Things that make you go hmmmm.

[DKSuddeth]

This should make you wonder, but I know how you all feel about conspiracy theories.

14 Search Dogs From Ground Zero Have Died Since 9/11

Fourteen search and rescue dogs who dug through the rubble of the World Trade Center have since died.

Eight of the dogs died from cancer.

Researchers at the University of Pennsylvania School of Veterinary Medicine said they don't believe there is a connection between the deaths and the chemicals the dogs were exposed to.

But the New York Daily News said some dog owners blame the mix of chemicals their dogs were exposed to during the hunt for survivors and remains after the attack on Sept. 11, 2001.

And the lead author of the study said the surviving dogs will need to be monitored for the rest of their lives. Dr. Cynthia Otto said if they begin to have health problems, there is a good chance that people who worked to clear the site could have problems as well.

 

[freeandfun1]

I wouldn't doubt if they died from the chemicals encountered in the searches. The WTC was old, and I know they were concerned about a lot of asbestos. Think about it, the dogs had their noses to the ground, sniffing that dust for weeks on end.

I love dogs so I hate to hear this, but I thank God they were able to help and I appreciate their service to us humans.

 

[Merlin1047]

This should make you wonder, but I know how you all feel about conspiracy theories.

Given the mix of pollutants and especially their density during the days following the collapse of the WTC towers, it is not surprising that this type of problem is beginning to surface. Even if the fallout from the WTC collapse had consisted of nothing more than concrete dust, there would be respiratory and other problems for those who breathed that air without a respirator or without a mask of some sort.

As for a conspiracies, I'm skeptical of that. Sounds more like bureaucratic butt-covering to me than anything else. But what really matters is identifying the people who breathed that dust cloud and monitoring them at least every six months for the next three or four years in order to catch any carcenoma development in the early stages.

 

[Mr. P]

This should make you wonder, but I know how you all feel about conspiracy theories.

Wonder? Wonder about what, DK? Do you have a Theory?

 

[DKSuddeth]

Wonder? Wonder about what, DK? Do you have a Theory?

actually, more questions, like why did the EPA issue bogus air quality information at ground zero? who ordered it? and why, when other information was made later, didn't they just admit that they lied about it?

 

[dilloduck]

actually, more questions, like why did the EPA issue bogus air quality information at ground zero? who ordered it? and why, when other information was made later, didn't they just admit that they lied about it?

We gotta get PETA to do some investigating for us.

 

[freeandfun1]

actually, more questions, like why did the EPA issue bogus air quality information at ground zero? who ordered it? and why, when other information was made later, didn't they just admit that they lied about it?

where are air samples taken? At human breathing levels or at dog breathing levels?

You seem to be overlooking the fact that the DOGS were walking around with their noses mm's above the ground SNIFFING for scents. Humans don't walk around with their nose just mm's above the ground do they?

 

[DKSuddeth]

I had a feeling that alot of people would like to just see this blown over. If you're at all interested, then read some articles I guess. Otherwise maybe I can safely assume that you have the same indifference to life.

google search on air quality at ground zero

 

[insein]

I fail to see what this means. EPA fucked up? Is it the first time a government agency has fucked up and tried to cover their asses? What were they supposed to do? Evacuate all of Manhatten for fear of a possible contaminent in the air? LEave the possibilty of survivors up in the air because no rescue workers could be permitted to enter ground zero?

DK, usually you have some good ideas but this one is pointless. Even if your theory is true, what good wil lcome of it?

 

[Bullypulpit]

This should make you wonder, but I know how you all feel about conspiracy theories.

14 Search Dogs From Ground Zero Have Died Since 9/11

Fourteen search and rescue dogs who dug through the rubble of the World Trade Center have since died.

Eight of the dogs died from cancer.

Researchers at the University of Pennsylvania School of Veterinary Medicine said they don't believe there is a connection between the deaths and the chemicals the dogs were exposed to.

But the New York Daily News said some dog owners blame the mix of chemicals their dogs were exposed to during the hunt for survivors and remains after the attack on Sept. 11, 2001.

And the lead author of the study said the surviving dogs will need to be monitored for the rest of their lives. Dr. Cynthia Otto said if they begin to have health problems, there is a good chance that people who worked to clear the site could have problems as well.

And let's not forget all the workers at the site who were exposed to that same environment, nor the Bush EPA who said it was safe.

 

[remie]

I had a feeling that alot of people would like to just see this blown over. If you're at all interested, then read some articles I guess. Otherwise maybe I can safely assume that you have the same indifference to life.

google search on air quality at ground zero

Ok I read the articles so I am not indifferent. I asked my wife who breeds, trains and cares for dogs about this and she had a couple of comments.

She wondered about the age of the dogs because generally the dogs that do this kind of work are not youngsters and they require a great deal of training to do the job.

She also commented that with improved vererinary care and diagnostic abilities that cancer in older animals is becoming a more common diagnosis. In the past these dogs just got sick and died and nobody really know the cause. It has been our experience that if a dog lives long enough a fair percentage will die of cancer.

Why in the world would the University of Pennsylvania Veterinary School say there was no connection if there was. Are they under pressure too?

While I have no doubt that there were pollutants at the site, I dont make the leap of a conspiracy to cover up things. I did notice that a number of the articles in your google search were from institutions and publications that may have an ax to grind and were looking for something. I am certainly not a fan of the EPA but until there is more information I have to give them a pass.

 

[Daniel]

Thanks for pointing this out DK...

If your Gov. is willing to lie to you about the air you breathe, why is it so hard to belive that they would lie to you about other things?

THIS IS NOT EXCUSABLE, under any circumstance

insein, you say that this is pointless....?

Another interesting fact about the WTC is that you all can probably remember seeing the white dust particles all over everything on TV.

The only way that the material could have been crystalized in this way would have been a nuclear device, or advanced, modern explisives like C4, but since there was no radiation this rules out a nuclear device.

Also, why, oh why was the rubble hauled away without being properly investigated and researched? it is interesting to know that this was also done during OKC, that building was also hauled away and buried.

Is it not a standard operating procedure in a criminal investigation to protect the crime scene?

 

[insein]

Thanks for pointing this out DK...

If your Gov. is willing to lie to you about the air you breathe, why is it so hard to belive that they would lie to you about other things?

THIS IS NOT EXCUSABLE, under any circumstance

insein, you say that this is pointless....?

Another interesting fact about the WTC is that you all can probably remember seeing the white dust particles all over everything on TV.

The only way that the material could have been crystalized in this way would have been a nuclear device, or advanced, modern explisives like C4, but since there was no radiation this rules out a nuclear device.

Also, why, oh why was the rubble hauled away without being properly investigated and researched? it is interesting to know that this was also done during OKC, that building was also hauled away and buried.

Is it not a standard operating procedure in a criminal investigation to protect the crime scene?

It is pointless. Had the EPA issued a hazardous warning on air pollutants that POSSIBLY could cause a problem, what good would that have done? Would we evacuate all of ground zero and the island of manhatten because there was a CHANCE that SOME people could inhale chemicals? Hell people inhale bad chemicals all day everyday when they drive.

Gorund Zero would have had thousands of people pouring in to help no matter what the EPA said. The EPA could have said that there was a nuclear leak down there and people would have came in to try and save any survivors.

You go on believing in the X-Files and i'll be living in reality where logic rules the day.

 

[lilcountriegal]

Thanks for pointing this out DK...

If your Gov. is willing to lie to you about the air you breathe, why is it so hard to belive that they would lie to you about other things?

THIS IS NOT EXCUSABLE, under any circumstance

insein, you say that this is pointless....?

Another interesting fact about the WTC is that you all can probably remember seeing the white dust particles all over everything on TV.

The only way that the material could have been crystalized in this way would have been a nuclear device, or advanced, modern explisives like C4, but since there was no radiation this rules out a nuclear device.

Also, why, oh why was the rubble hauled away without being properly investigated and researched? it is interesting to know that this was also done during OKC, that building was also hauled away and buried.

Is it not a standard operating procedure in a criminal investigation to protect the crime scene?

Yes, it is sop to protect the crime scene, however, the "crime scene" was the entire city of Manhattan. There would have been no way to section off ever place debris/dust spread to without serious economic problems.

As far as the material being crystalized, I'll let that up to one of the more intelligent members of the board versed in that area, but wouldn't the heat from the jet fuel alone be enough to crystalize the material?

 

[5stringJeff]

Thanks for pointing this out DK...

If your Gov. is willing to lie to you about the air you breathe, why is it so hard to belive that they would lie to you about other things?

THIS IS NOT EXCUSABLE, under any circumstance

insein, you say that this is pointless....?

Another interesting fact about the WTC is that you all can probably remember seeing the white dust particles all over everything on TV.

The only way that the material could have been crystalized in this way would have been a nuclear device, or advanced, modern explisives like C4, but since there was no radiation this rules out a nuclear device.

Also, why, oh why was the rubble hauled away without being properly investigated and researched? it is interesting to know that this was also done during OKC, that building was also hauled away and buried.

Is it not a standard operating procedure in a criminal investigation to protect the crime scene?

Only two points:

1. What was the "material" that crystalized? Asbestos? Dust? And given two airplanes full of fuel, and given the fact the the steel superstructure of the WTC buildings melted from the heat of the explosion and burning jet fuel, it is logical and reasonable to assume that temperatures were hot enough to rival those brough on by explosions of C-4.

2. Ground Zero was not a "crime scene." It was the scene of an attack in the War on Terrorism.