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In the movie "300" King Leonidas refers to Athenians as "...those boy lovers..." Yet Spartan men took young Spartan boys as sexual partners too.
"Sparta’s views on sexuality were mature, they weren’t prudish and they found it liberating. Relationships between Spartan men were closer to what we might consider gay sex. I don’t think it’s fair to say that the Spartans were homosexual, because that classification simply did not exist for them. Did ancient Greeks, and perhaps the Spartans, engage in sex with men? The answer ranges from yes to probably, they did not think simply in terms of straight, bi or gay.
I think it is anachronistic, to apply the term homosexual to them. As a warlike culture, the Spartans accepted male pairing and segregated the men in to military barracks from quite an early age for long periods of time. It was believed that they would fight stronger and harder for their male connections in that way and would defend each other. However, itg was fully expected that they would be married to women and father children in the future. In Athens, the older man would take a younger male under his wing. In Athenian and Spartan culture it was socially acceptable for older men and young men to be engaged in erotic relationships. This wasn’t in the way we understand homosexuality today though, for example anal sex was purely a heterosexual practice. Men and boys would procreate in different ways. Once the boy reached adulthood, it was fully expected he would leave the older man and get married. If he was wealthy enough, he too would have boys to teach and mentor, which again included sexually."
Spartan and Athenian Sexuality
While no one's under the impression "300" was historically accurate (a mere 300 never faced down the Persian army for instance, nor was Xeres an unusually tall bald refugee from a piercing convention) many Greek historical movies absolutely mutilate the reality of Greek sexuality. And in a time with increasing backlash against homosexuals for legalization of same-sex marriage and open service in the military I think it's important to set the record straight (so to speak, pun intentional hehe.)
Again, in "Troy" primary figures of Achielles and his (in the movie) 'cousin' distort the reality of their relationship omitting any hint of homosexual love. And yet,
"In the 5th and 4th centuries, the relationship with Patroclus was portrayed as same-sex love in the works of Aeschylus, Plato and Aeschines. Enigmatic verses from Lycophron's 3rd-century Alexandra seem to make unrequited love Achilles' motive for killing Troilus.
From the times of Classical Greece, and especially in Hellenism, to the time of the Romans, the relationship between Achilles and Patroclus was presented as loving and pederastic,[8] although these roles are anachronistic for the Iliad. Achilles is the most dominant, and among the warriors in the Trojan War he has the most fame; Patroclus performs duties such as cooking, feeding and grooming the horses, and nursing yet is older than Achilles. Both also sleep with women; see Iliad, IX.663-669:
But Achilles slept in the innermost part of the well-builded hut, and by his side lay a woman that he had brought from Lesbos, even the daughter of Phorbas, fair-cheeked Diomede. And Patroclus laid him down on the opposite side, and by him in like manner lay fair-girdled Iphis, whom goodly Achilles had given him when he took steep Scyrus, the city of Enyeus.
In the 5th century BC, in Aeschylus' lost tragedy The Myrmidons, Aeschylus regarded the relationship as a sexual one and assigned Achilles the role of erastes or protector (since he had avenged his lover's death even though the gods told him it would cost him his own life), and Patroclus the role of eromenos. He tells of Achilles visiting Patroclus' dead body and criticizing him for letting himself be killed. In a surviving fragment of the play, Achilles speaks of a "devout union of the thighs".[3][9]
Plato presented Achilles and Patroclus as lovers in the Symposium, written around 385 BC. The speaker Phaedrus holds the two up as an example of divinely approved lovers. He also argues that Aeschylus erred in saying that Achilles was the erastes, "for he excelled in beauty not Patroclus alone but assuredly all the other heroes, being still beardless and, moreover, much the younger, by Homer's account."[3] However, Plato's contemporary, Xenophon, in his own Symposium, had Socrates argue that Achilles and Patroclus were merely chaste and devoted comrades."
Achilles and Patroclus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
And given the continued rejection of homosexuality in modern times it's worth mentioning that many famous military leaders past and present were what we'd consider gay or very bi. As with British WWII general Montgomery (Pattons' British counterpart.)
"Letters show Monty as 'repressed gay'
Second world war hero had platonic love for soldiers and boys, claims friend and biographer
"This sort of thing may be tolerated by the French, but we're British - thank God."
So decreed Field Marshal Montgomery as he urged the House of Lords not to legalise gay sex and warned that the 1967 homosexuality bill would be a "charter for buggery".
More than 30 years on, the gay age of consent has been equalised to 16, homosexuals are allowed to serve in the military - and Britain's most famous wartime general has been outed as a repressed homosexual who had "quasi love affairs" with boys and men, according to a new book.
The Full Monty, by his official biographer, Nigel Hamilton, claims that Montgomery felt passionately about fellow soldiers and boys, some not yet in their teens."
Letters show Monty as 'repressed gay'
And in present-day, there's an out lesbian general in the US military,
Meet the U.S. Military’s First Openly-Gay General
And also currently, the Canadian head-of-state is openly lesbian,
Kathleen O'Day Wynne (born May 21, 1953)[1] is a Canadian politician and the 25th Premier of Ontario. In office since 2013, she is a member of the Legislative Assembly of Ontario, representing the riding of Don Valley West for the Liberal Party. She is the first female premier of Ontario, the first openly gay head of government in Canada, and the first openly gay head of government in the English-speaking world.
Kathleen Wynne - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
It's high time we depict heroes and leaders as gay or lesbian if they in fact are or were, and not ignore it in movies and other mentionings of them. It's sending the message homosexuality is incompatible with military glory or leadership when the reality proves the opposite is the case.
"Sparta’s views on sexuality were mature, they weren’t prudish and they found it liberating. Relationships between Spartan men were closer to what we might consider gay sex. I don’t think it’s fair to say that the Spartans were homosexual, because that classification simply did not exist for them. Did ancient Greeks, and perhaps the Spartans, engage in sex with men? The answer ranges from yes to probably, they did not think simply in terms of straight, bi or gay.
I think it is anachronistic, to apply the term homosexual to them. As a warlike culture, the Spartans accepted male pairing and segregated the men in to military barracks from quite an early age for long periods of time. It was believed that they would fight stronger and harder for their male connections in that way and would defend each other. However, itg was fully expected that they would be married to women and father children in the future. In Athens, the older man would take a younger male under his wing. In Athenian and Spartan culture it was socially acceptable for older men and young men to be engaged in erotic relationships. This wasn’t in the way we understand homosexuality today though, for example anal sex was purely a heterosexual practice. Men and boys would procreate in different ways. Once the boy reached adulthood, it was fully expected he would leave the older man and get married. If he was wealthy enough, he too would have boys to teach and mentor, which again included sexually."
Spartan and Athenian Sexuality
While no one's under the impression "300" was historically accurate (a mere 300 never faced down the Persian army for instance, nor was Xeres an unusually tall bald refugee from a piercing convention) many Greek historical movies absolutely mutilate the reality of Greek sexuality. And in a time with increasing backlash against homosexuals for legalization of same-sex marriage and open service in the military I think it's important to set the record straight (so to speak, pun intentional hehe.)
Again, in "Troy" primary figures of Achielles and his (in the movie) 'cousin' distort the reality of their relationship omitting any hint of homosexual love. And yet,
"In the 5th and 4th centuries, the relationship with Patroclus was portrayed as same-sex love in the works of Aeschylus, Plato and Aeschines. Enigmatic verses from Lycophron's 3rd-century Alexandra seem to make unrequited love Achilles' motive for killing Troilus.
From the times of Classical Greece, and especially in Hellenism, to the time of the Romans, the relationship between Achilles and Patroclus was presented as loving and pederastic,[8] although these roles are anachronistic for the Iliad. Achilles is the most dominant, and among the warriors in the Trojan War he has the most fame; Patroclus performs duties such as cooking, feeding and grooming the horses, and nursing yet is older than Achilles. Both also sleep with women; see Iliad, IX.663-669:
But Achilles slept in the innermost part of the well-builded hut, and by his side lay a woman that he had brought from Lesbos, even the daughter of Phorbas, fair-cheeked Diomede. And Patroclus laid him down on the opposite side, and by him in like manner lay fair-girdled Iphis, whom goodly Achilles had given him when he took steep Scyrus, the city of Enyeus.
In the 5th century BC, in Aeschylus' lost tragedy The Myrmidons, Aeschylus regarded the relationship as a sexual one and assigned Achilles the role of erastes or protector (since he had avenged his lover's death even though the gods told him it would cost him his own life), and Patroclus the role of eromenos. He tells of Achilles visiting Patroclus' dead body and criticizing him for letting himself be killed. In a surviving fragment of the play, Achilles speaks of a "devout union of the thighs".[3][9]
Plato presented Achilles and Patroclus as lovers in the Symposium, written around 385 BC. The speaker Phaedrus holds the two up as an example of divinely approved lovers. He also argues that Aeschylus erred in saying that Achilles was the erastes, "for he excelled in beauty not Patroclus alone but assuredly all the other heroes, being still beardless and, moreover, much the younger, by Homer's account."[3] However, Plato's contemporary, Xenophon, in his own Symposium, had Socrates argue that Achilles and Patroclus were merely chaste and devoted comrades."
Achilles and Patroclus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
And given the continued rejection of homosexuality in modern times it's worth mentioning that many famous military leaders past and present were what we'd consider gay or very bi. As with British WWII general Montgomery (Pattons' British counterpart.)
"Letters show Monty as 'repressed gay'
Second world war hero had platonic love for soldiers and boys, claims friend and biographer
"This sort of thing may be tolerated by the French, but we're British - thank God."
So decreed Field Marshal Montgomery as he urged the House of Lords not to legalise gay sex and warned that the 1967 homosexuality bill would be a "charter for buggery".
More than 30 years on, the gay age of consent has been equalised to 16, homosexuals are allowed to serve in the military - and Britain's most famous wartime general has been outed as a repressed homosexual who had "quasi love affairs" with boys and men, according to a new book.
The Full Monty, by his official biographer, Nigel Hamilton, claims that Montgomery felt passionately about fellow soldiers and boys, some not yet in their teens."
Letters show Monty as 'repressed gay'
And in present-day, there's an out lesbian general in the US military,
Meet the U.S. Military’s First Openly-Gay General
And also currently, the Canadian head-of-state is openly lesbian,
Kathleen O'Day Wynne (born May 21, 1953)[1] is a Canadian politician and the 25th Premier of Ontario. In office since 2013, she is a member of the Legislative Assembly of Ontario, representing the riding of Don Valley West for the Liberal Party. She is the first female premier of Ontario, the first openly gay head of government in Canada, and the first openly gay head of government in the English-speaking world.
Kathleen Wynne - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
It's high time we depict heroes and leaders as gay or lesbian if they in fact are or were, and not ignore it in movies and other mentionings of them. It's sending the message homosexuality is incompatible with military glory or leadership when the reality proves the opposite is the case.
