Torture Is Not an American Value

[DiamondDave]

my point has always been, not everything you guys consider torture is in fact torture

bingo

 

[Iriemon]

And again treaties currently signed effect POWS only. We have no POW's We have spies and saboteurs.

Geneva does not apply to such. Historically water boarding was the least spies and saboteurs could expect at the hands of the enemy. Had Washington laid hands on Benedict Arnold he would have been hung. Both British and American spies during the War of independence were hung the is how they have historically been dealt with.

No one has disputed convicted spies should be shot; or terrorists for that matter.

Are you claiming Washington would have had Arnold tortured?

 

[JimH52]

McCain Votes Against Torture Ban

Earlier today, ThinkProgress noted that Sen. John McCain (R-AZ), a former prisoner of war, has spoken strongly in favor of implementing the Army Field Manual standard. When confronted today with the decision of whether to stick with his conscience or cave to the right wing, McCain chose to ditch his principles and instead vote to preserve waterboarding:

 

[Immanuel]

McCain Votes Against Torture Ban

Earlier today, ThinkProgress noted that Sen. John McCain (R-AZ), a former prisoner of war, has spoken strongly in favor of implementing the Army Field Manual standard. When confronted today with the decision of whether to stick with his conscience or cave to the right wing, McCain chose to ditch his principles and instead vote to preserve waterboarding:

John McCain has principles? Well, you learn something every day.

Immie

 

[JimH52]

John McCain HAD principles. He had to abandon them to gain the GOP nomination. He lost lots of support from moderates when he did.

 

[Immanuel]

John McCain HAD principles. He had to abandon them to gain the GOP nomination. He lost lots of support from moderates when he did.

I was more or less joking. Everyone has principles.

As for abandoning them to get the nomination, I'm sure you are right, but it seems to me that when a person runs for a political office such as President or Senator, there is no room for one's principles. If you believe you should stand by them, don't bother running for office because somewhere you will have to give them up or lose the election.

Immie

 

[SW2SILVERQUASI]

I love that picture of Jesus with an Assault rifle. Thou shalt kill, after all. Do unto others before they do unto you? Now wasn't Jesus tortured, wasn't Crucifixion a form of torture? Now, I think of Jesus being waterboarded, and living another day un-disfigured, and somehow, the whole American torture thing loses it's meaning, it seems might exaggerated. Jesus, they water board a major terrorist suspect something like 75 times in a month, he's still alive and doing well. Somehow, this seems more like a tempest in a teapot than something we all should spend sleepless nights freting over.

 

[TofuDog]

"As for abandoning them to get the nomination, I'm sure you are right, but it seems to me that when a person runs for a political office such as President or Senator, there is no room for one's principles. If you believe you should stand by them, don't bother running for office because somewhere you will have to give them up or lose the election."

So Obama and every other president ruled without principles? Ya, that sounds about right.

 

[Immanuel]

"As for abandoning them to get the nomination, I'm sure you are right, but it seems to me that when a person runs for a political office such as President or Senator, there is no room for one's principles. If you believe you should stand by them, don't bother running for office because somewhere you will have to give them up or lose the election."

So Obama and every other president ruled without principles? Ya, that sounds about right.

Not "without principles" as you state, but rather without standing by those principles. Obviously you understand what it means to abandon one's principles, so your question is somewhat ridiculous or maybe meant in a humorous tone which didn't come through.

One cannot simply throw away one's principles, but one can sell them to the highest bidder.

Immie

 

[JimH52]

I love that picture of Jesus with an Assault rifle. Thou shalt kill, after all. Do unto others before they do unto you? Now wasn't Jesus tortured, wasn't Crucifixion a form of torture? Now, I think of Jesus being waterboarded, and living another day un-disfigured, and somehow, the whole American torture thing loses it's meaning, it seems might exaggerated. Jesus, they water board a major terrorist suspect something like 75 times in a month, he's still alive and doing well. Somehow, this seems more like a tempest in a teapot than something we all should spend sleepless nights freting over.

So you think Jesus would authorize waterboarding? "Love your enemies" means nothing to you? You think Jesus would slam anyone against the wall? You have a very twisted idea of who Jesus was, as do many on the right who want America to accept the same interrogation methods that we have prosecuted for years. Very sad...

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

If it worked for them, it will work for US. It's all about being too cowardly to keep our values.

What this OP is about is promoting the interests of the enemies of the US; through the projection that the interrogation techniques used to cull time-sensitive information which is needed to proven the free associates who are secretly hiding amongst the general population of civilians, from executing the wholesale slaughter of those civilians... thus turning reality on it's head and portraying MASS MURDERERS as THE VICTIMS.

Nothing new here...

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

I love that picture of Jesus with an Assault rifle. Thou shalt kill, after all. Do unto others before they do unto you? Now wasn't Jesus tortured, wasn't Crucifixion a form of torture? Now, I think of Jesus being waterboarded, and living another day un-disfigured, and somehow, the whole American torture thing loses it's meaning, it seems might exaggerated. Jesus, they water board a major terrorist suspect something like 75 times in a month, he's still alive and doing well. Somehow, this seems more like a tempest in a teapot than something we all should spend sleepless nights freting over.

Ahh yes.. another secularist come to lament the immutable principles... and to do so through the misrepresentation of those principles.

I think when Jesus returns to earth, he is going to be bringing with him a brand of pain which 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 treatments of waterboarding could not hope to produce; and the whole 'Jesus is a doormat' notion will finally be laid to rest.

Let's recall that Christ came to earth for a reason... to PAY THE TAB which humanity could not pay.

Now it's always been fascinating to me, that where a guy lays down the rules; and because those rules were found to be beyond the means of the kingdom to follow he, subjects himself to PAY THE PENALTY... how is it that you idiots come to believe that THAT guy is about ANYTHING but accountability and where such requires MAJOR PAIN that such will not be implemented.

I mean if a guy is willing to subject himself to the unspeakable pain which Christ willingly subjected himself to... what makes ya think that he would be hesitant to subject you to the same?

ROFL... Idiots.