find housing is a VIOLATION of a persons rights under the Constitution. If he can't afford it, thats not a problem, when laws are written to exclude him from being able to find housing then that is in direct violation of the Constitution. This law effectivelly excludes him from living in any city or town in America, or in this case the State he is forced to remain in until his Parole is up.

You want tougher sentencing, PASS THOSE laws, and let a Jury convict him with the understanding thats the punishment he faces. THATS how it works.The current law violates the 5th and 8th Amendment to the Constitution as well as the entire intent of the Document.

 

[maineman]

I completely concur with RGS on this point.

 

[CSM]

I completely concur with RGS on this point.

Dang, it sure is cold down here in hell today! The whole place is frozen over!