The truth about Slavery and the Civil War

Discussion in 'Education' started by lordspike8319, May 1, 2008.

  1. lordspike8319
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    lordspike8319 Rookie

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    For years I have sat by and listened to wave after wave of men explain that the Civil war was fought over Slavery and that quite simply is not true. The Civil War was fought becuase of taxes. Much like the brits the north taxed the south for what they felt was too much and after a while they decided to make their own country. My family fought and died under the rebel flag and I'm damn proud of it. They stood up for what they thought was right. They didn't own slaves we were poor even then but we still fought.

    Speaking of Slavery he's another kicker for you. The whites didn't steal Africans we were sold Africans so if blacks of the world want someone to blame most of it goes to your great great great ect grandfathers chief who said "Hey I got these boys you got rum and rope lets make a deal." or something along those line. White shouldn't have bought them that's a given, but we shouldn't smoke either and we do that too.

    What do I have to back up these claims not much. I studied the subject for about ten years of my schooling and I watch the history channel a lot and that's about it. However even this week Men who fought under the rebel flag were refered to as Racist terrorist who tried to destroy this country and it amazes me that history has been so perverted by Politics.
     
  2. ReillyT
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    ReillyT Senior Member

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    Both of your propositions are simplifications.

    Slavery was clearly a major issue in the civil war, even if it wasn't the only issue. White capitalist agriculture in the south depended on its cheap labour force and were understandably antsy about it restriction.

    Whites did at times steal Africans, but usually relied on African raiding parties that would steal Africans from other groups and then sell them as slaves. While it is true that most of the Africans were sold to colonial slave traders by other Africans, Africans were usually not selling their own and were responding to the market that was created by the colonizers and (later) the Americans. Africa has been trying to come to grips with its complicity in the slave trade for years. This is not something that hasn't been addressed, but it doesn't absolve the colonial powers and the United States for its role (which you pointed out).
     
  3. The_Hammer
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    The_Hammer Member

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    The war was fought to bring the country back together. This I do not deny. But the southern states seceded primarily over their fear of their citizens rights to own slaves. Hell slavery is explicitly mentioned in several southern states secession declarations.
     
  4. mattskramer
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    mattskramer Senior Member

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    Slavery was a small part of the issue[/QUOTE]

    True. It takes someone to sell and someone to buy.
     
  5. Gungnir
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    Gungnir Member

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    War Between the States.

    The South was not powerless, it had enough sway to impose the Fugitive Slave laws on the rest of the States, an abomination to the spirit of the Constitution if there ever was one. What were those taxes on? Imported goods that were processed overseas by European countries (remember we've fought with England, France, Spain, and some Germans). Many of those preprocessed goods originated as Slave produced materials in the South.

    Since it was the Super Rich Aristocracy which owned the majority of the Slaves they were enriching themselves at the expense of their country men. Both the Slave labor and foreign dealings of the Aristrocracy was essentially traitorous to other Americans.

    The Aristocracy took advantage of the the patriotism and fear (re Haiti) of the South and siezed upon words of Northern loudmouths as fuel for the fire.

    The Englishmen and Scotts fought for King and Country against ungrateful American insurrectionist, does that mean their war was just?

    Most people will fight an invader in their home. Even the Angels knocked before going into Lot's house.

    That is like saying you don't deserve a DUI because you bought the beer and didn't steal it.

    Forget them, the aristocracy {now ensocnsed in the Jackass Party} owes more explanation to you than anyone else. Why do you think there was almost no middle class in most of the South until the 40s? Can you imagine how cheap property would be if we didn't have all these millions of slave descendants here?

    The first thing I would ask my ancestors if I could go back in time would be what kind of traitorous jackass puts profit before patriotism?

    Are you just asking for the pc nutters to rip you a new one? At least be consistent. Your family wasn't part of that, right?

    Government public education and the History Channel? Egad man, those are not points of distinction!

    First, have more pride in the Lost Cause and stop calling them rebels. George Washington was more a rebel than Robert Lee.
    Second, (I read this on an anti-forum) stop confusing the genteel generalship and southern morality with the mainstream aristocratic traitorous bs that caused the War.
    Third, if you are going to be afraid of the R word you might as well just give up.
    Fourth, there are legitimate terrorist and then there is war. If you want terror look at Kansas and Viet'nam. If you want to see how to make terror work, look at Viet'nam. If you want to see how to make terror fail, look at Palestine.

    Grow a set man! We were the losers, that is how war is done. You should be thankful the South was readmitted into the Union and that we ONLY had Reconstruction. We got off the hook easy!

    Look at the inferiority clause in the CSA Constitution too!
     
  6. lordspike8319
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    lordspike8319 Rookie

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    You make some decent points all of you. I may have said what I ment to say wrong. What I ment is that slavery wasn't the only issue of the civil war and we seem to agree on that.

    However there has always been something that I've wondered. If the south had won don't you think they would of freed the slaves on their own someday. It may have been further in the future by I think it still would of happened.
     
  7. RetiredGySgt
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    RetiredGySgt Platinum Member

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    Ya like the South African Government Freed the blacks in their Country.
     
  8. The_Hammer
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    The_Hammer Member

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    Well considering that the south africans were indigenous...

    But actually the confederacy did abolish slavery, in fact before the union did. Though the way they did it was designed to create an apartheid very similar to that of south Africa.
     
  9. RetiredGySgt
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    RetiredGySgt Platinum Member

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    So the Confederacy banned slavery before the "Emancipation Proclamation"? Interesting claim, totally wrong of course but nice try.

    While it is true all the Proclamation did is free the slaves in the rebelling States it in effect ensured that once the war was over those couple States still in the Union would lose slavery as well.

    And since the South could only speak FOR the South and very little of it by 1865, the supposed banning of slavery was in fact meaningless. Not to mention it actually on freed them from chains not from being 3rd class citizens with few if any rights.
     
  10. cbi0090
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    cbi0090 Member

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    Slavery was a big issue but not in the sense we often think of it today. To the industrialists in the north it was an immoral advantage that the southern agriculturists had who they had to financially compete with. Of course, the northern industrialists had the quite of few immigrants who they treated not much better than slaves, but they did at least come over on their own accord. But more importantly, slavery was a battle cry.
    It resonanted with many, particularly in rural areas and the midwest, as an evil that good men had to stand up and fight.
    I have a letter written by my great-great grandfather providing instructions to family members and an explanation as to why he was leaving for a "short while" to "make all men free". He was very religious, as most in Indiana were at that time, and he felt obligated to act. That was typical in those areas.
    Of course, one of the most famous biographies regarding the Civil War "For the Union" spells out who many were motivated by the need to keep the country together and only nomally acknowledged the issue of slavery.
    It's difficult to imagine today, but slavery was not that uncommom throughout the world at that time and real action against was a fairly new movement in western culture. The mentality at that time is hard for us to grasp these days but it was one that had been around since the beginning of civilisation and seen by many as a basic fact of life or truth. That's not a justification, it's just something that was not much different than thinking that the world was flat in centuries before, or thinking that you belong to the one and only true religion, like many do today.
     

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