The uninsured

[Indigo_Girl]

The Uninsured
NY Times

Published: August 22, 2009




One of the major goals of health care reform is to cover the vast numbers of uninsured. But how vast, really, is that pool of people? Who are they? And how important is it to cover all or most of them?


Critics play down the seriousness of the problem by pointing out that the ranks of the uninsured include many people who have chosen to forgo coverage or are only temporarily uninsured: workers who could afford to pay but decline their employers’ coverage; the self-employed who choose not to pay for more expensive individual coverage; healthy young people who prefer not to buy insurance they may never need; people who are changing jobs; poor people who are eligible for Medicaid but have failed to enroll. And then there are the illegal immigrants, a favorite target of critics.


All that is true, to some degree. But the implication — that lack of insurance is no big deal and surely not worth spending a trillion dollars to fix — is not.


No matter how you slice the numbers, there are tens of millions of people without insurance, often for extended periods, and there is good evidence that lack of insurance is harmful to their health.


Scores of well-designed studies have shown that uninsured people are more likely than insured people to die prematurely, to have their cancers diagnosed too late, or to die from heart failure, a heart attack, a stroke or a severe injury. The Institute of Medicine estimated in 2004 that perhaps 18,000 deaths a year among adults could be attributed to lack of insurance.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/23/opinion/23sun1.html

you must post links to copyright material from other sources. you may not post articles in their entirety
thanks
del

 

[AllieBaba]

The people who are uninsured are those who can work, but don't, aren't disabled, don't have kids in the home, and aren't old enough to get medicare.

I see them every day.

 

[rightwinger]

The people who are uninsured are those who can work, but don't, aren't disabled, don't have kids in the home, and aren't old enough to get medicare.

I see them every day.

Bull Shit
Try people who have been laid off from work, young people who are entering the workforce with massive college debt and employers who won't provide insurance to new employees, the self employed who get charged exhorbitant rates, people with pre-existing conditions who can't find coverage.

Far from dead beats

 

[Big Black Dog]

It is not my responsibility to provide health insurance to anyone other than myself and family. It is also not the governments responsibility. Nowhere in the Constitution is this provided for. Health insurance is not a "right" to be provided for by the government. Why is that such a hard concept for you to accept? It is not intended that the government take care of us from birth to the grave. Take some responsibility for yourself for a change.

 

[Indigo_Girl]

alliebaba:

BONK !!

When the MIC can keep us in two expensive wars, CEOs can receive $Millions in bonuses, lobbyists can spend a $Million per day on Congressmen, I think we can spend money on healthcare for the poor. We have just lived thru eight years of intensive spending by republican oinkers...pork ! pork ! Year 2005 was a history-making year for republican frenzied feeding at the trough of taxpayers funds including 'The Bridge to Nowhere' which finally brought outcries of rage from the American population.

We can spend to bring some alleviation to the poor families so that they may retain their health and I believe the government owes them that. As a taxpayer, I don't mind giving my tax money to rehabilitate the poor so they may live longer and healthier lives. What I DO mind, is to have my taxes go to the huge war machine that is intent on killing our brave men and women and innocent civilians in war torn countries.

An excellent healthcare plan for every American citizen is inherent in the Democratic process....not just for Congressmen and government workers (paid for by the taxpayers) ....but for every American. If it is good enough for Congress, it should be good enough for the taxpayer !!

 

[paperview]

The people who are uninsured are those who can work, but don't, aren't disabled, don't have kids in the home, and aren't old enough to get medicare.

I see them every day.

Bull Shit
Try people who have been laid off from work, young people who are entering the workforce with massive college debt and employers who won't provide insurance to new employees, the self employed who get charged exhorbitant rates, people with pre-existing conditions who can't find coverage.

Far from dead beats

 

[veritas]

It is not my responsibility to pay for your unconstitutional preemptive imperialistic nations building resource grabbing BS either. Nowhere in the Constitution is this provided for. Imperialism is not a right granted under the Constitution, in fact, it is expressly prohibited.

And as unconstitutional imperialism goes, its a bad investment because we don't get anything, not a 51st or 52nd state, not a colony, not squat. Just more welfare for Halliburton and Blackwater and military industrial complex parasites, and the big oil gluttons and the rest of the tax evading government draining vampiric robber barons.

All we get is debt and dead and wounded. For what? So we can try democratic experiments on stone age ideologies that enslave women and thwart progress and justice?

No thanks.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Since when is it the govt.'s job to make sure we all have insurance?

 

[concept]

Ahh nothing like a good NYT oped.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

alliebaba:

BONK !!

When the MIC can keep us in two expensive wars, CEOs can receive $Millions in bonuses, lobbyists can spend a $Million per day on Congressmen, I think we can spend money on healthcare for the poor. We have just lived thru eight years of intensive spending by republican oinkers...pork ! pork ! Year 2005 was a history-making year for republican frenzied feeding at the trough of taxpayers funds including 'The Bridge to Nowhere' which finally brought outcries of rage from the American population.

We can spend to bring some alleviation to the poor families so that they may retain their health and I believe the government owes them that. As a taxpayer, I don't mind giving my tax money to rehabilitate the poor so they may live longer and healthier lives. What I DO mind, is to have my taxes go to the huge war machine that is intent on killing our brave men and women and innocent civilians in war torn countries.

An excellent healthcare plan for every American citizen is inherent in the Democratic process....not just for Congressmen and government workers (paid for by the taxpayers) ....but for every American. If it is good enough for Congress, it should be good enough for the taxpayer !!

If you're poor you can get help through medicaid if youre eligible. For those that lose their job there is COBRA to help those folks out. (COBRA) The Consolidated Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1985 requires most employers with group health plans to offer employees the opportunity to continue temporarily their group health care coverage under their employer's plan if their coverage otherwise would cease due to termination, layoff, or other change in employment status (referred to as "qualifying events").

Congressmen/women and govt. workers use private health insurance companies.

You cannot rehabilitate those who have yet to be habilitated.

Welfare is what keeps poor people poor. What incentatives to welfare recipients have to improve their situation?

 

[Indigo_Girl]

veritas:

u sed:

// It is not my responsibility to pay for your unconstitutional preemptive imperialistic nations building resource grabbing BS either. Nowhere in the Constitution is this provided for. Imperialism is not a right granted under the Constitution, in fact, it is expressly prohibited //

EXCELLENT !!!

 

[chanel]

Compare the NYT to the Washington Times:

Fourteen million of the 47 million are already eligible for government insurance, Medicaid, but have not signed up. (Pre-existing conditions do not exclude someone from joining Medicaid.) Those 14 million have not signed up because they do not want to pay the small monthly premium that Medicare charges. As a result, many who are eligible for Medicaid wait until they need care before they register. They are effectively insured at all times even when they are not formally enrolled in the program.

What about the uninsured who are not poor enough to qualify for Medicaid? Most are not in dire financial straits. After all, 27 million of the uninsured have personal incomes of more than $50,000.

True, there is a group of people who are borderline poor but not eligible for Medicaid, but the group is relatively small and many (if not most) of those people are illegal immigrants. Unfortunately, government surveys never ask respondents if they are legally in the United States.

The truly uninsured are, thus, largely young people who can afford insurance but who make the decision to temporarily go without it as they move between jobs. This tends to be for very short periods of time.

As the late, great senator from New York, Daniel Patrick Moynihan, used to say: "You are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own facts." The sensationalized plight of the uninsured is not a valid reason for enacting national health care.

EDITORIAL: Who are the uninsured? - Washington Times

 

[WillowTree]

weed out all the illegals, pass a national tamper proof ID and e verify. then we'll talk about the American un insured.

 

[paperview]

Compare the NYT to the Washington Times:

Fourteen million of the 47 million are already eligible for government insurance, Medicaid, but have not signed up. (Pre-existing conditions do not exclude someone from joining Medicaid.) Those 14 million have not signed up because they do not want to pay the small monthly premium that Medicare charges. As a result, many who are eligible for Medicaid wait until they need care before they register. They are effectively insured at all times even when they are not formally enrolled in the program.

What about the uninsured who are not poor enough to qualify for Medicaid? Most are not in dire financial straits. After all, 27 million of the uninsured have personal incomes of more than $50,000.

True, there is a group of people who are borderline poor but not eligible for Medicaid, but the group is relatively small and many (if not most) of those people are illegal immigrants. Unfortunately, government surveys never ask respondents if they are legally in the United States.

The truly uninsured are, thus, largely young people who can afford insurance but who make the decision to temporarily go without it as they move between jobs. This tends to be for very short periods of time.

As the late, great senator from New York, Daniel Patrick Moynihan, used to say: "You are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own facts." The sensationalized plight of the uninsured is not a valid reason for enacting national health care.

EDITORIAL: Who are the uninsured? - Washington Times

The Moonie Owned, Cult-Run Washington Times.

Literally owned by a man who proclaims himself as the next Messiah. (Really)
It's a Right Wing propaganda mill that has never made A DIME in the 20 years plus years of its existence. Rev. Moon funds it to the tune of BILLIONS. Yes, that's a B.
Capitalism at its best, eh?

Why would you be surprised?

 

[rightwinger]

It is not my responsibility to provide health insurance to anyone other than myself and family. It is also not the governments responsibility. Nowhere in the Constitution is this provided for. Health insurance is not a "right" to be provided for by the government. Why is that such a hard concept for you to accept? It is not intended that the government take care of us from birth to the grave. Take some responsibility for yourself for a change.

And its not my responsibility to feed the poor, provide housing for the homeless and educate those who can't afford it.
But somehow we find the money to execute two wars, provide tax breaks for the wealthy, and bail out banks and auto companies.
I love how you look at healthcare as some sort of luxury for those who can't afford it. Have you ever been sick? Ever been in constant pain? Ever needed a medical procedure that could save your life? Yea....screw the poor people

 

[paperview]

It is not my responsibility to provide health insurance to anyone other than myself and family. It is also not the governments responsibility. Nowhere in the Constitution is this provided for. Health insurance is not a "right" to be provided for by the government. Why is that such a hard concept for you to accept? It is not intended that the government take care of us from birth to the grave. Take some responsibility for yourself for a change.

But at least we build up all those Iraqi schools, eh?

 

[rightwinger]

So many of you are happy with your employer sponsored healthcare. Look at what has happened in the last decade. What will your employer sponsored healthcare plan look like ten years from now?

NCHC | Facts About Healthcare - Health Insurance Costs


Quote:
Employer and Employee Health Insurance Costs

Over the last decade, employer-sponsored health insurance premiums have increased 119 percent. 4

Employees have seen their share of job-based coverage increase at nearly the same rate during this period jumping from $1,543 to $3,354.4

The cumulative increase in employer-sponsored health insurance premiums have raised at four times the rate of inflation and wage increases during last decade. This increase has made it much more difficult for businesses to continue to provide coverage to their employees and for those workers to afford coverage themselves.4
The average employer-sponsored premium for a family of four costs close to $13,000 a year, and the employee foots about 30 percent of this cost.4 Health insurance costs are the fastest growing expense for employers. Employer health insurance costs overtook profits in 2008, and the gap grows steadily. 5
Total health insurance costs for employers could reach nearly $850 billion by 2019. Individual and family spending will jump considerably from $326 billion in 2009 to $550 billion in 2019.6
The Congressional Budget Office has estimated that job-based health insurance could increase 100 percent over the next decade.7 Employer-based family insurance costs for a family of four will reach nearly $25,000 per year by 2018 absent health care reform.7

 

[WillowTree]

It is not my responsibility to provide health insurance to anyone other than myself and family. It is also not the governments responsibility. Nowhere in the Constitution is this provided for. Health insurance is not a "right" to be provided for by the government. Why is that such a hard concept for you to accept? It is not intended that the government take care of us from birth to the grave. Take some responsibility for yourself for a change.

And its not my responsibility to feed the poor, provide housing for the homeless and educate those who can't afford it.
But somehow we find the money to execute two wars, provide tax breaks for the wealthy, and bail out banks and auto companies.
I love how you look at healthcare as some sort of luxury for those who can't afford it. Have you ever been sick? Ever been in constant pain? Ever needed a medical procedure that could save your life? Yea....screw the poor people

write your idiot in chief,, he bailed out the car companies, maybe he load up the acorn busses and get our money back, then when we weed out the illegals we can talk about insuring Americans whatchasay?

 

[KittenKoder]

I'm on Medicare and Medicaid ... I earn only $700 a month average ... don't even pay taxes because I am still under the poverty level. Anyone who is uninsured is just too damned lazy to fill out paperwork or too greedy to pay the small premium.

 

[rightwinger]

I'm on Medicare and Medicaid ... I earn only $700 a month average ... don't even pay taxes because I am still under the poverty level. Anyone who is uninsured is just too damned lazy to fill out paperwork or too greedy to pay the small premium.

Or is above the threshold to receive benefits.
The guy next door to me has a small lawncare business and a wife and three kids. He barely makes enough to pay his rent, utilities and food. He is able to afford a small healthcare policy with high premiums, copays and only pays a small percentage of his bills. He must avoid doctors visits and elective care because it will come out of pocket.

The US is the richest country in the world. We can do a better job of taking care of our people