The "OZONE HOLE" scam was the pre-curser to the Global Warmists movement.

[Crick]

You act like a liar who failed 7th grade physical science class.

 

[Marion Morrison]

A quick look at think progress indicates that I wasn't that far off..

We Saved The Ozone Layer. We Can Save The Climate.

clip: Congress held hearings under the bipartisan leadership of Senators Max Baucus, John Chafee, and Al Gore, and Representatives Henry Waxman and Sherwood Boehlert, keeping the danger in the public eye. And the news media covered the story, without giving equal time to marginal skeptics.

The discovery of the Antarctic ozone hole added new urgency. By 1986, even the chemical industry acknowledged CFC limits were needed.

The chemical industry being 3m who made billions on their CFC free freon replacement...abd those marginal skeptics were pointing out that the holes were always there and talking about the science of the ozone layer and how it couldn't be destroyed so long as there was O2 in the stratosphere and UV coming in from the sun.

Ahem..actually it was DuPont, but ok.

Yes, that was political and it fucked over just about every refrigeration tradesman in the nation.

 

[007]

Geee... where's our global warming?

11th coldest November to date

 

[flacaltenn]

The idea that the treaty negotiated and enacted by George HW Bush was a precursor to the global warming movement whatever that means is so totally whacked as to defy logic and a rational excuse.

You seem to have missed the entire point entirely. The theory about "being a model for the GW movement" is secondary to the SCIENCE and the data telling us that the "Ozone hole" fright was NEVER REALLY FIXED. The leadership of the world went on a wild goose chase with brand new satellite toys in the 70s and 80s and created a WORLD WIDE CRISIS where the CFC production went to ZERO -- but the ozone hole never DECREASED.

They just declared victory and moved on. All the lemmings and the lemming leaders. Because THAT science was FAR from settled as well. STILL IS.. All because we suddenly (35 yrs) was able to measure something for the FIRST TIME from space and saw it INCREASING and thought we should "fix it"....

Does that look "fixed" to you? With no ZERO CFCs being released and a 2 yr transit time from storage in the troposphere into the "hole"????

 

[flacaltenn]

The protocol worked as the ozone layer is recovering.

Nope.. Fake news. See NASA chart above..

 

[Billy_Bob]

The idea that the treaty negotiated and enacted by George HW Bush was a precursor to the global warming movement whatever that means is so totally whacked as to defy logic and a rational excuse.

You seem to have missed the entire point entirely. The theory about "being a model for the GW movement" is secondary to the SCIENCE and the data telling us that the "Ozone hole" fright was NEVER REALLY FIXED. The leadership of the world went on a wild goose chase with brand new satellite toys in the 70s and 80s and created a WORLD WIDE CRISIS where the CFC production went to ZERO -- but the ozone hole never DECREASED.

They just declared victory and moved on. All the lemmings and the lemming leaders. Because THAT science was FAR from settled as well. STILL IS.. All because we suddenly (35 yrs) was able to measure something for the FIRST TIME from space and saw it INCREASING and thought we should "fix it"....

Does that look "fixed" to you? With no ZERO CFCs being released and a 2 yr transit time from storage in the troposphere into the "hole"????

What i find amusing is the hole was well on its way to developing long before we even began using CFC's and now its not responding to near zero interference as the sun output wains..

Do you ever feel like you got the stick placed in unpleasant places? I know the folks who made CFC's do..

 

[flacaltenn]

The idea that the treaty negotiated and enacted by George HW Bush was a precursor to the global warming movement whatever that means is so totally whacked as to defy logic and a rational excuse.

You seem to have missed the entire point entirely. The theory about "being a model for the GW movement" is secondary to the SCIENCE and the data telling us that the "Ozone hole" fright was NEVER REALLY FIXED. The leadership of the world went on a wild goose chase with brand new satellite toys in the 70s and 80s and created a WORLD WIDE CRISIS where the CFC production went to ZERO -- but the ozone hole never DECREASED.

They just declared victory and moved on. All the lemmings and the lemming leaders. Because THAT science was FAR from settled as well. STILL IS.. All because we suddenly (35 yrs) was able to measure something for the FIRST TIME from space and saw it INCREASING and thought we should "fix it"....

Does that look "fixed" to you? With no ZERO CFCs being released and a 2 yr transit time from storage in the troposphere into the "hole"????

What i find amusing is the hole was well on its way to developing long before we even began using CFC's and now its not responding to near zero interference as the sun output wains..

Do you ever feel like you got the stick placed in unpleasant places? I know the folks who made CFC's do..

I know the heat exchanger that the govt designed for me with inferior refrigerants and "efficiency" barely produces any heat at below 35F.. It's 28DegF outside right now and it's gone thru 2 defrost cycles in the past hour and the "emergency heat" light is on.. Thats what I know.

Actually, I know more. All that UV we were worried about is increasing in historic levels as the Sun slides into a possible "grand" solar minimum..

With the NEW Ozone holes opening in the Northern Hemi as the article says..

 

[SSDD]

Cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo...

What causes the formation of an O3 molecule ...and how long does that formation take.

SSDD is literally denying that ozone absorbs UV light. That's literally on a level with round-earth denial. I'm just trying to decide if that's the dumbest thing he's ever typed. Given how many stupid things he's said over the years, it's hard to decide.

Ozone is the result of O2 absorbing UV. O3 absorbs some UV but because it is so unstable, The molecule breaks before it has absorbed anywhere as much energy as it takes to break an O2 molecule to allow the formation of O3. But do feel free to prove me wrong hairball.

Oh, do show us your science backing up your claim that the ozone layer would reform in milliseconds if removed.

Step on up and prove me wrong.

...i predict that the "holes" will increase in size as the solar minimum progresses and deepens without regard to the montreal or any other protocol.

As the holes have been shrinking as the solar minimum develops, such a prediction is already proven wrong. That was easy.

Sorry hairball...i already posted nasa data that proves you wrong...

 

[SSDD]

The Ozone "hole" was known back in the 1950's, when Dobson measured low values in the late 1950's,

Yes. But not nearly as low as they later got. Very dishonest of you to leave that out. Such dishonesty is standard behavior for cultists.

Denialism isn't the actual cult. Right-wing-crank authoritarianism is the actual cult. Ozone depletion denial, global warming denial and DDT harm denial are just some of the many kook conspiracy theories that the cultists are mandated to believe.

Bla bla bla, your inner ugliness spills out vividly.

What I said was correct and you know it since you didn't say it was wrong at all.

You act like a miserable human being.

Yep..she is one of the most bitter, miserable people I have encountered on these forums, and there are some real doozies out there.

 

[mamooth]

You seem to have missed the entire point entirely. The theory about "being a model for the GW movement" is secondary to the SCIENCE and the data telling us that the "Ozone hole" fright was NEVER REALLY FIXED. The leadership of the world went on a wild goose chase with brand new satellite toys in the 70s and 80s

So, satellites are part of the conspiracy. Can you explain exactly how that works? Are satellites faking data? Is the money to launch them going into Soros' pocket? Please be specific.

and created a WORLD WIDE CRISIS where the CFC production went to ZERO -- but the ozone hole never DECREASED.

Don't be absurd. CFC production didn't go to zero, other ozone munchers were still being produced, and the atmospheric residence time of those gases is way long. You're failing at the basics of the science again.

CFC breakdown products, of which there are no natural sources, found in high concentrations in the areas of ozone depletion. That's a smoking gun. Your "It's natural!" theory fails to account for that, so your "it's natural" theory is wrong. It is that simple. You're trying to invent a reality which is contradicted by hard data.

 

[Sunsettommy]

"omission"

Bla bla bla, your inner ugliness spills out vividly.

Something about heat and kitchens comes to mind. If you're going to be so free with insults, don't whine about getting them back.

Now, care to address the point you tried to run from? That point was your dishonesty-by-omission. The ozone hole was much less severe in the 1950's. That's not debatable. Yet you chose to leave that very pertinent fact out. Was your dishonesty-by-omission due to ignorance, or was it deliberate attempt at deception?

You act like a miserable human being.

Try to avoid the butthurt death spiral, or you'll end up like SSDD. You see his sad story here. He gets butthurt about having his shit science ripped apart, and everyone laughs at him, so he says even dumber things, which then get ripped apart again, and everyone laughs more, so he gets even more butthurt, and says even dumber things, and so on. Now he's only interesting as an example of cult pathology, and I would hope you want to avoid that fate.

Ha ha ha, here is my FIRST post YOU replied to:

"The Ozone "hole" was known back in the 1950's, when Dobson measured low values in the late 1950's, he was the same man who PREDICTED low O3 numbers back in the 1920's with his research."

No lies or name calling attack in it.

Your reply.... snicker...……,

"Yes. But not nearly as low as they later got. Very dishonest of you to leave that out. Such dishonesty is standard behavior for cultists.

Denialism isn't the actual cult. Right-wing-crank authoritarianism is the actual cult. Ozone depletion denial, global warming denial and DDT harm denial are just some of the many kook conspiracy theories that the cultists are mandated to believe. "

bolding mine

My next reply:

"Bla bla bla, your inner ugliness spills out vividly.

What I said was correct and you know it since you didn't say it was wrong at all.

You act like a miserable human being."

No lies or name calling attack in it.

your dishonest reply:

"Something about heat and kitchens comes to mind. If you're going to be so free with insults, don't whine about getting them back.

Now, care to address the point you tried to run from? That point was your dishonesty-by-omission. The ozone hole was much less severe in the 1950's. That's not debatable. Yet you chose to leave that very pertinent fact out. Was your dishonesty-by-omission due to ignorance, or was it deliberate attempt at deception?"

I didn't lie or insult you at all. I responded about YOUR WORDS only. Can't you tell?

You insistence of omission isn't even credible since all I said that low ozone levels in the late 1950's were recorded by Dobson, which is true. That is what YOU keep overlooking to promote your dishonest "omission" narrative.

 

[Dale Smith]

The common enemy of humanity is man.
In searching for a new enemy to unite us, we came up
with the idea that pollution, the threat of global warming,
water shortages, famine and the like would fit the bill. All these
dangers are caused by human intervention, and it is only through
changed attitudes and behaviour that they can be overcome.
The real enemy then, is humanity itself.“
– Club of Rome,

 

[Dale Smith]

Ozone is the result of O2 absorbing UV. O3 absorbs some UV but because it is so unstable,

Fascinating. So by your kook logic, there's no ozone layer at night, being it all decays instantly once UV stops creating it.

And yet ... we can measure it at night.

Ooh, sucks to be you. Another 'tard conspiracy theory down the drain. Notice how even your fellow deniers aren't jumping on your stupid train? That should give you an idea of how remarkably stupid it is.

i

Mamooth, you were sucked into a plan that was in the making back in the late 60s.........SUCKER!

 

[flacaltenn]

So, satellites are part of the conspiracy. Can you explain exactly how that works? Are satellites faking data? Is the money to launch them going into Soros' pocket? Please be specific.

Either you're intentionally stupid and purposely misinterpret what I say. Or looking for pity because you ARE that stupid. I'll go with #1 to give you the benefit of the doubt.

I said NOTHING about satellites "being a problem".. Have your special ed tutor explain my posts to you.. And leave me out of your taunting and delusions..

 

[cnm]

There's another dumb-off contender! According to the SSDD theory, the south pole in its winter receives less solar energy that the north pole in its winter. Why? Something about tilt. He apparently thinks earth's axial tilt varies on the short term.

Amazing, isn't it?

 

[cnm]

I don't see you [Crick] challenging anything I said.

What point? You didn't respond to queries on this claim of yours even after your vainglorious boasting...

The "holes" vary in size from summer to winter over each pole with them being larger during each respective winter...and the "hole" is always larger over the south pole because it receives less solar energy than the north due to the tilt of the earth.

I never make claims i can't back up...unlike you.

 

[SSDD]

Don't be absurd. CFC production didn't go to zero, other ozone munchers were still being produced, and the atmospheric residence time of those gases is way long. You're failing at the basics of the science again.

You know what one of the main ozone "munchers" is that your priests probably never told you about? Good old nitrogen, and hydrogen, and other compounds that are released naturally.. Ay 780,000 ppm, compared to somewhere between 5 and 20 ppm for CFC's, which do you think breaks down more ozone?

Ozone

"Because ozone and free oxygen atoms are highly unstable, they react very easily with nitrogen, hydrogen, chlorine, and bromine compounds that are found naturally in Earth's atmosphere"

CFC breakdown products, of which there are no natural sources, found in high concentrations in the areas of ozone depletion.

Well that's bullshit isn't it. Nitrogen exists in ozone "depletion areas" at a concentration of 780,000ppm. Then there the other natural compounds named above in various concentrations...compare that to the 20ppm pr less of CFC's that are present.

That's a smoking gun. Your "It's natural!" theory fails to account for that, so your "it's natural" theory is wrong. It is that simple. You're trying to invent a reality which is contradicted by hard data.

Actually, when you look at the facts, it is your fantasy that falls apart.

 

[SSDD]

I don't see you [Crick] challenging anything I said.

What point? You didn't respond to queries on this claim of yours even after your vainglorious boasting...

The "holes" vary in size from summer to winter over each pole with them being larger during each respective winter...and the "hole" is always larger over the south pole because it receives less solar energy than the north due to the tilt of the earth.

I never make claims i can't back up...unlike you.

So you have nothing...

 

[Wyatt earp]

The Montreal Protocol worked and that is what truly scares the bejeesus out of conservatives. The Protocol which has been very successful reduced ozone emissions which led to the recovery of the ozone layer. The reason it scares conservatives is because it is a precursor of a frame work that can work to fight climate change.

Given how anti-science and anti-fact the conservative movement has become, the Montreal Protocol would never, or at least be nearly impossible, to implement today to our detriment. At least then there were still rational conservatives like George HW Bush.

How the fuck do you know it hasn't always been there?

 

[frigidweirdo]

The ban on those nasty CFCs back in the 80s which closed "The Hole in the Ozone" (queue woman screaming) was a bunch of Liberal Hooey. But the success of the Ozone scam gave birth the Warmer movement and many of the same scientists that pushed the Ozone scare are the same ones pushing human caused climate change. Don't believe them, they have a reason why they use "science" to push scams just like they did with the Ozone Hole and CFCs.

New Ozone Hole Scare Won't Save the Great Climate Hoax | PSI Intl

Except that there was hole in the ozone, there still is to a certain extent.

This is what it looked like in 2006

This is what it looked like 3 days ago.

Big difference. Why?