The Reverend Wright

As for Wright, Macolm X and those ascribing to permanent victim status, my initial take is sadness. How anyone that went to these meetings/services, could come out with any hope is beyond my powers to comprehend.

The system is stacked against you, you haven't a chance, they'll screw you at every turn, if you manage to succeed, your kids will be screwed. Michelle exemplifies this message, her hope is that with Barack at the helm, it will change. In the mean time, she'll pull down over 300k per year, bitching the whole time.

First, The most important part of the Autobiography of Malcolm is the last part, after he went to Mecca, when he became Malik El Shabazz. He was not at all unhopeful, and he had grown far away from bitterness.

Second, the message is to be aware, to be wary, not too trusting, in other words: P.Y.O.A.

Third, does Michelle Obama pull down $300,000 as a lawyer? With her experience and education, that seems kinda low. Major East Coast city, someone I know is a "digital data specialist", not a lawyer, but works for a law firm, makes sure docs are digitized for the firm, easily available and searchable, etc. Easier to pass "discovery" and all around for suits and whatever if it is all on disk, rather than crates and crates of paper copies. That person gets about $120K plus bennies. For a lawyer, I think $300K would be low, especially for a place like Chicago.

Or is there something new I hadn't heard about? Are First Ladies paid $300K a year now?

General income info:

http://www.brookings.edu/papers/2007/11_blackwhite_isaacs.aspx

http://www.cbcfinc.org/pdf/sobefs.pdf


It would seem to me that if things really are so "equal"....

For one thing, there is this business of a person being an "identifiable minority." A person can change their name to Smith or Jones, and white, no one will ever know, most of the time, that they have other than a Northern European background. Instant acceptance, and certain things are automatically bestowed. However, the skin color is not something one can change.

Job-wise, all that should ever matter is qualifications and ability to do the work, not appearance:


http://www.hofstra.edu/pdf/orsp_shahani-denning_spring03.pdf




Anyway, to lighten it up, here is some "fun" reading.:

http://undercoverblackman.blogspot.com/2008/03/stuff-white-people-dont-like.html
 
A person can change their name to Smith or Jones, and white, no one will ever know, most of the time, that they have other than a Northern European background.

True enough, but that doesn't mean that such a person would no longer be affected by racism. There's no getting around the permanent psychological results of childhood.

Also, right on with the Malcolm X stuff. :clap2: No one cares to remember that he dropped the racism from his rhetoric, they just like to quote "By Any Means Necessary" out of context.
 
First, The most important part of the Autobiography of Malcolm is the last part, after he went to Mecca, when he became Malik El Shabazz. He was not at all unhopeful, and he had grown far away from bitterness.

Second, the message is to be aware, to be wary, not too trusting, in other words: P.Y.O.A.

Third, does Michelle Obama pull down $300,000 as a lawyer? With her experience and education, that seems kinda low. Major East Coast city, someone I know is a "digital data specialist", not a lawyer, but works for a law firm, makes sure docs are digitized for the firm, easily available and searchable, etc. Easier to pass "discovery" and all around for suits and whatever if it is all on disk, rather than crates and crates of paper copies. That person gets about $120K plus bennies. For a lawyer, I think $300K would be low, especially for a place like Chicago.

Or is there something new I hadn't heard about? Are First Ladies paid $300K a year now?

General income info:

http://www.brookings.edu/papers/2007/11_blackwhite_isaacs.aspx

http://www.cbcfinc.org/pdf/sobefs.pdf


It would seem to me that if things really are so "equal"....

For one thing, there is this business of a person being an "identifiable minority." A person can change their name to Smith or Jones, and white, no one will ever know, most of the time, that they have other than a Northern European background. Instant acceptance, and certain things are automatically bestowed. However, the skin color is not something one can change.

Job-wise, all that should ever matter is qualifications and ability to do the work, not appearance:


http://www.hofstra.edu/pdf/orsp_shahani-denning_spring03.pdf




Anyway, to lighten it up, here is some "fun" reading.:

http://undercoverblackman.blogspot.com/2008/03/stuff-white-people-dont-like.html

She made less as a lawyer. This if for being on the board at U of C.
 
First, The most important part of the Autobiography of Malcolm is the last part, after he went to Mecca, when he became Malik El Shabazz. He was not at all unhopeful, and he had grown far away from bitterness.

Second, the message is to be aware, to be wary, not too trusting, in other words: P.Y.O.A.

Third, does Michelle Obama pull down $300,000 as a lawyer? With her experience and education, that seems kinda low. Major East Coast city, someone I know is a "digital data specialist", not a lawyer, but works for a law firm, makes sure docs are digitized for the firm, easily available and searchable, etc. Easier to pass "discovery" and all around for suits and whatever if it is all on disk, rather than crates and crates of paper copies. That person gets about $120K plus bennies. For a lawyer, I think $300K would be low, especially for a place like Chicago.

Or is there something new I hadn't heard about? Are First Ladies paid $300K a year now?

General income info:

http://www.brookings.edu/papers/2007/11_blackwhite_isaacs.aspx

http://www.cbcfinc.org/pdf/sobefs.pdf


It would seem to me that if things really are so "equal"....

For one thing, there is this business of a person being an "identifiable minority." A person can change their name to Smith or Jones, and white, no one will ever know, most of the time, that they have other than a Northern European background. Instant acceptance, and certain things are automatically bestowed. However, the skin color is not something one can change.

Job-wise, all that should ever matter is qualifications and ability to do the work, not appearance:


http://www.hofstra.edu/pdf/orsp_shahani-denning_spring03.pdf




Anyway, to lighten it up, here is some "fun" reading.:

http://undercoverblackman.blogspot.com/2008/03/stuff-white-people-dont-like.html

A bit more:

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.co...itical-rise-accompanied-by-financial-success/

SPRINGFIELD, Ill. (AP) — Barack Obama has two best-selling books, a nice salary as a senator and a wife with a handsome income. Earlier this year he reported assets of up to $1.14 million in addition to his Chicago home.

That's small change to some of his presidential rivals, but more than enough to create entanglements and controversies for Obama, a Democrat who has been positioning himself as a friend of the little guy on financial matters.

Recently, he scolded Wall Street executives for focusing too much on their own success and not enough on what's good for the whole nation. And he called for tax cuts for the working poor.

"I didn't just discover working folks on the campaign trail. That's what I've been doing my entire adult life," he told union members Tuesday as he recounted his experience as a community organizer and civil rights attorney.

Obama's own success allowed him to buy a $1.65 million mansion near the University of Chicago in 2005. Political insider Antoin "Tony" Rezko, who was under federal investigation, bought the vacant lot next door and sold part of it to Obama, giving the senator more space.

There has been no suggestion that the arrangement was illegal. Obama paid Rezko for the extra space. But Obama has since said it was a mistake to do business with Rezko, who was indicted last year on charges he sought kickbacks from companies doing business with
an Illinois state pension fund.

Rezko and his companies contributed nearly $20,000 to Obama's state and federal races. Obama now has donated that amount to charity.

When he entered the U.S. Senate in 2005, Obama's salary jumped to more than $154,000 — nearly triple what he had been making as an Illinois legislator.

His sudden political stardom also brought him a three-book deal worth $1.9 million from Random House Inc. The deal includes a children's book, and Obama says he'll give $200,000 from that book to charity.


His contract gives Obama 15 percent of the sale of each hardcover book, 8 percent or more from paperbacks and 10 percent from audiobooks. His first book under the deal, "The Audacity of Hope," has sold more than 1 million copies since it was released nearly a year ago.

After Obama was elected to the Senate, his wife's income tripled thanks to a promotion she received at the University of Chicago Hospitals. When Michelle Obama rose from executive director to vice president, her salary increased from $121,910 to $316,962.

Obama says his wife's promotion was based on her merits — she's a Harvard Law School graduate — and not on his Senate victory. "You can't fault her for being smarter and better qualified for all sorts of jobs than I am," he said last year.

Mrs. Obama was also elected to the board of directors of an Illinois-based food supplier called TreeHouse Foods. For that, she was paid about $45,000 in 2005 and $51,000 in 2006.

But Wal-Mart is a major TreeHouse customer, and her husband has criticized the wages and benefits that Wal-Mart provides its workers. Mrs. Obama resigned from the TreeHouse board in May, citing the increasing demands of the presidential campaign, and she has also scaled back her hours for the university hospital system.

The government disclosure reports Obama has filed over the years, and the tax returns he has released voluntarily, reveal a relatively uncomplicated financial picture.

He has made money as a legislator, lawyer and lecturer at the University of Chicago. She has worked for the university and its hospital system and for TreeHouse. Their assets — which are between $457,000 and $1.14 million — are mostly in mutual funds and pensions.

That's paltry compared with some other presidential candidates. Democrats John Edwards and Hillary Rodham Clinton and Republican Rudy Giuliani are all worth tens of millions of dollars. Republican Mitt Romney is the wealthiest candidate in the race, reporting assets of between $190 million and $250 million.

Voters rarely seem concerned about whether a candidate is filthy rich or merely wealthy. Matt Bennett, who has worked on several Democratic presidential campaigns, said the main exception would if voters saw hypocrisy — a candidate talking like a blue-collar worker but spending like a movie star, for instance.

"They expect that their leaders are going to be well off, and for most people the difference between having a net worth of $1 million and $20 million is basically irrelevant," Bennett said.

Still, Obama's money is enough to raise occasional complications.

In 2005, Obama's broker invested more than $50,000 in two companies backed by some of his top campaign donors. Obama denied knowing anything about the investments, on which he lost about $13,000, and there was no evidence that he used his office to help the companies.

Ronald Powell, president of United Food and Commercial Workers Local 881 in Illinois, isn't interested in Obama's finances. What matters, he said, is that Obama has a record of working directly with poor families that wanted better lives.

"He worked the street. He knocked on doors," Powell said. "He speaks from personal experience."
 
True enough, but that doesn't mean that such a person would no longer be affected by racism. There's no getting around the permanent psychological results of childhood.

Also, right on with the Malcolm X stuff. :clap2: No one cares to remember that he dropped the racism from his rhetoric, they just like to quote "By Any Means Necessary" out of context.

It's not so much that he dropped the racism. What he did was moderate his views much in the way that Martin Luther King was moving away from his pacifist-only approach.

And, no, you don't ever really get past having hatred directed at you.
 
here is something i can't understand about obama:

his black father left him and his mother when he was a toddler, his white mother, grandma raised him....yet when he is around 13 he begins to not want to identify with whites so as not to ingratiate himself...

“I ceased to advertise my mother’s race at the age of twelve or thirteen, when I began to suspect that by doing so I was ingratiating myself to whites”

then, in order to get in with black politics, he joins with a black liberation/theology church. btw, such ideology believes that Jesus is black. why does he shun the whiteness in him? what harm did whites cause him? how is it he identifies with blacks, african americans.... when raised by white people? is it solely the color of his skin?

if so, is that not racism in a nutshell...
 
No, its not. People break the law all the time. Go onto a highway and see how well the whole "the law is x, everyone there follows x" works with speed limits.



This is naive. There IS racism in this country, and it DOES effect people. Whether its legal or not, the effects are there.



And who makes them apply themselves? Where one grows up has a HUGE effect on whether one applies oneselves in those situations. Where one grows up is often a result of racism and left over realities from times of greater discrimination.



Are you serious?

Welfare...you can only be on it for 5 years. That and its not exactly enough money to raise a stable environment.

Affirmative action doesn't kick in until AFTER you've gotten past poverty and racism until your 18. Oh and FAFSA is a loan. Know how much college is these days? Know what you can do with a college degree? Not much.



Congratulations. Your the exception, not the rule. Theres a reason that so many middle class kids go to college and so many poor kids don't.

Wow. Just wow. How many exceptions to the rule there must be. I have 3 kids, for each of them through 4 years of college, I probably contributed around $1k. I also paid their auto insurance, though 2 of them did not have autos at school, but they needed the insurance for when they were home or if driving others' cars.

I made a bit more than $19k, but for some of the time had 3 in university at the same time. Pell helped, along with the scholarships the kids earned. My youngest is now the only dependent still in school, he has been a resident assistant and worked 'the desk' in the dorm since his sophomore year. During the summer he's worked about 70 hours a week. He only has about $4k in loans; grants, scholarship, and work cared for the rest.

He's already been offered a graduate study scholarship, but is considering entering the Marines instead. He thinks it may get him further towards his goal.
 
Wow. Just wow. How many exceptions to the rule there must be.

I bet you could find out, if you started using statistics instead of repeating personal anecdotes. Don't get me wrong, what you've done is seriously impressive, but I'm sorry to report that you haven't single-handedly erased the income disparities of higher education.

I think you've got a serious fallacy in your thinking. If you want to make poor people give up and be complacent, you don't do it by showing them how they've been exploited, or how they can fight back. It seems pretty obvious that a hopeless liberator wouldn't waste the effort - you know, like, 20 years of effort - on such a lost cause.

If you want to make poor people give up, you do it by convincing them that they're responsible for their impoverished state. That's the predominant message shoved down our throats in America, where it sometimes seems that every man is expected to be an island unto himself. It doesn't matter that you were dealt a severe disadvantage from the start, or that your very identity is formed in part by your initial status in life - if a couple of famous people can pull themselves up by their bootstraps, why can't you?

So, literally quite the opposite of what you claim, these firebrands make it their business to convince poor people that they are legitimate human beings.

btw, such ideology believes that Jesus is black.

WOW! They really think that?! They seriously think that Jesus was black? They must be crazy! It's obvious, from all the non-photographic European-created images that we have of him, that he was WHITE. Duh! I mean, the Discovery Channel - a totally legitimate, scientific source - even did a show where they reconstructed his face! (There were cool computer graphics and everything.)

You really do have a way with irony. My sides still hurt from that gem. Oh, man.
 
I bet you could find out, if you started using statistics instead of repeating personal anecdotes. Don't get me wrong, what you've done is seriously impressive, but I'm sorry to report that you haven't single-handedly erased the income disparities of higher education.

I think you've got a serious fallacy in your thinking. If you want to make poor people give up and be complacent, you don't do it by showing them how they've been exploited, or how they can fight back. It seems pretty obvious that a hopeless liberator wouldn't waste the effort - you know, like, 20 years of effort - on such a lost cause.

If you want to make poor people give up, you do it by convincing them that they're responsible for their impoverished state. That's the predominant message shoved down our throats in America, where it sometimes seems that every man is expected to be an island unto himself. It doesn't matter that you were dealt a severe disadvantage from the start, or that your very identity is formed in part by your initial status in life - if a couple of famous people can pull themselves up by their bootstraps, why can't you?

So, literally quite the opposite of what you claim, these firebrands make it their business to convince poor people that they are legitimate human beings.



WOW! They really think that?! They seriously think that Jesus was black? They must be crazy! It's obvious, from all the non-photographic European-created images that we have of him, that he was WHITE. Duh! I mean, the Discovery Channel - a totally legitimate, scientific source - even did a show where they reconstructed his face! (There were cool computer graphics and everything.)

You really do have a way with irony. My sides still hurt from that gem. Oh, man.

I disagree, the way towards enabling anyone is to let them know they can achieve, on their own, without special preferences, even if the deal is stacked against them. There are no victims, only those that won't or feel they can't succeed.
 
here is something i can't understand about obama:

his black father left him and his mother when he was a toddler, his white mother, grandma raised him....yet when he is around 13 he begins to not want to identify with whites so as not to ingratiate himself...



then, in order to get in with black politics, he joins with a black liberation/theology church. btw, such ideology believes that Jesus is black. why does he shun the whiteness in him? what harm did whites cause him? how is it he identifies with blacks, african americans.... when raised by white people? is it solely the color of his skin?

if so, is that not racism in a nutshell...

In a nutshell? That's the exact definition of racism. Obama was a very lucky black man. He had it good growing up, yet he distanced himself from those that provided him the luxuries other blacks are claimed not to possess. Truth is, there's people of all colors that suffer the same disadvantages blacks are claimed to suffer, but we're supposed to feel sorry for the blacks, because some white people owned their ancestors 140 years ago. Give me a break.
 
No, its not. People break the law all the time. Go onto a highway and see how well the whole "the law is x, everyone there follows x" works with speed limits.


Still doesn't change the fact that the law is applied equally. A white man speeding is not different than a black man speeding


This is naive. There IS racism in this country, and it DOES effect people. Whether its legal or not, the effects are there.

I never said there wasn't racism genius. I said it's not as rampant as you claim it to be. And if fact, the very people that scream racism are the racist ones.



And who makes them apply themselves? Where one grows up has a HUGE effect on whether one applies oneselves in those situations. Where one grows up is often a result of racism and left over realities from times of greater discrimination.

Exactly, I'm glad you've figured it out, whether you know it or not. WHO MAKES THEM APPLY? Is it the governments responsibility. You're probably someone who gripes about too much government involvement. It's up to the people who "Want" or "need" to go to college. So basically I'm right, it's a lifestyle choice and a lack of value in education. The only person who can make you apply for college is you. So are you saying that because you grow up in poverty, that's ok that you don't apply to college? We'll just blame the government after the fact when the kid grows up and becomes an adult living in poverty.:rolleyes:

Are you serious?

Welfare...you can only be on it for 5 years. That and its not exactly enough money to raise a stable environment.

Well let me tell you, when you see people pull up to the human resources department in a mercedez or a lexus, and then strut inside wearing air force ones and 10lbs. of bling (including a grill), it makes one wonder....

Affirmative action doesn't kick in until AFTER you've gotten past poverty and racism until your 18. Oh and FAFSA is a loan. Know how much college is these days? Know what you can do with a college degree? Not much.

You must not have attended college....I can tell. FAFSA is a form you fill out that goes to the government. They assess your "income" and determine whether or not you get Federal help with college. And what I mean by "help" is Grants (Money you don't have to pay back---millions are given out each year), Scholarships (money you don' thave to pay back.), Work study, and loans.

Ok, you can't do much with a college degree? :cuckoo:
Go ask your architects, engineers, Nuclear plant operators, teachers, astronauts, professional athletes, welders, plumbers, electricians, business executives, politicians, computer programmers, Bill Gates, ........ you get the drift. You may be able to get jobs without a college degree...but let me tell you something. If you have that degree, you'll get paid more than the guy that doesn't.


Congratulations. Your the exception, not the rule. Theres a reason that so many middle class kids go to college and so many poor kids don't.

Because so many poor kids don't see the need to go to college, because their parents don't encourage them. You think it's because their poor??? LOL. Don't make me crap my pants. They have same educational opportunities. I'll try to find statistics on the number of middle class vs. lower class that even apply for college. I'm surethe middle class has significantly higher numbers; and is it because they're not handing out applications to the poor ones?? I highly doubt it. I'll also try to find the statistics on who applies for federal financial aid. No one is restricting poor kids to apply for college, or apply for aid <---It's Free to apply for FAFSA.

My wife paid $900.00 total for her 4 year Bachelor's degree. You wanna know why???? Was it her income? NO. Was it because she's white? NO. It's because she made good grades in school and applied herself. I was on the other end of the spectrum, my family didn't make as much, my grades weren't near as good, but I went to college and got the same degree, tell me it can't be done. Now if the lower classes encouraged their kids to make good grades and go to college, they could do the same.

Go ahead and tell you're kids not to attend college. It's your/their loss.
 
here is something i can't understand about obama:

his black father left him and his mother when he was a toddler, his white mother, grandma raised him....yet when he is around 13 he begins to not want to identify with whites so as not to ingratiate himself...



then, in order to get in with black politics, he joins with a black liberation/theology church. btw, such ideology believes that Jesus is black. why does he shun the whiteness in him? what harm did whites cause him? how is it he identifies with blacks, african americans.... when raised by white people? is it solely the color of his skin?

if so, is that not racism in a nutshell...

If you met someone of his skin color, facial features, hair type, and so on, would you ask him if he was white? or take it that he is what he looks like, black?

People who are racially identifiable minorities cannot shed their looks.


There are many sides... some who do not look black self identify anyway, and then there are those, historically, who have chosen, because of horrible treatment and horrible laws, to pass.

http://academic.udayton.edu/race/04needs/s98alouis.htm

http://www.post-gazette.com/lifestyle/20031026stain1026fnp2.asp

http://www.jimcrowhistory.org/resources/lessonplans/hs_es_passing_for_white.htm

http://www.helium.com/items/843273-speaking-woman-mixed-racial

Many mixed race children go through an identity crisis, especially at adolescence. The ones who live nearly exclusively with the white side of the family may have it tougher.


Know what I hate? When black children are raised by whites and the whites totally don't help them take care of their hair. Many black hairstyes are so beautiful, and white people in charge are just so totally lazy about it! and so CLUELESS!
 
If you met someone of his skin color, facial features, hair type, and so on, would you ask him if he was white? or take it that he is what he looks like, black?

People who are racially identifiable minorities cannot shed their looks.


There are many sides... some who do not look black self identify anyway, and then there are those, historically, who have chosen, because of horrible treatment and horrible laws, to pass.

http://academic.udayton.edu/race/04needs/s98alouis.htm

http://www.post-gazette.com/lifestyle/20031026stain1026fnp2.asp

http://www.jimcrowhistory.org/resources/lessonplans/hs_es_passing_for_white.htm

http://www.helium.com/items/843273-speaking-woman-mixed-racial

Many mixed race children go through an identity crisis, especially at adolescence. The ones who live nearly exclusively with the white side of the family may have it tougher.


Know what I hate? When black children are raised by whites and the whites totally don't help them take care of their hair. Many black hairstyes are so beautiful, and white people in charge are just so totally lazy about it! and so CLUELESS!

good lord, those evil whiteys
 
Still doesn't change the fact that the law is applied equally. A white man speeding is not different than a black man speeding

No it doesn't, but that fact doesn't magically make racism and its effects go away.

I never said there wasn't racism genius. I said it's not as rampant as you claim it to be. And if fact, the very people that scream racism are the racist ones.

Really? So you didn't say "The little black boy born yesterday has the same opportunities as the little white boy born yesterday."???

And no, the people who scream racism are trying to get rid of the racism that they see in others.

Exactly, I'm glad you've figured it out, whether you know it or not. WHO MAKES THEM APPLY? Is it the governments responsibility. You're probably someone who gripes about too much government involvement. It's up to the people who "Want" or "need" to go to college. So basically I'm right, it's a lifestyle choice and a lack of value in education. The only person who can make you apply for college is you. So are you saying that because you grow up in poverty, that's ok that you don't apply to college? We'll just blame the government after the fact when the kid grows up and becomes an adult living in poverty.

Who makes them apply? Their own drive, combined with the people around them and their influence. Those who are poor are less likely to have quality people around them influencing their decisions. Who said anything about the government's responsibility?

Well let me tell you, when you see people pull up to the human resources department in a mercedez or a lexus, and then strut inside wearing air force ones and 10lbs. of bling (including a grill), it makes one wonder....

I worked at Legal Aid for years. The large majority of people who came, came on the bus. Nobody came in a Lexus.

You must not have attended college....I can tell. FAFSA is a form you fill out that goes to the government. They assess your "income" and determine whether or not you get Federal help with college. And what I mean by "help" is Grants (Money you don't have to pay back---millions are given out each year), Scholarships (money you don' thave to pay back.), Work study, and loans.

I'm aware. Tell me whats the maximum the feds will give you per year for college?

Ok, you can't do much with a college degree?
Go ask your architects, engineers, Nuclear plant operators, teachers, astronauts, professional athletes, welders, plumbers, electricians, business executives, politicians, computer programmers, Bill Gates, ........ you get the drift. You may be able to get jobs without a college degree...but let me tell you something. If you have that degree, you'll get paid more than the guy that doesn't.

My point was that college is extremely expensive and more and more a college degree isn't worth very much anymore. Compare those jobs with a professional degree.

Because so many poor kids don't see the need to go to college, because their parents don't encourage them. You think it's because their poor???

You think maybe, just maybe, the two are related? Gee, I wonder why the poor are disenfranchised with the system and don't think that encouraging their kids to enter into it will do much.

I'll try to find statistics on the number of middle class vs. lower class that even apply for college. I'm surethe middle class has significantly higher numbers; and is it because they're not handing out applications to the poor ones?? I highly doubt it. I'll also try to find the statistics on who applies for federal financial aid. No one is restricting poor kids to apply for college, or apply for aid

Its because the poor ones can't afford to apply.

My wife paid $900.00 total for her 4 year Bachelor's degree. You wanna know why???? Was it her income? NO. Was it because she's white? NO. It's because she made good grades in school and applied herself.

Suppose there are 200 people. 100 are rich, 100 are poor. They are lined up in a line from most intellectual ability(100) to least intellectual ability(0).

Now, all other things being equal, 90% of the rich kids can go to college if they want too. Only 20% of the poor kids can go. Why the discrepancy? Because the poor kids need to be smarter, more motivated, and more organized to get into college than the rich kids can. This causes the bottom 80% who lack something to not get in.

Kapish?

I was on the other end of the spectrum, my family didn't make as much, my grades weren't near as good, but I went to college and got the same degree, tell me it can't be done. Now if the lower classes encouraged their kids to make good grades and go to college, they could do the same.

Nobody said it can't be done, obviously. Its just a hell of a lot harder.
 
What is rich? Why is it that only 28% of American adults have graduated from college? The other 73% are poor? I don't think so.
 
No it doesn't, but that fact doesn't magically make racism and its effects go away.



Really? So you didn't say "The little black boy born yesterday has the same opportunities as the little white boy born yesterday."???

And no, the people who scream racism are trying to get rid of the racism that they see in others.



Who makes them apply? Their own drive, combined with the people around them and their influence. Those who are poor are less likely to have quality people around them influencing their decisions. Who said anything about the government's responsibility?



I worked at Legal Aid for years. The large majority of people who came, came on the bus. Nobody came in a Lexus.



I'm aware. Tell me whats the maximum the feds will give you per year for college?



My point was that college is extremely expensive and more and more a college degree isn't worth very much anymore. Compare those jobs with a professional degree.



You think maybe, just maybe, the two are related? Gee, I wonder why the poor are disenfranchised with the system and don't think that encouraging their kids to enter into it will do much.



Its because the poor ones can't afford to apply.



Suppose there are 200 people. 100 are rich, 100 are poor. They are lined up in a line from most intellectual ability(100) to least intellectual ability(0).

Now, all other things being equal, 90% of the rich kids can go to college if they want too. Only 20% of the poor kids can go. Why the discrepancy? Because the poor kids need to be smarter, more motivated, and more organized to get into college than the rich kids can. This causes the bottom 80% who lack something to not get in.

Kapish?



Nobody said it can't be done, obviously. Its just a hell of a lot harder.


You're talking yourself in circles and have proven my argument. You say their own drive and the people around them make them apply, so whose problem is it??? Their problem, and if they want to change it, they need to change the company they hang out with and change their attitude toward education----what I've been saying all along.

I don't know what the maximum the fed will give you per year. But I know it's in the thousands considering you're income....the lower the income, the more aid you can get.

You also mention that poor kids can't afford to apply. First off, applying for Financial Aid is FREE. FAFSA---look up the meaning of the Acronym.

You're little math problem and statistics about your 200 students is rediculous in itself. It's not the fact that they can't go, it's the fact that the kids in poverty are less likely to even apply. That's not anyone's problem but their own. You keep griping about this, but seem to think their is something that someone else should do to make it easier for them, then again, that would be discriminating against the rest of the population.

My comparison of the little black and white boys being born and having the same opportunities have nothing to do with whether or not racism exists. It has to do with the fact that they have equal opportunities by law.

I never said racism doesn't exist, but it is not the era of Jim Crow laws like you suggest where the whites and wealthy dream up ways of keeping the black man down. And your characterization of civil rights activists such as Sharpton, Jackson, Wright, is super-retarded. Their the biggest racists of them all. Let me ask you this...how many times do you see them come out of the rabbit hole when a black man kills another black man? OR when a black man kills a white man? You only see them come out when a black man is killed or "done wrong" by a white man. So much for civil rights....more like black power in a country where everyone is considered equal. They fought for equality, but that doesn't seem to be good enough for them....they want more. If you can't see that, you're as blind as they are.
 

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