Think there's no proof for evolution? Have a cigarette!

[musicman]

...how did all these gay people get AIDS? Because they went to the cities, NY and SF especially. Why did they do that? Because their form of love was not acceptable at home.

Right - they were probably subjected to backwoods, unenlightened thinking like, "Male-on-male sex is unnatural, unclean, unsafe, and - therefore - unwise". What horrible stuff to have to listen to; it would be laughable - except that the truth of actual events appears to have borne this viewpoint out.

What if they had been able to have long-term, accepted relationships in their own communities? Well, then they wouldn't have had to travel, wouldn't have experienced the low self-esteem that leads to promiscuity, and wouldn't have caught AIDS.

Or, they could have considered the glorious possibility that the hometown bumpkins were RIGHT. They went to the cities in order to freely engage in behaviors their country neighbors considered unnatural, unclean, unsafe , and unwise - caught the disease which often results from such behavior - and now it's their NEIGHBORS' fault? This is pathetic, man.

In other words, a major driving force behind the AIDS epidemic is homopprobrium.

I think you mean, homosexuality.

Here's more food for thought. All those disease--e.g. measles, mumps, and rubella--which decimated the American Indians, were acquired by Europeans from their livestock. Were they having sex with their animals?
Mariner.

Had any of those diseases provably gotten a foothold in the human population via sexual perversion - as is the case with AIDS -, your question might have some relevance. They didn't, so it doesn't.

 

[Kagom]

I don't necessarily think a belief in evolution is contrary to a belief in a Deity, or even the christian Deity.

Such a Deity could use evolution as a tool to create life. I don't see how one could not compliment the other.

Personally, I believe that evolution is the process that created the current life on this planet. Do I think that is evidence that God doesn't exist? Of course not. While I don't believe in the christian version of the Deity, I can see no direct evidence that would deny His existence because of evidence of evolution.

I will say my piece again...

I believe that science answers this question:

How did He do it? or How did it happen?

I believe that science has no way to answer the question:

Does He exist?

That's the most sane thing I've ever read

I think evolution is very much real. Just look at diseases and viruses. They adapt and change as do people. That's real evolution.

Also, your thoughts that a deity could use evolution is something I believe in.

 

[musicman]

Originally Posted by no1tovote4
I don't necessarily think a belief in evolution is contrary to a belief in a Deity, or even the christian Deity.

Such a Deity could use evolution as a tool to create life. I don't see how one could not compliment the other.

Personally, I believe that evolution is the process that created the current life on this planet. Do I think that is evidence that God doesn't exist? Of course not. While I don't believe in the christian version of the Deity, I can see no direct evidence that would deny His existence because of evidence of evolution.

I will say my piece again...

I believe that science answers this question:

How did He do it? or How did it happen?

I believe that science has no way to answer the question:

Does He exist?

That's the most sane thing I've ever read

I think evolution is very much real. Just look at diseases and viruses. They adapt and change as do people. That's real evolution.

Also, your thoughts that a deity could use evolution is something I believe in.

Agreed - a most sane and level point of view!

 

[Avatar4321]

Rethinking the whole point of the thread I realize its based on another straw man that really hasnt been covered.

Has anyone claimed there was no evidence for evolution?

There is evidence for alot of things, simply because their is evidence doesn't mean its true. Back in the 15th century there was evidence that the world was flat. We just eventually gained enough evidence to show that it was incorrect.

That is one of the strong points of science. it doesn't claim to have all the answers. it is constantly reevaluating past theories. But it's also why science could never disprove revealed religion.

I remember a scientist who was also a wise and religious man who was asked a question of what he did when science and faith conflict. He said he waits for science to catch up. And you know, its interesting but I do see science catching up alittle.

The fact of the matter is the Spirit is alot better at teaching truth than science. In fact, i think most scientific theory which is accurate is taught by the Spirit.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

Has anyone claimed there was no evidence for evolution?

Repeatedly.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

Whether the airline steward was called Patient O, Patient Zero, or King Neptune, the initial findings of the study appear to remain intact:

"The AIDS virus was first discovered around year 1980 in the United States. A group of young gay men and also some drug users were getting ill often... During first few years of the detection of the new disease AIDS, all the possible reasons of spread of the disease were unknown. This helped the disease spread from one infected person to another. Back in the decade of 60's, there were very rare chances of a disease spreading across continents or countries. It was possible only when one person traveled from one country to another and carried the disease knowingly or unknowingly. The spread of AIDS is also said to be related with the same situation. It is said that when flight attendants used to fly across the seas, they had many sex partners in almost all the countries they visited. This helped AIDS spread from Africa and allowed it to enter in America."

What in the above quote indicates that AIDS was brought to the US by a SINGLE steward who had sex with an African man who had sex with a monkey?

You condone their actions, then - their use of political power to thwart the reasonable efforts of the medical community to arrest the spread of AIDS? You actually believe homosexuals would have been butchered in the streets - with impunity - if the 4000 early cases had been quarantined?

You actually believe you can prevent the spread of a disease to the US which is a global problem?

 

[musicman]

What in the above quote indicates that AIDS was brought to the US by a SINGLE steward

http://www.writing.uct.ac.za/ELL319F/students2001/anthony/web-site/Travel.htm

who had sex with an African man who had sex with a monkey?

The link which traced the steward's African sex partner was posted on this board some two years ago, by - of all things - another homosexual apologist. In the linked article, the African man's contact with monkeys was delicately described as "closer than normal". I'll keep looking for it.

You actually believe you can prevent the spread of a disease to the US which is a global problem?

It wasn't yet a global disaster in the early 1980's. As to whether the American medical community could have held the disease in check here, I guess we'll never know, will we? Homosexuals, playing politics with our lives, saw to that.

 

[Mariner]

There is 150 years of accumulated evidence for evolution, which has been refined and cross-correlated and enriched by scientists from diverse fields. It's one of the most powerful, consistent explanatory models in all of science, and is the direct basis for all of modern biology and medicine.

Yes, there was evidence that the world seemed flat. Then new evidence came along which contradicted it. Has some new evidence appeared which contradicts evolution? Quite the contrary, new evidence piles up daily to support it. In just the past few weeks there have been discoveries relating to earlier members of the T. Rex family tree, theories of how our ears formed (the structures may originally have served as respiratory organs), and a wonderful new book about how DNA can be thought of as a toolkit, so that the wide variety of appendages--flippers, hands, hoofed legs, for example--can arise relatively easily via simple mutations. If you pay attention to the major science journals (or a digest service like Science News) you'll see a continuous stream of new discovery that enhances the theory of evolution.

Darwin got this idea 150 years ago. Within a generation, most scientists, including Christian ones, had accepted the evidence. Why we're still fighting about it so much later is beyond me. it would seem better to accept that science explains the natural world--which includes our bodies and their origins--while religion does what science cannot do--help us figure out how to behave.

Mariner.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

http://www.writing.uct.ac.za/ELL319F/students2001/anthony/web-site/Travel.htm

Even disregarding the fact that your link provides no evidence whatsoever to back its claim, and the fact that the only link you could find was one to the University of Cape Town South Africa, a nation where people are so ill-informed about AIDS they think raping a 5 year old girl will cure them, I'm still not reading in that link where the guy had sex with an African who had sex with a monkey.

I'm calling Bullshit on you.

 

[Annie]

Even disregarding the fact that your link provides no evidence whatsoever to back its claim, and the fact that the only link you could find was one to the University of Cape Town South Africa, a nation where people are so ill-informed about AIDS they think raping a 5 year old girl will cure them, I'm still not reading in that link where the guy had sex with an African who had sex with a monkey.

I'm calling Bullshit on you.

So what is it you are disregarding?

 

[SpidermanTuba]

So what is it you are disregarding?

... a) the fact that [MusicsMan's] link provides no evidence whatsoever to back its claim, and

b) the fact that the only link [MusicMan] could find was one to the University of Cape Town South Africa, a nation where people are so ill-informed about AIDS they think raping a 5 year old girl will cure them,...

 

[Annie]

... a) the fact that [MusicsMan's] link provides no evidence whatsoever to back its claim, and

b) the fact that the only link you could find was one to the University of Cape Town South Africa, a nation where people are so ill-informed about AIDS they think raping a 5 year old girl will cure them,...

I didn't provide a link, to Cape Town or anywhere else. Who promoted you to the position of link approver? I didn't get the memo.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

I didn't provide a link, to Cape Town or anywhere else. Who promoted you to the position of link approver? I didn't get the memo.

Is your name MusicMan?

Note the text "Originally Posted by musicman"

Who promoted you to position of speaking on behalf of musicman? I didn't get the memo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman
http://www.writing.uct.ac.za/ELL319...site/Travel.htm


Even disregarding the fact that your link provides no evidence whatsoever to back its claim, and the fact that the only link you could find was one to the University of Cape Town South Africa, a nation where people are so ill-informed about AIDS they think raping a 5 year old girl will cure them, I'm still not reading in that link where the guy had sex with an African who had sex with a monkey.

I'm calling Bullshit on you.

 

[Annie]

Is your name MusicMan?

Note the text "Originally Posted by musicman"

See link #71, YOU are having problems reading.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

I can't believe I actually have to explain this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman
http://www.writing.uct.ac.za/ELL319...site/Travel.htm


Even disregarding the fact that your link provides no evidence whatsoever to back its claim, and the fact that the only link you could find was one to the University of Cape Town South Africa, a nation where people are so ill-informed about AIDS they think raping a 5 year old girl will cure them, I'm still not reading in that link where the guy had sex with an African who had sex with a monkey.

I'm calling Bullshit on you.

See where it says "Originally posted by musicman"? OK, that means, I am replying to a message by music man. So everywhere in the message where it says "you" I am referring to musicman.

 

[Annie]

I can't believe I actually have to explain this.



See where it says "Originally posted by musicman"? OK, that means, I am replying to a message by music man. So everywhere in the message where it says "you" I am referring to musicman.

Last edited by Spidey, the pompous ass....

 

[SpidermanTuba]

Last edited by Spidey, the pompous ass....

You asked what I was disregarding.

I couldn't undestand why, exactly, since in the post directly above your question I in fact wrote in plain English what I was disregarding. But I reposted it anyway, and assumed that you would just be able to figure out that "you" in the repost still referred to the same "you" it referred to when I originally wrote it, namely "musicman".

 

[Annie]

You asked what I was disregarding.

I couldn't undestand why, exactly, since in the post directly above your question I in fact wrote in plain English what I was disregarding. But I reposted it anyway, and assumed that you would just be able to figure out that "you" in the repost still referred to the same "you" it referred to when I originally wrote it, namely "musicman".

Hey asshat, you have nailed, (in your mind anyways), many on not being 'precise' in their reponses. You however, didn't make it clear, although came back later with an 'edited by' failing to NOTE that it was to clarify. Pomposity should be in your past.

 

[musicman]

Even disregarding the fact that your link provides no evidence whatsoever to back its claim...

Oh - is that what we're playing - "Spiderman's links are golden and musicman's links are shit"? I'd bail out if I were you, Spiderman; you're not holding the cards. At least my links address facts; the entire thrust of yours appears to be the business of deflecting blame away from homosexuals (and it's done very well, as I said before: reading your link, one would conclude that homosexuality was completely irrelevant to the spread of the disease. This is plainly not the case.).

More:
"Though the term ''superspreader'' is new, the idea that particular individuals have an outsized role in fueling epidemics isn't. In early 20th-century New York, before health inspectors finally got wise, a cook named Mary Mallon infected with typhoid seven different families that employed her. ''Typhoid Mary'' felt fine and didn't understand why the inspectors wanted to test her blood and stool, so she assaulted them with kitchen implements and fled. Eventually captured and banished to New York's North Brother Island, Mallon won clemency after three years of isolation-only to cause another outbreak after returning to work as a cook under a pseudonym.

The most famous contemporary superspreader is Gaetan Dugas, the French-Canadian flight attendant who had sex with thousands of men all over the world in the late 1970s and early `80s. Immortalized in Randy Shilts's 1987 book ''And the Band Played On,'' Dugas was no doubt responsible for a large percentage of early AIDS cases, though just how many remains in dispute. Like Mary Mallon, Dugas hardly cuts a sympathetic figure. According to Shilts, Dugas would sometimes turn on the lights in a bathhouse after an anonymous encounter, revealing the purple lesions on his body to his partner. ''Gay cancer,'' he would say. ''I'm going to die and so are you.'' ".

http://www.newamerica.net/index.cfm?pg=article&DocID=1214

...and the fact that the only link you could find was one to the University of Cape Town South Africa, a nation where people are so ill-informed about AIDS they think raping a 5 year old girl will cure them...

Oh - because that kind of ignorance exists in South Africa, everything that comes out of South Africa must be likewise ignorant? I'm surprised at you; I would never have thought you so bigoted.

...I'm still not reading in that link where the guy had sex with an African who had sex with a monkey.

I have been informed by USMB staff that the link I referenced is no longer available here. If it has not found it's way down the Internet memory hole, I will find it.

I'm calling Bullshit on you.

In the meantime, I would greatly appreciate your not impugning my integrity. I deserve better.

 

[William Joyce]

If there's no proof for evolution, then by the same standards, there's no proof that smoking causes cancer. So light up!


http://72.14.207.104/search?q=cache...f+proof+of+evolution&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=4

Haven't followed this whole thread, but ST, and your libbie buddies, riddle me this: what do you guys think of the fact that evolutionary theory explains racial difference?

Here's a book to confound both liberals and creationists:

[ame]http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0965683613/002-1126912-4440065?v=glance&n=283155[/ame]

Author says that different environmental pressures made for different selection for whites, blacks and Asians. Today, we see this reflected in high intelligence held by Asians, moderately high intelligence held by whites, and low intelligence held by blacks. Differences also explain why blacks have such high birth rates and low-investment parenting techniques (and sexually transmitted diseases).