The Numbers Case For SS Reform

[rtwngAvngr]

If you read my earlier posts you will see that this started with a question. I asked the conservatives on this board to lay down a coherent argument supporting the presidents plan. The performance thus far has been lackluster at best. Privitization comes at a hefty cost (two trillion), has yet to actually work anywhere else in the world, and does little to fix the current problem. Knowing this I would argue that we should focus on fixing the problem rather than chasing around private accounts.

you're as dense as they come. It's a ponzi scheme. If people take control of their own retirement, they're out of the ponzi scheme. It's just that simple. Why are you such a retard?

 

[Annie]

you're as dense as they come. It's a ponzi scheme. If people take control of their own retirement, they're out of the ponzi scheme. It's just that simple. Why are you such a retard?

Please, if you are going to post this again, give a flood warning! I come here after like 10 post to see Ponzi again! You may be right, but if he didn't get it in the first 10, 15, 20 posts, give it a rest, or at least send him back to an earlier one! Please!

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Please, if you are going to post this again, give a flood warning! I come here after like 10 post to see Ponzi again! You may be right, but if he didn't get it in the first 10, 15, 20 posts, give it a rest, or at least send him back to an earlier one! Please!

If he's gonna repeat. I shall too. Don't read the thread.

 

[Annie]

If he's gonna repeat. I shall too. Don't read the thread.

Let his idiocy stand on it's own. He gives different words though to the same old same old.

Flooding is not ok.

 

[no1tovote4]

If you read my earlier posts you will see that this started with a question. I asked the conservatives on this board to lay down a coherent argument supporting the presidents plan. The performance thus far has been lackluster at best. Privitization comes at a hefty cost (two trillion), has yet to actually work anywhere else in the world, and does little to fix the current problem. Knowing this I would argue that we should focus on fixing the problem rather than chasing around private accounts.

Once again, privatization is an improvement on a system that simply cannot stand in the current state. Rather than killing benefits to people that were promised and lowering their payments (regardless what you may think making the age later definitely lowers payments). By simply killing the system you can make me happy, but simply raising the taxes on it, (which would have been unnecessary if the promised privatized accounts ever came upon us or if they even put the money in trust for the retirees rather then spent it like drunk monkeys) or raising retirement age still won't cure this program's ills. As people live longer and longer it will simply once again fall in on itself. The more we privatize and make sure the government cannot spend our money the better off we are, the more the system will not have to change.

 

[cptpwichita]

Social security is not guranteed!If you look at your social security statement there will be an asterisk which if you care to look further it will even tell you it is not guranteed.Government can at will reduce benefits,raise the retirement age,or increase your payroll taxes.As you suggested one way is to remove the 90,000 cap (a tax increase),the only problem with that besides it hurting the economy is that social security was never supposed to be a welfare program (income redistribution) but an insurance program to supplement other investments and savings but unlike insurance the money collected is not re-invested to pay benefits nor is it saved in a lock box waiting for that person to retire it is simply spent on government projects and an iou is put in its place.the whole problem is a demographic problem-there are not enough working to support the people who are not working.

liberals like yourself do not believe in an ownership society and personal property rights where people are held responsible for their own actions and liberals like yourself do not believe in free enterprise and open markets.liberals like yourself believe in massive governmental systems like social security and universal heath-care while despising competition,personal achievement and acquisition of wealth.Liberals love high taxes (just as long as it is not them) to take care of all the poor unfortunates (and those making a living off of them).

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Let his idiocy stand on it's own. He gives different words though to the same old same old.

Flooding is not ok.

Back off, mama!

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Ponzi Scheme
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Ponzi Scheme

 

[Huckleburry]

Why is that conservatives are always telling me what I believe in? As of yet I have not posted on how I think we should fix social security, so how do you know what I believe in? If I took the liberal view of you I would say that you believe in robbing from the poor and giving to the rich, are a bigot, a racist, believe we should be living in a theocracy, and believe that black homosexual Jews are planning on, not only taking over the globe, but fucking you and your entire family (pets included) in your sweet white behind. Now does this accurately reflect what you believe in or have I made some misguided assumptions?

 

[cptpwichita]

Why is that conservatives are always telling me what I believe in? As of yet I have not posted on how I think we should fix social security, so how do you know what I believe in? If I took the liberal view of you I would say that you believe in robbing from the poor and giving to the rich, are a bigot, a racist, believe we should be living in a theocracy, and believe that black homosexual Jews are planning on, not only taking over the globe, but fucking you and your entire family (pets included) in your sweet white behind. Now does this accurately reflect what you believe in or have I made some misguided assumptions?

o.k. what did i say that was untrue about liberals and why?
by the way conservatives are more likely to support the nation of israel than liberals who tend to support the palestinians.conservatives believe that people should keep their own money not have it seized by the federal government for some redistribution scheme.it is not the role of the federal government to take care of everyone (in the liberals crade to grave society).the republicans have historically been at the front of the civil rights march not democrats you had better check your history (ever hear of abe lincoln-he was a republican).isn't the democrats the party of robert kkk byrd.
I am not a conservative i am a pro-life libertarian (and for securing our borders which differs from the libertarian platform).
what did i say about liberals you disagree with?Ican be honest about my agenda can you?

 

[Huckleburry]

Among other things I am not a liberal. However liberals clearly believe in property rights, can you provide an example of a respected liberal arguing against personal property rights? I can find a few examples of conservatives arguing against personal property rights in the name of economic improvement. Any way the topic of the thread is about SS reform not conservative misconceptions about the views of 54 million or so Americans. The point I was trying to make with my last point is that conservatives (especially on this board) are very keen on telling me what I believe rather than asking me.

 

[cptpwichita]

Among other things I am not a liberal. However liberals clearly believe in property rights, can you provide an example of a respected liberal arguing against personal property rights? I can find a few examples of conservatives arguing against personal property rights in the name of economic improvement. Any way the topic of the thread is about SS reform not conservative misconceptions about the views of 54 million or so Americans. The point I was trying to make with my last point is that conservatives (especially on this board) are very keen on telling me what I believe rather than asking me.

I agree imminent domain law is not just a liberal issue and neither is government spending.Bush has done a bad job on both and if his solution to social security reform is raising taxes than i believe he has failed there also.bush has done a bad job on border security and has constantly increased the size,scope and power of the federal government.
so i am not a party hack who tows the line (by the way i will say again i am a libertarian not a true conservative).my point is this-do you believe people should own their own retirement account (ownership)?be able to have some say in how that retirement money is invested (choice)?be able to leave that money to a loved one (personal property rights)?

a very important question is this-what percentage of peoples income should the government take and what should they spend it on?please answer this question honestly,if you think the government should take up to 70% and have government run health-care and other programs say so.By the way if you are against privatizing social security than tell us what you are in favor of or how you would fix the current system.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Among other things I am not a liberal. However liberals clearly believe in property rights, can you provide an example of a respected liberal arguing against personal property rights? I can find a few examples of conservatives arguing against personal property rights in the name of economic improvement. Any way the topic of the thread is about SS reform not conservative misconceptions about the views of 54 million or so Americans. The point I was trying to make with my last point is that conservatives (especially on this board) are very keen on telling me what I believe rather than asking me.

Yes, you are a liberal.

 

[nakedemperor]

Yes, you are a liberal.

Sorry Huck. If he thinks it, its so. Remember, he knew things about me that even I wasn't conscious of!

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Sorry Huck. If he thinks it, its so. Remember, he knew things about me that even I wasn't conscious of!

Liberals spend half their energy denying their actual beliefs, denying their liberals. Why? Because you know it's ultimately an evil and selfish ideology?

You're just too young I guess to realize what a typical lib you are.

 

[nakedemperor]

Liberals spend half their energy denying their actual beliefs, denying their liberals. Why? Because you know it's ultimately an evil and selfish ideology?

You're just too young I guess to realize what a typical lib you are.

Listen, your NAME is RightWing. You've ostentaciously advertised that you will defend the party line at every turn, in an aggressive and invective manner (that's how I read avenger, and by golly you live up to it, in effort if not in results). You want to talk about typical? You want to talk about immutible ideologies and faith in policy that won't and can't be shifted even in the face of failed policy? Take a look in the mirror.

Now, social security is a ponzi scheme, and you're saying that investment acounts will "get people out of the system"; except it won't. Most people will rely mostly on social security benefits (not PIA payoffs) for decades to come. The transition to this partial program alone will cost 2 trillion dollars. It does not fix the problem that social security faces insolvency in 40 years (currently) nor does it "get people out of the system"; at least, not in its current form.

 

[Fmr jarhead]

Alright, NE...you may be partially correct....regarding SSA. By allowing partially private accounts (some of the monies diverted), we will not be fixing the system....but why on earth would you want to fix a system that has proven to be irrefutably flawed, by allowing the foxes watching the henhouse (you know...politicians looking out for our tax money).

Best case scenario...we should have a goal of completely eliminating the social security benefit over the course of the next 40 years....all new workers just entering in to the workforce (earning their very first paycheck in the year 2010) would pay little toward SSA (maybe 25% of their deducted taxes now allocated for SSA would still go there, the reaminder would go toward their own "private account).

I realize that my retirement will not be funded by social security, and if you have half the intelligence I think you do, I would be damned concerned about retirement, NOW....and not wait until you are at the end of your 30's and only have 30 years left to live.....get on it now, and don't be caught like the hare without any preparation for winter.

 

[cptpwichita]

I wish liberals would be honest about their agenda.

 

[cptpwichita]

where do you stand?

1.tax reform

2.social security reform

3.border security

4.abortion

5.death penalty

6.imminent domain law

7.military doctrine (size of military and when to use it)

8.prostitution,gambling,and drug legalization

9.education reform

10.gay marriage


just to explore the liberal mind a little bit

 

[Fmr jarhead]

How dare you! A litmus test? I am outraged!