To the victor go the spoils...

[Bullypulpit]

The socialism you love cause economies to shrink, here, in this world. Moral relativism leads to personal irresponsiblity and an inability to care for oneself, here in this world.

Socialism is the failed bastard child of Marx and Engels, both of whom were upper class twits. Where you get moral relativism from consequentialist ethics is beyond me. You can't get more objective that rooting your ethics in the consequences of your actions on this life and in this world.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Socialism is the failed bastard child of Marx and Engels, both of whom were upper class twits. Where you get moral relativism from consequentialist ethics is beyond me. You can't get more objective that rooting your ethics in the consequences of your actions on this life and in this world.

You're operating on the premise that liberalism is equivalent to consequentialist ethics. You're always going on about it, with your "here in this world" mantra, but the rest of your party has not picked up the talking point from you.

When I continually point out to you that the consequences of liberal policies lead to shrinking economies HERE IN THIS WORLD, which means people lose jobs, etc, HERE IN THIS WORLD, you never give a convincing response.


RE:Moral Reltivism

This is what I said, "Moral relativism leads to personal irresponsiblity and an inability to care for oneself, here in this world." We need rules for living with each other, this is what morality boils down to. WHen I say "morality", i don't mean strict christian morality, or jewish, or islamic. We can abstract principles from all of these sources, plus others, for use in the construction of a pluralist, mulitcultural society, WHICH IS WHAT WE HAVE NOW. Contrary to new liberal propaganda, George Bush is not going to try to install a Christian Theocracy.

 

[Avatar4321]

can we say "coat-hanger abortions?"

among many other things that will happen if an archconservative is put on the supreme court, this is the one thing that haunts me the most. it would finalize the deep failure of democratic and republican leaders for decades.

i don't believe in a woman's right, but neither do i believe the government should outlaw it.

my beef and my hope would be that leaders would address many of the side problems that make abortion often appear to be the only choice for some misled, poorly advised, desperate women.

the adoption system in this country is f*****. planned parenthood is a sick joke. the sex education system in this country's a joke.

Nato, there are time like these that i dont understand what your thinking. We should let abortion be legal because people are going to break the law anyway? There are alot of laws that people are going to break regardless. Should we legalize stealing? Maybe create a thieves guild to have the government regulate it. Give them a quota of how much they have to steal each month and tax it and if they steal more the get thrown in prison. That way any unrecognized theives would take out their competition and we wouldnt have to worry about funding police as much. I mean if stealing is going to happen anyway we may as well legalize it so we can regulate and tax it.

My position on abortion isnt hard to figure out. I think its one of the few things this nation has ever legalized thats worse than slavery. Atleast with slavery the slaves had a life, had a chance to be well taken care of and had a chance to be free someday. a child who is killed by abortion doesnt even get that right. And why? Because mommy and daddy cant take responsibility for themselves.

There are millions of families who would love to be able to adopt children. Adoption laws can be cleaned up a bit but we should be able to encourage it more than abortion. We need to create a culture of life and family. Some people may not want it outlawed, but we as a society cannot survive if we promote abortion. If we continue to take life for granted we will become just as barbaric as the terrorists trying to kill us. Honestly i think there are too many people that barbaric as it is.

Ironically it may have been abortion that has caused them the last two election. If liberals werent busy killing their children but instead raising them to beleive as they do there would be alot more Democrat voters. But i guess this is darwinism at its finest. survival of the fittest.

 

[5stringJeff]

can we say "coat-hanger abortions?"

among many other things that will happen if an archconservative is put on the supreme court, this is the one thing that haunts me the most. it would finalize the deep failure of democratic and republican leaders for decades.

i don't believe in a woman's right, but neither do i believe the government should outlaw it.

my beef and my hope would be that leaders would address many of the side problems that make abortion often appear to be the only choice for some misled, poorly advised, desperate women.

the adoption system in this country is f*****. planned parenthood is a sick joke. the sex education system in this country's a joke.

All right NATO, here's my two cents:

First, your coat hangar abortion remark sounds like the knee jerk reaction of NOW and NARAL.
Now, to the solutions: I firmly believe that abortion is immoral. I also believe that Roe v. Wade is the worst possible way to impose abortion on America. Roe v. Wade should be overturned not because it legalizes abortion, but because it installs nationwide abortion by judicial fiat. Abortion laws should be left up to the states to decide. In the meantime, no federal tax dollars should be given to any group (to include Planned Parenthood) that performs abortions.

 

[Avatar4321]

All right NATO, here's my two cents:

First, your coat hangar abortion remark sounds like the knee jerk reaction of NOW and NARAL.
Now, to the solutions: I firmly believe that abortion is immoral. I also believe that Roe v. Wade is the worst possible way to impose abortion on America. Roe v. Wade should be overturned not because it legalizes abortion, but because it installs nationwide abortion by judicial fiat. Abortion laws should be left up to the states to decide. In the meantime, no federal tax dollars should be given to any group (to include Planned Parenthood) that performs abortions.

I could deffinately agree with this. Overturn Roe v Wade and let the states decide. its atleast altitle more acceptable than this situtation.

 

[NATO AIR]

.
i don't believe in a woman's right, but neither do i believe the government should outlaw it.

my beef and my hope would be that leaders would address many of the side problems that make abortion often appear to be the only choice for some misled, poorly advised, desperate women.

the adoption system in this country is f*****. planned parenthood is a sick joke. the sex education system in this country's a joke.

here's the thing. the federal government and states have failed for so long to create an adequate, all-encompassing system that reduces the number of unwanted pregnancies.

it should not cost 40,000 or more to adopt a child in this nation. it should be more like 4,000 or less. i guarantee 70% of the women who have abortions would probably have the kid if they could have a guaranteed quick adoption for the kid, instead of the kid being stuck in an orphanage for a year or more.

a sad thing too is, many of the anti-abortion and pro-abortion forces in this country make too much money raising funds to support their position to really, truly bring an end to this problem. they're corrupt off of power and money now.

i think abortion is immoral and wrong, but until the federal and state governments start talking about real reform and real change that can take care of women in this situation and their unwanted babies, i don't want to see a change in roe vs. wade because there will be illegal abortions that will get people killed.

if pres. bush wanted to overhaul the adoption and healthcare system in this nation quickly, and then roe vs. wade gets overturned, i'll be thrilled. i just don't see it happening.

 

[Bullypulpit]

You're operating on the premise that liberalism is equivalent to consequentialist ethics. You're always going on about it, with your "here in this world" mantra, but the rest of your party has not picked up the talking point from you.

When I continually point out to you that the consequences of liberal policies lead to shrinking economies HERE IN THIS WORLD, which means people lose jobs, etc, HERE IN THIS WORLD, you never give a convincing response.


RE:Moral Reltivism

This is what I said, "Moral relativism leads to personal irresponsiblity and an inability to care for oneself, here in this world." We need rules for living with each other, this is what morality boils down to. WHen I say "morality", i don't mean strict christian morality, or jewish, or islamic. We can abstract principles from all of these sources, plus others, for use in the construction of a pluralist, mulitcultural society, WHICH IS WHAT WE HAVE NOW. Contrary to new liberal propaganda, George Bush is not going to try to install a Christian Theocracy.

Assuming responsibility for one's own actions is the first and foremost duty of the citizens of any healthy society. By extension, assuming responsibility for their actions is the first and foremost duty of thase chosen to lead that society. This means that the consequences of government actions upon the members of a given society, from its least to its greatest, must be considered in the formulation of government policy, all policy.

If that is liberalism, then I'm a liberal.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Assuming responsibility for one's own actions is the first and foremost duty of the citizens of any healthy society. By extension, assuming responsibility for their actions is the first and foremost duty of thase chosen to lead that society. This means that the consequences of government actions upon the members of a given society, from its least to its greatest, must be considered in the formulation of government policy, all policy.

If that is liberalism, then I'm a liberal.

YES and your policy of excessive taxation and overregulation causes the economy to shrink and people lose jobs, here in this world. Why do you consider a statgnating economy beneficial? ecology?

 

[TheEnemyWithin]

YEAH BUDDY! Another four years of a cognitively impaired dry-drunk with his finger on the trigger, and on a mission from God!

Bully, there aren't enough BS flags on earth to slap on all your messages....

 

[Avatar4321]

Assuming responsibility for one's own actions is the first and foremost duty of the citizens of any healthy society. By extension, assuming responsibility for their actions is the first and foremost duty of thase chosen to lead that society. This means that the consequences of government actions upon the members of a given society, from its least to its greatest, must be considered in the formulation of government policy, all policy.

If that is liberalism, then I'm a liberal.

What the heck are you talking about Bully? Taking responsibility for ones own actions is the last thing you or your liberal buddies are advocating. You are the guys that complained that we shouldnt take care of Saddam because "we created him." You are the guys that are advocating that we outsource our national security to France, Germany, and the other useless nations on the UN. How the heck are we assuming responsibility by refusing to secure ourselves but telling other nations they need to do it? How the heck is it taking responsibility for our actions by encouraging people to let the government take care of their problems and making them dependent on social programs that destroy them rather than help them like they are supposed to do? How the heck is it responsible to tell people to be immoral as they want and there is no consequence? how is it responsible to support the murder of an innocent child before its born? How is it responsible to tell people to follow after their lusts rather than helping them overcome their lusts and be a productive part of society? How is it responsible to encourage children to have sex? How is it responsible to allow politicians spend as much as they want without any limits and then fine any citizen if the spend money advertising against those politicians in an election? What on earth is responsible about your sick liberal ideas and the corruption its brought on this great nation?