The radicalization of white Americans

[IM2]

white progressives suffer
they are white people
I grew up
current white victimhood
listening to whites
you are white and nothing
for being white
old white
deeper than whites
blamed for being white

. . .And all that just from one post!
Classic anti-White bias Black inferiority complex.
And no, he's yet to grow up.

More of the expected white psychosis.

Well-stated from the master black psychotic.

BTW, where did you ever get the idea I was white? Or is that just more of your white prejudice? I never said what color I am, you just assume anyone who calls you out must be so.

Your posts.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Eh, I dunno ... his problem is that he is here to preach, not converse. He talks about dialogue, but he has ZERO interest in hearing anyone else's opinion unless it conforms with his own. Whether he is a racist or not is kind of irrelevant; he is being deceptive/dishonest, and that's what really bothers me about him. The guy doesn't give a shit what anyone says unless that person is him.

And what exactly am I being dishonest about in your well experienced opinion?. Break it down to me Johnny. Where in the 37 years of work, study, research and analysis of these issues I have done I missed so much that your disagreements have validity?

Appeal to authority is a logical fallacy, you know. I think I stated my opinion clearly enough the first time; you are here to preach. Don't talk about dialogue when you have no interest in it.

Appeal to authority is your excuse because you can't dispute things I have sad. Dialogue for you is you wanting to express a white opinion of blacks based on non factual bullshit and me agreeing with it.

Dispute what? Everything you say basically amounts to the same thing. White people are bad and are oppressors. Black people are all poor innocent victims. White people are always wrong about everything. I'm always right about everything.

How does one have a conversation when those are your "facts"?

"Because most whites have not been trained to think with complexity about racism, and because it benefits white dominance not to do so, we have a very limited understanding of it (Kumashiro, 2009; LaDuke, 2009). We are the least likely to see, comprehend, or be invested in validating people of color’s assertions of racism and being honest about their consequences (King, 1991). At the same time, because of white social, economic, and political power within a white dominant culture, whites are the group in the position to legitimize people of color’s assertions of racism. Being in this position engenders a form of racial arrogance, and in this racial arrogance, whites have little compunction about debating the knowledge of people who have thought deeply about race through research, study, peer-reviewed scholarship, deep and on-going critical self-reflection, interracial relationships, and lived experience (Chinnery, 2008). This expertise is often trivialized and countered with simplistic platitudes, such as “people just need to see each other as individuals” or “see each other as humans” or “take personal responsibility.”

White lack of racial humility often leads to declarations of disagreement when in fact the problem is that we do not understand. Whites generally feel free to dismiss informed perspectives rather than have the humility to acknowledge that they are unfamiliar, reflect on them further, seek more information, or sustain a dialogue (DiAngelo & Sensoy, 2009)."

Dr. Robin DiAngelo

These are words from a white person. This history and present in America is what it is.Racism is a form of abusive behavior based upon the belief in the superiority of you race. This abuse involves, physical, psychological, emotional, plus there were especially in the past, sexual abuse.

“Bryant-Davis and Ocampo (2005) noted similar courses of psychopathology between rape victims and victims of racism. Both events are an assault on the personhood and integrity of the victim. Similar to rape victims, race-related trauma victims may respond with disbelief, shock, or dissociation, which can prevent them from responding to the incident in a healthy manner. The victim may then feel shame and self-blame because they were unable to respond or defend themselves, which may lead to low self-concept and self-destructive behaviors. In the same study, a parallel was drawn between race-related trauma victims and victims of domestic violence. Both survivors are made to feel shame over allowing themselves to be victimized. For instance, someone who may have experienced a racist incident may be told that if they are polite, work hard, and/or dress in a certain way, they will not encounter racism. When these rules are followed yet racism persists, powerlessness, hyper vigilance, and other symptoms associated with PTSD may develop or worsen (Bryant-Davis & Ocampo, 2005).”

If you study abuse, it has been shown that specific types of abuse can cause different types behaviors ether positive or negative. I have held all types of conversations in social and other settings about race as well as the impact of racism from the perspective of being black. What I discovered is that a lot of whites really don’t have much of a clue about what racism can do to a person. For example, you try explaining to a white person that blacks riot in their communities because of white racism and the first thing you hear is, ’Come on man white racism did not cause that.” Now here we have a person who has not experienced the first second of what racism does to a person talking about what they believe cannot happen.

Yet if you talk to this same person about child abuse, sexual abuse or other types of abuses, they are more than able to talk about the behaviors that can result. But racism, well that’s just something you can easily get beyond. Meanwhile every other abuse is a lifelong struggle for the person who must deal with it.

There has been tremendous psychological damage caused to nonwhites because of the racist policies and individual actions by whites in America and worldwide. But what some whites seem to think is that racism is simple and that it carries no psychological consequences to those who are the victims of it.

“On occasion, the emotional weight of racism can lead African Americans to engage in maladaptive coping, such as remaining in denial, engaging in substance use, aggression, self-blame – even in extreme cases suicide (i.e., Black Lives Matter activist Marshawn McCarrel) and terrorism (i.e., Dallas shooter Micah Xavier Johnson). These responses are harmful and lead to negative, long-term consequences.”

Monnica T. Williams Ph.D.

You want a dialogue. If that is what you want, you have to do better than crying about how I think whites are oppressors and blacks are all poor innocent victims. You need to dig deep and study the overall impact of white racsim on people instead of taking the easy way out because you are white and can't face it.


~

Maybe you should ask why you and your communities fail compared to Asian and Hispanic communities?

You will never discuss because you then realize it is your bigoted way of thinking that enslaves you...

 

[John Shaw]

I don't see myself as a victim. I was mocking IM2's posts.

I know racism and fear are two of the main drivers of Trump's rise. I've been saying that since the very beginning. You're making too many assumptions about me and not being fully accurate. I get frustrated when people just say "white people are the problem" and don't think any more deeply than that. They are contributing to the right's sullen resistance to self-reflection.

I know you were mocking him. The way you chose your mockery is still your decision, as is the disrespectful way in which you treated IM2 generally, and it both gives you away.

White people, a great number of them, are the problem. They, and their racism, are the main obstacles Blacks are facing, and their ignorance, their not even knowing themselves and their racism, are the biggest obstacles to change. You've perceptively noted that Trump runs on racism and fear, and yet you see no racism around you in real life.

But enough about you. There ought to be enough radicalization to be found to talk about.

White people are the main obstacle? In what sense?

See, this is that adversarial talk I was referring to earlier. Why would white people listen when they're being referred to as obstacles and enemies right out the gate?

And as long as we're referring to white and black as two separate and distinct entities, isn't it the black folks who are primarily interested in attaining political, social, and financial equity with other racial groups, primarily white and Asian? Isn't it then their role, as the party that wants something, to make an offer? And within that offer, shouldn't there be something of interest to make it worthwhile to "whites" and others to help them? It seems to me that attacking someone's identity and threatening to take things from them is not a very appealing offer.

Whites have done this to everybdy else. Asians face the same racism we do and we don't have to make an offer with something of interest to make it worthwhile to "whites" to follow the law. Then you talk as if white racism isn't what's adversarial. You've got a lot to learn.

Asians also are doing pretty damn well. I don't think they face the same racism blacks do either, by any stretch of the imagination, so that's kind of a weird thing for you to say.

I'm telling you the truth. If you think you know better on account of pride, that's your own damned problem, and others who think like you. No one is going to listen to someone when that person comes right out and regards them as an enemy, period. A very basic knowledge of psychology would tell you that much; you don't need a long white beard and moss growing out your ears to figure out something so (to me at least) simple. Why would you do what your so-called "enemy" wants anyway? Why would you listen to what they have to say? The answer is, you wouldn't. They are your enemy, by their own admission, and an enemy is just going to try to fuck you over.

And are you not trying to get white people to hear your side of the story? Is that not the point? Or was my initial suspicion correct, and you're only here to vent and lecture people about how terrible they are, intrinsically. Which is also kind of ironic, given the subject matter.

 

[MizMolly]

In 1921 one of the most commercially successful black neighborhoods in the US was burned to the ground by whites.

Tulsa race riot - Wikipedia

Most AmerickKKans have never heard of this.

Can't you just feel the white love?

Even in 1921 folks wanted to Make AmeriKKKa White Again.

They still do.

bullshit, this isn't 1921

 

[MizMolly]

Yeah we get it. Everything whitey do be bad. Everything the black man does is good. Let the black man rule over whitey. Give all whitey money to the black man. Give all of whitey possessions to the black man. Let the black man kill off whitey. Then the world will be perfection, it will be perfect, it will be heaven.

Too bad some blacks do not understand the idea that we if we tried to get along things would be better. If we each tried to excel on our own and not at the cost of someone else. But unfortunately some have the idea that the only way to make race relations better is to put down and degrade the other race.

The reason we are at this point is because whitey does not want to get along. Whitey has what he has at the expense of everybdy else.

"Racism has distorted reality for many whites. Teachings about history, the world, the pursuits of thought, expressions of culture, and personal relationships have for most whites been both limited and false."

"Racism has produced in white society a mental health problem: characteristic responses among many whites are dominated by unfounded fear of blacks, hatred, suspicion, guilt, shame, and jealousy. These words are the language of disease."

You and other racist blacks are the ones not wanting to get along. You want special treatment for things that happened long ago to other people who are not alive now nor the people who affected them negatively

 

[MizMolly]

Yeah we get it. Everything whitey do be bad. Everything the black man does is good. Let the black man rule over whitey. Give all whitey money to the black man. Give all of whitey possessions to the black man. Let the black man kill off whitey. Then the world will be perfection, it will be perfect, it will be heaven.

Too bad some blacks do not understand the idea that we if we tried to get along things would be better. If we each tried to excel on our own and not at the cost of someone else. But unfortunately some have the idea that the only way to make race relations better is to put down and degrade the other race.

The reason we are at this point is because whitey does not want to get along. Whitey has what he has at the expense of everybdy else.

"Racism has distorted reality for many whites. Teachings about history, the world, the pursuits of thought, expressions of culture, and personal relationships have for most whites been both limited and false."

"Racism has produced in white society a mental health problem: characteristic responses among many whites are dominated by unfounded fear of blacks, hatred, suspicion, guilt, shame, and jealousy. These words are the language of disease."

Oh yes affirmative action was all about not getting along. It was all about expense of others.

Yes I have no doubt that those like Neil Degrasse Tyson, Whitney Housten and other successes are convinced that they are held back by whitey.

Have you ever considered that racism is a two way street? If you hate whitey then why would you expect anything less in return?

"Racism has distorted reality for many whites. Teachings about history, the world, the pursuits of thought, expressions of culture, and personal relationships have for most whites been both limited and false."
.
Affirmative action.....

This distorted reality includes the inability of some white men to understand that the reason such things are being done because white men did not allow others in these professions based on race and sex.

Because affirmative action has helped whites the most.
Speaking against whites who are racists is not hatred of whites as a race. Unless YOU are saying that all whites are racists.

It is a dislike for whites who still practice racism.

You guys are dumb. Straight stump stupid.

But you call all whites who dare disagree with you a racist, therefore you think all whites are racist. Where is proof that whites benefit the most from Affirmative Action? Don't quote a made-up study conducted by someone who has no clue of what they are writing about.

 

[MizMolly]

The OP is the biggest pussy on this site. Period.
Dude gives a colic newborn a run for their money in the whining dept.
Grow up, faggot.

I've had nothing but disagreements with the OP, but wish you have challenged his thread rather than to dwell on his character.

I'm not sure what he even considers radicalization? Does he mean people that want their country back? I have no idea where he's going.

Dylann Roof readily comes to mind, hell any white person who has planned to harm and/or kill black people due to their race and then actually carried out their plans all fall into that category, including the miscreants who dragged James Byrd to his death by a rope tied to a pickup truck down in Jasper, Texas.

And that doesn't even take into account those who work in law enforcement. Amber Guyger anyone?
How Guyger is being groomed to get away with murder:
Amber Guyger's new look is no accident, say attorneys skilled in remaking a client

The Long List of Killings Committed by White Extremists Since the Oklahoma City Bombing

New Black Panther Party

 

[MizMolly]

Oh yes affirmative action was all about not getting along. It was all about expense of others.

Yes I have no doubt that those like Neil Degrasse Tyson, Whitney Housten and other successes are convinced that they are held back by whitey.

Have you ever considered that racism is a two way street? If you hate whitey then why would you expect anything less in return?

"Racism has distorted reality for many whites. Teachings about history, the world, the pursuits of thought, expressions of culture, and personal relationships have for most whites been both limited and false."
.
Affirmative action.....

This distorted reality includes the inability of some white men to understand that the reason such things are being done because white men did not allow others in these professions based on race and sex.

Because affirmative action has helped whites the most.
Speaking against whites who are racists is not hatred of whites as a race. Unless YOU are saying that all whites are racists.

It is a dislike for whites who still practice racism.

You guys are dumb. Straight stump stupid.

Well we can play at this all day but I will never convince a bigot and racist that they need to change since in their view it is others that need to conform to their reality.

Your bigotry and your racism are your problem.

I was not the op of every black is better then any white. I was not the one attempting to make the point that whites are responsible for me being a failure. But yeah I guess you could claim I am a bigot when it comes to people being stupid and attempting to blame others for their mistakes.

The truth of what has happened in this country is what it is. Your bigotry and your racism are your problem. This IS the race ad racism section and you do not say the same things to whites. Your whining about affirmative action is you attempting to make the point that non whites are responsible for you being a failure. My mistakes include a bachelors and Masters degree, building 3 organizations, and awards for work in the community. And I have fought and beaten punk ass racists like you every step of the way.

Just because this is the race and racism board doesnt mean you have to show your hatred for whites with every post you make

 

[MizMolly]

Nope.

"The most radical of them simply proclaim that the Fourteenth Amendment doesn't count; it wasn't validly adopted. Southern Senators and Representatives weren't seated in the Congress that proposed it at the end of the Civil War, they argue, so that body was illegitimate."

And LH Perez 1866 comments are as dead as he is.

Name one justice on the SCOTUS that agrees with what Perez said in 1866.

In the United States, a white person is almost six times more likely to be killed by another white person than he or she is to be killed by a black person. Yet, while the media obsesses about black on black violence we rarely if ever hear any mention of the problem of white on white violence. In fact, in 2011 (the most recent year available) according to FBI homicide data there were more instances of white homicides committed against white victims than there were black on black murders. This statistic however has not led to a media outcry about the problem of white on white crime or the unique pathology of the white community. Such broad brush characterizations would probably be regarded as unfair and irresponsible, and justly so, since most white people do not in fact kill other white people. Yet, the same media pundits, from Fox News’ Bill O’Reilly to CNN’s Don Lemon, have no problem referencing “black on black” violence, despite the fact that most African-Americans do not kill other black people.

When media discussions talk about gang-related homicides, they invariably treat it as an almost exclusively African-American problem, yet according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics for the period from 1980 to 2008, a majority (53.3 percent) of gang-homicides were committed by white offenders, and a majority of gang-homicide victims (56.5 percent) were white.

Why is There no Discussion of White on White Violence?

"Racism has distorted reality for many whites. Teachings about history, the world, the pursuits of thought, expressions of culture, and personal relationships have for most whites been both limited and false."

It's probably the most thankless job on earth, but someone has to do it, that is, explain current-day racism to fellow citizens, and point out its prevalence and pervasiveness. Sorry the job falls mostly to you, since most others couldn't do it, or won't, as the case may be. And don't let yourself be dissuaded by the willful ignorance, efforts at derailing your threads, or otherwise loutish comments like "Your opinion is irrelevant." For it is not, even though few seem to possess the wisdom to listen.

So, thanks.

View attachment 243440

The majority of crimes committed are by whites.

not the scary stuff, the violent crimes.

 

[MizMolly]

Dispute what? Everything you say basically amounts to the same thing. White people are bad and are oppressors. Black people are all poor innocent victims. White people are always wrong about everything. I'm always right about everything.

How does one have a conversation when those are your "facts"?

"Because most whites have not been trained to think with complexity about racism, and because it benefits white dominance not to do so, we have a very limited understanding of it (Kumashiro, 2009; LaDuke, 2009). We are the least likely to see, comprehend, or be invested in validating people of color’s assertions of racism and being honest about their consequences (King, 1991). At the same time, because of white social, economic, and political power within a white dominant culture, whites are the group in the position to legitimize people of color’s assertions of racism. Being in this position engenders a form of racial arrogance, and in this racial arrogance, whites have little compunction about debating the knowledge of people who have thought deeply about race through research, study, peer-reviewed scholarship, deep and on-going critical self-reflection, interracial relationships, and lived experience (Chinnery, 2008). This expertise is often trivialized and countered with simplistic platitudes, such as “people just need to see each other as individuals” or “see each other as humans” or “take personal responsibility.”

White lack of racial humility often leads to declarations of disagreement when in fact the problem is that we do not understand. Whites generally feel free to dismiss informed perspectives rather than have the humility to acknowledge that they are unfamiliar, reflect on them further, seek more information, or sustain a dialogue (DiAngelo & Sensoy, 2009)."

Dr. Robin DiAngelo

These are words from a white person. This history and present in America is what it is.Racism is a form of abusive behavior based upon the belief in the superiority of you race. This abuse involves, physical, psychological, emotional, plus there were especially in the past, sexual abuse.

“Bryant-Davis and Ocampo (2005) noted similar courses of psychopathology between rape victims and victims of racism. Both events are an assault on the personhood and integrity of the victim. Similar to rape victims, race-related trauma victims may respond with disbelief, shock, or dissociation, which can prevent them from responding to the incident in a healthy manner. The victim may then feel shame and self-blame because they were unable to respond or defend themselves, which may lead to low self-concept and self-destructive behaviors. In the same study, a parallel was drawn between race-related trauma victims and victims of domestic violence. Both survivors are made to feel shame over allowing themselves to be victimized. For instance, someone who may have experienced a racist incident may be told that if they are polite, work hard, and/or dress in a certain way, they will not encounter racism. When these rules are followed yet racism persists, powerlessness, hyper vigilance, and other symptoms associated with PTSD may develop or worsen (Bryant-Davis & Ocampo, 2005).”

If you study abuse, it has been shown that specific types of abuse can cause different types behaviors ether positive or negative. I have held all types of conversations in social and other settings about race as well as the impact of racism from the perspective of being black. What I discovered is that a lot of whites really don’t have much of a clue about what racism can do to a person. For example, you try explaining to a white person that blacks riot in their communities because of white racism and the first thing you hear is, ’Come on man white racism did not cause that.” Now here we have a person who has not experienced the first second of what racism does to a person talking about what they believe cannot happen.

Yet if you talk to this same person about child abuse, sexual abuse or other types of abuses, they are more than able to talk about the behaviors that can result. But racism, well that’s just something you can easily get beyond. Meanwhile every other abuse is a lifelong struggle for the person who must deal with it.

There has been tremendous psychological damage caused to nonwhites because of the racist policies and individual actions by whites in America and worldwide. But what some whites seem to think is that racism is simple and that it carries no psychological consequences to those who are the victims of it.

“On occasion, the emotional weight of racism can lead African Americans to engage in maladaptive coping, such as remaining in denial, engaging in substance use, aggression, self-blame – even in extreme cases suicide (i.e., Black Lives Matter activist Marshawn McCarrel) and terrorism (i.e., Dallas shooter Micah Xavier Johnson). These responses are harmful and lead to negative, long-term consequences.”

Monnica T. Williams Ph.D.

You want a dialogue. If that is what you want, you have to do better than crying about how I think whites are oppressors and blacks are all poor innocent victims. You need to dig deep and study the overall impact of white racsim on people instead of taking the easy way out because you are white and can't face it.


~

If I had a magic power to prevent people from getting discriminated against for shit that is outside their control (including race), I would gladly do so. Alas, I lack that mystical power. Which, of course, you are well aware. You are talking to the wrong people.

It is about if you have the will and CONTENT OF CHARACTER to WANT to do.

I guess my question is, what do you actually think needs to happen to make life better for black Americans? What, specifically, do you think needs to happen? And not something miraculous like; every racist in America just randomly changed their minds all of a sudden and isn't racist anymore.

My question is what do whites need to do in order to rid their community of it's racism? .And what are YOU going to do in order to help make it happen?

Because that is what will make life better for black Americans.

While I don't doubt there is racism (all races included), which communities are full of white racists? Everyone I know gets up, goes to work,lives their lives, without racism,etc etc. You are not going to change the racists minds, especially when you are one yourself.

 

[Preacher]

USMB is full of these examples.

The radicalization of white Americans
By German Lopez

We need to talk about homegrown extremism too.

The common causes of radicalization
One thing experts emphasize: There is no single pathway to radicalization, and there are many contributors to radicalization. But generally, radicalization takes root when someone has some sort of problem — whether about his own life, society at large, or something else entirely — and a radical ideology or group provides an answer to that problem. He may seek out that radical ideology himself, or a group will come to him.

J.M. Berger, an expert on terrorism and author of Jihad Joe: Americans Who Go to War in the Name of Islam, explained in a talk that sources of grievances can be broadly broken into two categories: personal issues and social issues.

For personal, he cited economic insecurity, loss of a loved one, exposure to violence, relocation, religious conversion, and some kinds of mental illness.

For social, he cited war and insurgency, rapidly changing demographics, swift changes in civil society or civil rights, watershed changes in communication technology, efforts to foment uncertainty by state actors, and economic upheaval.

Arlie Hochschild, a sociologist and author of Strangers in Their Own Land, provided an apt analogy for how many white Americans feel: As they see it, they’re all in a line toward a hill with prosperity at the top. But over the past few years, globalization and income stagnation have caused the line to stop moving. And from their perspective, other groups — black and brown Americans, women — are now cutting in the line, because they’re getting new (and more equal) opportunities through new anti-discrimination laws and policies like affirmative action.

A common thread among people who are radicalized is a lack of purpose in life, which radical views — especially if a person acts on them — can help fill. “People tend to be seeking some meaning in their lives,” Bloom said. “They want to be part of something bigger than themselves.”

Peter Bergen, an expert on radicalization at New America, put this bluntly: They’re people we would often consider losers. “If you look at the attackers in this country, that is not a bad description,” Bergen said. “They are often people whose lives aren’t going well.”

The radicalization of white Americans

Better believe I am radicalized. Prepared as well

 

[miketx]

In 1921 one of the most commercially successful black neighborhoods in the US was burned to the ground by whites.

Tulsa race riot - Wikipedia

Most AmerickKKans have never heard of this.

Can't you just feel the white love?

Even in 1921 folks wanted to Make AmeriKKKa White Again.

They still do.

That has nothing to with today.