Tom Brady- The next Joe Montana?

[Erinwltr]

Noooooooooooooooooooooooo!

Just kidding. Not!

 

[Edgetho]

Joe Montana was a 'system quarterback'.

Steve Young proved that

 

[Jarlaxle]

Montana never cheated

Horse shit.

 

[rightwinger]

interesting comparisons this generation and the last.

Brady = Montana
-Lots of Rings. Undersized QB's that were efficient at their position and won the big games.

Manning = Marino
-Every major passing record will be his by the time he's done. But will he ever win a super Bowl?

McNabb = Elway
-Elway reached the Super Bowl 3 times before he finally won it on his 4th. McNabb hasnt reached one yet and his fortunes may change in the near future but the similarities are distinct. Elway and McNabb are savvy guys that were mobile in their early years and great passers moving foward. Both managed to CARRY their teams as far as they could. Maybe Mcnabb can do it this year but who knows

Roethlisberger = Farve
-Thats not a very deep comparison. But Farve was the young gun when Montana, MArino and Elway were making their last strides. Now Rothelisberger comes in with a fresh start.

Some food for thought.

Bart Starr...
FIVE NFL championships in SEVEN years.
Don’t expect that to be matched.

Packers needed to beat out 13 other teams to win the championship
You went through a 14 game seaso and went right to the championship

Now, you have to beat out 31 other teams and win at least three playoff games

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

interesting comparisons this generation and the last.

Brady = Montana
-Lots of Rings. Undersized QB's that were efficient at their position and won the big games.

Manning = Marino
-Every major passing record will be his by the time he's done. But will he ever win a super Bowl?

McNabb = Elway
-Elway reached the Super Bowl 3 times before he finally won it on his 4th. McNabb hasnt reached one yet and his fortunes may change in the near future but the similarities are distinct. Elway and McNabb are savvy guys that were mobile in their early years and great passers moving foward. Both managed to CARRY their teams as far as they could. Maybe Mcnabb can do it this year but who knows

Roethlisberger = Farve
-Thats not a very deep comparison. But Farve was the young gun when Montana, MArino and Elway were making their last strides. Now Rothelisberger comes in with a fresh start.

Some food for thought.

Bart Starr...
FIVE NFL championships in SEVEN years.
Don’t expect that to be matched.

Packers needed to beat out 13 other teams to win the championship
You went through a 14 game seaso and went right to the championship

Now, you have to beat out 31 other teams and win at least three playoff games

And you have 8 playoff spots to qualify as opposed to 2. The entire season was a playoff sequence.

 

[rightwinger]

interesting comparisons this generation and the last.

Brady = Montana
-Lots of Rings. Undersized QB's that were efficient at their position and won the big games.

Manning = Marino
-Every major passing record will be his by the time he's done. But will he ever win a super Bowl?

McNabb = Elway
-Elway reached the Super Bowl 3 times before he finally won it on his 4th. McNabb hasnt reached one yet and his fortunes may change in the near future but the similarities are distinct. Elway and McNabb are savvy guys that were mobile in their early years and great passers moving foward. Both managed to CARRY their teams as far as they could. Maybe Mcnabb can do it this year but who knows

Roethlisberger = Farve
-Thats not a very deep comparison. But Farve was the young gun when Montana, MArino and Elway were making their last strides. Now Rothelisberger comes in with a fresh start.

Some food for thought.

Bart Starr...
FIVE NFL championships in SEVEN years.
Don’t expect that to be matched.

Packers needed to beat out 13 other teams to win the championship
You went through a 14 game seaso and went right to the championship

Now, you have to beat out 31 other teams and win at least three playoff games

And you have 8 playoff spots to qualify as opposed to 2. The entire season was a playoff sequence.

Used to be you won a seven team division and you were in the championship game

Much much easier than having to win three or four playoff games

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

interesting comparisons this generation and the last.

Brady = Montana
-Lots of Rings. Undersized QB's that were efficient at their position and won the big games.

Manning = Marino
-Every major passing record will be his by the time he's done. But will he ever win a super Bowl?

McNabb = Elway
-Elway reached the Super Bowl 3 times before he finally won it on his 4th. McNabb hasnt reached one yet and his fortunes may change in the near future but the similarities are distinct. Elway and McNabb are savvy guys that were mobile in their early years and great passers moving foward. Both managed to CARRY their teams as far as they could. Maybe Mcnabb can do it this year but who knows

Roethlisberger = Farve
-Thats not a very deep comparison. But Farve was the young gun when Montana, MArino and Elway were making their last strides. Now Rothelisberger comes in with a fresh start.

Some food for thought.

Bart Starr...
FIVE NFL championships in SEVEN years.
Don’t expect that to be matched.

Packers needed to beat out 13 other teams to win the championship
You went through a 14 game seaso and went right to the championship

Now, you have to beat out 31 other teams and win at least three playoff games

And you have 8 playoff spots to qualify as opposed to 2. The entire season was a playoff sequence.

Used to be you won a seven team division and you were in the championship game

Much much easier than having to win three or four playoff games

But every game was a playoff game. No 2nd chances.

 

[rightwinger]

interesting comparisons this generation and the last.

Brady = Montana
-Lots of Rings. Undersized QB's that were efficient at their position and won the big games.

Manning = Marino
-Every major passing record will be his by the time he's done. But will he ever win a super Bowl?

McNabb = Elway
-Elway reached the Super Bowl 3 times before he finally won it on his 4th. McNabb hasnt reached one yet and his fortunes may change in the near future but the similarities are distinct. Elway and McNabb are savvy guys that were mobile in their early years and great passers moving foward. Both managed to CARRY their teams as far as they could. Maybe Mcnabb can do it this year but who knows

Roethlisberger = Farve
-Thats not a very deep comparison. But Farve was the young gun when Montana, MArino and Elway were making their last strides. Now Rothelisberger comes in with a fresh start.

Some food for thought.

Bart Starr...
FIVE NFL championships in SEVEN years.
Don’t expect that to be matched.

Packers needed to beat out 13 other teams to win the championship
You went through a 14 game seaso and went right to the championship

Now, you have to beat out 31 other teams and win at least three playoff games

And you have 8 playoff spots to qualify as opposed to 2. The entire season was a playoff sequence.

Used to be you won a seven team division and you were in the championship game

Much much easier than having to win three or four playoff games

But every game was a playoff game. No 2nd chances.

Not really

During th GB title runs there were maybe four quality NFL teams. GB also did not have to worry about losing players to free agency

Pats had to continually rebuild

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

Bart Starr...
FIVE NFL championships in SEVEN years.
Don’t expect that to be matched.

Packers needed to beat out 13 other teams to win the championship
You went through a 14 game seaso and went right to the championship

Now, you have to beat out 31 other teams and win at least three playoff games

And you have 8 playoff spots to qualify as opposed to 2. The entire season was a playoff sequence.

Used to be you won a seven team division and you were in the championship game

Much much easier than having to win three or four playoff games

But every game was a playoff game. No 2nd chances.

Not really

During th GB title runs there were maybe four quality NFL teams. GB also did not have to worry about losing players to free agency

Pats had to continually rebuild

There was no less parity in those days than now. What’s more, free agency provides better opportunity for teams to build now. Green Bay had plenty of changeover in the 60’s.
Bottom line is Starr won as many in fewer years. Way fewer. And he didn’t have the rules in place that allow linemen to extend their arms, open their hands and even hold to a degree. Eligible receivers were not given free reign beyond one contact within five yards of the LOS and linemen were not allowed to block downfield on passes completed behind the LOS.
Starr did more in less time with more restrictions.

 

[Jitss617]

Brady lives 10
Mins from me.. he’s the man!

 

[rightwinger]

Packers needed to beat out 13 other teams to win the championship
You went through a 14 game seaso and went right to the championship

Now, you have to beat out 31 other teams and win at least three playoff games

And you have 8 playoff spots to qualify as opposed to 2. The entire season was a playoff sequence.

Used to be you won a seven team division and you were in the championship game

Much much easier than having to win three or four playoff games

But every game was a playoff game. No 2nd chances.

Not really

During th GB title runs there were maybe four quality NFL teams. GB also did not have to worry about losing players to free agency

Pats had to continually rebuild

There was no less parity in those days than now. What’s more, free agency provides better opportunity for teams to build now. Green Bay had plenty of changeover in the 60’s.
Bottom line is Starr won as many in fewer years. Way fewer. And he didn’t have the rules in place that allow linemen to extend their arms, open their hands and even hold to a degree. Eligible receivers were not given free reign beyond one contact within five yards of the LOS and linemen were not allowed to block downfield on passes completed behind the LOS.
Starr did more in less time with more restrictions.

Starr played 16 years and won 5 NFL championships
Brady has played 18 years and won 9 AFC championships

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

And you have 8 playoff spots to qualify as opposed to 2. The entire season was a playoff sequence.

Used to be you won a seven team division and you were in the championship game

Much much easier than having to win three or four playoff games

But every game was a playoff game. No 2nd chances.

Not really

During th GB title runs there were maybe four quality NFL teams. GB also did not have to worry about losing players to free agency

Pats had to continually rebuild

There was no less parity in those days than now. What’s more, free agency provides better opportunity for teams to build now. Green Bay had plenty of changeover in the 60’s.
Bottom line is Starr won as many in fewer years. Way fewer. And he didn’t have the rules in place that allow linemen to extend their arms, open their hands and even hold to a degree. Eligible receivers were not given free reign beyond one contact within five yards of the LOS and linemen were not allowed to block downfield on passes completed behind the LOS.
Starr did more in less time with more restrictions.

Starr played 16 years and won 5 NFL championships
Brady has played 18 years and won 9 AFC championships

Starr won 5 in 7 years.

 

[rightwinger]

Used to be you won a seven team division and you were in the championship game

Much much easier than having to win three or four playoff games

But every game was a playoff game. No 2nd chances.

Not really

During th GB title runs there were maybe four quality NFL teams. GB also did not have to worry about losing players to free agency

Pats had to continually rebuild

There was no less parity in those days than now. What’s more, free agency provides better opportunity for teams to build now. Green Bay had plenty of changeover in the 60’s.
Bottom line is Starr won as many in fewer years. Way fewer. And he didn’t have the rules in place that allow linemen to extend their arms, open their hands and even hold to a degree. Eligible receivers were not given free reign beyond one contact within five yards of the LOS and linemen were not allowed to block downfield on passes completed behind the LOS.
Starr did more in less time with more restrictions.

Starr played 16 years and won 5 NFL championships
Brady has played 18 years and won 9 AFC championships

Starr won 5 in 7 years.

Again, with a lower bar
Brady won 5 AFC titles in 7 years

Same level of difficulty

 

[SandSquid]

interesting comparisons this generation and the last.

Brady = Montana
-Lots of Rings. Undersized QB's that were efficient at their position and won the big games.

Manning = Marino
-Every major passing record will be his by the time he's done. But will he ever win a super Bowl?

McNabb = Elway
-Elway reached the Super Bowl 3 times before he finally won it on his 4th. McNabb hasnt reached one yet and his fortunes may change in the near future but the similarities are distinct. Elway and McNabb are savvy guys that were mobile in their early years and great passers moving foward. Both managed to CARRY their teams as far as they could. Maybe Mcnabb can do it this year but who knows

Roethlisberger = Farve
-Thats not a very deep comparison. But Farve was the young gun when Montana, MArino and Elway were making their last strides. Now Rothelisberger comes in with a fresh start.

Some food for thought.

Bart Starr...
FIVE NFL championships in SEVEN years.
Don’t expect that to be matched.

Packers needed to beat out 13 other teams to win the championship
You went through a 14 game seaso and went right to the championship

Now, you have to beat out 31 other teams and win at least three playoff games

And you have 8 playoff spots to qualify as opposed to 2. The entire season was a playoff sequence.

That is true. Imagine if all you needed was the best record in the Conference? OI think both of those have a flip side, but just numerically, finishing on top of a 10-16 team league is much easier than finishing on top of a 32 team league.

 

[SandSquid]

Packers needed to beat out 13 other teams to win the championship
You went through a 14 game seaso and went right to the championship

Now, you have to beat out 31 other teams and win at least three playoff games

And you have 8 playoff spots to qualify as opposed to 2. The entire season was a playoff sequence.

Used to be you won a seven team division and you were in the championship game

Much much easier than having to win three or four playoff games

But every game was a playoff game. No 2nd chances.

Not really

During th GB title runs there were maybe four quality NFL teams. GB also did not have to worry about losing players to free agency

Pats had to continually rebuild

There was no less parity in those days than now. What’s more, free agency provides better opportunity for teams to build now. Green Bay had plenty of changeover in the 60’s.
Bottom line is Starr won as many in fewer years. Way fewer. And he didn’t have the rules in place that allow linemen to extend their arms, open their hands and even hold to a degree. Eligible receivers were not given free reign beyond one contact within five yards of the LOS and linemen were not allowed to block downfield on passes completed behind the LOS.
Starr did more in less time with more restrictions.

While free agency can help a team, it can also ruin a team. I don't see anything that makes it inherently easier to win with FA. Before that, if you had great players and someone else wanted them, they had to trade you for them, or wait for you to release them.

FA has positives. Can fill a hole with an experienced player in a pinch. Those who run it well are at an advantage.

And negatives. Nobody is there to pull apart a dynasty by offering more money. Those who mess up at it struggle.


For me, even though I love Joe and hate Tom, I think I'm giving it to Tom. Yeah Joe was perfect in the SB (no int's and no losses), but Tom's so consistent, has some MASSIVE playoff games, and just doesn't stop playing at an elite level.

Yes I think Joe had a nice advantage, combining the WCO with the new rule change to open up the offense. Was night and day seeing some of those QB's in the WCO and out of it. And Tom has his advantages as well.

But today while it is easier to throw, its so much more put on the QB. I love Starr, but he was able to win championships with a game where he completed 9 passes for 85 yards. Brady lost one where he had 500 yards and 3 TD's.

Starr could make the post-season and be the SB favorite (and win it) in a year he completed less than 10 passes a game, and had a really rough year.

Gone are the days the run game paced your offense. The years where the Packers would run the ball about 150 times more than they threw it. That's flipped now, the pressure is on the QB on nearly every play.

It's so tough comparing across era's. Different game. Different training and off-seasons. Different rules. Different medical technology...

But it's hard to say that the guy winning in a QB driven league isn't the best.

I get the "Starr had a lot of championships in a short while."

Star won one every 3.12 years.
Sid Luckman won one every 3 years
Otto Graham won one ever 2 years in the NFL, and never played without winning a championship game. (fun fact, in his pro football and pro basketball career he went to the championship 11 times in 11 years).

To me, Bradshaw winning as many Championships as Montana, but in fewer years doesn't make Terry the better QB.

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

interesting comparisons this generation and the last.

Brady = Montana
-Lots of Rings. Undersized QB's that were efficient at their position and won the big games.

Manning = Marino
-Every major passing record will be his by the time he's done. But will he ever win a super Bowl?

McNabb = Elway
-Elway reached the Super Bowl 3 times before he finally won it on his 4th. McNabb hasnt reached one yet and his fortunes may change in the near future but the similarities are distinct. Elway and McNabb are savvy guys that were mobile in their early years and great passers moving foward. Both managed to CARRY their teams as far as they could. Maybe Mcnabb can do it this year but who knows

Roethlisberger = Farve
-Thats not a very deep comparison. But Farve was the young gun when Montana, MArino and Elway were making their last strides. Now Rothelisberger comes in with a fresh start.

Some food for thought.

Bart Starr...
FIVE NFL championships in SEVEN years.
Don’t expect that to be matched.

Packers needed to beat out 13 other teams to win the championship
You went through a 14 game seaso and went right to the championship

Now, you have to beat out 31 other teams and win at least three playoff games

And you have 8 playoff spots to qualify as opposed to 2. The entire season was a playoff sequence.

That is true. Imagine if all you needed was the best record in the Conference? OI think both of those have a flip side, but just numerically, finishing on top of a 10-16 team league is much easier than finishing on top of a 32 team league.

Not when you need only to finish fourth.

 

[SandSquid]

interesting comparisons this generation and the last.

Brady = Montana
-Lots of Rings. Undersized QB's that were efficient at their position and won the big games.

Manning = Marino
-Every major passing record will be his by the time he's done. But will he ever win a super Bowl?

McNabb = Elway
-Elway reached the Super Bowl 3 times before he finally won it on his 4th. McNabb hasnt reached one yet and his fortunes may change in the near future but the similarities are distinct. Elway and McNabb are savvy guys that were mobile in their early years and great passers moving foward. Both managed to CARRY their teams as far as they could. Maybe Mcnabb can do it this year but who knows

Roethlisberger = Farve
-Thats not a very deep comparison. But Farve was the young gun when Montana, MArino and Elway were making their last strides. Now Rothelisberger comes in with a fresh start.

Some food for thought.

Bart Starr...
FIVE NFL championships in SEVEN years.
Don’t expect that to be matched.

Packers needed to beat out 13 other teams to win the championship
You went through a 14 game seaso and went right to the championship

Now, you have to beat out 31 other teams and win at least three playoff games

And you have 8 playoff spots to qualify as opposed to 2. The entire season was a playoff sequence.

That is true. Imagine if all you needed was the best record in the Conference? OI think both of those have a flip side, but just numerically, finishing on top of a 10-16 team league is much easier than finishing on top of a 32 team league.

Not when you need only to finish fourth.

In a 16 team league, making the Championship is the same as having a top 2 record in the AFC. (top 2 teams in a 16 team league by record with the 60's Packers winning some with a 14 team league... or bye week in the 16 team AFC playoffs). 12 times the Patriots have done that under Brady.

Now instead of that top 2 record getting them an automatic ticket to the championship game, it gets them a bye week where they have to win 2 more playoff games. All your dominance all year for your record resets... twice, to sniff the SB.

So the equivalent of 12 Championship game appearances that they would have in a 16 team league. If you don't want to round for the packers favor, you can take out two teams for the 14 team league the Packers 60's dynasty started in, and you'd have an expected rate of 13.7 championship game appearances.

 

[rightwinger]

There is also the Jerry Rice factor

Montana had the advantage of throwing to the greatest receiver in history. Double up Rice and he had John Taylor. Tried to take out his wide receivers and he killed you with Roger Craig

Brady had different receivers and running backs throughout his career. None superstars

 

[Natural Citizen]

Brady is no Favre and never will be, so Montana's the next best to try to emulate, I guess.

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

Bart Starr...
FIVE NFL championships in SEVEN years.
Don’t expect that to be matched.

Packers needed to beat out 13 other teams to win the championship
You went through a 14 game seaso and went right to the championship

Now, you have to beat out 31 other teams and win at least three playoff games

And you have 8 playoff spots to qualify as opposed to 2. The entire season was a playoff sequence.

That is true. Imagine if all you needed was the best record in the Conference? OI think both of those have a flip side, but just numerically, finishing on top of a 10-16 team league is much easier than finishing on top of a 32 team league.

Not when you need only to finish fourth.

In a 16 team league, making the Championship is the same as having a top 2 record in the AFC. (top 2 teams in a 16 team league by record with the 60's Packers winning some with a 14 team league... or bye week in the 16 team AFC playoffs). 12 times the Patriots have done that under Brady.

Now instead of that top 2 record getting them an automatic ticket to the championship game, it gets them a bye week where they have to win 2 more playoff games. All your dominance all year for your record resets... twice, to sniff the SB.

So the equivalent of 12 Championship game appearances that they would have in a 16 team league. If you don't want to round for the packers favor, you can take out two teams for the 14 team league the Packers 60's dynasty started in, and you'd have an expected rate of 13.7 championship game appearances.

There are currently 12 teams that make the playoffs out of 32 teams. That would mean it’s 3 times easier to make the playoffs than it was in 1966.
1967 divided the league into 4 divisions so 4 teams of 16 made the post-season. That still would equate to only 8 teams now as opposed to 12.
The current 16-game season allows for a greater chance to make up for earlier losses. Combined, it’s much easier now to make the post-season than in Starr’s era.
The rules changes that currently protect QBs now also allow for longer careers.