The United States Is Hated Or Feared

Psychoblues

Senior Member
Nov 30, 2003
2,701
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North Missisippi
by most of the world.

This was reported by CNN, MSNBC and by Fox. It was a statement by an Iowan voter. I am ashamed to say that I agree with that voter.

Just why would the most free nation in the world be feared or hated by anyone? I am at a loss for an explanation. Perhaps we are not as free as we purport to be? Or is it that we have abused our freedom and allowed despots to direct our national policy? Either way, it ain't pretty for Americans to be saying on international television that "The United States is hated or feared by most of the world."

An American saying that?!??!?!?!?!?!??!?!? Just what do Americans do to change that perception? gwb is history now. WE CAN do better!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
by most of the world.

This was reported by CNN, MSNBC and by Fox. It was a statement by an Iowan voter. I am ashamed to say that I agree with that voter.

Just why would the most free nation in the world be feared or hated by anyone? I am at a loss for an explanation. Perhaps we are not as free as we purport to be? Or is it that we have abused our freedom and allowed despots to direct our national policy? Either way, it ain't pretty for Americans to be saying on international television that "The United States is hated or feared by most of the world."

An American saying that?!??!?!?!?!?!??!?!? Just what do Americans do to change that perception? gwb is history now. WE CAN do better!!!!!!!!!!!!

Better to be hated or feared, then loved, at least as a country. They are not as likely to take advantage of you if they fear you or hate you.

And we are hated BECAUSE we are so good, so powerful and so effective. It is called petty jealousy.
 
by most of the world.

This was reported by CNN, MSNBC and by Fox. It was a statement by an Iowan voter. I am ashamed to say that I agree with that voter.

Just why would the most free nation in the world be feared or hated by anyone? I am at a loss for an explanation. Perhaps we are not as free as we purport to be? Or is it that we have abused our freedom and allowed despots to direct our national policy? Either way, it ain't pretty for Americans to be saying on international television that "The United States is hated or feared by most of the world."

An American saying that?!??!?!?!?!?!??!?!? Just what do Americans do to change that perception? gwb is history now. WE CAN do better!!!!!!!!!!!!

Blah, blah, blah ... like this is something new. We are only "liked" when we are doing someone else's bidding, no questions nor anything in return asked. Otherwise, we have been the "bad guys" for decades.

Big deal.
 
Misery loves company .... Thats why they hate us... The Euros that hate America hate us because they no longer have what we have... they came under control of liberal secular theology and have lost everything... Jews and Christians are stepped on and Muslims and seculars are beyond approach... Sorry to say, but if we dont crush the liberal secular metality they have injected into or society we may suffer the same fate... Misey loves company...
 
Is the US hated or feared by most of the world?

Hated by those who have the ability to turn New York into a pile of smoldering ashes and feared by those who don't.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
This is one person’s excellent perspective on the issue:

http://www.opednews.com/dinan_081204_hated.htm

In our cocoon of flag-waving patriotism, it is easy to protect ourselves from the harsher truth of the moment: America has too much power in the world and it is not wielding it with wisdom. We are playing God with other countries, wrecking havoc environmentally, and siphoning as many resources as possible from the developing world. We have the largest military budget to protect our “assets,” while we spend the lowest per capita on development aid of any advanced nation. We have over 700 military bases in more than 100 countries. We are aggressively self-interested.

We are, in short, an empire. And not a particularly benevolent one.

I know it’s hard to stomach this. It’s much easier to wave the flag, sing patriotic tunes, and wax poetic about the American dream. Everyone wants to be the good guy. But, at the moment on the world stage, we are not.

America HAS been an extraordinary catalyst for the world at times. We have led boldly. We’ve played the heroic savior, such as during World War II. I don’t want to deny positive credit for what our country has done, from laying foundations for democracy to advancing women’s rights to propelling technological revolutions. We do deserve kudos and there are ALWAYS individual Americans who carry the torch of greatness with grace.

But we cannot look only to the past or to individual heroism. We must look at the big picture of the moment and the scene is not pretty. We are running the world like a petty tyrant, demanding allegiance and obedience, punishing those who disagree with us, and conquering in the name of greed. Our leaders lie often and egregiously. Our populace is fattened with gluttony and sedated by hours of TV. Our political system has become increasingly corrupt and our cherished rights undermined. Our media is increasingly a tool for propaganda.

As a country, we have outpaced the rest of the world in terms of power. This essentially makes us the world’s dictator – we can dictate what happens and when. Benevolent dictators are a rare breed and America is showing that even a nation founded on noble principles can, upon assuming the reins of unchecked power, become addicted to that power, addled by it, and march towards tyranny.

Inasmuch as America is becoming a tyrannical empire, perhaps we do deserve some of the world’s hatred of us.

Hate is a reflection of positive life force being thwarted. It is like fire, directed at whatever holds back the next stage of growth. For the planet as a whole, America is now the single biggest barrier to world peace and healthy development. It’s the single biggest threat to the environment. Put simply, America is the greatest threat to life on this planet. And we are showing few signs of using our power for collective benefit.

We now wield the power of the patriarch in the family, but operate with the moral code of the teenager. Our power has grown faster than our sense of compassion and this disconnect creates suffering. As a country, we take as much money as possible from the rest of the world, spend it lavishly on ourselves, and use our military, CIA, and FBI to quash dissent both internally and externally, even using torture, while also engaging in wars of unilateral aggression.

Most foreigners are too generous with America right now, preferring to blame our government and not our people. Of course, some go to the extreme of turning hate into actual violence, which I do not support or advocate. But I do think outrage, disgust, and disapproval towards the American people is warranted, if only as a spur for us to wake up. It seems to be the only thing that can burst our self-congratulatory bubble.

If we really feel the hate of the world, we are gradually forced to shift our understanding of ourselves: in what ways are we no longer the world’s hero but the world’s exploiter? How have we become a tyrant among nations? Are we leading the way in addressing the most serious problems or are we making them worse?

These are important questions for us to ask in order to grow into true adulthood as a country and fulfill the promise of our noble ideals. The world cannot passively wait for us to make this shift: the stakes are too high for us to be the petulant king on the hill.

The true king rules in service to the kingdom, not himself. A true king lays down clear tracks towards democratic governance. A true father in a family makes the first and greatest sacrifices.

Right now, America does none of these.

America needs to go through a profound maturation and the only way to do so is by facing the truth – the whole truth and nothing but the truth. It means seeing through the lies of our government. It means demanding democracy. It means dismantling power structures that have been corrupted. It means taking the reins of power from those who cannot wield them with wisdom. It means repealing the Patriot Act and dismantling the war machine. It means creating an empowered citizenry and doing so fast.

If it takes the rest of the world’s outrage to turn up the fire that propels us into adulthood, I welcome it. I want America to become the glorious leader we are capable of becoming. But the stench of rotted ideals and corrupted power is strong at the moment and the forces of self-serving empire grow more entrenched every day. We need a cleansing that goes far deeper than removing Bush from power. We need a full transformation.

Nothing less than a humble acknowledgment of our misdeeds, a committed effort to make reparations, and a generous use of our power for the collective good will suffice. That will not happen with Bush at the helm. But it will also not happen with a mere changing of the guard. The American people themselves need to go through a second revolution, a revolution of heart and truth resulting in a more mature relationship with power. We do have the potential, unlike past empires, to grow beyond decadence and corruption into a nobler destiny. Or, we may crumble, perhaps financially under massive debt. Or morally. Or militarily. Empires are brittle and the cracks are already showing in the armor. The choice is ours about how to proceed.

I believe that America needs to use its vast power in the service of leading the world towards the next stage of peace, sustainability, and prosperity. When we stand in integrity and loving service in that role, THAT is when America will earn the love of the rest of the world. Until then, I suspect we need to keep turning up the heat.
 
Now seriously...

Most of the world sees the US as a big bully invading other countries with ridiculous casus belli.

It's absolutely ok to codenm the US for launching unjustified wars against other nations like Vietnam under the pretext of preserving democratic values.

But is this a fair comprehensive evaluation of the role the US play in the world?

Of course not.

A fair analysis of the US would necessarily take into consideration the fact that the country has been for the last 100 years one of the most important factors behind the dissemination of free, democratic societies throughout the world, even though the country itself became a democracy only in 1960/65.
 
Excellent post, Matt

PS: the "America is becoming a tyrannical empire" part was a lil too much in my opinion.
 
I think it's time to stop shelling out foreign aid to any country that's going to berate us.
 
This is SO Matts:

This is one person’s excellent perspective on the issue:

http://www.opednews.com/dinan_081204_hated.htm

In our cocoon of flag-waving patriotism, it is easy to protect ourselves from the harsher truth of the moment: America has too much power in the world and it is not wielding it with wisdom. We are playing God with other countries, wrecking havoc environmentally, and siphoning as many resources as possible from the developing world. We have the largest military budget to protect our “assets,” while we spend the lowest per capita on development aid of any advanced nation. We have over 700 military bases in more than 100 countries. We are aggressively self-interested. Exactly what does this mean? We spend considerably less less of our GDP on military than many states, especially while at war. That we give out billions more in aid than other countries, often in loans that are not paid back? That we provide the Lion's share of the funding of an organization like the UN, that uses those monies in passing resolutions against our interests, fails systemically to aid us when it's 'in our interest'? That military bases are as numerous as they are because in many cases we have allies that have failed since WWII and before to provide security for their own people. That those bases are the reason we can get to areas hit by tsunamis, earthquakes, volcanic eruptions faster than the UN can hold their first study on the feasibility of providing aid, *ahem* the monies of which also come significantly from our country?

We are, in short, an empire. And not a particularly benevolent one. Whoa, no definition of empire given here. Can't wait to see how the empire that isn't, fails to be benevolent. The ultimate strawman. :cuckoo:

I know it’s hard to stomach this. It’s much easier to wave the flag, sing patriotic tunes, and wax poetic about the American dream. Everyone wants to be the good guy. But, at the moment on the world stage, we are not.Adding more straw, geez.

America HAS been an extraordinary catalyst for the world at times. We have led boldly. We’ve played the heroic savior, such as during World War II. I don’t want to deny positive credit for what our country has done, from laying foundations for democracy to advancing women’s rights to propelling technological revolutions. We do deserve kudos and there are ALWAYS individual Americans who carry the torch of greatness with grace. Token credit, getting to the BUT

But we cannot look only to the past or to individual heroism. We must look at the big picture of the moment and the scene is not pretty. We are running the world like a petty tyrant, demanding allegiance and obedience, punishing those who disagree with us, and conquering in the name of greed. Our leaders lie often and egregiously. Our populace is fattened with gluttony and sedated by hours of TV. Our political system has become increasingly corrupt and our cherished rights undermined. Our media is increasingly a tool for propaganda.Oh it's our weight and tv watching. Cripey, is there any canard missing here?

As a country, we have outpaced the rest of the world in terms of power. This essentially makes us the world’s dictator – we can dictate what happens and when. Benevolent dictators are a rare breed and America is showing that even a nation founded on noble principles can, upon assuming the reins of unchecked power, become addicted to that power, addled by it, and march towards tyranny. Right, because we are ahead of 'the world' in power, we are a dictator, this must be related to being the 'not benevolent empire. Notice a lack of any example for the second qualifying statement. There's no there, there.

Inasmuch as America is becoming a tyrannical empire, perhaps we do deserve some of the world’s hatred of us. Crap. He proves nothing, says what he says is true, then makes another strawman, built upon the first.

Hate is a reflection of positive life force being thwarted. It is like fire, directed at whatever holds back the next stage of growth. For the planet as a whole, America is now the single biggest barrier to world peace and healthy development. It’s the single biggest threat to the environment. Put simply, America is the greatest threat to life on this planet. And we are showing few signs of using our power for collective benefit.Again, another strawman. Soon they can make a strawman pyramid, with a tinfoil flag upon the top.

We now wield the power of the patriarch in the family, but operate with the moral code of the teenager. Our power has grown faster than our sense of compassion and this disconnect creates suffering. As a country, we take as much money as possible from the rest of the world, spend it lavishly on ourselves, and use our military, CIA, and FBI to quash dissent both internally and externally, even using torture, while also engaging in wars of unilateral aggression. This is so much pap, with zero logic, I mean zero. Failure to provide any logical reasoning to back up the points he's self-declaring facts. The sad part is that Matt copy and pasted this 'F' paper and Jose pats him on the back for doing so.

Most foreigners are too generous with America right now, preferring to blame our government and not our people. Of course, some go to the extreme of turning hate into actual violence, which I do not support or advocate. But I do think outrage, disgust, and disapproval towards the American people is warranted, if only as a spur for us to wake up. It seems to be the only thing that can burst our self-congratulatory bubble. Wow! Just Wow! This is the only paragraph that grows out of all the words written before. He's saying he is a good person, by writing this illogical diatribe. It's an exercise in hubris by a narcissist. :lol:

If we really feel the hate of the world, we are gradually forced to shift our understanding of ourselves: in what ways are we no longer the world’s hero but the world’s exploiter? How have we become a tyrant among nations? Are we leading the way in addressing the most serious problems or are we making them worse? 'Hate is a bad thing' but a force for change, so the world needs to have the US more.' Gotcha.

These are important questions for us to ask in order to grow into true adulthood as a country and fulfill the promise of our noble ideals. The world cannot passively wait for us to make this shift: the stakes are too high for us to be the petulant king on the hill.

The true king rules in service to the kingdom, not himself. A true king lays down clear tracks towards democratic governance. A true father in a family makes the first and greatest sacrifices.

Right now, America does none of these.I wonder if it's occurred to Matt yet, that in the preceding few sentence, the argument has been forth that the US should act as king of the world. A benevolent king, but a king?

America needs to go through a profound maturation and the only way to do so is by facing the truth – the whole truth and nothing but the truth. It means seeing through the lies of our government. It means demanding democracy. It means dismantling power structures that have been corrupted. It means taking the reins of power from those who cannot wield them with wisdom. It means repealing the Patriot Act and dismantling the war machine. It means creating an empowered citizenry and doing so fast. OMG, I just had a choking fit from laughing so hard. Matt, please tell me you didn't read this all the way through? Never mind, I'm sure you did, it appeals to the relevancy rules you live by I guess. :doubt: Somehow we get from dismantling power structures, (which there is no hint if we are talking about here or Sudan or wherever, but onto the Patriot Act, which may actually be the point of this essay?)

If it takes the rest of the world’s outrage to turn up the fire that propels us into adulthood, I welcome it. I want America to become the glorious leader we are capable of becoming. But the stench of rotted ideals and corrupted power is strong at the moment and the forces of self-serving empire grow more entrenched every day. We need a cleansing that goes far deeper than removing Bush from power. We need a full transformation.

Nothing less than a humble acknowledgment of our misdeeds, a committed effort to make reparations, and a generous use of our power for the collective good will suffice. That will not happen with Bush at the helm. But it will also not happen with a mere changing of the guard. The American people themselves need to go through a second revolution, a revolution of heart and truth resulting in a more mature relationship with power. We do have the potential, unlike past empires, to grow beyond decadence and corruption into a nobler destiny. Or, we may crumble, perhaps financially under massive debt. Or morally. Or militarily. Empires are brittle and the cracks are already showing in the armor. The choice is ours about how to proceed.

I believe that America needs to use its vast power in the service of leading the world towards the next stage of peace, sustainability, and prosperity. When we stand in integrity and loving service in that role, THAT is when America will earn the love of the rest of the world. Until then, I suspect we need to keep turning up the heat.
Well it's hard to write a good conclusion when there was nothing of substance written. I have 6th grade students that know they can't get away with sweeping pronouncements, with no stated reasons to back it up. Matts, you went to college, ignore my snarkiness and look at what you are calling 'excellent.'
 
Better to be hated or feared, then loved, at least as a country. They are not as likely to take advantage of you if they fear you or hate you.

And we are hated BECAUSE we are so good, so powerful and so effective. It is called petty jealousy.
I totally disagree with your first statement. as for the second, Yes, we are hated because we are more powerful AND effective than most, That certainly doesn't make us good, IT should make us ashamed.

And it isn't jelousy. it is out and out "fear and disgust".
 
This is one person’s excellent perspective on the issue:

http://www.opednews.com/dinan_081204_hated.htm

In our cocoon of flag-waving patriotism, it is easy to protect ourselves from the harsher truth of the moment: America has too much power in the world and it is not wielding it with wisdom. We are playing God with other countries, wrecking havoc environmentally, and siphoning as many resources as possible from the developing world. We have the largest military budget to protect our “assets,” while we spend the lowest per capita on development aid of any advanced nation. We have over 700 military bases in more than 100 countries. We are aggressively self-interested.

We are, in short, an empire. And not a particularly benevolent one.

I know it’s hard to stomach this. It’s much easier to wave the flag, sing patriotic tunes, and wax poetic about the American dream. Everyone wants to be the good guy. But, at the moment on the world stage, we are not.

America HAS been an extraordinary catalyst for the world at times. We have led boldly. We’ve played the heroic savior, such as during World War II. I don’t want to deny positive credit for what our country has done, from laying foundations for democracy to advancing women’s rights to propelling technological revolutions. We do deserve kudos and there are ALWAYS individual Americans who carry the torch of greatness with grace.

But we cannot look only to the past or to individual heroism. We must look at the big picture of the moment and the scene is not pretty. We are running the world like a petty tyrant, demanding allegiance and obedience, punishing those who disagree with us, and conquering in the name of greed. Our leaders lie often and egregiously. Our populace is fattened with gluttony and sedated by hours of TV. Our political system has become increasingly corrupt and our cherished rights undermined. Our media is increasingly a tool for propaganda.

As a country, we have outpaced the rest of the world in terms of power. This essentially makes us the world’s dictator – we can dictate what happens and when. Benevolent dictators are a rare breed and America is showing that even a nation founded on noble principles can, upon assuming the reins of unchecked power, become addicted to that power, addled by it, and march towards tyranny.

Inasmuch as America is becoming a tyrannical empire, perhaps we do deserve some of the world’s hatred of us.

Hate is a reflection of positive life force being thwarted. It is like fire, directed at whatever holds back the next stage of growth. For the planet as a whole, America is now the single biggest barrier to world peace and healthy development. It’s the single biggest threat to the environment. Put simply, America is the greatest threat to life on this planet. And we are showing few signs of using our power for collective benefit.

We now wield the power of the patriarch in the family, but operate with the moral code of the teenager. Our power has grown faster than our sense of compassion and this disconnect creates suffering. As a country, we take as much money as possible from the rest of the world, spend it lavishly on ourselves, and use our military, CIA, and FBI to quash dissent both internally and externally, even using torture, while also engaging in wars of unilateral aggression.

Most foreigners are too generous with America right now, preferring to blame our government and not our people. Of course, some go to the extreme of turning hate into actual violence, which I do not support or advocate. But I do think outrage, disgust, and disapproval towards the American people is warranted, if only as a spur for us to wake up. It seems to be the only thing that can burst our self-congratulatory bubble.

If we really feel the hate of the world, we are gradually forced to shift our understanding of ourselves: in what ways are we no longer the world’s hero but the world’s exploiter? How have we become a tyrant among nations? Are we leading the way in addressing the most serious problems or are we making them worse?

These are important questions for us to ask in order to grow into true adulthood as a country and fulfill the promise of our noble ideals. The world cannot passively wait for us to make this shift: the stakes are too high for us to be the petulant king on the hill.

The true king rules in service to the kingdom, not himself. A true king lays down clear tracks towards democratic governance. A true father in a family makes the first and greatest sacrifices.

Right now, America does none of these.

America needs to go through a profound maturation and the only way to do so is by facing the truth – the whole truth and nothing but the truth. It means seeing through the lies of our government. It means demanding democracy. It means dismantling power structures that have been corrupted. It means taking the reins of power from those who cannot wield them with wisdom. It means repealing the Patriot Act and dismantling the war machine. It means creating an empowered citizenry and doing so fast.

If it takes the rest of the world’s outrage to turn up the fire that propels us into adulthood, I welcome it. I want America to become the glorious leader we are capable of becoming. But the stench of rotted ideals and corrupted power is strong at the moment and the forces of self-serving empire grow more entrenched every day. We need a cleansing that goes far deeper than removing Bush from power. We need a full transformation.

Nothing less than a humble acknowledgment of our misdeeds, a committed effort to make reparations, and a generous use of our power for the collective good will suffice. That will not happen with Bush at the helm. But it will also not happen with a mere changing of the guard. The American people themselves need to go through a second revolution, a revolution of heart and truth resulting in a more mature relationship with power. We do have the potential, unlike past empires, to grow beyond decadence and corruption into a nobler destiny. Or, we may crumble, perhaps financially under massive debt. Or morally. Or militarily. Empires are brittle and the cracks are already showing in the armor. The choice is ours about how to proceed.

I believe that America needs to use its vast power in the service of leading the world towards the next stage of peace, sustainability, and prosperity. When we stand in integrity and loving service in that role, THAT is when America will earn the love of the rest of the world. Until then, I suspect we need to keep turning up the heat.

Well stated.
 
Originally posted by Kathianne
This is so much pap, with zero logic, I mean zero. Failure to provide any logical reasoning to back up the points he's self-declaring facts. The sad part is that Matt copy and pasted this 'F' paper and Jose pats him on the back for doing so.

Calm down, Kathianne.

I didn't even find the article that great.

Since the towers collapsed the US has invaded only one country without a valid causus belli.

In my opinion, this is not enough to justify many of the sweeping accusations of imperialism the author threw against America.

I said it was "excellent" because Matt happened to post the article in the middle of two of my posts that were logically connected.

I was just trying to be friendly.

God knows I need to change my well deserved reputation for having a short fuse :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Lighten up a bit, irish girl.
 
José;636418 said:
Calm down, Kathianne.

I didn't even find the article that great.

Since the towers collapsed the US has invaded only one country without a valid causus belli.

In my opinion, this is not enough to justify many of the sweeping accusations of imperialism the author threw against America.

I said it was "excellent" because Matt happened to post the article in the middle of two of my posts that were logically connected.

I was just trying to be friendly.

God knows I need to change my well deserved reputation for having a short fuse :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Lighten up a bit, irish girl.

LOL! You just avoided the "Ok, we have Doniston backing you guys up! Cheers!"

Matts, Doniston agrees with you, Jose sees the problem with the post, do you?
 
This is SO Matts:

Well it's hard to write a good conclusion when there was nothing of substance written. I have 6th grade students that know they can't get away with sweeping pronouncements, with no stated reasons to back it up. Matts, you went to college, ignore my snarkiness and look at what you are calling 'excellent.'
Whether Matt was or was not the sole contributor of the artical. It is factual, and if you can't see the empire he has stated. then it is you who can't read or comprehend.
 
Whether Matt was or was not the sole contributor of the artical. It is factual, and if you can't see the empire he has stated. then it is you who can't read or comprehend.

There are no facts in that article. Wait maybe one, 'the US has the power...' from that point on, just stream of consciousness.

Here's a similar article, but written with examples to back up the writer's point:

http://www.spectator.co.uk/the-maga...-war-with-hatred-fanaticism-and-despair.thtml

Bernard-Henri Lévy, the French philosopher, points out that with Benazir Bhutto, they killed ‘a spectacularly visible woman’ who, whatever her flaws as a political leader, was astonishingly brave in fighting — uncovered, unveiled — for politics ‘and refusing the curse that, according to the new fascists [the jihadists], floats over the human face of women’.

Lévy suggests that Benazir’s name should now become another password ‘for those who still believe that the good genius of Enlightenment will win out over the evil genius of fanaticism and crime’. But the Enlightenment will be lost unless we all realise that we have to fight for it.

First of all we have to give up the luxury of pretending that the war with Islamism is our fault. It is not. It is a deadly serious attempt by reactionary theocrats, Sunni and Shia, to enslave as much of the world as possible. It is powerful — it has the resources of a rich state, Iran, behind its Shia arm, and oil wealth gushes into the coffers of its Sunni side.

‘The war on terror’ may not be the best of phrases, but it is a reasonable shorthand. Islamist terrorist murderers don’t kill decent and brave people because of mistakes made by President Bush or Tony Blair or President Musharraf or anyone else. They do so to destroy the chance of millions of Muslims and ‘infidels’ all over the world to live decent lives.

Secondly, the murder of Bhutto should also demonstrate — yet again — that this war is not the fault of the Israelis. The Islamists did not kill Benazir Bhutto because of concern about the West Bank. They killed her because they feared her power to give the Pakistani people more than the Islamists want them to have, and because they seek to push Pakistan into total chaos and unlimited carnage.

Third, Iraq is not the cause of this war — it is part of it. Remember one of the first terrible suicide murders committed in Iraq: in August 2003 al-Qa’eda killed Sergio Vieira de Mello, one of the UN’s most gifted officials, and many of his colleagues. De Mello was Kofi Annan’s special representative in Iraq and, like Annan, was opposed to the US war effort there. But al-Qa’eda denounced Annan as ‘America’s criminal slave’ and abused de Mello as ‘diseased’. They hated him in particular because he had helped Christian East Timor win independence from Muslim Indonesia — a heinous crime to al-Qa’eda.

It goes on in such a logical fashion. Perhaps Matts would send it or something like it to the author of the first 'post'.

Both are 'opinion' pieces, yet this one gives reasons for his ideas, that's logical reasoning. It can be wrong, that can be argued, but the reader has someplace to begin.
 
This is SO Matts:

Well it's hard to write a good conclusion when there was nothing of substance written. I have 6th grade students that know they can't get away with sweeping pronouncements, with no stated reasons to back it up. Matts, you went to college, ignore my snarkiness and look at what you are calling 'excellent.'

Wow ! you teaching 6th grade what a scary thought. this is why we home school our children ,hey! heres a assignment for you .think you can handle it..mabey it could be a class project

Spies, Communism, and Bananas: How and Why the CIA overthrew a government that led to 40 years of brutal repression : Part Three of the Cold War unit

A note: I recommend using all three parts of this lesson plan so students get a real feel for the period, but if you don't have time any of them can be done separately.

Grades:9-12

Time:

A. Coup overview research to select topic: one day
B. Research and presentation writing: two weeks
C. Presentation: 10-15 minutes per student
Overview: In 1954, a CIA-backed coup overthrew the democratically elected government of Guatemala and established a brutal military dictatorship in its place. Though the U.S. denied its participation at the time, the evidence is overwhelming, particularly since the Freedom of Information Act has made available many documents which leave little doubt of U.S. involvement. In early 1999, President Clinton even made an almost apology for the U.S. role in Guatemalan politics.


The coup resulted in 40 years of repression and the killing of over 200,000 Guatemalans.

The reported motivation for the violent coup was Jacobo Arbenz's communist leanings. He had the support of communists for many of his policies, including his desire to provide land to the many poor, landless peasants. He also encouraged unions among the workers at United Fruit Company, a United States based firm that had a stranglehold on much of Guatemala. United Fruit was very displeased with Arbenz's election and sought to undermine his government by pressuring the U.S. government to take action, and providing money to fund that action. In 1954, they finally got their wish.

Materials: Internet and library access.

Objectives:

Acquire a thorough understanding of the CIA-backed overthrow of Guatemala
Practice good research skills
Gain confidence in delivering effective oral presentations

Activities:

A. Have students deliver short (10 or 15 minute) talks on different aspects of the Guatemalan coup. Give them a day to come up with their own topic after reviewing some of the sites below. Some topic suggestions (all have corresponding web sites below




http://www.nancymatson.com/CLDWR3.HTM
 
Take into account who is hating us, and what, exactly, we'd have to do to make them love us.

Why anyone would want to be loved by backward, ignorant and tyrannical morons is beyond me.
 
I totally disagree with your first statement. as for the second, Yes, we are hated because we are more powerful AND effective than most, That certainly doesn't make us good, IT should make us ashamed.

And it isn't jelousy. it is out and out "fear and disgust".

Wow Doniston, for once I agree with you. I already posted this on another post, it just seems appropriate to be put here.

Do You Know About The CIA, Cocaine, And Bill Clinton?
And How the CIA laundered millions in drug profits from Mena and paid for Clinton's 1992 election campaign?
2 months ago
Additional Details
2 months ago

http://menacocaine.blogspot.com

http://www.apfn.org/apfn/snowjob1.htm

In part one of this article, we examined a CIA-supervised
cocaine smuggling operation based during the '80s in Mena, Arkansas. We also detailed evidence of then-Governor Clinton's role in suppressing evidence, mishandling federal funds, even blocking a congressional level investigation into the affair. While Clinton's at-least tacit role in the Mena cover-up continues to this day (he has yet to authorize any investigation into the charges), behind the scenes are highly secretive, quasi-independent elements within the US intelligence community who are handling the actual machinery. In a high level deal between the National Security Council and the Medellin cartel, millions of dollars were paid to Felix Rodriguez, the CIA's commander at El Salvador's Ilopango Air Base, and others (including Manuel Noriega) in exchange for access to the CIA pipeline for Medellin cocaine.
2 months ago

In this conclusion, we examine the secret network which laundered the Mena drug money. We also find that these same covert bankers, with close ties to BCCI, financed Clinton's 1992 presidential campaign. [It should be noted that since the publication of part one, this writer has learned that Buddy Young was appointed by Pres. Clinton to head the Dallas Regional Office of the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA). Young was Governor Clinton's chief of security, and the man who framed Terry Reed for trying to quit the Mena operation.
2 months ago

FEMA, of course, is the agency empowered to sieze control of the country in the event of martial law.]

HIGH FINANCE
There is one estimate that Barry Seal ran as much as $100 million worth of cocaine a month--$1.2 billion a year--through the Mena airbase.
2 months ago

Former Mena pilot Terry Reed has testified that large sums of money were being laundered through leading Arkansas banks and bond brokers (a pattern of investment also being examined by a federal investigator just as his researches were abruptly terminated).[1] For a period, he says, satchels containing $10 million in laundered cash were airdropped weekly at the airfield. These funds did not include other secret bank arrangements.
CBS News correspondant Bill Plante has said that there is trail of "tens of millions of dollars in cocaine profits [from Mena], and we don't know where it leads. It is a trail that has been blocked by the National Security Council."[
2 months ago

But despite the efforts of the NSC, there actually is a pretty good indication of where the money went (beside's the Secret Team's pockets). Money from CIA drug smuggling operations is known to have been laundered through BCCI, a massive transnational mega-bank set up and run to launder "covert funds" for intelligence and criminal clients.[3]
Coincidentally, BCCI has extremely deep roots in Arkansas. In fact, President Clinton has ties with some of BCCI's top shareholders. Most of the money for Clinton's 1992 campaign came from these people. They are the same people who were also raking in fortunes through companies which were supplying the Mena operation. In plain words, President Clinton was elected with money from CIA guns-and-drugs operations.
2 months ago

'COMPANY' PROPERTY & BIOWARFARE

One business in the CIA's Arkansas network was Park-on-Meter, or POM Inc. Based in Russellvile, AR its current annual revenue is estimated at $18 million.[4]
Commercially, it produces parking meters and machine parts. Covertly, it was manufacturing untraceable custom weapons parts for the Contras and shipping them to Mena. POM had subcontracted the job from a CIA front called Iver Johnson's Firearms
(now bankrupt), of Jacksonville, AR
2 months ago

Former CIA scientist Michael Riconosciuto[6] has told reporters that he was closely involved in these covert arms operations at POM. He claims that he supervised high-tech equipment transfers to POM, and had developed software to help launder the Mena drug money.[7]
He also says that POM manufactured external fuel tanks for C-130 transport planes.
This would have allowed the massive cargo planes to travel the long distances to Central and South America.[8] He also claims to have worked on fuel-air explosives specifically for use in the Contra war.[9] But Riconoscuito's most disturbing allegations concern his work in developing chemical and biological weapons in a project connected to POM.
2 months ago

He says that in 1983 the company, in conjunction with the infamous "private" police force Wackenhut and Stormont Laboratories in Woodland, CA, began production of the delivery system for the new chemical and biological warfare CBW weaponry for use in the Contra war.
He claims that POM was to receive chemical agents from the 354th Chemical Company of the Army Reserve, located on property across from the corrugated barn housing the POM facilities, for use in small explosive devices made with the same equipment POM used to produce parking meters.[10]
When contacted by journalist Alexander Cockburn, Stormont Labs acknowledged only "discussions" with Wackenhut about biological weapons. Wackenhut denied ever working with POM.
2 months ago

POM pres. Seth Ward admitted that the company had defense contracts, but only for "re-entry nose cones for the nuclear warheads on the MX missile and nozzles for rocket engines," not CBW weapons. Ward also falsely denied that POM ever accepted any money from the ADFA.

THE A.D.F.A.

Continued.................
2 months ago

BANK OF COKE & CLINTON

Fact: of the known BCCI assets in the US--approximately $60
billion--only $1.9 billion was ever located by investigators.
Fact: Despite pleading guilty to 31 felony counts--and the
missing $58.1 billion--BCCI paid only a simple $15 million fine in the United States, in a deal offered by Attorney General Richard Thornberg in 1990. (Thornberg was succeeded by William Pelham Barr, a "retired" CIA employee.)
2 months ago

And you could say Jackson Stephens had close ties to BCCI--he was the one who brokered the very arrival of BCCI in America in 1977. He is an old friend of former Carter official Bert Lance and was investment banker to Lance's National Bank of Georgia. Stephens introduced Lance to Saudi billionaire Ghaith Pharaon (who, fronting for BCCI, would later buy the National Bank of Georgia) and to BCCI founder Agha Hassan Abedi. SEC documents show that Stephens also steered Abedi to take over First American Bankshares in Washington DC.[29]
2 months ago

In 1990, another BCCI investor, Abdullah Taha Bakhsh, doubled his stake in Stephens' Worthen National Bank to a $10 million share. Worthen National is a Stephens-owned bank which extended a $3 million line of credit (at a lucrative rate of interest) to Clinton's presidential campaign in January 1992. (The Stephens family itself donated $100,000 to the Clinton campaign.) Later, Worthen became the Clinton campaign's depository for $55 million in federal campaign funds.
2 months ago

Last year Worthen National and Stephens Inc. were under investigation by the Federal Reserve last year for federal banking and antitrust violations. The investigation centered in part around misleading documents filed to the Fed in 1984 by William H. Kennedy 3d. Kennedy is now associate White House counsel and formerly the head of the Rose law firm.
And when former Whitewater special prosecutor Robert Fiske showed up in Little Rock, Worthen had a mysterious fire in which important documents related to the case were lost.

BCCI & THE CIA
2 months ago

The congressional Iran-Contra committee noted that then-CIA
director William Casey wanted to establish an offshore entity capable of conducting operations in furtherance of US foregin policy that was "stand-alone"-- financially independent of appropriated funds, and, in turn, congressional oversight.
Casey got his wish. The CIA was used BCCI and a complex offshore
financial system to set up its own unregulated, private, foreign policy apparatus.
In this way, it could ignore Congress and carry out its own political objectives throughout the world.
2 months ago

There is no question that BCCI was intimately involved in
covertly funding the decade's most heinous secret wars. "Black funds" travelled through BCCI for the Contra war, the Iranian-Israeli payoffs, and large covert wars in Afganistan
and Angola.

Since its inception in 1972, BCCI was born and bred to move
billions of dollars of blood money with no one seeing it. Time magazine wrote of the bank, "Superlatives are quickly exhausted: it is the largest corporate criminal enterprise ever."
Even enemies were apparently welcome at the trough.
2 months ago

A 1987 intelligence report by the French security services, later supported by US Congressional findings, stated that "BCCI had commercial links with Abu Nidal and front companies set up to finance his radical Palestinian group. The report also said Kuwaiti embassy officials paid $60 million into Nidal's BCCI account in London in 1987.[31] (This would have been around the time of the first Persian Gulf "Crisis", when Kuwaiti ships were reflagged as American and escorted by US warships.) The bank also maintained "cozy relations" with Libya, Syria, Iraq, and the PLO.
2 months ago

BCCI shareholder/frontman Abdul-Rouf Khalil is known to have
Saudi CIA connections, and frequents the office of the CIA station chief in Saudi Arabia.
The chief attorney for BCCI's powerful legal team was Clark
Clifford, a former Secretary of Defense and advisor to four presidents. His influence stretched even into the Federal Reserve. When Clifford was tried and convicted for his role in BCCI, Clinton himself pardoned him, ostensibly out of concern for the old man's health.
2 months ago

Perhaps most significantly, the US Senate has investigated the role
in BCCI of former Director of Central Intelligence Richard Helms. Helms aided the 1978 takeover attempt of First American Bank on behalf of BCCI Ltd, Georgia (Stephens' bank deal).[32]
Richard Helms was the Deputy Director of (covert) Operations at the CIA in the 1960s, under Nixon. Not surprisingly, his projects included the Laos operation, which first brought together the Secret team which would later wreak such havoc in the '80s.
Helms conducted the CIA's Chile campaign, climaxing with the assassination of Salvador Allende and the installation of Pinochet's fascist military state.
Helms was then CIA Director in the '70s. He later served as the US Ambassador to Iran. He joined the Shah's payroll and declared himself an agent of a foreign government after retiring.[
2 months ago

FULL SERVICE BANK

Not surprisingly, the sprawling BCCI transnational bank network
has been directly
linked to the laundering of CIA drug money.
John Blum, a former chief special counsel for the Senate Foreign
Relations
Committee's investigation of BCCI chaired by John Kerry, disclosed that the US Dept. of Justice "failed to act" on substantial evidence of money laundering, including a Chicago operation that dated back to 1985.[34] Blum also said that in 1988 he met BCCI employees in Florida who detailed drug-money laundering activities by the bank. He said the Senate knew about the use of BCCI by Manuel Noriega to launder large sums of cash.
As part of the CIA drug network, Noriega received millions of dollars in kickbacks from the Medellin cartel, laundering $90 million of it through BCCI.
His credit was such that BCCI executives routinely took him and his mistress out for extravagant nights on the town, running up tabs of $100,000.[35]
2 months ago

According to Congressional testimony by Jose Blandon, the CIA had actually advised Noriega to use BCCI as his bank. They themselves were paying an additional $200,000 a year into his account there.
BCCI's Panama branch, in the words of Time magazine, also "systematically helped Noriega loot the national treasury."[36]

HEROIN IN THE GOLD CRESCENT

BCCI's drug dealings stretched also into the Middle East.
Pakistan's finance minister, Sartaj Asis, revealed that local branches of BCCI had laundered drug money for the CIA, channelled covert CIA aid to the Afghan resistance, and also managed a multi-million dollar "slush fund" for covert operations.[37]
2 months ago

The CIA's Afghan effort was one of the largest of the post-WWII era.
Coincidentally, Afghanistan and Pakistan are two of the largest producers of heroin and opium in the world. (As is the Bekaa Valley in Lebanon.) Thus they became part of the CIA's global drug supermarket.
Even the Colombians showed up.
In what has been described as a "typical operation", a container ship from Colombia docked at night in Karachi, Pakistan. On one particular night in April 1989, "black unit operatives" paid $100,000 in bribes to Pakistan officials and then directed the unloading of massive crates. Using cranes, the crates were put onto trucks and taken to a secure airport where they were loaded onto an unmarked 707 jet. The loading was supervised by an American CIA officer.[38]
From Karachi the plane flew to Czechoslovakia, electronically disguised as a Pakistan International Airlines commercial flight. From Czechoslovakia the drug laden plane flew into the United States.[39]
2 months ago

The network which supported these routine missions thus moved heroin from the "Golden Crescent" and cocaine from South America through Europe and into the United States. The routes closely parallel those used by the CIA since the 1950s to move heroin from the Corsican mafia. The famous French Connection was a small fragment of the huge international network set up in a deal between the CIA and gangster Lucky Luciano.
(For a superb history of the early days of CIA drug running, see The Great Heroin Coup [South End Press, 1980] by Henrik Kruger.)
2 months ago

CONCLUSION

While Clinton is clearly a mere cog in the secret network, close examination of his friends and backers repeatedly betrays their deep connections in some of the most heinous covert operations in modern history. These include the smuggling of cocaine into the US by government officials, the theft of billions of dollars through bank and S&L fraud, top-secret bio-chemical warfare conducted against the civilian population of Nicaragua, and campaigns of terror, framing, and even assassination.
2 months ago

Furthermore, there is evidence which points pretty clearly to CIA's rigging of the US election in an operation which makes the October Surprise look like a game of tiddly winks. Using drug profits and money stolen from BCCI and other corrupt banks, the CIA and its co-conspirators actually paid for the election of a man ostensibly their rival. They have gone from merely sabotaging US elections to installing their own to appear as a rival.
2 months ago

The revelations of connections to the Casolaro "Octopus" are also profoundly disturbing. There are, in fact, surprising similarities between the apparently unrelated scenarios, all the way down to the fortuitous deaths of key witnesses and investigators, most of whom showa surprising propensity for dying within Treasury Dept. jurisdiction.
This story is far from being fully told. It is this writer's opinion that the United States is amidst a silent crisis which threatens to annihilate any vestige of constitutional government, freedom, and privacy. The government's use of the Promis software means that they have had the ability to track dissident populations--within the US and abroad--to a degree previously left only to the most laughable science fiction.
2 months ago

This story, and the tentacles it could only touch upon, describes a nation--the most powerful on earth--which has successfully been seized by a small army of blood thirsty pirates. It is a coup d'etat of astounding proportions and astonishing efficiency, one which begs a whole new definition of the word.
This is a story which makes one view the world through new eyes.
The question that remains: is Clinton a part of the Directorate, or is he himself a mere--perhaps unwitting--pawn in an incredibly cynical plan to destroy democracy as we know it this country?

So yeah, when it comes to Obama and Huckabee, I'll take Huckabee. Atleast he holds himself accountable to a higher authority. Weather that authority exists could be debated all day long. It doesn't matter...He believes it!
 

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