The Supposed Virgin Birth

And who figured out that it took god 6 days to make everything and that he was so tired that he needed a rest day?
 
And who figured out that it took god 6 days to make everything and that he was so tired that he needed a rest day?

Good question. Always wondered if some bored mathematician could use that 6 day figure and come up with how long it took God to make the universe adding up all the stars and planets and such. :) If the answer exceeded 13.4 billion years by a significant amount, oops. :)
 
And who figured out that it took god 6 days to make everything and that he was so tired that he needed a rest day?
Humans were created b'tzlem Elokim (In the image of God).
Tzelem means shadow.
In order for humans to appreciate God, they require a time to step back and contemplate on God.
That time was defined by God as once every 7 days.
 
Isaiah 7:14 – A Virgin Birth?

Jews For Judaism Isaiah 7 14 8211 A Virgin Birth

Why do Christians try to convert Jews to a pagan religion?

Christians don't try to convert Jews to a pagan religion but from a pagan religion just as the prophet Jeremiah did.

As for your OP, Yahsua was fully God and fully man, therefore, John did not mention the virgin birth because he chose to focus his genealogy on the eternal nature of Yashua, thus you have "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God" (John 1:1).

I agree with you in your response that while Jeremiah was following God the Jews were following men and believing men over the Word God gave them that judgment was coming. The dead were raised, the lame walked, the blind saw when Jesus came and yet they denied Him because they didn't want to be thrown out of the synagogues -they loved the praises of men more than the praise of God - the prophecies were fulfilled and yet they still denied him just as Isaiah prophesied they would.

Still God is able to graff back in the natural branch but in the meantime He has a people who were not even looking for Him! Gentiles believed on His name while His own received him not. The bible says this was to provoke the Jews to jealousy - also through the broken off branch the world has been given the opportunity to be graffed in - as with the Jews - some will - some won't - but think of how foolish it is to say no to Jesus Christ who is God- in order to say yes to men who supposedly claim to serve Him! Can you imagine a Rabbi who dies and sees God and He says you were given the truth about my Son and denied the salvation I offered you through Him - depart from me thou worker of iniquity.

Imagine being in hell while knowing Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and the prophets are there. Imagine that. Too horrific. We should be spending every waking hour we have warning people and pleading with them to come to Jesus Christ while they still can. There is nothing more important than this. How dare any Pastor, any tv evangelist preach about money, the widows mite, the prophet and the widow and the last meal offering when then this world is starving for Jesus Christ, thirsting after Jesus Christ. If anyone is in a church like that? Get out of there right now! If anyone is listening to that nonsense on tv? Turn it off and go read James 5: 1 - 6 and see what misery awaits these false prosperity teachers and preachers. Hell is their future if they do not turn and repent.
 
http://www.heartofisrael.net/chazak/articles/almah.html

Four things are very obvious from reading the above verses. One, it cannot "be proved 'alma designates a young woman who is not a virgin." [Macrae (672) [emphasis added], contra Kirby who claims "that the context many times demands that "almah" is *not* rendered as "virgin," see also J. G. Machen, The Virgin Birth of Christ, p. 288, cited by Feinberg (1967: 45); Price states it this way: "No usage of the word "almah" in the Hebrew bible can be shown to mean other than a sexually mature virgin ...


"; Vawter (310) declares that "nowhere in the OT is 'almah used in a way that certainly excludes the idea of virginity"; these are contra the claim made by Nahigian, Kirby and others--see below.]

Two, while this word isn't a "technical term for a virgin: it does represent a "young woman one of whose characteristics is virginity." [ibid.; see also Davies and Allison (214); contra Showalter (790) who claims that 'almah is "without any implication of virginity"; or, Clements (88) who states that the young woman "is not necessarily a virgin"; Ibn Ezra (42) states it even stronger [almah] "is certainly not a virgin"; to which Toy (531) and Kirby agrees -- note that not a single one of these writers provides any support for such a claim. See also Solomon Mandelkern, Veteris Testamenti Concordantiae (Tel Aviv, 1978): 881; he defines "'almah" as "puella nubilis," "virgo matura," "puella nubilis" means marriageable child and "virgo matura" means mature virgin. We should note here that Jerome, who studied under the rabbi's of his time, used the word virgo.] In his Basic Theology (Victor Press), Charles Ryrie says "There is no instance where it can be proved that almah designates a young woman who is not a virgin." This is very important as we will see later. Watts (99) suggests that the "common meaning is one who is sexually mature. It is difficult to find a word in English that is capable of the same range of meaning. "Virgin" is too narrow, while "young woman" is too broad." Sauer makes the same points in his article. Price defined almah as "sexually mature virgin." After analyzing the use of the term "'almah" in the OT, Niessen (147) concludes, that "a more accurate translation would be "young virgin"." This would be an especially appropriate translation considering the cultural context which is something most critics seem to ignore; for an example, see Moody (62-3). Likewise, even Cranfield (181) understates the evidence at hand when he notes that "the word 'almah; simply denotes a young woman." Why he didn't take note of the connotation of the word is not revealed. Other suggested translations include the following: Fitzmyer (40) and Kissane (88) translates "'almah" as "a young woman of marriageable age." Baab (787) suggests that it might be translated as "be mature sexually." Likewise, Creager (341) notes that etymologically speaking "the basic meaning was "a sexually mature female."" The combined effect of all these translations is to lead one to the full meaning of the word "'almah": "young woman of marriageable age who is sexually mature who is not already married." Dummelow (418) puts it as "one of maturing and marriageable age." Wheless (235) cites the New Standard Bible Dictionary (939): "Bethulah conveys the idea of virginity, of a young unmarried woman; almah is used simply of a young woman of marriageable age." This definition of almah is misleading because it totally ignores the cultural context and in the case of Isaiah 7:14 it ignores the prophetic context.

Three, there is no evidence from these verses that could lead one to the conclusion that the word "'almah" refers to one who is "newly married" as some lexicons suggest--see Brown - Driver - Briggs - Gesenius, and Koehler and Baumgartner. It is worth noting that neither of these lexicons provided any proof for this "translation." Which is probably why Brennan, page 971, says "it is never used in the Hebrew Bible when referring to a married woman." Or, as Young, (1965): 287 & 288, states the matter: "At the outset we can confidently assert that the word almah is never employed of a married woman. ... Only almah makes clear that the mother was unmarried." Moody (1962) page 789 says that a man and a woman "were considered husband and wife from the time of betrothal" citing Matthew 1:19-20 as support. However, an inspection of the Greek reveals that the word used for "husband" here is "aner" which can mean a "betrothed or future husband."

Some have suggested that given that other English translations use the word "maid" or "maiden" that therefore this indicates as well that the word "'almah" does not mean "virgin." However, as Price notes, these words are synonyms for "virgin" -- Webster's Universities Dictionary (Library Guild, 1940): 1022 has "an unmarried woman; especially a virgin" as part of its first definition of the word "maid."

Four, another thing that can be seen from the above uses of the word "'almah" in the Bible is that there is not a single case, as noted by Brennan (971), Young (121), Surburg (114), Sauer (553), and Kissane (89) in which the word refers to a married woman. This is contra the suggestion made by Owens (58 -- here he violates one of his own rules for proper interpretation), Willis (11-2), the Catholic Encyclopedia, Buckwalter (12), Toy (531), and others. Motyer (125, with emphasis added) notes that "'almah" is "the only Hebrew word which without qualification means an unmarried woman." See also Kraeling (287), Reymond (3), and Wilson (316).

TABLE 2: Other Translations of Isaiah 7:14 (with their respective notes)
Contemporary English Version But the LORD will still give you proof. A virgina is pregnant; she will have a son and will name him Immanuel. {aOr, "young woman." [extended note not included]}

God's Word So the Lord himself will give you this sign: A virgin will become pregnant and give birth to a son, and she will name him Immanuel [God Is With Us].

King James Version Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.

Living Bible All right then, the Lord himself will choose the sign--a child shall be born to a virgin!d And she shall call him Immanuel (meaning, "God is with us"). {Provides lengthy note on the word translated "virgin".}

Modern Language Bible Therefore the LORD Himself will give you a sign: Behold, the virgin shall conceive and shall bear a son and shall call His name Immanuel;

New American Bible Therefore the Lord himself will give you this sign: the virgin shall be with child, and bear a son, and shall name him Immanuel.

New American Standard Bible "Therefore the Lord Himself will give you a sign: Behold, a virgin will be with child and bear a son, and she will call His name Immanuel."

New Century Version The Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgina will be pregnant. She will have a son, and she will name him Immanuel. {a virgin The Hebrew word means "a young woman." Often this meant a girl who was not married and had not yet had sexual relations with anyone.}

New English Bible Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign: A young woman is with child, and she will bear a son, and will call him Immanuel.

New International Version Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.

New Jerusalem Bible The Lord will give you a sign in any case: It is this: the young womanb is with child and will give birth to a son whom she will call Immanuel. {b. . . For 'young woman' Gk reads 'virgin', interpreted by Mt of Mary.}

New Living Translation All right then, the Lord himself will choose the sign, Look! The virgin* will conceive a child! She will give birth to a son and will call him Immanuel--'God is with us.' {*Or young woman;.}

New Revised Standard Version Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign. Look, the young woman q is with child and shall bear a son, and shall name him Immanuel. {qGk the virgin;}

Revised English Bible Because you do, the Lord of his own accord will give you a sign; it is this: A young woman is with child, and she will give birth to a son and call him Immanuel.

Revised Standard Version Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign. Behold, a young woman i shall conceive and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. {iOr, virgin;}

Today's English Version/Good News Bible Well then, the Lord himself will give you a sign: a young woman kwho is pregnant will have a son and will name him 'Immanuel.' {kYOUNG WOMAN: The Hebrew word here translated "young woman" is not the particular term for "virgin," but refers to any young woman of marriageable age. The use of "virgin" in Mt 1:23 reflects a Greek translation of the Old Testament, made some 500 years after Isaiah.;}


It should be noted that the word "'almah" is translated in the Septuagint as "parthenos" (translated as "virgin" in its normal sense; see Carmignac (329-330), Abel (398); Willis (12) makes no attempt to explain why the Septuagint translators then used "parthenos" here if they didn't understand it to mean "virgin".) in only two cases (Is. 7:14 and Gen. 24:43); whereas, "bethulah" is translated as "parthenos" in all but three cases: 1 Kings 1:2, Jer. 14:7, and Esther 2:2 (the Septuagint doesn't translate Est. 2:19). This fact would indicate that "parthenos"/"be'thulah" means a woman (exact age unknown -- to show that a young woman is being referred to the Hebrew would modify "bethulah" by the word "na'arah") who is a virgin --the following exceptions should be noted: Joel 1:8; Est. 2:17; Ezek. 23:3 (these texts will be dealt with below). One might note, as Davies and Allison (214) have, that in Gen. 24:16 the word "be'tulah" is qualified by the clause "no man had known her" which is unusual if "bethulah" strictly meant "virgin" (unless it is a "poetic repetition"--Wadsworth (167) points out that it is "commonplace in the Old Testament" to use "redundancy" "to give emphasis to an important point." Dodd (302) notes the verse but entirely skips the qualification! Willis (11), notes that Wenham makes an illegitimate attempt to extend the qualifier to "'almah" as well since it is used in verse 43.). Note that the qualifying phrase does not appear in 24:43 where the Hebrew uses the word "'almah" and that the Septuagint used "parthenos" in both cases--the use of "parthenos" in the Septuagint in Gen. 24:43 was, Vawter's (322) opinion "obviously predetermined by the btwlh; of v. 16." Now note that this idea doesn't govern the use of "parthenos" in Is. 7:14. For other verses that have to use a qualifying phrase with "bethulah" see Judges 21:12 ("... virgins, that had known no man by lying with any male ...") and Lev. 21:3 ("... a virgin, ..., which hath had no husband; ...") for other examples of qualifying clauses being added. It should also be noted that there are cases in classical literature where "parthenos" refers to females who are not virgins (see Dodd (302) who also refers the reader to Liddel and Scott, and Lattey (94); Ford (294) also supplies examples from undated sepulchral inscriptions. Roberts (503) mentions that this word is "regularly applied to temple prostitutes"; unfortunately, he supplies no details or sources.); just as in Is. 7:14 and Gen. 24:43 "parthenos"/"'almah" means a young woman who is a virgin, or, instead, "young virgin." This confluence of meanings would be the only reason why the Jewish Greek translations of the OT (Aquila, Symmachus and Theodotion) used "neanis" (young woman) instead of "parthenos" at Is. 7:14 (cf. J. Ziegler, Septuaginta xiv Isaias (1939): 147; Both Dodd (304) and Lippard note the change in wording without bothering to ask why these translations changed the wording.); otherwise there would have been no reason to change the wording. In contesting this changing of the word's Jerome argued that although, in Kamesar's words (page 63), "the term almah; itself does not mean virgin, it necessitates virginity ... it entails 'more than virginity'." Kamesar (71) notes that Jerome claimed that "the word almah; is used only of virgins in the Hebrew Bible." Jerome's testimony on this matter is important, as Wilson (315) points out, because he "studied Hebrew under the Jewish rabbis of his time (about A.D. 400)." Likewise, Machen points out that "as a matter of fact there is no place among the seven occurrences of 'almah in the Old Testament where the word is clearly used of a woman who was not a virgin." [J. G. Machen, The Virgin Birth of Christ, page 288; cited by Feinberg (256-7)] This simple fact seems to have escaped the attention of Robby Berry; he claims that the word "'almah" "could refer to a virgin, or not, depending on the context."


sorry Jeri there is nothing in the Hebrew scripture that talks about a divine man god messiah, and Isaiah isn't talking about a Messiah, no matter how much Christians try to twist Torah (who was given to the Jews)

Do you always change topic rather than address the counter argument, Guno? That is rude. Just hear me out for a minute or two here. I have given you more than enough evidence that almah is definition of a virgin in that day - that not once was almah used to describe a "non - virgin" in the Torah - Tanach - Old Testament - no not one single time - the word denotes virgin - yet you ignored my response - then I gave you many scriptures on Luke referencing Mary - including angel appearing to her to announce her future as mother of Jesus - a virgin birth - by the Holy Spirit - and you jump to Isaiah who most certainly WAS revealing the Messiah - indeed the very One He encountered in the Throne Room! How could He write down the vision without having seen first? You see, Jesus warned the Jews - Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and the prophets will be in heaven while you yourselves will be shut out! When he went to the cross? He went down to hell and took the keys to hell and the grave and those awaiting the promise - those in the grave- residing in a place called paradise - within view of hell - heard Him, received Him, went with Him in the ascension and are in heaven for ever more while you? You are still a work in progress here! But keep talking because we shall surely sort it out!
 
And who figured out that it took god 6 days to make everything and that he was so tired that he needed a rest day?
Humans were created b'tzlem Elokim (In the image of God).
Tzelem means shadow.
In order for humans to appreciate God, they require a time to step back and contemplate on God.
That time was defined by God as once every 7 days.
And who figured out that it took god 6 days to make everything and that he was so tired that he needed a rest day?
Humans were created b'tzlem Elokim (In the image of God).
Tzelem means shadow.
In order for humans to appreciate God, they require a time to step back and contemplate on God.
That time was defined by God as once every 7 days.
And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

So, god gets tired and needs a nap. Now you know. :lol:
 
The virgin birth myth predates Christianity. It's just another thing Christianity co-opted from older religions
 
The virgin birth prophesy - including the prophecy of Christ predates the birth of Christ by many hundred years, Skull Pilot. It is found in the Torah - Tanach - Isaiah prophesied of His coming - Malachi - who was the very last prophet God spoke through for 400 years ( God was silent for 400 yrs after Malachi ) until John the Baptist arrived ( then God spoke through John the Baptist ) - who Malachi prophesied would be the messenger sent to prepare the way for the Messiah - Jesus Christ - He is clearly spoken of in Malachi 3:1 but to call the prophesies of the prophets myths is wrong and to attach the teachings of demons in false religions preceding which were rooted in Baal worship is like taking the testimony of a Satanist under oath - as he lays his hand on the bible - a joke. A bad joke at that. Anyone who would believe a baal worshiper is a fool. Satan's workers are incapable of honesty because honesty is a virtue and Hell has not virtues. Understand? Keep reading. You will. Satan does not know the future - Herod didn't know who to murder so he murdered all male babes under age 2. The truth is history revisionists have always been around - the devil always moves the boundary markers thinking no one will figure it out. How do you think the truth of this nations Christian roots became buried and covered up from this present generation? As I said, keep reading. You'll understand.
 
The virgin birth prophesy - including the prophecy of Christ predates the birth of Christ by many hundred years, Skull Pilot. It is found in the Torah - Tanach - Isaiah prophesied of His coming - Malachi - who was the very last prophet God spoke through for 400 years ( God was silent for 400 yrs after Malachi ) until John the Baptist arrived ( then God spoke through John the Baptist ) - who Malachi prophesied would be the messenger sent to prepare the way for the Messiah - Jesus Christ - He is clearly spoken of in Malachi 3:1 but to call the prophesies of the prophets myths is wrong and to attach the teachings of demons in false religions preceding which were rooted in Baal worship is like taking the testimony of a Satanist under oath - as he lays his hand on the bible - a joke. A bad joke at that. Anyone who would believe a baal worshiper is a fool. Satan's workers are incapable of honesty because honesty is a virtue and Hell has not virtues. Understand? Keep reading. You will. Satan does not know the future - Herod didn't know who to murder so he murdered all male babes under age 2. The truth is history revisionists have always been around - the devil always moves the boundary markers thinking no one will figure it out. How do you think the truth of this nations Christian roots became buried and covered up from this present generation? As I said, keep reading. You'll understand.

Satan isn't the devil you ignorant girl. Satan's first mention is in Tanach, as an angel of God's. Hell's first mention is in the New Testament. There is zero mention of hell or anything remotely akin to hell in Judaism, and certainly no indication Satan rules hell until Christianity came along and perverted a Jewish text.

...One of the things I have against Christianity referencing another thread. :)
 
All these were lifted straight from other religions, some of which preceded Christianity by 700 years
hey guru, remember the last time you made this claim and I proved you were lying but you ran away and never responded?.......I do.......
Out of curiosity, what is your proof?
the actual mythologies of those who the atheists claim had virgin births....so far, in every one claimed, the stories surrounding the deity didn't actually mention a virgin birth until some atheist posted it on his website.....
so far we've covered the "virginity" of Isis who impregnated herself with a golden dildo made from her dead husband's penis, the virgin birth of Buddha who was the seventh son of his parents and seven or eight others......if you think you have one we missed I will be glad to prove you wrong.....

This story of Buddhas birth from About.com sounds a lot like Virgin Birth. Why do you say it isn't?;
/boggle......the six sons she already had argue against it......

I suppose we non-Christians tend to lump "Virgin Birth" into a file labeled "Miraculous Births". And if your claim that she already had six children before she gave birth to the Buddha was correct it would definitely disprove the "Virgin" detail in the miraculous nature of his birth. However I haven't seen any corroborating evidence of your claim in my research, as a matter of fact the most unambiguous answer comes from some sort of expert on Buddhism in an answer forum on wiki.answers.com - Did Buddha Have Siblings?

Answered by - Buddhism Supervisor Chrishan Silva;

"Buddha did not have any full blooded brothers or sisters because his mother Maha Maya died seven days after she gave birth to him, he was an only child at the time."

It could almost seem silly arguing the details of myths and legends, they tend to change substantially from teller to teller, time to time and place to place. When we are discussing a 2000 year old story like the birth of a man-god such as the one in the Christian narrative I guess it is unavoidable. The myriad of pagan rites, dates and myths absorbed by the Judeo-Christian tradition are more instructive in a study of the evolution of the Christian religion though than an outline of Buddhas miraculous birth. I don't think anybody has claimed Christians "copied" that component of the Buddha myth. It is instructive however in delineating the many traits ancient religions had in common
 
Other examples of virgin born Gods
Krishna was born of the virgin Devaki
Savior Dionysus was born of the virgin Semele.
Buddha too was born of a virgin,
The old Teutonic goddess Hertha was a virgin impregnated by the heavenly Spirit and bore a son.
Scandinavian Frigga was impregnated by the All-Father Odin and bore Balder, the healer and savior of mankind..."
Krishna - the eighth child of Davarki...
Hindu Gods Krishna - the Hindu God Krishna

Dionysus - Dionysus is the son of Zeus andSemele. He is the only god to have a mortal parent. Zeus came to Semele in the night, invisible, felt only as a divine presence. Semele was pleased to be a lover of a god, even though she did not know which one.
Dionysus

Buddha -
According to ancient tradition, Queen Maya, his mother, first had a dream of a beautiful white elephant coming down into her womb, and this was interpreted as a sign that the Buddha, or a universal emperor, was about to be born. When her time came, Queen Maya went into the garden and gave painless birth to the bodhisattva. He immediately walked, spoke, and was received by Brahma.
nothing about virginity in the original tradition.....
LIFE OF BUDDHA

Hertha - sorry, went through a dozen websites about Hertha and found nothing about birth, let alone a virgin birth....apparently she went around among mortals on a wagon tour every year.....one story said that "when she tired of intercourse with humans" the priests would return her home and the slaves that accompanied her were drowned......this might argue against virginity....

Frigga - the wife of Odin....he may not take kindly to aspersions regarding his virility.....
Frigg - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia
 
Answered by - Buddhism Supervisor Chrishan Silva;

"Buddha did not have any full blooded brothers or sisters because his mother Maha Maya died seven days after she gave birth to him, he was an only child at the time."
point noted, I had Buddha confused with Krishna...see above....his mother was, however, married to the King, unless your are arguing that the reason he had no older siblings was that the King had not performed his marital duties.....
 
The virgin birth prophesy - including the prophecy of Christ predates the birth of Christ by many hundred years, Skull Pilot. It is found in the Torah - Tanach - Isaiah prophesied of His coming - Malachi - who was the very last prophet God spoke through for 400 years ( God was silent for 400 yrs after Malachi ) until John the Baptist arrived ( then God spoke through John the Baptist ) - who Malachi prophesied would be the messenger sent to prepare the way for the Messiah - Jesus Christ - He is clearly spoken of in Malachi 3:1 but to call the prophesies of the prophets myths is wrong and to attach the teachings of demons in false religions preceding which were rooted in Baal worship is like taking the testimony of a Satanist under oath - as he lays his hand on the bible - a joke. A bad joke at that. Anyone who would believe a baal worshiper is a fool. Satan's workers are incapable of honesty because honesty is a virtue and Hell has not virtues. Understand? Keep reading. You will. Satan does not know the future - Herod didn't know who to murder so he murdered all male babes under age 2. The truth is history revisionists have always been around - the devil always moves the boundary markers thinking no one will figure it out. How do you think the truth of this nations Christian roots became buried and covered up from this present generation? As I said, keep reading. You'll understand.

Satan isn't the devil you ignorant girl. Satan's first mention is in Tanach, as an angel of God's. Hell's first mention is in the New Testament. There is zero mention of hell or anything remotely akin to hell in Judaism, and certainly no indication Satan rules hell until Christianity came along and perverted a Jewish text.

...One of the things I have against Christianity referencing another thread. :)

I wish you would agree with me to just buy a bible rather than reading it online, Delta. It would be a blessing to you I am certain of it. Now hell is mentioned over 400 times in the Old Testament and even more times in the New Testament. Satan is the devil and I am not ignorant nor am I a "girl". I am a grown woman. Thank you. Satan is known as the devil, the dragon, Lucifer among other titles. If you would buy a bible and read it instead of getting your information off the internet you'd be reading the bible more. If you would like the scriptures referencing hell in the old testament just ask. I will post them tomorrow. ( God willing )
 
The virgin birth myth predates Christianity. It's just another thing Christianity co-opted from older religions

No, the true virgin birth predates little baby Tammuz's mamma's fantasies. The virgin birth was foretold in the plan of redemption foretold in the very stars God set in place at the beginning of creation. After all, Yashua was/is the lamb slain from the foundation of the earth. Babylonian sun god worship was all an attempt by satan to copy God's plan.
 
Satan isn't the devil you ignorant girl. Satan's first mention is in Tanach, as an angel of God's. Hell's first mention is in the New Testament. There is zero mention of hell or anything remotely akin to hell in Judaism, and certainly no indication Satan rules hell until Christianity came along and perverted a Jewish text.

...One of the things I have against Christianity referencing another thread. :)

The Hebrew says what it says. Therefore you can look at it as Jesus defined sheol as hell or the Jews redefined it as the "nether-world".
 
Should read Catholic Encyclopedia's entry for hell which discusses the origin, and more notably, the linking of it to sheol.

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA Hell

"The term hell is cognate to "hole" (cavern) and "hollow". It is a substantive formed from the Anglo-Saxon helan or behelian, "to hide". This verb has the same primitive as the Latin occulere and celare and the Greek kalyptein. Thus by derivation hell denotes a dark and hidden place. In ancient Norse mythology Hel is the ill-favoured goddess of the underworld. Only those who fall in battle can enter Valhalla; the rest go down to Hel in the underworld, not all, however, to the place of punishment of criminals...
...The Latin infernus (inferum, inferi), the Greek Hades, and the Hebrew sheol correspond to the word hell. Infernus is derived from the root in; hence it designates hell as a place within and below the earth. Haides, formed from the root fid, to see, and a privative, denotes an invisible, hidden, and dark place; thus it is similar to the term hell. The derivation of sheol is doubtful. It is generally supposed to come from the Hebrew root meaning, "to be sunk in, to be hollow"; accordingly it denotes a cave or a place under the earth. In the Old Testament (Septuagint hades; Vulgate infernus) sheol is used quite in general to designate the kingdom of the dead, of the good (Genesis 37:35) as well as of the bad (Numbers 16:30); it means hell in the strict sense of the term, as well as the limbo of the Fathers. But, as the limbo of the Fathers ended at the time of Christ's Ascension, hades (Vulgate infernus) in the New Testament always designates the hell of the damned."


What you have to understand first is as Catholics, they believe in Hell proper. So any mention in other faiths or mythologies refering to some afterlife under the ground will be interpreted as indicating this Hell-place they believe in, and not as anything else. So when they read sheol in Judaism is some place underground, they make the leap that that must be Hell.

But Judaism has no version of Hell whatsoever. If God doesn't like you he simply wont ressurect you on that day. Which is much more practical than designing some place just to punish people out of spite.
 
I wish you would agree with me to just buy a bible rather than reading it online, Delta. It would be a blessing to you I am certain of it. Now hell is mentioned over 400 times in the Old Testament and even more times in the New Testament. Satan is the devil and I am not ignorant nor am I a "girl". I am a grown woman. Thank you. Satan is known as the devil, the dragon, Lucifer among other titles. If you would buy a bible and read it instead of getting your information off the internet you'd be reading the bible more. If you would like the scriptures referencing hell in the old testament just ask. I will post them tomorrow. ( God willing )

Dunno what version you're reading that "hell" is in the OT portion, but I can only assume that particular Bible uses large print and has color illustrations.
 
I wish you would agree with me to just buy a bible rather than reading it online, Delta. It would be a blessing to you I am certain of it. Now hell is mentioned over 400 times in the Old Testament and even more times in the New Testament. Satan is the devil and I am not ignorant nor am I a "girl". I am a grown woman. Thank you. Satan is known as the devil, the dragon, Lucifer among other titles. If you would buy a bible and read it instead of getting your information off the internet you'd be reading the bible more. If you would like the scriptures referencing hell in the old testament just ask. I will post them tomorrow. ( God willing )

Dunno what version you're reading that "hell" is in the OT portion, but I can only assume that particular Bible uses large print and has color illustrations.

No, you can get them in small print and without color illustrations if you prefer. Sarcasm aside, if you are reading Catholic versions of the Bible, chances are there will be very few if any references to hell in the OT and even the NT for that matter.
 

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