Three Questions I Would Like Answers Too

[Nuc]

The Jewish people have a right to exist, there are plenty of muslim countries for muslims why is there such outcry for ONE jewish nation?

The Holocaust was a European issue. Most of the "Israelis" are Europeans. Israel should have been located in Europe. Or in some other negotiated area. For example if they want to live in a desert maybe they could have negotiated with Australia for a larger hunk of the outback than the dust they occupy in "Israel". Or we could give them Nebraska or part of Arizona.

I don't buy the argument about wanting access to "holy sites" etc. A religion that can't stand on its philosophy and needs physical access to specific sites is weak. There is no reason the entire world should be threatened because some European Jews want to show the Palestinians who is boss.

If they need specific sites build replicas such as those in Las Vegas.

 

[Gunny]

The Holocaust was a European issue. Most of the "Israelis" are Europeans. Israel should have been located in Europe. Or in some other negotiated area. For example if they want to live in a desert maybe they could have negotiated with Australia for a larger hunk of the outback than the dust they occupy in "Israel". Or we could give them Nebraska or part of Arizona.

I don't buy the argument about wanting access to "holy sites" etc. A religion that can't stand on its philosophy and needs physical access to specific sites is weak. There is no reason the entire world should be threatened because some European Jews want to show the Palestinians who is boss.

If they need specific sites build replicas such as those in Las Vegas.

Israel IS a negotiated area. When you get your butt kicked in a war and lose your land, "to the victors go the spoils." And while that is not current conventional wisdom, it was throughtout history up to and including WWII. Transjordan was taken away from the Ottoman's following WWI.

I really can't understand how people who decry racial/cultural discrimination in this Nation can turn around and defend the xenophobic Muslims who feel justified in murdering anyone that believes differently than they.

 

[Nuc]

Israel IS a negotiated area. When you get your butt kicked in a war and lose your land, "to the victors go the spoils." And while that is not current conventional wisdom, it was throughtout history up to and including WWII. Transjordan was taken away from the Ottoman's following WWI.

I really can't understand how people who decry racial/cultural discrimination in this Nation can turn around and defend the xenophobic Muslims who feel justified in murdering anyone that believes differently than they.

I am not defending Muslims. I despise the rise of Islamofascism. I'm just saying that the world would be a safer place if Israel was located anywhere else than where it is now.

As someone who is not a Muslim or a Jew, it offends me that their little squabbles put the entire world at risk of annihilation.

Do you think the world is safer with Israel where it is, rather than say the middle of Australia or Greenland?

 

[CSM]

...
I don't buy the argument about wanting access to "holy sites" etc. A religion that can't stand on its philosophy and needs physical access to specific sites is weak. There is no reason the entire world should be threatened because some European Jews want to show the Palestinians who is boss.

If they need specific sites build replicas such as those in Las Vegas.

Great!! Then maybe the Catholic Church should build the "Vatican Hotel and Casino" and give the little tiny chunk of land back to the Italians. After all, all that architecture there is merely symbolic and surely the Catholic Church can stand on its philosophy. Catholics dont NEED physical access to those sites, right?


Sarcasm folks...and in no way intended to insult Catholics.

 

[Nuc]

Great!! Then maybe the Catholic Church should build the "Vatican Hotel and Casino" and give the little tiny chunk of land back to the Italians. After all, all that architecture there is merely symbolic and surely the Catholic Church can stand on its philosophy. Catholics dont NEED physical access to those sites, right?


Sarcasm folks...and in no way intended to insult Catholics.

I used to live in Rome and I had an apartment about 4 blocks away from the Vatican. Wish I still had that.

The Italians do not resent the presence of the Vatican there. It's also not likely that the Vatican being located in the middle of Rome and Italy will lead to wars, terrorism and the potential of nuclear or other disaster. Another thing is that no Italians have been displaced to make room for Catholics from let's just say, South America.

Bad analogy.

 

[CSM]

I used to live in Rome and I had an apartment about 4 blocks away from the Vatican. Wish I still had that.

The Italians do not resent the presence of the Vatican there. It's also not likely that the Vatican being located in the middle of Rome and Italy will lead to wars, terrorism and the potential of nuclear or other disaster. Another thing is that no Italians have been displaced to make room for Catholics from let's just say, South America.

Bad analogy.

You missed the point (surprise surprise). Your comment was:

I don't buy the argument about wanting access to "holy sites" etc. A religion that can't stand on its philosophy and needs physical access to specific sites is weak. There is no reason the entire world should be threatened because some European Jews want to show the Palestinians who is boss.

If they need specific sites build replicas such as those in Las Vegas.

You denigrate the Israelis for wanting access to 'holy sites' yet dismiss the same desire in Christians. The religion of Islam is even more vehement in their stance about access to holy sites; so much so that mosques are used as a refuge for terrorists under the guise of religious dogma. The peaceful religion is SO vehement about access to holy sites that they have engaged in jihad for centuries over that very thing. If we believe your original premise that the Jewish and Christian faiths are weak because of dependence on holy sites then Islam is truly a sham.

Why did you not avow that the world would be a safer place if the Palestinians had a homeland in Jordan or anywhere else? I suspect I know the answer to that question.

 

[Nuc]

You missed the point (surprise surprise). Your comment was:

I don't buy the argument about wanting access to "holy sites" etc. A religion that can't stand on its philosophy and needs physical access to specific sites is weak. There is no reason the entire world should be threatened because some European Jews want to show the Palestinians who is boss.

If they need specific sites build replicas such as those in Las Vegas.

And I stand behind that. I think it was a mistake to locate "Israel" in its current location for the benefit of Europeans in response to a European problem. And I don't think any religion is important enough to put world peace at risk.

 

[CSM]

And I stand behind that. I think it was a mistake to locate "Israel" in its current location for the benefit of Europeans in response to a European problem. And I don't think any religion is important enough to put world peace at risk.

While I agree religion is a piss poor excuse for ANY war (or even a minor argument); I am not so sure locating Israel where it is (even if it was for the benefit of Europeans in response to a European problem) has any bearing on the real issue.

I agree that its geographical location provides a convenient excuse for jihad, but I think the world is beginning to realize that the Islamic fanatics don't really need that excuse. The fact that Muslims are stuck in the Middle Ages (socially, culturally, religiously, etc) has a more fundamental bearing on the issues.

I guess what I am saying is that the elimination/relocation of Israel at this point in time will alter nothing except to demonstrate that the Islamic fundamentalists are using the right tactcs and bolster their already perverted view of reality.

 

[Nuc]

While I agree religion is a piss poor excuse for ANY war (or even a minor argument); I am not so sure locating Israel where it is (even if it was for the benefit of Europeans in response to a European problem) has any bearing on the real issue.

I agree that its geographical location provides a convenient excuse for jihad, but I think the world is beginning to realize that the Islamic fanatics don't really need that excuse. The fact that Muslims are stuck in the Middle Ages (socially, culturally, religiously, etc) has a more fundamental bearing on the issues.

I guess what I am saying is that the elimination/relocation of Israel at this point in time will alter nothing except to demonstrate that the Islamic fundamentalists are using the right tactcs and bolster their already perverted view of reality.

I can agree with that.

 

[MtnBiker]

The fact that Muslims are stuck in the Middle Ages (socially, culturally, religiously, etc) has a more fundamental bearing on the issues.

And for the most part economically. Except for oil exports they offer little more in global trade. It always amazes me to watch footage of the Arab Street, it seems any day of the week there can be thousands of men ranting and raving up an down the street all day long. Working class people who are actually contributing something to society have little oppurtuninty to do that at the drop of a hat.

 

[CSM]

And for the most part economically. Except for oil exports they offer little more in global trade. It always amazes me to watch footage of the Arab Street, it seems any day of the week there can be thousands of men ranting and raving up an down the street all day long. Working class people who are actually contributing something to society have little oppurtuninty to do that at the drop of a hat.

Whats a little ranting and raving to a people that drop everything to pray FIVE times a day? Hmmm...maybe that is why Arab culture hasn't had time to develop beyond the Middle Ages!

 

[MtnBiker]

And their resentment of prosperous nations will continue to grow.

Perhaps if well all lived in mud huts the muslims would feel better about themselves.

 

[CSM]

And their resentment of prosperous nations will continue to grow.

Perhaps if well all lived in mud huts the muslims would feel better about themselves.

Only if it was a MUSLIM mud hut!

 

[David2004]

The United States government cannot have domination over the United Nations and in the Middle East without being held responsible to the international community of nations. With so many of the problems growing out of control in the United States as well as in the rest of the world it is time to address them. They break down into two main groups foreign and domestic problems and sometimes they overlap. The fact that the United States consumes 25% of the world’s oil is clearly one of them. The fact was most of the personal and equipment of the National Guards of the State of Louisiana and Mississippi during Hurricane Katrina was over in Iraq is another one.

The United States domestic policies should clearly serve in what is in the best interest of the American people. The United States Foreign Policies have to serve in what is in the best interest of the people in the world at large while serving the American people interest too. Today this is very out of balance with the gigantic corporate special interest groups controlling the United States government policies to serve their own self-interest. This has compounded many of our old problems into the larger ones we face today.

The modern industrial world has not proven its satiability over the course of a long period time. To be able to build without maintaining into the future is not progress. The course we decide to take over the next five to ten years will greatly influence where we will be in fifty years from now. Many of the cornerstones of the past will not support the current growth and demands of the world of tomorrow. A better balance between the global population growth, the consumption of the world’s natural resources and environment is needed for the security and future of mankind.

Without the United States making major changes to its domestic and foreign policies very soon. Chaos and Wars will take over the internationally leading to the collapse of the international financial markets. The following are some links to some of the needed changes that must come about very soon.

Peace Reform
http://peacereform.blogspot.com/

Next Step to Road Map to Peace
http://globalcrier.blogspot.com/2006/02/next-step-on-road-map-to-peace.html

Global Base Currency
http://globalcrier.blogspot.com/2006/02/global-base-currency.html

Balancing the Best Interest between the Mega Corporations
http://globalcrier.blogspot.com/2006/02/balancing-best-interest-between-mega.html

International Crude Oil Export Tax (OET)
http://globalcrier.blogspot.com/2006/01/international-crude-oil-export-tax-oet.html

 

[Gunny]

I am not defending Muslims. I despise the rise of Islamofascism. I'm just saying that the world would be a safer place if Israel was located anywhere else than where it is now.

As someone who is not a Muslim or a Jew, it offends me that their little squabbles put the entire world at risk of annihilation.

Do you think the world is safer with Israel where it is, rather than say the middle of Australia or Greenland?

I'm more than willing to give them California, Oregon and Washington State.

I do not think the existence of Israel has anything to do with Islamofacism. I think the fact that people exist (to include us) who do not think the way the Islamofascists say we should is the problem.

Perhaps Israel was the beginning .... or was Muhammed? Either way, the Islamofascists have gone global. They've attacked Europe, the UK, the US, Chechnya, taken control of Iran, and generally done what they please to whoever they please with little fear of reprisal.

In a battle of survival, I'm choosing sides, and it ain't theirs.

 

[Gunny]

The United States government cannot have domination over the United Nations and in the Middle East without being held responsible to the international community of nations. With so many of the problems growing out of control in the United States as well as in the rest of the world it is time to address them. They break down into two main groups foreign and domestic problems and sometimes they overlap. The fact that the United States consumes 25% of the world’s oil is clearly one of them. The fact was most of the personal and equipment of the National Guards of the State of Louisiana and Mississippi during Hurricane Katrina was over in Iraq is another one.

The United States domestic policies should clearly serve in what is in the best interest of the American people. The United States Foreign Policies have to serve in what is in the best interest of the people in the world at large while serving the American people interest too. Today this is very out of balance with the gigantic corporate special interest groups controlling the United States government policies to serve their own self-interest. This has compounded many of our old problems into the larger ones we face today.

The modern industrial world has not proven its satiability over the course of a long period time. To be able to build without maintaining into the future is not progress. The course we decide to take over the next five to ten years will greatly influence where we will be in fifty years from now. Many of the cornerstones of the past will not support the current growth and demands of the world of tomorrow. A better balance between the global population growth, the consumption of the world’s natural resources and environment is needed for the security and future of mankind.

Without the United States making major changes to its domestic and foreign policies very soon. Chaos and Wars will take over the internationally leading to the collapse of the international financial markets. The following are some links to some of the needed changes that must come about very soon.

Peace Reform
http://peacereform.blogspot.com/

Next Step to Road Map to Peace
http://globalcrier.blogspot.com/2006/02/next-step-on-road-map-to-peace.html

Global Base Currency
http://globalcrier.blogspot.com/2006/02/global-base-currency.html

Balancing the Best Interest between the Mega Corporations
http://globalcrier.blogspot.com/2006/02/balancing-best-interest-between-mega.html

International Crude Oil Export Tax (OET)
http://globalcrier.blogspot.com/2006/01/international-crude-oil-export-tax-oet.html

:finger:

If you need an English-to-stupid translation, let me know.

 

[CSM]

...

Without the United States making major changes to its domestic and foreign policies very soon. Chaos and Wars will take over the internationally leading to the collapse of the international financial markets. The following are some links to some of the needed changes that must come about very soon.
....

I say let the rest of the world make major changes to THEIR domestic and foriegn policy. It is very apparent that you hold the US responsible for the ills of the world without regard to the role other nations have in the global community. It must be very convenient for you to merely blame everything on the US; I bet it saves a lot of thinking on your part.

 

[BaronVonBigmeat]

For some reason I don't believe you're being completely truthful here. What you've just said doesn't jive with your questions above about America and it's wars. Because if you knew anything about the wars we've been in, you'd also know that because of those wars, you have the "right" to "free speech". Is that something you feel we fought a war for that we shouldn't have?

Not all american wars have been to keep us free. The civil war, the spanish-american war, WWI, Korea, and Vietnam, for instance. In addition, the civil war and WWI were notable for crackdowns on free speech.

America has tried "staying out of war" before. But when we try that trick, it leads to the greatest loss of life we've ever seen. Remember Pearl Harbor? Remember the World Trade Centers? We were caught with our pants down and sucker punched. Now I don't know what a "conservative radical" does in those situations, but this "conservative" say's we need to go kick some serious ass. War, it's unavoidable in many, many circumstances.

The only problem here is, we weren't trying to stay out of war in the early 40's, and we certainly haven't persued a policy of neutrality in the last 50+ years in the mideast. FDR was doing his damndest to get us into the european war via the "japanese backdoor", as described in The New Dealers' War and Day of Deceit. Operation Rainbow Five was the plan to get the US into a war with Japan that had been in development for at least two years before Pearl Harbor. Aside from this, you've got the unavoidable fact that WWII was a direct outgrowth of WWI, and our senseless involvement in that war cannot really be described as "isolationist".

Then of course you've got the history of US interventionism in the mideast:

1949--Syria
1952--Egypt
1953--Iran
1958--Iraq
1958--Lebanon
1969--Libya
1980--Iraq
1983--Lebanon
1986--Libya
1991--Iraq & Kuwait
1995--Afghanistan
1996--Iraq
1998--The Sudan & Afghanistan