The State Of Our Knowledge

[pywakit]

You are patient. Yes. DNA's tenacity is legendary. But remember, it took 3.8 billion years, and around 7 billion tries to get homosapiens. Once a species finds it's niche, it stops evolving ... or almost anyway. Our branch of the DNA tree was a very happy accident. There are/were 7 billion prior, and present examples of this. Sharks have cruised the oceans for 350 million years essentially unchanged. This is no accident. The life at the great rift will never get to radio-capable. They are happy right where they are. It is a safe bet that life is also 350 million years old ....

But once started, a non-DNA based life would be subjected to the same evolutionary pressures as the life that came before us was.

And, no, I cannot imagine what the alternative base would be. More into geology than biology. Hope someone on the board has enough knowledge in this area to present some alternatives.

Well, I am certain there are many 'possible' alternatives. But they would be nothing more than pure speculation. On the order of "The universe could have been created by fairy dust." There is a ton of evidence that DNA works great. No evidence of any kind that any other combination will. The SETI experiments for over 50 years have proven one thing beyond ANY shadow of doubt. Intelligent ( radio capable ) life ... past or present ... is much rarer than anyone thought. Those who don't agree simply don't know the facts. And don't understand the numbers involved. Or ... like those at SETI ... simply refuse to accept reality.

 

[rdean]

An objective, rational examination of all current scientific knowledge ( math, physics, chemistry, paleontology, experiments, observations, SETI, etc. ) tells us that .....


1. The human form is very special. 'We' are not.

2. There is an astronomically small likelihood that molecular combinations other than DNA produce life.

3. Radio-capable life is extremely rare in the visible/local universe.

4. There is a very high probability that the only radio-capable life is identical in form to us.

5. The ACTUAL universe is infinite.

6. The ACTUAL universe is eternal.

7. The 'big bang' was not a unique event in the universe.

8. The 'big bang' is actually a black hole ( ultra-dense star ) having achieved critical mass.

9. The amount of mass necessary FOR a 'big bang' is equal to the mass that came FROM the 'big bang'.

10. The process is a 'closed loop'. No atom escapes.

11. The process has gone on since 'the beginning of time' .... And will continue forever.

12. The properties of space preclude such events from overlapping.

13. An infinite number of 'big bangs' are occuring as I write this.

14. The observed properties of matter preclude 'infinite' smallness.

15. The observed properties of matter preclude 'infinite' denseness.

16. The observed properties of matter preclude 'infinitely large'.

17. 'Materializing' sub-Planck particles 'borrow' energy from the fabric of space and last about a billionth of a second.

18. Matter above Planck size does not materialize at all ... anywhere within the visible/local universe.

19. Black holes ... and their main effect ( creation of matter/finite universe ) ... are borrowed energy from 'infinite' space.

20. There is no evidence of 'dark matter'. Purely hypothetical.

21. There is no evidence of 'dark energy'. Purely hypothetical.

22. The observed properties of infinite space, and matter preclude 'other' universes from operating under completely different physics.

23. There is an extremely high probability that all 'finite' universes ... infinite in number ... function in exactly the same manner as 'our' universe.

24. Time and space did not begin with the arrival of 'our' universe. ( redundant )

25. Super-physics/super-technology do not exist. Not here. Not anywhere. ( FTL travel )

26. A worm hole harnessed to enable biological species to leap light years is not possible in the physical universe. ( mathematical probability/certainty does not equate to actually existing in the physical universe )

27. Meta-physics do not exist here. Or anywhere. ( alternate dimensions, telepathy, telekinesis, elemental transmutations ... such as turning straw into gold ... super-natural events and occurences, etc. )

28. Time travel is not possible due to the physical constraints ( laws ) of space.

29. The same materials ( atoms ) that comprise 'our' end of the universe comprise the 'other' end too.

30. The visible/local universe is not 'teeming' with life.

31. The current generally accepted theoretical cosmological model of the universe ( THE ONE AND ONLY 'big bang' ) has critical and insurmountable flaws.

32. A variety of circumstances and beliefs are in play that force 'mainstream' science to ignore observations and experimental evidence that contradict the accepted theory.

33. Each new contradictory discovery that can not be ignored by 'mainstream' science is explained 'after the fact' through the use of manufactured 'hypotheticals'.

34. The current 'big bang' model relies ( in part ) on the extremely unlikely future creation of purely speculative 'new' physics.

35. The current 'big bang' model has failed to make a substantive, accurate prediction. Ever.

36. My model solves all the 'problems' inherent in the current model using proven, existing physics.

Recapping ... These rational, logical conclusions are based on every bit of scientific evidence currently available.

They are devoid of dreams, opinions, wishes, agendas, hopes, beliefs, supernatural entities, or any other unproven, or purely speculative, or hypothetical possibility.

This is the state of our knowledge to date.

1. The human form is very special. 'We' are not.

2. There is an astronomically small likelihood that molecular combinations other than DNA produce life.

3. Radio-capable life is extremely rare in the visible/local universe.

4. There is a very high probability that the only radio-capable life is identical in form to us.

Not very well thought out.

Sorry.

We are special. Why would you think we aren't?

Why would you think we are?

NOTE: Fossils indicated that some dinosaurs might already have been filling the "niche" we currently inhabit. Standing upright, large brain, opposable thumb.

Really? Dinosaurs lived for 100s of millions of years. Never built a radio. Never even built a wheel. Homosapiens did it in less than 300,000 years.

Some scientist have wondered why silicone based life wouldn't work as well as carbon. Something to consider.

Why? It's pure speculation. I could just as easily speculate that fairies run the universe. There is no evidence of silicone based life anywhere, and we have plenty of nice spots right here in our own solar system where silicone based life could flourish.

The universe is billions of years old. Radio capable life might be very common,. It's just that when one civilization ends, another doesn't rise for a million years and they have lost that opportunity for communication like strangers in the night. Two lovers passing.

I'm thinking you can't grasp the actual size of our galaxy, let alone the number of stars within 8 billion light years. If radio life was common, as you suggest, then SETI would have had an earful from the moment it was switched on. Oddly, the scientists at SETI made the same hypothesises you have, and they were pretty darn certain we would catch a signal FORTY FIVE TO FIFTY YEARS AGO.

How dare you tell me I don't know what I'm talking about. Well, I admit it, I don't really know too much about it. But I do know that I know so much more than you.

8. The 'big bang' is actually a black hole ( ultra-dense star ) having achieved critical mass.

Let me explain this one thing. We are made of "exploded stars" - the ONLY way to create the heavy elements necessary to create us and our planet. We know the early universe was made of hydrogen. How do we know? Because we can take pictures. The further away we can see, the younger the universe appears. Using the natural lensing affect of from the curvature of galaxies, we can see even farther away. No only that, we use a variety of instruments. Not just "telescopes", but other equipment, such as spectroradiometers.

We know that in the space nearest us, there is a lot of heavy elements, the farther away you look there is less, because it's older.

An exploding black hole wouldn't have just turned into "hydrogen".

Dinosaurs lived for "hundreds of millions of years". You know that for "hundreds" with an "s", you need at least two hundreds. Just thought I would point that out.

You might consider taking a few science classes.

 

[pywakit]

1. The human form is very special. 'We' are not.

2. There is an astronomically small likelihood that molecular combinations other than DNA produce life.

3. Radio-capable life is extremely rare in the visible/local universe.

4. There is a very high probability that the only radio-capable life is identical in form to us.

Not very well thought out.

Sorry.

We are special. Why would you think we aren't?

Why would you think we are?

NOTE: Fossils indicated that some dinosaurs might already have been filling the "niche" we currently inhabit. Standing upright, large brain, opposable thumb.

Really? Dinosaurs lived for 100s of millions of years. Never built a radio. Never even built a wheel. Homosapiens did it in less than 300,000 years.

Some scientist have wondered why silicone based life wouldn't work as well as carbon. Something to consider.

Why? It's pure speculation. I could just as easily speculate that fairies run the universe. There is no evidence of silicone based life anywhere, and we have plenty of nice spots right here in our own solar system where silicone based life could flourish.

The universe is billions of years old. Radio capable life might be very common,. It's just that when one civilization ends, another doesn't rise for a million years and they have lost that opportunity for communication like strangers in the night. Two lovers passing.

I'm thinking you can't grasp the actual size of our galaxy, let alone the number of stars within 8 billion light years. If radio life was common, as you suggest, then SETI would have had an earful from the moment it was switched on. Oddly, the scientists at SETI made the same hypothesises you have, and they were pretty darn certain we would catch a signal FORTY FIVE TO FIFTY YEARS AGO.

How dare you tell me I don't know what I'm talking about. Well, I admit it, I don't really know too much about it. But I do know that I know so much more than you.

8. The 'big bang' is actually a black hole ( ultra-dense star ) having achieved critical mass.

Let me explain this one thing. We are made of "exploded stars" - the ONLY way to create the heavy elements necessary to create us and our planet. We know the early universe was made of hydrogen. How do we know? Because we can take pictures. The further away we can see, the younger the universe appears. Using the natural lensing affect of from the curvature of galaxies, we can see even farther away. No only that, we use a variety of instruments. Not just "telescopes", but other equipment, such as spectroradiometers.

We know that in the space nearest us, there is a lot of heavy elements, the farther away you look there is less, because it's older.

An exploding black hole wouldn't have just turned into "hydrogen".

Dinosaurs lived for "hundreds of millions of years". You know that for "hundreds" with an "s", you need at least two hundreds. Just thought I would point that out.

You might consider taking a few science classes.

From wiki ...

Dinosaurs were the dominant terrestrial vertebrate animals for over 160 million years, from the late Triassic period (about 230 million years ago) until the end of the Cretaceous period (about 65 million years ago), when the Cretaceous–Tertiary extinction event caused the extinction of most dinosaur species. The fossil record indicates that birds evolved from theropod dinosaurs during the Jurassic period, and most paleontologists regard them as the only clade of dinosaurs to have survived until the present day.

First, I apologise for not being more precise. But considering that birds are considered dinosaurs, I wasn't TECHNICALLY wrong. Lol. And the whole thing was to drive home a point. None of these species ever came close at all. With MANY MANY millions of years more than we had to do it. I stand by my assertions.

How do you know I haven't taken science classes? Think I thought all this up in a vacuum?

I never said the "exploding black hole turned into hydrogen". Go read it all again. Maybe you will understand it better the second time around.

And thank you for informing me about being made of 'star stuff'. Wow! Total news to me! Lol. It always amazes me that ( otherwise nice ) people like you can be so arrogant, and blind at the same time. Maybe my black hole should have exploded CARBON .... ! Lol.

So when did I say the black hole exploded? I can't imagine saying such a thing ... It did certainly release all ( or a lot ) of it's stored energy. Whether reaction, or angular momentum ( spin ), it let go ...

I will be happy to critique YOUR model of the universe if you would like. Ok. I don't need to beat on you. I'm sure you actually are a nice guy.

I'm sorry for insulting you, too. I shouldn't have.

 

[Skull Pilot]

"Nothing really matters".

Really, it doesn't. Just relax, enjoy yourself, do no harm. Be a good person.

It just doesn't matter

[youtube]g3S_k1dRbXY[/youtube]

 

[Skull Pilot]

The cool thing about all our vast knowledge is that we picked the worst mediums as far as preservation is concerned on which to record it all.

 

[Old Rocks]

The cool thing about all our vast knowledge is that we picked the worst mediums as far as preservation is concerned on which to record it all.

OK. Then here's a hammer and chisel, there is a big granite mountain. Rots of ruck.

 

[Skull Pilot]

The cool thing about all our vast knowledge is that we picked the worst mediums as far as preservation is concerned on which to record it all.

OK. Then here's a hammer and chisel, there is a big granite mountain. Rots of ruck.

If we disappeared tomorrow and 500,000 years from now some alien archeologist discovered the planet, he would find little or none of our modern recordings left as paper would have disintegrated and electronic storage would have degraded but those old stone tablets would be still legible.

 

[Old Rocks]

If we disappeared, would it matter? And that is always Ironbottom Sound, where they could form an accurate opinion of us from the Iron Oxide casts.